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Traction Control
- Thread starter NSXZERO
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I believe it does but it will take some tuning time to make it active and working properly.
Yes, that is possible with the Series 2 AEM.
I have the Series 2 AEM and don't have TCS according to my tuner. Can someone explain to me how to make it work?
I had this system and launch control was tuned in by Autowave. Pretty jaw dropping when activated. They said it did have TCS but because this would have to be "tuned", it would cost more because of time setting that system up. I just settled for the launch control. I'm sure the new Infinity system is even better.
The AEM ECUs have a two-step RPM to aid in launch control but not in the same since as a modern car has a button for launch control. The two step works by allowing you to set a lower rev limiter when the car is not moving or is moving below a certain wheel speed. Set the two step to 4k RPM and with the car not moving hold the throttle too the floor and the the car will rev to the 4k RPM point, release the clutch and as soon as the wheel speed reaches the desired speed the RPM redline return to normal operation. This is a feature useful to drag racers to dial in their launch RPM for a given track surface but that is about it, unless you like the sound of your motor bouncing off the rev limiter then you can set the two-step at 2k RPM and hear that without stressing the motor.
Traction control in the AEM Series 1 or 2 is an entirely different thing, since the ECU can not see the individual wheel speed sensors to determine if there is wheel slip, it uses a few tables to determine if the RPMs of the engine are revving faster than would be possible if the tires had traction. Since the engine accelerates at different rates depending on the gear you are in there is a table to account for each gear and has to be tuned for each gear, the amount of interference the ECU applies to deal with wheel spin is also programmable, the method used to control wheel spin like ignition or fuel or both is also programmable. It takes a great deal of time to dial this in and even then it is a compromised design limited by the lack of true wheel speed data. Almost every other "Traction Control" system looks at at least two wheel speed sensors and most look at all four to determine wheel slip and then react to that. Without true wheel speed data this design can really only be tuned for one condition and a margin of error, different road surfaces or tire materials all effect the final tune. Aside from launching from a dead stop or very slow speeds the system can not really handle wheel slip at higher speeds or higher RPMs very well and the tuning process would be very difficult because it is trial and error at best to get it right.
I am not saying it does not work but considering the data limitations there is only so much that can be done to detect wheel slip and then control it.
Dave
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Are you guys having slippage off the line from a roll?
I'm running 285 wide Extreme rated tires and from a roll there is almost zero traction issues when the tires are warmed up. It gets off the line as if was AWD.
I'm running 285 wide Extreme rated tires and from a roll there is almost zero traction issues when the tires are warmed up. It gets off the line as if was AWD.
My TCS button doesn't work. How do I know if the TCS system is on or off? If the TCS light isn't on, that means TCS is off?
If the light is on TCS is off.
I've mentioned it previously but I've been using the factory TCS with the AEM Series 2. My experience is that it works way better on a high HP car than on a stock car. It seems to work as it should have stock,; it takes a lot of the excess wheel spin out while continuing to let the car try to claw forward. Instead of as it works stock that when it intervenes it really kills momentum IMHO.
Thanks for the reply!
So I do experience some wheel spin starting from a stop, I'm sure I could get it to spin even more if I tried. When I went to get my emissions, it's a 92 so it's done on a dyno, the tech said that they had trouble since they couldn't turn off the TCS? (Or maybe he said turn on, I forget)
So I get the sense that it's not working however there's no light on either.
Is there a way I can figure out whether it's truly on or off without going by the cluster light?
How are you controlling the stock TB with the Series 2, and how are you getting the input from the OEM TCS to the Series 2?
I think you are using the AEM Series 2 ECU as a piggy back to the OEM ECU given the fact that your 95 NSX is partial OBD2, if this is the case your car will be unique to most others using a series 1 or series 2 AEM ECU, unless they are using it in the piggyback configuration like you are. It is important to clarify this when you ask or reply to questions about the AEM Series2 or available feature sets. Using a stand-a-lone ECU in a piggy back configuration will effect how it is programmed and how it integrated into the car compared to a complete ECU swap.
Dave
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Keep in mind that you and "curtsr" do not have the same year NSX, you have an OBDI car and he has an OBDII car, different solutions to engine management even though you have similar hardware. On the OBDI cars the AEM Series 2 ECU is a swap for the OEM ECU and OEM Traction control is lost, so the light on the dash means nothing and the switch for TCS does nothing. For the OBDII cars the AEM Series 2 ECU is in a piggyback form with the OEM ECU still in charge of the OEM Throttle Body DBW system, and the OEM TCS will likely still be available but may be less effective since the OEM ECU can only control the DBW TB and will not effect engine fuel or spark.
Dave
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Dave,
Agreed that my NSX as a 95 is for all intents and purposes a "tweener"; not quite a full ODB2 and not 100% an ODB1 either.
I probably should have prefaced that with a YMMV because having a 95 has indeed presented its own unique tuning issues.
Good catch!
