I am going to focus on setting up my suspension this year while I am getting the motor built may as well set it up. There are some things that are way too technical for me and as it sits the nsx abilities far exceed my driving abilities but none the less I would like it as balanced as possible for my needs. The car is a 93 with 500 hp turbo and kw3 suspension. I do not know what the settings are at. It is pretty low ride height and I like it like that. I have volk gtv 18/19 setup with toyo t1r on front and r888 on back. The two things I am not wiling to change are the ride height and wheels. Open to all other suggestions. I do have an upgraded rear sway bar to accomodate the turbo kit (I will find the details on that ) but from what I have read this will make the back end tighter where my front end should be tighter with different compound tires front to back. What is the non compliance stuff and would these parts help my situation. What about allignment specs? My driving style is this/ I never track the car and never will. I drag race every opportunity I get on the streets. I do high speed highway runs in excess of 150 regularly with flats, hills, and sweeping corners. The car feels great and I don't feel like there is a deficiency or anything I just want it as dialed in as it can be for my purposes. I have had mixed reviews about different compound tires and trust me if they made a matching set in my size I would get the r888. I did have the t1r all the way around before and I was not impressed with the rear traction. Thanks a lot for your help.
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Need advice
- Thread starter kevgk
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Well, you're already aware that the tires are an issue, and that the limitations arise from the 18"/19" wheels. There just aren't any R compound track tires in the front size of 215/35-18. Having really sticky tires on the rear and not on the front is just fine for the dragstrip, but if you're doing anything involving cornering, it's a prescription for severe understeer (in which the car tends to "plow" straight ahead when you try to turn). You can get the Sumitomo HTR Z III in that size for the front; it's somewhat stickier than the T1R, but it's a street tire (and not even an extreme performance street tire) so it won't make the understeer go away. So your options are (a) keep using what you've got, with severe understeer; (b) switch to the HTR Z III in front, still with severe understeer but slightly less; (c) get HTR Z III front and rear, which will reduce/eliminate the understeer but with which you will almost certainly not be impressed by the rear traction; or (d) get a different set of wheels, for which you can get stickier tires front and rear but which you say you don't want to do.
Oh, and don't be a fool. I strongly recommend that you STOP drag racing on the street. We've had enough reports here of NSXprime members who have passed away. We don't need another one. Take it to the dragstrip, which is designed for that purpose. And take it to the track if you want to learn how your car handles/corners without endangering others.
Oh, and don't be a fool. I strongly recommend that you STOP drag racing on the street. We've had enough reports here of NSXprime members who have passed away. We don't need another one. Take it to the dragstrip, which is designed for that purpose. And take it to the track if you want to learn how your car handles/corners without endangering others.
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Thanks for the advice. I always make sure the streets are safe and empty when I do foolish things endangering only myself. (Not really because like I said I do not push my car to near its limits). The reason i know this is because i have never felt the understeer you describe not even once. To rephrase "spirited light to light pulls". I may pick up a set of the stickier fronts that you mentioned if it will help. I do have access to a set of goodyear f1 assumetric I heard they are stickier than t1r also? In Canada tracks are few and far between and unfortunatey the general public is not a fan of motorsports like in the USA where tracks are plentiful comparatively.
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There are a lot of things going on in this post that concern me.
Considering your goal is mostly drag racing, I understand why you want a softer tire in the rear. But as NSXTASY already pointed out, that setup is really hard to overcome for handling with suspension. It is arguable that tires have the greatest impact on handling. Really soft rears with less sticky fronts will create a car that understeers badly.
When you say “upgraded” rear bar I assume you mean stiffer than stock. And I am not sure I understand what you mean by “make the back end tighter” and “front end should be tighter”.
