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Will my insurance work on the track

Joined
22 May 2002
Messages
333
Ok, one day I called my insurance company to find out about the exclusions on my policy. I do the NASA Green Flag and other non timed
events with and without driving instructors. I was told my poloicy is void if I RACE the car. Mmmm, so does that mean a non timed event considered DRIVING SCHOOL is ok. The carrier is Geico if that helps. Thanks, Dan
 
You need to specificly describe your on track activities to your agent.Most companies will cover non timed events that are labelled as driver education.Be aware that any damage to track hardware ie guardrails is payed by you,and multicar shunts are usually every man for himself.Injury is another kettle and you should inquire with the host of your event. the pool of insurers for these events is a shrinking,nationaly.
 
Insurance policies vary in their wording. Some policies prohibit "competition and timed events" but don't prohibit high performance driver education (HPDE) events. I have heard that Allstate recently changed the wording of their policies to exclude any event that takes place on a racetrack. The first thing to do is to check the wording in your policy.

Beyond the specific wording, some companies will give you a hard time on any claim filed for damage incurred in a track event, while others may not give you trouble at all. Your treatment may also vary depending on how long you have been with that company and what other policies you carry with them.

Bottom line is that there's no clear-cut answer for any particular company and policy. If you're not sure, check with your agent or insurance company.

If they tell you that only RACING is excluded, that should not exclude a non-timed, non-competitive HPDE event, but this is just my personal opinion.

The FAQ also has some interesting information on this topic.
 
I don't believe that statement about Allstate is true. I am currently insured with them and had my agent over at my home this evening. I specifically asked him about track events as I intend to participate in one this weekend. He told me, with witnesses present, that as long as there was no competing/racing that I was covered. I also have it in writing in the form of a fax that he sent to me previously.
 
From another bbs:

"Whether this is legitimate or not will be left for another discussion. My point here is to let folks know that I just got a fax from my insurance agent and Allstate has just added language to their policies excluding liability, medical payment, uninsured motorist and protection against loss or theft coverage:

-- “for bodily injury or property damage arising out of the participation in any racing or speed contest,
-- when using the insured vehicle at a track or course designed for racing,
-- or in practice or preparation for any use of this type.”

It looks like Allstate is closing any loophole which may have existed. Thought folks might want to know. "

Thread is at: http://corner-carvers.com/forums/showthread.php?s=f1916290bcdbec8c0c6e7362254034bb&threadid=2314&highlight=allstate

Note: Paste all the above into your browser.

-Doug
Read the fine print. Those lawyers will stick it to you every time....
 
Does anyone know what type of insurance the driving schools use? I am just guessing that they have insurance to cover a student crashing thier cars.

-matt
 
Originally posted by blurr:
Does anyone know what type of insurance the driving schools use? I am just guessing that they have insurance to cover a student crashing thier cars.

Driving schools purchase specialized insurance for their needs; the biggest vendor in this area is K&K Insurance. The insurance that the schools purchase is primarily to protect their liability (in case a student crashes and sues them). It is not normally intended to cover damages to the students' own automobiles. Schools that provide the cars for track usage usually spell out who is responsible for any damage, and they often provide the ability for the student to purchase insurance for the event, to protect them against such damages.
 
I have USAA and I specifically asked the agent about driving schools and I was told I was covered. I believe USAA is only available to members of the US military and their dependants.
 
Originally posted by nsxtasy:
Schools that provide the cars for track usage usually spell out who is responsible for any damage, and they often provide the ability for the student to purchase insurance for the event, to protect them against such damages.

That is exactly what I am talking about. Some sort of per day insurance. I found a Uk site that provides you insurence for the day. http://www.competition-car-insurance.co.uk/

We just need to find something like this here in the states.
 
Has anyone here insured by Allstate ever received notification of a policy change as suggested by another BBS? I am insured by Allstate in NY and have never received such a notification. My agent also is unaware of such a change. If someone actually has received such a policy endorsement, please email me so I can give you my fax number if you wouldn't mind sending me a copy. I am also an attorney practicing in NY and do quite a bit of insurance coverage work and would be interested in actually seeing such a policy endorsement so I can do a little research into the validity of it.

Bob
 
not to cheat the system
but why tell them anything
most insurance companies are some of the most powerful companies in the country

if you wreck bad at the track flat bed it home and tell them you slid off a narrow road

don't see the harm in that. do you?..
 
Originally posted by smoore:
if you wreck bad at the track flat bed it home and tell them you slid off a narrow road

don't see the harm in that. do you?..

Yes. If they investigate and find out that you lied about what happened, not only can they deny the claim, but you can get charged and convicted of fraud. NOT a good idea.

And that's totally aside from the fact that it's lying and it's WRONG.

[This message has been edited by nsxtasy (edited 17 September 2002).]
 
Originally posted by hondaholic:
I have USAA and I specifically asked the agent about driving schools and I was told I was covered. I believe USAA is only available to members of the US military and their dependants.

BE CAREFUL, I believe your exposed! You should ask you agent to call the company underwriters. I use'd to insure with USAA and made the call myself to their information help line. I spoke with an operator and quickly determined that I would not be covered, Said thank you and hung up...end of story? NO!

On a Sunday afternoon within an hour of asking the question, Underwriting called me at home, grilled me on how I was using my vehicle and, in no uncertain terms told me I would not be covered at the track. Drivers Ed, non timed and everything...AND she was NOT nice about it, she even seemed angry. The help line operator at USAA called over to Underwriting and "told on me"!!! I took offense of the intrusion and cancelled my policy.