Curt
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No Issues, the entire process of engine management on these cars is complicated and it is easy to assume that everyone is in the same boat, but there are so many variables with the different cars and ECU configurations that if you are looking for a specific answer it is best to lay out all the specifics about your setup first. I have seen just about every AEM setup on just about every FI system and to be honest I do not really know what the OEM TCS system will or could do in your particular arrangement using the AEM ECU as a piggyback to the OEM ECU. I am assuming the OEM ECU would still partially close the DBW Throttle when wheel slip is found but since the OEM ECU no longer has timing or fueling control that part of the traction control system would need to be handled on the AEM's TCS programming.
Both Mike at Autowave and Chris at SOS would be better suited to address questions about your particular system, they both have designed systems for the unique work around for your OBDII car.
Dave
I have done a bunch of research into this and was concerned about it when shopping for an ecu replacement for my 94 nsx. As Dave mentioned, it is not possible to retain the factory TCS with the S1 or S2. If you have the S2, it has some built in TCS functionality, but to use it, it needs to be properly set up and calibrated.
The ecu needs to have at least 2 speed signals to determine if there is any slippage. People with other hondas have managed to get the TCS setup on the S2 using the speed sensor (ABS wheel speed sensor) input from a non-driven (in our case, one of the front wheels) and comparing it to one from the tranny speed or another 'driven' wheel speed input (in our case, one of the rear wheels).
Now, theres some confusion over the speed sensor input. The hondas have a 2 wire magnetic sensor and some people say that you need a converter box to change this to a digital signal before it gets to the AEM S2 ECU. Others say that you can simply specify the signal type in the tuning setup and no converter is required.
So, lets clear this up
1. On OBD1 cars, you will NOT have TCS if you replace the ECU with an AEM S1 or S2. The AEM box has its own TCS functionality which requires additional setup and tuning.
Details from other honda forum:
http://honda-tech.com/drag-racing-36/using-rear-abs-aem-3015100/
More on this from AEM:
http://aemelectronics.com/?q=<wbr>forum/how-3step-wheel-speed-<wbr>differential-traction-control
2. On OBI2 cars, I believe some TCS functionality is retained - check with Dave and other gurus.
I have purchased a S2 and will be getting it tuned in the near future once I have saved up some $$ for the upgrades I will let you guys know how it all works out.
The ecu needs to have at least 2 speed signals to determine if there is any slippage. People with other hondas have managed to get the TCS setup on the S2 using the speed sensor (ABS wheel speed sensor) input from a non-driven (in our case, one of the front wheels) and comparing it to one from the tranny speed or another 'driven' wheel speed input (in our case, one of the rear wheels).
Now, theres some confusion over the speed sensor input. The hondas have a 2 wire magnetic sensor and some people say that you need a converter box to change this to a digital signal before it gets to the AEM S2 ECU. Others say that you can simply specify the signal type in the tuning setup and no converter is required.
So, lets clear this up
1. On OBD1 cars, you will NOT have TCS if you replace the ECU with an AEM S1 or S2. The AEM box has its own TCS functionality which requires additional setup and tuning.
Details from other honda forum:
http://honda-tech.com/drag-racing-36/using-rear-abs-aem-3015100/
More on this from AEM:
http://aemelectronics.com/?q=<wbr>forum/how-3step-wheel-speed-<wbr>differential-traction-control
2. On OBI2 cars, I believe some TCS functionality is retained - check with Dave and other gurus.
I have purchased a S2 and will be getting it tuned in the near future once I have saved up some $$ for the upgrades
I will let you guys know how it all works out.
AEM Infinity
I have made the decision to retain my Areodyne twins and install them on my '91. I understand that I can send my S2 box back to AEM to have it set up for OBD1. I'll need to get another wire loom made that will support this new mod. As this box has my tune already for a 3.2 NA2, the re-tune should be relatively short, making most of the changes to displacement. On my old set up ('97 NA2 3.2) I was running RC 550 injectors with clips. Will I be able to use these same injectors, do I remove the clips, or am I hosed and need to get new injectors? I did not have any traction control with the old set up and do understand the limitations of programming it into the S2. But I currently don't have an operable TCS on this car so I really wouldn't know what I was missing anyway.
How can I tell what ECU I have? Whether OEM or aftermarket like AEM? Sorry, noob here.
I would start by looking at it. What does it say on it?
Once converted to OBD1 the series 2 ECU will be plug-n-play to the OEM engine harness, you can add a harness extension to splice in all of your other sensors or gauges without having to cut the OEM wires. You can get one from Boomslang the 91-94 NSX part number is BF13005 and it is $225.00 you may be able to find one for less from another vendor as they are fairly common connectors.
Your injectors can be used but there is an injector resistor pack that will need to be bypassed with those injectors or you can buy new units from RC with the proper impedance and plug type so they will be plug-n-play.
Dave
Thanks Dave. I have the resistor pack being shipped and the harness too. I've decided to go with the Injector Dynamic 1000's. Looking to gather up the parts by mid week and start the build Thursday or Friday of this coming week. Looking forward to this. And as always, thanks for your time and expertise.
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