A stiffer rear bar would increase oversteer (decrease understeer). I don’t know how that accommodates the extra HP from the turbo. It would make power-on corner exit even scarier, but maybe not so badly with the severe tire mismatch, but even so, I can’t imagine trying to control this car powering out of a turn. Either way, I cannot imagine a rear swaybar stiff enough to account for such a mismatch of tires. If you are trying to reduce understeer due to the rear tires being very sticky compared to the front, a stiffer front bar would make understeer even worse. I know it is counter-intuitive but look up wikipedia for why this happens. So, if you are trying to compensate for the tire mismatch, going with a stiffer front bar is not the way to do it. You can actually go to a softer front bar (if one is available).
I am not even going to attempt to respond to this.
With the setup you have, if you have not noticed a deficiency, then you are not even close to pushing the car laterally. And given the tone of your post here and how badly the car seems to be set up now based on your description, I think that is a really good thing for you and those around you.
We appreciate you asking here and we will try to help, but please expect us to be less than forgiving when you admit to such shenanigans, no matter how desolate the roads and careful you say you try to be. We’d really hate to hear that something happened, and hate even more to hear that it involved another innocent party.
(This isn’t a troll post, is it? I’ll give the OP the benefit of the doubt.)
As far as alignment, we’d need to know much more info before we can say anything about that, such as, which sways, tires, sways you end up with, and what your shock and spring specs are.
As far as tires go, I'll let others post as to availability to stickier sizes for the fronts.
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Wait. You're in BC. Is this km/hr or mph/hr? If km/hr, not as much as a big deal, sorry, but comments I didn't actually make about street hooliganism would still apply.
This is important to know for next steps to make. However, if you know how the car is behaving you can start from there to make adjustments, although having the specs would make it much easier to provide advice.
Considering your goal is mostly drag racing, I understand why you want a softer tire in the rear. But as NSXTASY already pointed out, that setup is really hard to overcome for handling with suspension. It is arguable that tires have the greatest impact on handling. Really soft rears with less sticky fronts will create a car that understeers badly.
When you say “upgraded” rear bar I assume you mean stiffer than stock. And I am not sure I understand what you mean by “make the back end tighter” and “front end should be tighter”.
A stiffer rear bar would increase oversteer (decrease understeer). I don’t know how that accommodates the extra HP from the turbo. It would make power-on corner exit even scarier, but maybe not so badly with the severe tire mismatch, but even so, I can’t imagine trying to control this car powering out of a turn. Either way, I cannot imagine a rear swaybar stiff enough to account for such a mismatch of tires. If you are trying to reduce understeer due to the rear tires being very sticky compared to the front, a stiffer front bar would make understeer even worse. I know it is counter-intuitive but look up wikipedia for why this happens. So, if you are trying to compensate for the tire mismatch, going with a stiffer front bar is not the way to do it. You can actually go to a softer front bar (if one is available).
I am not even going to attempt to respond to this.
With the setup you have, if you have not noticed a deficiency, then you are not even close to pushing the car laterally. And given the tone of your post here and how badly the car seems to be set up now based on your description, I think that is a really good thing for you and those around you.
We appreciate you asking here and we will try to help, but please expect us to be less than forgiving when you admit to such shenanigans, no matter how desolate the roads and careful you say you try to be. We’d really hate to hear that something happened, and hate even more to hear that it involved another innocent party.
(This isn’t a troll post, is it? I’ll give the OP the benefit of the doubt.)
As far as alignment, we’d need to know much more info before we can say anything about that, such as, which sways, tires, sways you end up with, and what your shock and spring specs are.
As far as tires go, I'll let others post as to availability to stickier sizes for the fronts.
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Wait. You're in BC. Is this km/hr or mph/hr? If km/hr, not as much as a big deal, sorry, but comments I didn't actually make about street hooliganism would still apply.
Assuming you mean the Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric summer tire (and not the one specifically called the Goodyear Eagle F1 Asymmetric All-Season), yes, it's stickier than the T1R, and similar in grip to the Sumitomo HTR Z III mentioned above. However, it's not available in 215/35-18 for the NSX front. And you will still have significant understeer when used with the R888, just like you would with that Sumitomo tire.
