Lots of options available

Olyar15 · 20 February 2015

According to this: http://www.edmunds.com/car-news/acura-dealers-to-stress-personalization-with-2016-acura-nsx.html there will be many options available to personalize the new NSX a. However, what worries me is the part about how dealers will require a special lift for the car.

Seriously, Honda? Why the fuck can't you design and engineer this Honda to be like all your other Hondas. I was hoping that this car would still be serviceable by DIYs and independent shops, at least for the basic things like oil changes, brake work, etc.

One of the best features of the original NSX was that, at its core, it was still a Honda, a sensibly engineered car that still shared components with all the other Hondas, that had provisions to use a hydraulic jack and jack stands so the owner can work on the car. I was really hoping that the new NSX a would be similar. Sigh.

nsxtacey · 20 February 2015

Most likely did it on purpose. Don't want people messing with it or modding it.
One article mentioned how Honda can tune it for more boost down the line for different version further down the car's cycle.

vf2ss · 20 February 2015

This statement:
"Accavitti said it is too early to predict what percentage of Acura's 273 dealers will sell the car. All of the requirements have not been determined. However, there will be special tools and possibly a special hoist to lift the car that could be costly."

Accavitti makes 4 assertions as Senior VP & GM in his quote:

1. not all dealerships will sell it
2. requirements to sell
3. special tools req'd (sounds definitive)
4. special hoist req'd (sounds speculative)

Stating that not all dealerships will sell the car was a given. However, to imply that they are not going to sell because there are requirements to do so instead of it just being due to lack of local demand/local order introduces problematic scenarios.

Is a requirement to sell a requirement to service? If that becomes the reason some dealerships can't or won't, that is going to be a brand damaging nightmare. Imagine buying the new NSX and then move to another city, your first scheduled maintenance is due, you drive to your local Acura dealership only to discover that (a) they don't have the special tools, and (b) they don't have the special lift. Options? Ship to the next nearest dealership to wherever you moved to that has met the requirements and entrust your car and your money with a bunch of people you have never met? Who will pay for the transport in this scenario? Going local obviously wouldn't work...not only are they missing the tools, but even if they try to hoist it up just to look around they could possibly damage it sounds like. Regardless, as a relatively new owner you would also be one rather peeved owner.

I cannot see how they will not make sure these scenarios are not some how addressed and resolved in a better customer-minded manner.

2slow2speed · 20 February 2015

vf2ss said:
This statement:
"Accavitti said it is too early to predict what percentage of Acura's 273 dealers will sell the car. All of the requirements have not been determined. However, there will be special tools and possibly a special hoist to lift the car that could be costly."

Accavitti makes 4 assertions as Senior VP & GM in his quote:

1. not all dealerships will sell it
2. requirements to sell
3. special tools req'd (sounds definitive)
4. special hoist req'd (sounds speculative)

Stating that not all dealerships will sell the car was a given. However, to imply that they are not going to sell because there are requirements to do so instead of it just being due to lack of local demand/local order introduces problematic scenarios.

Is a requirement to sell a requirement to service? If that becomes the reason some dealerships can't or won't, that is going to be a brand damaging nightmare. Imagine buying the new NSX and then move to another city, your first scheduled maintenance is due, you drive to your local Acura dealership only to discover that (a) they don't have the special tools, and (b) they don't have the special lift. Options? Ship to the next nearest dealership to wherever you moved to that has met the requirements and entrust your car and your money with a bunch of people you have never met? Who will pay for the transport in this scenario? Going local obviously wouldn't work...not only are they missing the tools, but even if they try to hoist it up just to look around they could possibly damage it sounds like. Regardless, as a relatively new owner you would also be one rather peeved owner.

I cannot see how they will not make sure these scenarios are not some how addressed and resolved in a better customer-minded manner.

FWIW, this happens on other cars from other manufacturers as well.

For example in order to be able to sell a Porsche 918, the tech's at the Porsche dealer's service department need to be trained as well as new set of tools need to be purchased for the car. (this is not cheap at all, so not all dealers wanted to sell the 918's)

For the Nissan GT-R, not all Nissan dealers are certified to sell/service the GT-R, same as above, new alignment rack that could clear the low rideheight of the GT-R was needed, some dealers decided to forgo the cost of having to send the tech's for service training, etc.

