• Protip: Profile posts are public! Use Conversations to message other members privately. Everyone can see the content of a profile post.

New build components...

nsxotic911

nsxotic911

Legendary Member
Joined
6 November 2006
Messages
3,359
Location
Austin, TX
I may very well start a new motor build soon. I have been talking to Shad @ DA for the work. Here is the current work order.

Car is a 98 3.2 with 90K miles AEM/SC making about 370RWHP at the moment. I'd like to make 400-420RWHP ..safely... I want to stay with OEM, hardened OEM, Toda or maybe some other reputable Japanese brand, and stay away from US Manufacturer...no offense..

Current list:
  • Toda Oil Billet Gear & Toda Timing Belt
  • OEM Harmonic Balancer.
  • TitaniumDaves Timing Belt Tensioner. (in process)
  • OEM New Harmonic Balancer
  • TitaniumDave Harmonic Balancer shield (in process)
  • ARP Head Kit
  • AEM FIC...though I have RC Injectors. Hopefully this will work..

Investigating.. ...:
 
Last edited:
You should add my/ DA billet mains W/ an ARP stud kit :wink:

You should see some pics why from Shad soon.
 
My stock main caps bent side-to-side about .010 on a motor with 425 rwhp. Put yours on a flat table and see if they rock. Program Engineering back east has made most of the NSX caps I know of. Less than $500 bucks as I remember for mine but the lead time can be a problem. In addition, you'll need an align bore/hone from a GOOD machine shop. Another $300 -$400 bucks. Did my engine have any issue with slightly bent main caps? Not really, but it's not right.
 
Mark911 said:
My stock main caps bent side-to-side about .010 on a motor with 425 rwhp. Put yours on a flat table and see if they rock. Program Engineering back east has made most of the NSX caps I know of. Less than $500 bucks as I remember for mine but the lead time can be a problem. In addition, you'll need an align bore/hone from a GOOD machine shop. Another $300 -$400 bucks. Did my engine have any issue with slightly bent main caps? Not really, but it's not right.
Click to expand...

We're talking about the 6 dollar oem plugs right vs billet alum?

Stephen
 
sduffass said:
We're talking about the 6 dollar oem plugs right vs billet alum?

Stephen
Click to expand...

Not sure exactly what you mean but Program Eng offers several different kinds of materials/alloys for main caps. My are 4040 steel, more than two times the tensile strength of cast iron. 7075 alum is an option, but it's not that much stronger than the stock items, although the CTE is much closer to the block material.
 
Current list:

Toda Oil Billet Gear & Toda Timing Belt
OEM Harmonic Balancer.
TitaniumDaves Timing Belt Tensioner. (in process) UMM USA
OEM New Harmonic Balancer
TitaniumDave Harmonic Balancer shield (in process) USA
ARP Head Kit USA
AEM FIC...though I have RC Injectors. Hopefully this will work.. USA
 
01blacks4 said:
Current list:

Toda Oil Billet Gear & Toda Timing Belt
OEM Harmonic Balancer.
TitaniumDaves Timing Belt Tensioner. (in process) UMM USA
OEM New Harmonic Balancer
TitaniumDave Harmonic Balancer shield (in process) USA
ARP Head Kit USA
AEM FIC...though I have RC Injectors. Hopefully this will work.. USA
Click to expand...

I was thinking the same thing.
 
For added twist.. I talked to Shad today and he says we can doo 400, 420 even as high as 450 with the strong rleatively stock 3.2 + motor and a high boost pulley on either of the charges (Whipple or Autorotor) mainly with a thicker headgasket lowering compression to slightly under 10:1. No new piston, rods or crank required......

:eek:

I'm sure we'll have dissenters here, let's hear it!

The Autorotor is something I'm looking at..but Shad says with a good tune, the Whipple can make just as much power, it's just a.. little bit harder.. Hard call to make :cool:

Anyone know if I can sell my Whipple for anything on the street?
 
Last edited:
slownsxt said:
... I want to stay with OEM, hardened OEM, Toda or maybe some other reputable Japanese brand, and stay away from US Manufacturer...no offense.
[/LIST]
Click to expand...

Having built a LOT of Honda motors, I have to chuckle at this.

Toda's greatest feat of engineering is constructing prices that are completely out of line with the quality of their products. They re-use basic components from other manufacturers (eg. Toyota throttle bodies) and jack the prices through the roof. They hack up OEM parts (nsx stroker crank) and charge a fortune for them. Or, if a part requires actual technical expertise to produce, they outsource it to someone like Cosworth and put their logo on it. And, they consistently misrepresent their product specs.

Don't get me wrong, some of their parts are decent (they make a solid B series cam, not great, but pretty good), but they don't make anything that isn't out-performed by several lower cost parts from other companies.

I know you are not going to change your mind but almost any solid US manufacture builds better quality parts than Toda. But, its your money. . .


BTW - don't go nuts on your build. You are not really looking for much power and the motor (except for the cast pistons) is rock solid from the factory.
 
David said:
Having built a LOT of Honda motors, I have to chuckle at this.

Toda's greatest feat of engineering is constructing prices that are completely out of line with the quality of their products. They re-use basic components from other manufacturers (eg. Toyota throttle bodies) and jack the prices through the roof. They hack up OEM parts (nsx stroker crank) and charge a fortune for them.............
Click to expand...

Like the NSX Adj. cam gears (from Toda) are stock Honda gears drilled with an Adj. ring added :wink:

Buy the CT Cam gears.
 
David said:
Having built a LOT of Honda motors, I have to chuckle at this.