Dquarasr2: I feel like I should get a fresh start here before we get into a tiff. My objective on my post is to gain information and perhaps find a guy or a shop that can set up my suspension to its most functional ability based on some asthetics that I like,as mentioned. I don'y know shit about suspension other than theres some tires and wheels and shocks and stuff. I purchased my car set up how it is, therefore I dont know what it is set at. What I want is some help, guidance and advice to reach my goals for the car WHICH ARE: a decent handling and safe setup. For all I know things are waaaay waaaaay off and this is why: because I purchased my car used and have not driven another nsx in any spirited sort of context. But have driven a few mellowly ...not enough speed to give my opinion on their handling comparison capabilities. Although I did own an Intergra type r for like 8 years which I pushed to the brink (amazing car btw) Ive just been timid with the nsx. So if you know where I can start that would be appreciated. Even better if you want to offer your services maybe we can arrange something. I confirm your point of never pushed the car to its extremes laterally, and this is due to my request. FUNTIONAL AND SAFE SETUP. I drive fast Im not stupid so put away the deroggatory comments please.
I figured I could count on this amazing community for HELP. Hence the posting title.
NSXtasy: I hear what you are saying, but would it make sense that if the car is throwing down more power, and with the thicker rear sway bar as the other poster mentioned it would even things out somewhat? What if I had toyo t1r on the back too or any matching set don't you think the extra power exiting corners would create and insane amount of oversteer and the car will be all over the place (back end)? I can see how its not ideal and Im trying to understand this stuff a bit. Ps I had matching toyo t1r when I had my supercharger at only 350 hp the back had poor traction at best. Do you think Im even warming up the rear tires enough to have them operate ideally? Oh and I can get the discontinued goodyear will has a pair. Maybe this additional info helps you
I figured I could count on this amazing community for HELP. Hence the posting title.
NSXtasy: I hear what you are saying, but would it make sense that if the car is throwing down more power, and with the thicker rear sway bar as the other poster mentioned it would even things out somewhat? What if I had toyo t1r on the back too or any matching set don't you think the extra power exiting corners would create and insane amount of oversteer and the car will be all over the place (back end)? I can see how its not ideal and Im trying to understand this stuff a bit. Ps I had matching toyo t1r when I had my supercharger at only 350 hp the back had poor traction at best. Do you think Im even warming up the rear tires enough to have them operate ideally? Oh and I can get the discontinued goodyear will has a pair. Maybe this additional info helps you
I don’t think we need a fresh start as I don’t think we are approaching a tiff. (I also didn’t think my comments were derogatory, either. Generally, posts here on Prime mentioning street racing have historically been met with a severe backlash and then a debate from those who do engage in that activity, and it sometimes devolves.) I agree, let’s put all that aside.
I think the core problem is that you are trying to satisfy conflicting goals. Strong traction digging out of a dead stop and maximum, safe cornering are difficult, if not impossible, to maximize at the same time. That goes for any car, not just and NSX, whose strengths are in high handling prowess.
Here’s why: for drag racing, you’d obviously want maximum grip tires on the rear, whether they are matched by maximum grip in the front (although you could also mention that low rolling resistance tires in the front helps marginally, and such tires are not strong on grip). You’d also want weight transfer from front to back to put weight on the rear tires for good hook up.
To get good weight transfer, you’d want springs and shocks to encourage that weight transfer. For instance, if you have double-adjustable shocks, you’d want rebound really soft in the front, and compression really soft in the rear. If you have only single-adjustable shocks (most adjustable shocks adjust rebound only), you’d want to go really soft in the front, rebound on rear would not matter much for weight transfer front/rear.
But that would really change handling characteristics. For good handling, you want excellent balance front-to-rear, so that understeer and oversteer are about the same.