I am now at State Farm and have a new fax cover sheet faxed to me from the UNDERWRITING department each time I go tracking. I don't run with a transponder and do not race. It cost's me about an additional 170.00 a year over USAA.

Your agent may be able to speak on behalf of the insurance company they represent, but it doesn't mean their right, and will they back you when it comes down to you and him? I know one instance that this was the case, and believe me, the agent changed his tune once the ins company backed away!!!

I assume the agent could be held responsible but I'd get it in writing from the ins co themselves.

Just trying to help.
 
I just called Progressive about this same issue. Apparently my policy excludes stunts, racing, or preparation for those activities. Unfortunately, the claims department ruled that the activities of a driving school fall under "preparation for a stunt"??? In no uncertain terms, the adjuster informed me that I was not covered during the NSXPO track event. They also refused to provide an endorsement for this event. I am awaiting a response from three different motorsports insurance specialists. I will keep you posted.

------------------
Ron
1991 NSX (black/black)
2001 M3 (silver/red)
 
Originally posted by NO TKTS:
I just called Progressive about this same issue. Apparently my policy excludes stunts, racing, or preparation for those activities. Unfortunately, the claims department ruled that the activities of a driving school fall under "preparation for a stunt"??? In no uncertain terms, the adjuster informed me that I was not covered during the NSXPO track event. They also refused to provide an endorsement for this event. I am awaiting a response from three different motorsports insurance specialists. I will keep you posted.


Wisenberg insurance company only handles dedicated race cars, not combined use vehicles.



------------------
Ron
1991 NSX (black/black)
2001 M3 (silver/red)
 
Another negative reponse:

"Thank you for your interest but we do not have a market for your needs.
 
Gulfway Insurers"




------------------
Ron
1991 NSX (black/black)
2001 M3 (silver/red)
 
Well, when I called I just asked if there was any exclusions on my polocy. I was told there are a lot of them and what does this concern. Without tipping my hat I asked about driving school and was told just not to race. ANY underwriter would most likely say no way. Also now you have been warned and we have a record of it or worse, cancel you policy. I have not heard of anyone not being covered from a (school) event incident. But if they told you not to, well...
 
RSO 34 said:
Has anyone here insured by Allstate ever received notification of a policy change as suggested by another BBS? I am insured by Allstate in NY and have never received such a notification. My agent also is unaware of such a change. If someone actually has received such a policy endorsement, please email me so I can give you my fax number if you wouldn't mind sending me a copy. I am also an attorney practicing in NY and do quite a bit of insurance coverage work and would be interested in actually seeing such a policy endorsement so I can do a little research into the validity of it.

Bob

Bob I have Allstate...I switched from American Family to them because I found out AF does not cover anything on a race track. I know a kid who cracked up his car at a track and AF said sorry no coverage. To make a long story short I called ten different Insurance Co to see who would cover any Driving Schools Allstate said they have nothing in there policy that says they wouldn't cover it.


I went to a local Allstate office and talked to the Insurance man and told him outright I do Driving Schools do you or do you not cover Driving Schools. He said he would call the underwriter and get back to me... he called later that day and said they cant find anything in there policy that says no coverage for any type of event like that.


I had him double check for me the next day before I went with them he said come down and look at our policy I did and it says nothing about no coverage in racing events. So I switched over to them I got my policy it was the same one in the office this was over a year ago.


To this day I have never recieved anything in the mail or email that says there is a change in the policy. I got to know my Agent pretty good and I will check tomorrow with him to see if he heard anything about this change in the wording of the policy.




Steven 91 Blk/Ivory
 
steven,

Allstate is one company that now have specific section for driving school or any track events on their policy. This was added about a year ago. Also created quite a buzz and discussed in length about a year ago by a friend of mine who is a lawyer, and also run driving events.

You better go back and check their policy.
 
those of you who track and drive the NSX on public roads(not a dedicated track car): what insurance do you guys carry?
 
Andrie Hartanto said:
steven,

Allstate is one company that now have specific section for driving school or any track events on their policy. This was added about a year ago. Also created quite a buzz and discussed in length about a year ago by a friend of mine who is a lawyer, and also run driving events.

You better go back and check their policy.

I still have Allstate and my policy still does not have that language. I had asked if anyone actually had a copy of the policy to confirm that it was added in some but I have never seen such a policy issued by Allstate.

Bob
 
I talked to my Agent on this matter and he says he has heard nothing about it...He said when your policy come up for renewal if there is a change it will state it... I guess I will have to wait until then which is two more months.




Steven 91 Blk/Ivory
 
I got my insurance renewal today from Allstate, and it has the following revision

"... we have added an exclusion specifying that coverage does not apply to bodily injury or property arising out of the participation in any prearranged or organized: racing contest; speed contest; use of the insured vehicle at a track or course designed for racing or high performance driving; or in practice or preparation for any contest or use of this type"

To make things worse, I have already signed up and paid for a HPDE event at Lime Rock on Nov 9. Looks like I'm going to lose my entry fee, because clearly I am not covered now.
 
I solved this problem by picking up a less expensive car: 91 MR2 na. It is a cool sport car to have and is cheaper to replace than the NSX. It is only 1/4th of the price. I drove the NSX every now and then at the 1/8, but not for the auto-x that i am planning to do.
 
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