View Full Version : Tires...
Wow, I knew the NSX eats through tires, but I'm going to be lucky if I get 7,000 miles on my rear Bridgestone OEM tires. The inside tread of the driver's side rear is nearly gone...and I'm only at 6,500 miles.
I read through the FAQ I'm still not 100% certain of what tires I should replace them with. I am sticking with the stock sizes for now and am considering the OEM replacements (either Yokos or Bridgestone)...but strong recommendations of the others could sway me. I'm looking for something that is for a daily ride, but one that doesn't sacrifice the performance I'm currently getting. Also, my fronts should be good for another few thousand miles...
Which has the better prices - Tire Rack or Discount Tire Direct (with the NSXCA discount)? Or is there some place better I should be considering?
I'm no tire expert, so I'm sure my lack of regularly checking the pressure contributed to their fast demise...when I last checked, my driver's side rear had dropped below 30 (passenger side rear was still in the mid-to-high 30s as it had been filled more recently). I brought them back up to the factory recommended pressures as soon as I realized this.
Also, I have no idea where I should take my NSX to get the tires changed. Any recommendations for the West L.A. / Marina del Rey area???
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--akira3D ('00 NSX-T red/black #113)
"Reality is better than the dream..."
akira3d.com/nsx (http://akira3d.com/nsx)
Wow, I knew the NSX eats through tires, but I'm going to be lucky if I get 7,000 miles on my rear Bridgestone OEM tires.
Sounds about right. http://www.nsxprime.com/ubb/biggrin.gif
If that's a problem, you might want to consider some of the alternative alignment settings discussed in the FAQ. They may reduce cornering precision, but increase treadlife.
I am sticking with the stock sizes for now and am considering the OEM replacements (either Yokos or Bridgestone)...but strong recommendations of the others could sway me.
What about strong recommendations of the OEM tires? http://www.nsxprime.com/ubb/smile.gif That's what I recommend, unless you want to sacrifice performance.
Which has the better prices - Tire Rack or Discount Tire Direct (with the NSXCA discount)?
Last time I bought tires (OEM), I found that the prices were better from DTD with the discount. But someone else found the reverse on pricing some other tires. Best thing to do is check the Tire Rack price on the 'net, and, when you're ready to order, have it handy when you call DTD, to see who's lower.
Originally posted by akira3d:
Wow, I knew the NSX eats through tires, but I'm going to be lucky if I get 7,000 miles on my rear Bridgestone OEM tires. The inside tread of the driver's side rear is nearly gone...and I'm only at 6,500 miles.
Akira,
My '00 (#81) has almost exactly the same amount of miles and my tires are at the same point. I have the stock Yoko's and have been diligent in keeping correct air pressure. I run them at 35/40. I too have spent ALOT of time recently looking for tires. The choices are very limited if you intend, as I do, in keeping the stock 16/17 wheels. The difficulty for the fronts is not increasing the diameter of the tire - almost nobody makes 215/45-16's. The most common appears to be 225/50 which is 1.3" larger than stock. The Dunlop 9000 comes in 225/40-16 which is the same as stock. The Dunlop also comes in stock size rear as well as 255/40-17 which is extremely close to stock diameter. I would love to try a set of YokoAVS Sport (with the 'Y' pattern) but would have to go to 225/50-16F and 255(or275)/40-17R. I believe both the Dunlop and AVS would get better mileage than stock but might lack the performance. Also, if we go to larger diameter in the rear we in effect put a 'longer' gear in the car and slow the acceleration. If we go to a larger diameter in the front we can cause TCS problems.
The prices at DTD w/ the discount appear to be best. 166/F, 182/R for the Yokos.
Has anybody any experience with the Dunlop 9000 or the YokoAVS??
PS. This link is useful for determining tire sizes:
http://www.powerdog.com/tiresize.cgi
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BobsYT
2000 Red/Black #81
[This message has been edited by BobsYT (edited 30 January 2001).]
[This message has been edited by BobsYT (edited 30 January 2001).]
My 95 NSX-T got exactly 5000 miles out of the original Yokos before the rears were bald. Rather than replace the rears with new Yokos, I bought 4 new Dunlap 9000s.
I now have 4,000 miles on these Dunlaps, and I can hardly see any wear at all. I run 42 lbs in the rear and about 40 lbs in the fronts. I drive mostly on curved mountain and hilly roads, and I push the car every chance I can.
It is true that when I first put on the Dunlaps I noticed a good amount of understeer, whereas the OEM Yokos were very compliant when asked to enter turns. The OEM tires seem to dive into the turns, by comparison. I don't notice the understeer at all now. This is the only performance difference that I have noticed.
The 9000's have amazing grip in the turns, and they are not wearing fast at all. Other threads on this web site on this topic have similar testimonials: the 9000's give very long wear and if you get a lot of rain, they're really great in the wet.