On to alignment: for good handling, on an NSX, you’d want negative camber all the way around (there are tons of threads here on Prime for alignment specs for good handling, please refer to them) to maximize tire contact patch on the ground when the car is leaning in turns, but for drag racing, on the rear, you’d want as much of the contact patch in the ground in a straight line, so you’d want zero camber. Same compromises for toe.
As far as compliance setup, I understand that for handling you can get away with less toe-out in the rear (normally an NSX would be set up with a fair amount of toe-in at the rear), possible even going to zero toe. That would also help with straight-ahead traction.
So, the problem is the conflicting goals.
There are also certain R-compound tires that are better than others at longitudinal grip. For instance, Kumho Victoracers are pretty decent laterally (but not nearly as good as things like Hoosier, Toyo RA1 or 888, to name a few), but are better longitudinally. I can’t speak of the Toyo 888, or of the other tires you are considering. IN GENERAL, tires with a somewhat stiffer sidewall tend to be better for lateral grip but not as good for longitudinal grip.
If you were going for maximum drag race grip, you might want to look into drag radials. These are excellent for drag racing, and only marginal for lateral grip. This might be the ticket considering it might be a better match for lateral grip compared to what you can buy for the front. This might balance the car front-to-rear better than Toyo 888, which is a DOT R-compound road-racing tire. Drag radials are available from Nitto, Hoosier, and BFG. I’ll leave it up to you to determine if they are available in rear sizes for your wheels.
Considering the NSX was designed primarily for handling, if it were my car, I’d be going for optimal handling and balance, and I’d live with the compromise in drag racing such a setup would result in. But it’s not my car. So you’d have to prioritize what you want from the car and act accordingly.
If you really do want to go with good, safe, handling, then you'd for sure want to match tires front to rear. There are so many threads here on great tires in your sizes. I'd start there, then see how the car handles. If you are worried about power oversteer, you could remove or disconnect the rear bar altogether. Some NSX trackers have tried that with good results.
I don’t know if this helped.
I think the core problem is that you are trying to satisfy conflicting goals. Strong traction digging out of a dead stop and maximum, safe cornering are difficult, if not impossible, to maximize at the same time. That goes for any car, not just and NSX, whose strengths are in high handling prowess.
Here’s why: for drag racing, you’d obviously want maximum grip tires on the rear, whether they are matched by maximum grip in the front (although you could also mention that low rolling resistance tires in the front helps marginally, and such tires are not strong on grip). You’d also want weight transfer from front to back to put weight on the rear tires for good hook up.
To get good weight transfer, you’d want springs and shocks to encourage that weight transfer. For instance, if you have double-adjustable shocks, you’d want rebound really soft in the front, and compression really soft in the rear. If you have only single-adjustable shocks (most adjustable shocks adjust rebound only), you’d want to go really soft in the front, rebound on rear would not matter much for weight transfer front/rear.
But that would really change handling characteristics. For good handling, you want excellent balance front-to-rear, so that understeer and oversteer are about the same.
On to alignment: for good handling, on an NSX, you’d want negative camber all the way around (there are tons of threads here on Prime for alignment specs for good handling, please refer to them) to maximize tire contact patch on the ground when the car is leaning in turns, but for drag racing, on the rear, you’d want as much of the contact patch in the ground in a straight line, so you’d want zero camber. Same compromises for toe.
As far as compliance setup, I understand that for handling you can get away with less toe-out in the rear (normally an NSX would be set up with a fair amount of toe-in at the rear), possible even going to zero toe. That would also help with straight-ahead traction.
So, the problem is the conflicting goals.
There are also certain R-compound tires that are better than others at longitudinal grip. For instance, Kumho Victoracers are pretty decent laterally (but not nearly as good as things like Hoosier, Toyo RA1 or 888, to name a few), but are better longitudinally. I can’t speak of the Toyo 888, or of the other tires you are considering. IN GENERAL, tires with a somewhat stiffer sidewall tend to be better for lateral grip but not as good for longitudinal grip.