Prospective buyers of the NSX2.0 want the latest and greatest technology (which in most cases means that the car will be complex) on a car that is bespoke because it doesn't really share that many components with other Acura's. There is no such thing as a free lunch.

JD Cross · 20 February 2015

Olyar15 said:
According to this: http://www.edmunds.com/car-news/acura-dealers-to-stress-personalization-with-2016-acura-nsx.html there will be many options available to personalize the new NSX. However, what worries me is the part about how dealers will require a special lift for the car.
Seriously, Honda? Why the fuck can't you design and engineer this Honda to be like all your other Hondas. I was hoping that this car would still be serviceable by DIYs and independent shops, at least for the basic things like oil changes, brake work, etc.
One of the best features of the original NSX was that, at its core, it was still a Honda, a sensibly engineered car that still shared components with all the other Hondas, that had provisions to use a hydraulic jack and jack stands so the owner can work on the car. I was really hoping that the new NSX a would be similar. Sigh.

While there won't be a spare tire, it would be very unHondalike not to be able to jack up the NSX to do an emergency tire change at roadside.
According to a source at Dilawri, participating dealers have to invest about $80K in special equipment to service the NSX, and that may include the special hoist.
Hopefully it's something as simple as a hoist that's low enough to get under the car and has more flexibility to reach special jacking points.

I'm hoping the rest of the options will mainly be choice of wheels/tires, an array of cosmetic add-ons like Ferrari and others offer now, and possibly a track oriented suspension system.
I think Honda (and the others) is aware of how much owners spend/have spent on aftermarket bits and they wish to cash in on that.
In a way that's good as OEM optional parts should hold their value better than aftermarket parts.

If I hear any news that has come out of the Honda Canada dealer meetings held in conjunction with the Toronto show, I'll post them.

2slow2speed · 20 February 2015

JD Cross said:
While there won't be a spare tire, it would be very unHondalike not to be able to jack up the NSX to do an emergency tire change at roadside.
According to a source at Dilawri, participating dealers have to invest about $80K in special equipment to service the NSX, and that may include the special hoist.
Hopefully it's something as simple as a hoist that's low enough to get under the car and has more flexibility to reach special jacking points.

I'm hoping the rest of the options will mainly be choice of wheels/tires, an array of cosmetic add-ons like Ferrari and others offer now, and possibly a track oriented suspension system.
I think Honda (and the others) is aware of how much owners spend/have spent on aftermarket bits and they wish to cash in on that.
In a way that's good as OEM optional parts should hold their value better than aftermarket parts.

If I hear any news that has come out of the Honda Canada dealer meetings held in conjunction with the Toronto show, I'll post them.

Seriously doubt that Honda/Acura will be making huge amounts of money from the options that will be available for the car given the projected volume for the NSX2.0.

What the options will do is make the customer/owner happy that they can have a unique NSX2.0 the way that they want. I would be very surprised if Honda/Acura offers an option like Paint To Sample as some of the high end manufacturers offer for their cars.

goldNSX · 10 March 2015

Here in Switzerland the 'spezial lift requirement' is said to be asked on purpose by Honda in the past for: NSX v1.0 and Legend both sold as Honda here. Honda has been patient with the dealer who did not want to invest in a showroom etc. in the past. These dealers are about to loose there Honda-dealership as soon as Honda found a better dealer in that area.
Honda doesn't like to see potential customers being shocked by dirty garage-floors, filthy fingers and self-respecting pin-up-girls on the wall.

That's why they ask for conditions that can't be met by these kind of low-end-dealers. It's not a technical restriction if you want to DIY. For the first years DIY will be ruled out anyway by itself as you would loose guarranty.

nsxtasy · 10 March 2015

goldNSX said:
For the first years DIY will be ruled out anyway by itself as you would loose guarranty.

If that's true in Switzerland/Europe, it's different there than here in the States. Here, the warranty is not voided by doing maintenance yourself or by having it done somewhere other than at an Acura dealership.

NSX69 · 1 April 2015

Accavitti Interview

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/videos/2015-03-31/nsx-sales-to-boost-acura-brand-awareness-accavitti-says

Hothonda · 1 April 2015

My understanding is a dealer's location & its demographics will be part of the criteria to be eligible to sell the NSX.

