FAILED EMISSIONS! Need Help!!!

[X-TNSIV]

Ok, so here's the deal...

I have a BEGI TT kit on my car and tried to pass emissions here in Oregon. I do not have headers and DO HAVE cats.

the Max THC limit is 1.20 and I got a 6.05

the Max NOX limit is 3.00 and I got a 3.83

I tried and disconnected the boost generated from the turbos and thus in turn the additional injectors were not activated during the dyno passes.

the only thing I can think of is that the fuel pressure riser is still too high and the injectors are flowing too much fuel to be cleanly burned...making me fail.

unfortunately, I don't know much about 'tuning' the car so any help from you guys would be much appreciated.

can I just reduce the fuel pressure level and be fine?

thanks!
Allen

[Brad]

Allen, I would call Mark Basch at (602) 244-8010 and he should be able to solve your emissions problem.

[CityofAngels]

I agree. Talk to a professional. You sound like you are burning a rich mixture(too much fuel) or your catalytics are possibly clogged and not functioning properly. Usually, aftermarket Turbo kits do run rich to avoid blowing holes in pistons. You should be able to have the fuel mixture dialed back at idle by the turbo kit manufacturer.

[madfast]

c'mon from owning a TT Z you don't know how to do this? hehhehe ok do this. Run the car on the highway and force the car so the Cat converter gets really hot and does it job. ok after that pull to the emission station. lean the FPR. Do you an an EGT? make sure that temps don't go over 900C. cool? I assume you don't have aboost controlller. I think the Beggi TT kit is pre adjusted right? so grab 2 vacuum lines and hooked them up to the 2 internal wastegates on the turbo. connect these two lines then to a y-connector...and from the y-connector attach another vacuum line that should go to a pump. Pump up air lines until you see the wastegate arms moving 1/2 inch. Don't go over 10psi. Now your wastegates are totally open and there would be no boost. Unplug the electrical wires that go to the additional injectors. and that's it! Run the car on the dyno. Guaranteed you'll pass. also if you have Apex AFC...even better. just tune your fuel curve down. let me know if this works.

[X-TNSIV]

Originally posted by madfast:
c'mon from owning a TT Z you don't know how to do this? hehhehe ok do this. Run the car on the highway and force the car so the Cat converter gets really hot and does it job. ok after that pull to the emission station. lean the FPR. Do you an an EGT? make sure that temps don't go over 900C. cool? I assume you don't have aboost controlller. I think the Beggi TT kit is pre adjusted right? so grab 2 vacuum lines and hooked them up to the 2 internal wastegates on the turbo. connect these two lines then to a y-connector...and from the y-connector attach another vacuum line that should go to a pump. Pump up air lines until you see the wastegate arms moving 1/2 inch. Don't go over 10psi. Now your wastegates are totally open and there would be no boost. Unplug the electrical wires that go to the additional injectors. and that's it! Run the car on the dyno. Guaranteed you'll pass. also if you have Apex AFC...even better. just tune your fuel curve down. let me know if this works.

I have the factory spring actuated turbos and no boost controller. I didn't want to have to remove my rear bumper to take off the rear diffusor, so I went a different route.

ok, this is exactly what I did...


on the turbo return pipe to the manifold, there is an extra closed off tube. I opened this tube up to relieve created pressure. (Thus generating zero boost, just abient pressure at the manifold). Since the Greddy Rebic IV senses pressure off of the manifold and no boost is generated, the additional injectors are never activated. I added a bottle of "guaranteed to pass" and filled the car half tank. I then drove the car for over 1 hour between 4-5K rpm and then drove straight to the emissions testing facility.

with this set-up, my second attempt last night was even worse than my first...

THC was 6.21 (1.20 MAX)
NOX was 6.01 (3.00 MAX)
CO was 30.9 (30.0 MAX)

that is why I think it is the fuel pressure riser. But what I don't have experience with is adjusting the fuel pressure up or down. The last thing I need is to detonate after I lowered it, or detonate from not re-raising it back up after I'm done...

Allen



[This message has been edited by X-TNSIV (edited 21 November 2002).]

[true]

Originally posted by X-TNSIV:
on the turbo return pipe to the manifold, there is an extra closed off tube. I opened this tube up to releive created pressure. (Thus generating zero boost, just abient pressure at the manifold).