If you were going for maximum drag race grip, you might want to look into drag radials. These are excellent for drag racing, and only marginal for lateral grip. This might be the ticket considering it might be a better match for lateral grip compared to what you can buy for the front. This might balance the car front-to-rear better than Toyo 888, which is a DOT R-compound road-racing tire. Drag radials are available from Nitto, Hoosier, and BFG. I’ll leave it up to you to determine if they are available in rear sizes for your wheels.
Considering the NSX was designed primarily for handling, if it were my car, I’d be going for optimal handling and balance, and I’d live with the compromise in drag racing such a setup would result in. But it’s not my car. So you’d have to prioritize what you want from the car and act accordingly.
If you really do want to go with good, safe, handling, then you'd for sure want to match tires front to rear. There are so many threads here on great tires in your sizes. I'd start there, then see how the car handles. If you are worried about power oversteer, you could remove or disconnect the rear bar altogether. Some NSX trackers have tried that with good results.
I don’t know if this helped.
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Yes that really helps a lot. I didn't know there is such a diverse difference between setups. It is definitely more important to me to have the lateral grip and balance better than straight line since I do a fair amount of highway driving and road trips and such. If I wanted a drag purpose car I would get a fox mustang or something. So choosing matching tires will be something I can research and get done over winter here. I have negative camber which my rears have lots of as I have stock camber adjustments and car is pretty low. I can adjust fronts to ad camber. I have a question about toe: Can you please clarify rear toe you said normally "less rear toe" and in the same sentence "more toe in". This means the front side of the rear tire is tracking (pointing) inwards right? Or should be ? I always thought opposite. Shows how much I know lol. And what is compliance and what does it mean? There is all sorts of "non compliance" stuff for sale on SOS and other sites. What does this do? Thanks so much for your time. Oh ya the previous owner of my car had the suspension installed and allignment done at SOS so I presume they had a pretty decent baseline set up on it there.
Here comes a long post. If you don't want to read the whole thing, you can skip down to the bolded summary of my recommendations to you at the end.
You're looking for the best handling - the ability to corner fast, safely, and comfortably. But you're WAY too fixated on the suspension and alignment as the determining factors in handling, when at best they are a distant third. Especially when the NSX already starts out with an excellent stock suspension, balanced and neutral, and presumably Science of Speed already made marginal improvements in it as well. I'll say it again: The suspension and alignment don't matter as much as other factors.
The second most important factor in handling is the tires, and their ability to grip the road. This includes the type of tires, the make/model of tires, and the pressure in them. Let's look at various types of tires on the marketplace first, and then we'll talk about what is best for your NSX. We'll go in order of traction, starting with the stickiest tires:
Various categories of all-season tires are designed for use in a wide variety of weather conditions, from extreme cold and light snow to hot summer days. They are a compromise; in exchange for the ability to operate in a wider range of temperatures, they don't grip as well in warmer temperatures as summer tires, and they don't grip as well in frigid temperatures as winter tires. They also last a lot longer than summer tires. They are the most commonly used tires on vehicles other than high-performance sports and high-end luxury cars.
For the best, most neutral handling, it's best to use four tires of the same make/model; if you can't do that, they should at least be in the same performance category (among those listed above). If you have tires that differ substantially in grip, front vs rear, that introduces an undesirable variable into the handling. When the front tires grip more than the rear, you have oversteer; when you turn the wheel, the car wants to turn even more, and a spin can result. When the rear tires grip more than the front, you have understeer; when you turn the wheel, the car wants to plow straight ahead. And if you have different tires on the front and rear, this variable can change at a moment's notice; maybe your rear tires grip better on dry pavement (so the car understeers), but you hit a wet patch or it starts to rain, and then your front tires grip better (so the car oversteers). Or, vice versa. So to maximize your handling, it's best to use four tires of the same make/model, or at least the same performance category. I would absolutely NOT recommend mixing R compound track tires with any street tire, especially a poor-performing one like the Toyo T1R.