Toda's greatest feat of engineering is constructing prices that are completely out of line with the quality of their products. They re-use basic components from other manufacturers (eg. Toyota throttle bodies) and jack the prices through the roof. They hack up OEM parts (nsx stroker crank) and charge a fortune for them. Or, if a part requires actual technical expertise to produce, they outsource it to someone like Cosworth and put their logo on it. And, they consistently misrepresent their product specs.

Don't get me wrong, some of their parts are decent (they make a solid B series cam, not great, but pretty good), but they don't make anything that isn't out-performed by several lower cost parts from other companies.

I know you are not going to change your mind but almost any solid US manufacture builds better quality parts than Toda. But, its your money. . .


BTW - don't go nuts on your build. You are not really looking for much power and the motor (except for the cast pistons) is rock solid from the factory.
Click to expand...

Well, likely the only two parts I'll be getting is the Toda Billet Gears and the Toda timing belt. The gears are $500, which is in line with other off the shelf parts, and the timing belt is $200 vs $100.

My frustration is that this build would probably not have been necessary had the fancy titanium retainers from a unknown/undisclosed manufcaturer been put in my car! I don't know who these guys are, what the quality assurance process is, whether they've had problems etc.. The one manfuctaturer I suspected might be it, didn't return two of my phone calls!

If something fails in the future, I'd rather know it's OEM or Toda.... which have a clear reputation. I have a hard time believing that though since they build 3.5 race car engines. I may very well go with some US manufacturer, but I'd like to know who they are, what their reputation is, whether they have had failures (everyone does) and what was done about it. Am I being too anal?

No, it's my 20K engine, 10K supercharger and 10k rebuild. I want to make a calculated risk decision rather than "ooh here, install this cool part.." I know "CT" parts are good, but many of them are also outsourced and CT has mentioned to me that they've had bad batches, in some cases, with their spiffy spring + retainers... Does that mean you shouldn't get them? No, it just means that you can't assume that the risk of them being bad is zero and that CT is able to know this before putting them in your car.

For the parts that they make in-house, or oversee, I have more confidence in.
 
Last edited:
David said:
Having built a LOT of Honda motors, I have to chuckle at this.

Toda's greatest feat of engineering is constructing prices that are completely out of line with the quality of their products. They re-use basic components from other manufacturers (eg. Toyota throttle bodies) and jack the prices through the roof. They hack up OEM parts (nsx stroker crank) and charge a fortune for them. Or, if a part requires actual technical expertise to produce, they outsource it to someone like Cosworth and put their logo on it. And, they consistently misrepresent their product specs.

Don't get me wrong, some of their parts are decent (they make a solid B series cam, not great, but pretty good), but they don't make anything that isn't out-performed by several lower cost parts from other companies.

I know you are not going to change your mind but almost any solid US manufacture builds better quality parts than Toda. But, its your money. . .


BTW - don't go nuts on your build. You are not really looking for much power and the motor (except for the cast pistons) is rock solid from the factory.
Click to expand...

David is on the right track here , Honda put a lot of engineering (read money) into the NSX engine.
Trying to re-engineer it is very difficult.
Addressing the main weak points is ok , but you are not looking for a huge HP level and I think maintaining stock reliability / driveability is worth a lot.
The minute you start altering c/r , cams , bore/stroke , port shapes/volumes , you will lose something somewhere else , be it driveability , life span or reliability or what have you .
The main reason why people like turbo hondas is that they have higher compression , giving great response , with the recent popularity of methanol injection and other great tuning aids , lower compression is becoming totally unnecesary.
 
Toda "hacks" up OEM cranks to make strokers? I don't buy that. And he doesn't "want" much HP??? While Shad seems to be almost a god sent for us, Comptech has made bad parts, I've bought em. I agree asking this bunch of part time mechanics(myself included) is almost a waste of time if you have Shads ear. If you are going FI you won't be winding high so you won't even need or want the valve retainers, right? And you may not want cams either. Here again, Shad is the one to ask, but I believe it's the cams and the retainers that are the short life items. Their HP gain is modest i believe. So skip-em for better piece of mind if you want.
 
David - Could you provide some source or reference to your assertion?

Are you saying that the parts toda has on their race cars, are different than what they sell?

If that's the case, than I could see there being some truth to it, but if not, I can't see how they would skimp out on their race engines..

I agree with you on the OEM NSX parts. Based on this discussion and Shad discussing daily, I will go with a lot fewer Toda parts.. if any. Probably looking at just the gears and the timing belt.

With CT parts, afaik, they are not truly "CT" parts - they are bought from other, mainly US manufacturers.

In the past, some parts have been bad, with destructive consequenecs... and I haven't (heard) of the same with Today. Hopefully that doesn't happen now....

I'm only brainstorming parts list here, and this is a good discussion.

Thanks for all the feedback.
-Paul
 

Similar threads

Aargh
  • Locked
***SOLD*** 1991 NSX 5-speed 74K Berlina Black/Ivory Interior JH4NA1159MT001038
Replies
3
Views
2K
Aargh
Aargh
MotorMouth93
High Compression 3.2L Engine Build
2 3
Replies
59
Views
8K
MotorMouth93
MotorMouth93
LooseNut
  • Locked
SOLD! 1994 NSX For Sale 66k miles 2 owners Comptech SC
Replies
2
Views
2K
LooseNut
LooseNut
SLAM
  • Locked
1991 NSX coupe Black/Black 5-Speed 99636 JH4NA1155MT000985
Replies
19
Views
12K
SLAM
SLAM
Big McLargeHuge
Big McLargeHuge’s 1990 JDM NSX Adventure Thread
14 15 16
Replies
388
Views
58K
Big McLargeHuge
Big McLargeHuge
Back
Top