Don't do that, that's not very good for your turbos. You didnt mention intake or exhaust manifold, but it sounds to me that you just opened up a port on your intake manifold's charge pipe. That's a good way to over-rev your turbos. I would suggest actually finding out your problem and stop guessing. You are not just close...you are way off. Check your fuel pressure to see where it's at. It could be an oxygen sensor, cat converter as well. Ever have check engine lights? Has it ever passed with the twin turn kit, and have you ever had your car on a dyno to see where your air fuel is?


[This message has been edited by true (edited 21 November 2002).]

[X-TNSIV]

Originally posted by true:
Don't do that, that's not very good for your turbos. You didnt mention intake or exhaust manifold, but it sounds to me that you just opened up a port on your intake manifold's charge pipe. That's a good way to over-rev your turbos. I would suggest actually finding out your problem and stop guessing. You are not just close...you are way off. Check your fuel pressure to see where it's at. It could be an oxygen sensor, cat converter as well. Ever have check engine lights? Has it ever passed with the twin turn kit, and have you ever had your car on a dyno to see where your air fuel is?


[This message has been edited by true (edited 21 November 2002).]

I purchased the car with the TT kit installed and therefore it has never passed emissions before here in Oregon. I was told that it was wide-band O2 tuned and was running at 12.5 on air/fuel on WOT.

you are correct, I did remove the cap on the charge pipe. I will take your word on it the over-reving the turbos and be careful. So far, I can just barely hear the turbos spooling...even under decent acceleration. I am trying to contact a few local tuners, but the "right people" in Portland is VERY limited.

[Biaggi]

When I used to live in the DC area, I 'heard' of people that paid the emissions testers extra $$$ to 'pass' their cars.....
Not that I would condone this behavior.....

But good luck though... OR you can move to NC where certain counties are still backwards and do not test for emissions ;-P

------------------
Biaggi
92 Red NSX #483
94 CBR900RR

[X-TNSIV]

ok, so I just spoke to a local tuner...

from what he said...where I'm failing the testing is when you lift off of throttle, there is too much un-burned fuel.

so I'm guess that I will need to adjust my fuel pressure riser.

my computer at work does not have acrobat reader. If someone knows what the stock fuel pressure should be, or has a chance to look it up, I would really appreciate it!

I'm currently running at 41lbs at idle.

thanks,
Allen

[X-TNSIV]

Just found out the root of the problem...

Preston at Cartech said that the factory ECU is re-mapped for a different fuel curve.

so I need a loaner ecu in order to pass emissions.

wish me luck!
Allen

[X-TNSIV]

Originally posted by true:
Don't do that, that's not very good for your turbos. You didnt mention intake or exhaust manifold, but it sounds to me that you just opened up a port on your intake manifold's charge pipe. That's a good way to over-rev your turbos. I would suggest actually finding out your problem and stop guessing. You are not just close...you are way off. Check your fuel pressure to see where it's at. It could be an oxygen sensor, cat converter as well. Ever have check engine lights? Has it ever passed with the twin turn kit, and have you ever had your car on a dyno to see where your air fuel is?


[This message has been edited by true (edited 21 November 2002).]

oh yeah...and just as a FYI, Preston said that having the charge pipe open will not be detrimental to the turbos.

Allen

[madfast]

I have the factory spring actuated turbos and no boost controller. I didn't want to have to remove my rear bumper to take off the rear diffusor, so I went a different route.

ok, this is exactly what I did...


on the turbo return pipe to the manifold, there is an extra closed off tube. I opened this tube up to relieve created pressure. (Thus generating zero boost, just abient pressure at the manifold). Since the Greddy Rebic IV senses pressure off of the manifold and no boost is generated, the additional injectors are never activated. I added a bottle of "guaranteed to pass" and filled the car half tank. I then drove the car for over 1 hour between 4-5K rpm and then drove straight to the emissions testing facility.

with this set-up, my second attempt last night was even worse than my first...

THC was 6.21 (1.20 MAX)
NOX was 6.01 (3.00 MAX)
CO was 30.9 (30.0 MAX)

that is why I think it is the fuel pressure riser. But what I don't have experience with is adjusting the fuel pressure up or down. The last thing I need is to detonate after I lowered it, or detonate from not re-raising it back up after I'm done...

Allen,
there is no way you can detonate by just running the car w/ no boost. If there is boost then it's more likely that u'll detonate. Believe me you can detonate even if your car is rich. The only problem that you may get from adjusting the FPR is running lean. But like I said on my previous post, if you have an EGT ur fine. I wish you the best of luck with ur other attempt with a stock ecu.

[madfast]

if ur not running turbos make sure the fpr is above 25psi. I know this cuz my maxima has a stillen FPR