You seem to be seeking the best performance in brisk street driving. The best setup for this purpose is four extreme performance tires. Unfortunately, none of these tires are available in 18"/19" sizes for the NSX (215/35-18 and either 265/30-19 or 275/30-19), so if you're wedded to those wheels, your best setup is four maximum performance summer tires such as the Sumitomo HTR Z III, which is a very good tire of this type. If you want better grip, you might want to consider getting some 17"/18" wheels, which permit the use of tires in 215/40-17 and either 255/35-18 or 265/35-18; extreme performance tires available in those sizes include the Dunlop Direzza ZII Star Spec, the Yokohama Advan Neova AD08R, and the Falken Azenis RT-615K.
I would not recommend R compound track tires like the R888 for street use. They will never get a chance to warm up and reach their potential grip when used on streets or highways. Use the track tires on the racetrack, not on the street.
If you've read this far, you may be wondering what the most important factor in handling is, even more important than the suspension or the tires. That's the driver. An experienced driver can make a car handle far, far better than an inexperienced driver, even if the car has less sticky tires and a less compliant suspension. People who have never driven on a racetrack - and I can tell from your post that this includes you (no offense, we all started as beginners) - say things like, "Oh, I'm a fast driver; I've driven my car XXX miles an hour!" Then they go to their first racetrack event, often with a high-horsepower great-handling car, and they find themselves being passed by more experienced drivers in cars that have far less capabilities in the way of horsepower, tires, and suspension. It really is ALL ABOUT THE DRIVER.
SUMMARY
My recommendations to you are these: (1) Leave the suspension alone, and if you have had an alignment done to the factory specs, leave that alone as well. At this point any changes in tires and the driver are far, far more important. (2) Get a set of four matching tires. If you really want to maximize your car's street performance, get a set of 17"/18" wheels and slap four sticky extreme performance tires on them; if you can't get new wheels, get four of the Sumitomo HTR Z III maximum performance tire for them. (3) Sign up for some on-track drivers schools. I'm not familiar with tracks in BC that might be closer to you, but I know Pacific Raceways outside Seattle, which hosted NSXPO 2008, is a fun track where drivers schools are held by various organizations.
HTH!
You're looking for the best handling - the ability to corner fast, safely, and comfortably. But you're WAY too fixated on the suspension and alignment as the determining factors in handling, when at best they are a distant third. Especially when the NSX already starts out with an excellent stock suspension, balanced and neutral, and presumably Science of Speed already made marginal improvements in it as well. I'll say it again: The suspension and alignment don't matter as much as other factors.
The second most important factor in handling is the tires, and their ability to grip the road. This includes the type of tires, the make/model of tires, and the pressure in them. Let's look at various types of tires on the marketplace first, and then we'll talk about what is best for your NSX. We'll go in order of traction, starting with the stickiest tires:
- Drag radials are the stickiest tires you can buy. They are very expensive and they don't last very long. They are designed for drag racing at the dragstrip, with the best traction in a straight line; design features include big tread blocks, a very soft compound, and sidewalls that can deform without problems. The reason for this last feature is that, at the dragstrip, racers reduce the pressure in their rear tires to increase the size of the contact patch (the area of the tire that comes into contact with the pavement).
- R compound track tires, or "R comps", are designed for maximum grip on the racetrack, especially while cornering. (Most are designed for maximum grip on dry pavement, although there are special rain tires designed for maximum grip when it's wet.) They are very expensive and they don't last very long. Design features include big tread blocks (and, on some R comps, no tread blocks at all, only one or two circumferential grooves), a very soft compound, and relatively stiff sidewalls to help maintain grip while cornering. By design, they don't reach their maximum grip until they heat up to operating temperature on the racetrack; they can seem surprisingly traction-less until that point. Also, when pushed to their limits, they don't give much warning (e.g. squealing) before losing grip; for this reason, they are recommended only for those with significant racetrack experience.
