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Porsche Cayman GT4 vs. Modified NSX

RYU

RYU

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Every so often I consider selling the NSX. I'm attached to the car but mostly because it provides me with so much driving satisfaction. Lately, that desire has been tested over and over again so the last year or so i've been looking at alternatives. There is no clear sell signal yet but I have driven a GT4 and it's a damn nice car. Still a bit short from filling the gap of what my NSX provides for me but there are certainly strong pros and cons. The interior of the GT4 and the 'feel' of the components is so satisfying. Of course, there are overwhelming reasons the NSX is not practical to hoon around in anymore.. namely parts availability.

Here's a by-the-numbers look at both of these cars. I was surprised to find them compare closely to each other. Both cars are street legal and both cars are comfortable on a 4hr trip.

Thoughts?

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RYU said:
Every so often I consider selling the NSX. I'm attached to the car but mostly because it provides me with so much driving satisfaction. Lately, that desire has been tested over and over again so the last year or so i've been looking at alternatives. There is no clear sell signal yet but I have driven a GT4 and it's a damn nice car. Still a bit short from filling the gap of what my NSX provides for me but there are certainly strong pros and cons. The interior of the GT4 and the 'feel' of the components is so satisfying. Of course, there are overwhelming reasons the NSX is not practical to hoon around in anymore.. namely parts availability.

Here's a by-the-numbers look at both of these cars. I was surprised to find them compare closely to each other. Both cars are street legal and both cars are comfortable on a 4hr trip.

Thoughts?

attachment.php
Click to expand...
Keep the NSX
 
RYU said:
I had a little difficulty trying to find correct GT4 numbers. This was my best attempt at sorting thru the internet. I would love to see more accurate #'s if you guys will stand by them. Please post! I'll update the chart accordingly.
Click to expand...

it would vary depending on which gear you were in, after all, the power is transmitted through two torque multipliers.

If you had 350nm of torque at the flywheel, that would be multiplied through the gearbox (1:1 ish in the case of 4th gear) and then again through the final drive (4:1 ish) so you would end up with about 1400nm measured at the wheels.

torque measured at the wheels is not really informative of an engines performance characteristics :)
 
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hkz286 said:
it would vary depending on which gear you were in, after all, the power is transmitted through two torque multipliers.

If you had 350nm of torque at the flywheel, that would be multiplied through the gearbox (1:1 ish in the case of 4th gear) and then again through the final drive (4:1 ish) so you would end up with about 1400nm measured at the wheels.

torque measured at the wheels is not really informative of an engines performance characteristics :)
Click to expand...


My GT4 numbers were taken from Dyno charts online. You can measure torque from a few places. The reason why I picked "at the wheels" is because those are the numbers I have on my car. Apples to apples if you will...
 
By the way.. this exercise isn't going to be a perfectly scientific comparison. Unless I had both cars in the same dyno room with the same scales, etc.. it's virtually impossible. Best we can do is extrapolate from the information online.

Again, i'm happy to update the numbers if you guys have better figures.
 
RYU said:
My GT4 numbers were taken from Dyno charts online. You can measure torque from a few places. The reason why I picked "at the wheels" is because those are the numbers I have on my car. Apples to apples if you will...
Click to expand...

yeah what im saying is your numbers for measuring torque at the wheels is incorrect,

If a Cayman is putting out 292 at the wheels, the final drive (3.89) and 4th gear ratio (1.13) would mean it would be putting out 70 flt/lbs at the crank,

As it happens, it puts out a max of 309 lb.ft (according to Porsche) which means that it would be 1358 lb.ft at the wheels if dyno'd in 4th gear.

The gearbox is obviously used to reduce the speed of the engine to the wheels, this will in turn increase the torque :)

Like is said, measure power at the wheels if you wish (I have other issues with this but another conversation) but measuring torque at the wheels doesn't make sense, and certainly wont be less than that measured at the flywheel. :)
 
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I'm laughing at GT-4 vs RYU coupe.....:tongue:
 
[MENTION=31273]hkz286[/MENTION] - I understand your argument but it doesn't help in any practical way in this comparison. I think that's the inherent flaw in dyno readings... but there's really no other practical way to compare. So again... for purposes of this discussion would you have a better way to compare given limited access to measuring equipment.
[MENTION=4282]docjohn[/MENTION] I laugh at my car all the time :D
 
btw.. I thought it was obvious but all of these dyno readings "at the wheels" are taken at the gear which is closest to a 1:1 ratio. In this case 4th gear in the JDM NSX trans and 5th gear in the GT4.

Also instead of wTQ I probably should have written ft-lbs. Anyway, I had assumed people got the point :)
 
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RYU said:
@hkz286 - I understand your argument but it doesn't help in any practical way in this comparison. I think that's the inherent flaw in dyno readings... but there's really no other practical way to compare. So again... for purposes of this discussion would you have a better way to compare given limited access to measuring equipment.
@docjohn I laugh at my car all the time :D
Click to expand...

just use power and torque at the flywheel :)

dyno readings are usually fairly accurate when used correctly. For example the latest dyno dynamics dyno in shootout mode has very little human input and as a result is pretty much as accurate as a your going to get :) its when people start inputting goofy figures it tends to get messy :)
 
hkz286 said:
just use power and torque at the flywheel :)

dyno readings are usually fairly accurate when used correctly. For example the latest dyno dynamics dyno in shootout mode has very little human input and as a result is pretty much as accurate as a your going to get :) its when people start inputting goofy figures it tends to get messy :)
Click to expand...


How would you recommend I get crank figures from my NSX?
 
Its a decision you have to make. With all the time and effort you put into making your nsx truly unique and admired by many, its a keeper.
If I were in your shoes. I'd sell the s2k and pick up the gt4.
Once I finish (long shot) building my nsx. Gt4 or gt4 RS is the next addition to the garage.
 
Small pick - I think you have your whp to lb label backwards. 7.7 hp per lb would be really impressive.

There seems to be some focus on rear wheel torque and hp. If that is what is really important these cars are all plonkers. The production version of the Ducati Panigale R has a wet weight to rear wheel horsepower a shade under 2.5 lb/hp and its MSRP starting at $35 k makes it a bargain. However, wind noise might be a bit extreme, it probably chews through tires faster than an NSX with the original alignment specs and I don't think it would meet your 4 hr comfort measurement. Also, suffers from water ingress during rain storms.
 
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The GT4 is a fantastic car.

Have you considered a 996 or 997 GT3? They have a similar feel and performance envelope to the GT4, but with the added benefit of back seats.
 
From someone who sold his NSX (I had to, no regret) I'd keep the NSX. You can always get a GT4 or whatever else, but once you sell your NSX that ship will have sailed.

If you're wondering if you should sell it you need to keep it.

But stop comparing numbers. I understand that yours is modded but there's no comparing a 30 year old car to the latest and greatest - it falls down hard. If you continue to try to rationalize the NSX as competing with current cars you'll miss what's so great about it. Hell, F40s can't compete with current cars and it couldn't matter less. Mclaren F1 - toast against current cars.

Keep it not because it's better than current cars but because it's an NSX
 

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