Craigy · 13 April 2015

Very interesting, I think this is a good thing. Although it'll be expensive... they're clearly taking a page from Porsche's book here. Pretty different from the typical one-size-fits-all Honda package system.

Special lift, training, tools is par for the course. There are viper techs, GT-R techs, etc. Although there are many who have done it, the original NSX was not intended to be serviced at any given Honda dealer.

NZNick · 14 April 2015

As was said years ago, all new NSX will be built to order, specced by the customer from a long list of options via an on-line configurator.

As an aside, the original NSX was only available from a select number of Honda dealers in the UK - they had to invest in tools, training etc.

goldNSX · 15 April 2015

NSX 1.0, built in Japan, lot of options available in Japan. Only standard versions outside of Japan.
NSX 2.0, built in the US, lot of options available in the US. Makes sense to me. What about outside of the US? Only standard versions? I seriously hope not.

GBL1 · 17 April 2015

Not necessarily a special lift, but more just special attaching "connecting" arms are added to a standard shop lift for LaFerrari, and yes, the dealership had to have one or two of their techs specially trained on LaFerrari at the factory, and special tools are required to work on the car...(LaFerrari lift pictured below...with added wood ramps to get car over the cross-bars)

.

Olyar15 · 17 April 2015

GBL1 said:
Not necessarily a special lift, but more just special attaching "connecting" arms are added to a standard shop lift for LaFerrari, and yes, the dealership had to have one or two of their techs specially trained on LaFerrari at the factory, and special tools are required to work on the car...(LaFerrari lift pictured below...with added wood ramps to get car over the cross-bars)

.

Yeah, that's my concern. This, of course, is completely idiotic and something that I would expect from Ferrari, Mclaren, etc. but not Honda. The whole point of the original NSX was that a real car company, with real engineers, designed a real supercar. Not only could the NSX be used with a normal lift, it could even accommodate jacks and jackstands so the home DIY could still work on the car. Now I have no issue with requiring special tools for certain tasks or having special training for certain tasks. I certainly would not want to touch the hybrid system. But it is still a car, with a conventional ICE. Assuming the car comes stock with iron rotors rather than CC, replacing pads and discs should be doable by the home mechanic. Same for fluid changes, spark plugs, etc.

If the new car requires a special lift, it not only locks out the DIYer, but many independent shops as well, even for minor maintenance. Imagine if you get a flat tire, and are required to tow your vehicle hundreds of miles to an approved Acura dealer simply because your local tire shop can't even get the car off the ground. Imagine all those owners who track their car who won't even be able to swap their brake pads because they can't get the wheels off. Hopefully Honda is smarter than this, and don't actually require a special lift.

Valkyrie Pilot · 17 April 2015

Olyar15 said:
Yeah, that's my concern. This, of course, is completely idiotic and something that I would expect from Ferrari, Mclaren, etc. but not Honda. The whole point of the original NSX was that a real car company, with real engineers, designed a real supercar. Not only could the NSX be used with a normal lift, it could even accommodate jacks and jackstands so the home DIY could still work on the car. Now I have no issue with requiring special tools for certain tasks or having special training for certain tasks. I certainly would not want to touch the hybrid system. But it is still a car, with a conventional ICE. Assuming the car comes stock with iron rotors rather than CC, replacing pads and discs should be doable by the home mechanic. Same for fluid changes, spark plugs, etc.

If the new car requires a special lift, it not only locks out the DIYer, but many independent shops as well, even for minor maintenance. Imagine if you get a flat tire, and are required to tow your vehicle hundreds of miles to an approved Acura dealer simply because your local tire shop can't even get the car off the ground. Imagine all those owners who track their car who won't even be able to swap their brake pads because they can't get the wheels off. Hopefully Honda is smarter than this, and don't actually require a special lift.

This seems to be a very reasonable and legitimate concern.

I am no expert on tech service or lifts but could they be planning some kind of retrofit or adapter that allows standard lifts to handle NSXs?