- "Extreme performance summer tires" are the stickiest tires designed for use on public roads (streets and highways). They are relatively expensive (although not as much as the two previous types) and they tend to wear rather quickly (although again, not as much as the two previous types). They are designed for maximum grip, especially while cornering, primarily on dry pavement. Grip in rain varies from tire to tire but is usually better than the previous group. Since they are street tires, they do not need to get hot to reach their maximum grip, the way R comps do.
- "Maximum performance summer tires" are designed for excellent grip, although not quite as much as the extreme performance tires; in exchange, they last significantly longer. On wet pavement, they also grip as well as, sometimes even better than, the extreme performance tires.
- "Ultra high performance summer tires" are designed for a combination of performance/grip and value. Grip is significantly less than the maximum performance tires; in exchange, they usually cost significantly less. They typically last as long as the maximum performance tires.
Various categories of all-season tires are designed for use in a wide variety of weather conditions, from extreme cold and light snow to hot summer days. They are a compromise; in exchange for the ability to operate in a wider range of temperatures, they don't grip as well in warmer temperatures as summer tires, and they don't grip as well in frigid temperatures as winter tires. They also last a lot longer than summer tires. They are the most commonly used tires on vehicles other than high-performance sports and high-end luxury cars.
For the best, most neutral handling, it's best to use four tires of the same make/model; if you can't do that, they should at least be in the same performance category (among those listed above). If you have tires that differ substantially in grip, front vs rear, that introduces an undesirable variable into the handling. When the front tires grip more than the rear, you have oversteer; when you turn the wheel, the car wants to turn even more, and a spin can result. When the rear tires grip more than the front, you have understeer; when you turn the wheel, the car wants to plow straight ahead. And if you have different tires on the front and rear, this variable can change at a moment's notice; maybe your rear tires grip better on dry pavement (so the car understeers), but you hit a wet patch or it starts to rain, and then your front tires grip better (so the car oversteers). Or, vice versa. So to maximize your handling, it's best to use four tires of the same make/model, or at least the same performance category. I would absolutely NOT recommend mixing R compound track tires with any street tire, especially a poor-performing one like the Toyo T1R.
You seem to be seeking the best performance in brisk street driving. The best setup for this purpose is four extreme performance tires. Unfortunately, none of these tires are available in 18"/19" sizes for the NSX (215/35-18 and either 265/30-19 or 275/30-19), so if you're wedded to those wheels, your best setup is four maximum performance summer tires such as the Sumitomo HTR Z III, which is a very good tire of this type. If you want better grip, you might want to consider getting some 17"/18" wheels, which permit the use of tires in 215/40-17 and either 255/35-18 or 265/35-18; extreme performance tires available in those sizes include the Dunlop Direzza ZII Star Spec, the Yokohama Advan Neova AD08R, and the Falken Azenis RT-615K.
I would not recommend R compound track tires like the R888 for street use. They will never get a chance to warm up and reach their potential grip when used on streets or highways. Use the track tires on the racetrack, not on the street.
If you've read this far, you may be wondering what the most important factor in handling is, even more important than the suspension or the tires. That's the driver. An experienced driver can make a car handle far, far better than an inexperienced driver, even if the car has less sticky tires and a less compliant suspension. People who have never driven on a racetrack - and I can tell from your post that this includes you (no offense, we all started as beginners) - say things like, "Oh, I'm a fast driver; I've driven my car XXX miles an hour!" Then they go to their first racetrack event, often with a high-horsepower great-handling car, and they find themselves being passed by more experienced drivers in cars that have far less capabilities in the way of horsepower, tires, and suspension. It really is ALL ABOUT THE DRIVER.
SUMMARY
My recommendations to you are these: (1) Leave the suspension alone, and if you have had an alignment done to the factory specs, leave that alone as well. At this point any changes in tires and the driver are far, far more important. (2) Get a set of four matching tires. If you really want to maximize your car's street performance, get a set of 17"/18" wheels and slap four sticky extreme performance tires on them; if you can't get new wheels, get four of the Sumitomo HTR Z III maximum performance tire for them. (3) Sign up for some on-track drivers schools. I'm not familiar with tracks in BC that might be closer to you, but I know Pacific Raceways outside Seattle, which hosted NSXPO 2008, is a fun track where drivers schools are held by various organizations.
HTH!
Awesome information and it makes perfect sense about Mis matching tires. And no offense taken btw. Thats why I'm here to learn and become a better driver. I think there are track days at mission down by Vancouver pretty close to me. So I will be picking up a set of the sumitomo right away where is the best place - I have had good luck with tire rack. I will get the car on an allignment rack and see what the specs are at. You said leave the alignment specs stock but how can this be possible if the car is lowered and has the negative camber in the rear? Can you send a link to a helpful thread that discusses allignment specs for my needs please? Can you also touch on what non compliance is and if I would need any of that stuff? Thanks a tonne! K
As usual, NSXTASY delivered excellent advice.
I think even if you are lowered you will end up with alignment that would either fit within the stock alignment specs or be close. If lowered, you may end up with more negative camber than stock ride height, but that probably is not a problem.
If you are not tracking (yet) I wouldn't worry about the non-compliance bits. If you are not driving to the limits of the car yet, then the non-compliance bits won't help, yet. NSXTASY had great advice about driver improvement. Once you are pushing the car to its limits without those bits, you can then address its minor faults and make it even better. But if you are new to track driving then it could be a long time until you're ready to make further improvements to the setup. But do look into matching the tires front and rear. SOS setup will likely get you really, really close if not spot on to what you need, after you straighten out the tire situation.
I think even if you are lowered you will end up with alignment that would either fit within the stock alignment specs or be close. If lowered, you may end up with more negative camber than stock ride height, but that probably is not a problem.
If you are not tracking (yet) I wouldn't worry about the non-compliance bits. If you are not driving to the limits of the car yet, then the non-compliance bits won't help, yet. NSXTASY had great advice about driver improvement. Once you are pushing the car to its limits without those bits, you can then address its minor faults and make it even better. But if you are new to track driving then it could be a long time until you're ready to make further improvements to the setup. But do look into matching the tires front and rear. SOS setup will likely get you really, really close if not spot on to what you need, after you straighten out the tire situation.
Tire Rack is fine, as long as they'll ship north of the border. So is Discount Tire Direct, with the same stipulation. I know prices on this side of the border tend to be a lot lower than Canadian dealers, but you can try them as well. I know of two big dealers in BC that ship: 1010tires.com and TireTrends.com
As noted by dquarasr, you should be able to get pretty close to the stock specs.
Are you familiar with the NSX Wiki? It contains the answers to frequently asked questions, and you can access it by clicking "NSX Wiki" on the red bar at the top of this (and every) page on NSXprime. If you enter Alignment in the search box, it takes you to the Alignment section (or click here).
There are several non-compliance products for the suspension that you can get from Science of Speed; click here to read about them. There's also a very good write-up about suspension mods in the Wiki here. But I really don't think you need any of it at this point in time. Replace the tires, and start getting some track experience. Then decide. You may find that you like your suspension just fine. Or you may decide you want to make changes, but in areas other than the suspension. (FWIW, I never got any of the non-compliance parts for my NSX, and I was very happy with its handling, including over 13,000 actual track miles.)
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Tire Rack ships to Canada no problem. Acura dealers won't ship parts direct to Canada anymore though.:frown:
Great info guys. I just read that wiki on alligmmemt specs and it looks very technical and I would not want to mess anything up. I will be in search of a shop in bc or wa state that's capable of checking and getting this us properly. Someone who is confident with it. I have a mail box across the line so I usually go pick my orders up to save on shipping anyways. And the project begins.... Thanks again
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