I am assuming the issue is with the carbon fiber floor pan?

latzke · 18 April 2015

Acura person at Denver auto show (likely doesn't know any more than us and was speculating) said there would essentially be two versions available. Base (at $155k) and a reasonably-priced package that would include all the safety tech (lane-keep assist, collision mitigation braking, adaptive cruise, etc) - plus made-to-order (pick interior/exterior colors, few things like that).

I can't imagine they're re-inventing how to lift a car.

N Spec · 18 April 2015

latzke said:
I can't imagine they're re-inventing how to lift a car.

This ^ So I'm not sure what the big fuss is able. I'd be concern with warranty voids and actual service intervals of the batteries/e-motors which require a bit more than the typical tech knowledge.

Olyar15 · 18 April 2015

N Spec said:
This ^ So I'm not sure what the big fuss is able. I'd be concern with warranty voids and actual service intervals of the batteries/e-motors which require a bit more than the typical tech knowledge.

Did you bother to read the report I linked in the original post? Here is the part I'm talking about:

"Accavitti said it is too early to predict what percentage of Acura's 273 dealers will sell the car. All of the requirements have not been determined. However, there will be special tools and possibly a special hoist to lift the car that could be costly."

ncdogdoc · 18 April 2015

Good God people. Everyone wants a "world beater" but also wants it to come with its own CHILTON manual??

The car has four motors, they have to be accessible when the car is in the air, and not have the rest of the car come crashing down when things are disconnected. The special lift has nothing to do with oil/tire changes. At least it doesn't have a single lug nut like a GT3RS that requires over 200lb/ft to torque correctly. Probably not doing that with your Craftsman.

I, for one, am excited about this car, even though there is no way I can afford it. I just wish it looked better overall from the outside, and less like an Eclipse. Out of the park with the interior.

N Spec · 19 April 2015

Olyar15 said:
Did you bother to read the report I linked in the original post? Here is the part I'm talking about:

"Accavitti said it is too early to predict what percentage of Acura's 273 dealers will sell the car. All of the requirements have not been determined. However, there will be special tools and possibly a special hoist to lift the car that could be costly."

I read it. Keyword is "possibly". I just can't see how this car is so special that it would need a new style of lifting that does not already exist. It still has 4 wheels like any other car. Special tools - sure. A special lift???

- - - Updated - - -

And I understand your frustration with limiting choices of service facilities, but I think that really good shops will be able to find a way to work on it if they are prolific and experienced enough.

Even though the first gen NSX could be serviced like a regular car, most people did not want just any garage working on their cars...

latzke · 28 April 2015

McLaren has 17 service centers in the US. An owner in Colorado who wants to get warranty service or use official service center needs to send the car to Scottsdale AZ, SoCal, NoCal, or Chicago (the first three about equidistant from here, Chicago farther but a straight-shot down I-80).

Even if just 20% of Acura's 273 dealers meet requirements, that is 55 service centers. And probably at least one of those will be in the Rocky Mountain region (probably front range of Colorado).

nsx_2k · 28 April 2015

I recently had my NSX in for service at a local Acura dealership and had a very nice conversation with my regular service rep who has so far been spot on with information (ie. told me about the new NSX prior to reading about it on other sites/magazines).

He stated that his dealership was sending two technicians away in June for training on the NSX (one already a NSX specialist and exclusively works on my car). So they are indeed starting the whole training process. Additionally, he did admit that there were special tools needed. When asked about the special lift, he stated that it was simply to address the low clearance of the car. That makes sense for he stated that there have been some heavily modified NSX's that come in the shop and are somewhat difficult to get on the lift.

Honestly, I can't imagine that Honda would create a car that needs a special lift just to change tires as some of you are concerned about.

nikey22 · 28 April 2015

It will be a computer/electronics-intensive car.
There will likely be a TCU (Transmission Control Unit) to look after the 9 speed; Some computers/ECUs for the batteries and e-motors; Diagnostic scanner equipment like those used for the Ferrari cars (SD2 and SD3), etc...
The learning curve will be steep for the Acura mechanic let alone the DIY'er.

nsxtacey · 6 May 2015

agree thats its too high tech and not something you want to modify and mess things up let alone void the warranty. thats why you don't see tuner shops offering mods on the LaFerrari or P1 or 918 because of the electric motors.

Lots of options available

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