Finally, there is another very good convenience point about these Dunlaps compared with the OEM tires. The 9000's are not made for each of the four corners, they are either fronts or rears, so you can actually rotate them side to side.
I'm seeing about even wear on the inside and outside, but within the next 1,000 miles I'm bringing the car back to Discount tire, where they will remove all four tires from the wheels, swap the right and left tires, remount and balance the wheels, for only $5/tire (it's in my original contract).
At my current rate of wear I predict 20-25,000 miles for the tires to go bald. I paid about $850, out the door. I couldn't be more satisfied. Life is good.
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NSXY
95 NSX-T, 5 sp, Red/Tan, Stock, except Dunlaptya SP9000s
Has anybody any experience with the Dunlop 9000 or the YokoAVS??
The Dunlop 9000 has a tread wear of 280, which is really high for performance tires. I have them in the back and rank it a little below the Michelin Pilot SX which carries a tread wear of 220. I would recommend the 9000's as it is a good balance between performance, wear and cost.
Not on an NSX, but I'm currently running Yoko AVS Sports on my BMW M3 rears. The OEM tires on my M3 were Michelin Pilot Sports and they have got to be one of the best tires. I decided to go with AVS based on all the good reviews and wanted to see how comparable it would be and the fact that they looked really aggressive. I'd say, I put about 4k miles on it so far and the tread still looks like it's new. In comparison to the Pilots, the AVS are not as good in dry but "decently comparable" in the wet. It's cheaper by about $100/tire, but you get about $100 less performance per tire compared to the Pilots. When cornering hard on the Pilots, you get a good warning before you reach the limit of the tires. Very predictable on the Pilots and you get a good sense for where the limits are pretty easily. But with AVS, it can get a bit scary since the tires are a bit harder and there's not much or little warning before you reach the limits of these tires. For everyday driving, you'd be able to tell a slight difference, but for "spirited driving" the differences are very noticeable and I drive my M3 pretty hard.
Based on my current experience(& my personal opinion), I would never put AVS on my NSX unless all you're going to be doing is driving it in the rain. On high performance tires, I would rate the AVS average and rate Pilots and OEM NSX tires as high. I've heard good things about Bridgestones, but never had the opportunity to drive on them. I need to replace my OEMs within the next 1k miles, but after doing more research and knowing how good OEMs are, I've decided to stick with OEMs.
The average cost on OEMs run about $200/tire and I would pay the extra $20-30/tire and get the OEMs on the NSX. You'll enjoy your NSX more. Only down side is the limited treadlife, but it's well worth it.
Let me know if anybody else has a different opinion on the Yoko AVS Sports.
bluesaint
01-31-2001, 15:36
Guys if you want something that is high performance in both dry and wet with a treadware of 200 get the Bridgestone S02 Pole Positions. I just bought some for my Impreza 215/45/17's A tad expensive $170 a tire, but well worth it.
James Cruz
01-31-2001, 16:13
I'm also running the SO2's and they are amazing tires!!! They stick to street like glue. Tire wear is reasonable considering the low tread wear.
ChopsJazz
01-31-2001, 20:37
I have recently switched from OEM Yok's to Dunlop 9000's and I can't stand them.
They feel numb and disconnected from the road, and this is with the original (pretty radical) '91 alignment specs.
There is a benefit to designing each tire for a specific purpose, as the OEM tires are designed. And that is to greatly increase turn-in response, road feel, crisp handling, etc. All of which, I believe, are the hallmark of the NSX.
Granted, the 9000's are very sticky, and they wear considerably better than the OEM's, but turn-in is sloppy by comparison and at high speed the car feels dangerously disconnected. I'd much rather have the performance of the OEM's any day and sacrafice treadwear.
I hope my 9000's wear out soon so I can have my old car back!
khiroshima
01-31-2001, 21:09
Now, THERE'S the "old" Ken we know and love. Thought we lost you for a minute, but I knew you would be back. http://www.nsxprime.com/ubb/wink.gif
Go OEM!
Kevin
After reading through your responses and going over the FAQ one more time, I've decided to go with the OEM Yokos. I've been curious to try them since the day I first realized my '00 came with the Bridgestones and I'm not terribly concerned with how quickly they'll wear out...at least not for now.
Hmmm. No one mentioned where I should get these tires installed. Anyone from the L.A. area checking this post????
Discount Tire is a chain store all over S. Cal, and I know for a fact that they have sales on NSX Yokos sometimes. The Yoko prices have been reasonable even without the sale.
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NSXY
95 NSX-T, 5 sp, Red/Tan, Stock, except Dunlaptya SP9000s
Would they be willing to install tires bought through a vendor like Tire Rack or Discount Tires Direct?
rquintero
02-01-2001, 00:51
For what is worth (and perhaps out of ignorance) I am sold on the fact that the NSX is *extremely* sensitive to its tires, more than any car I've ever had.
So I'll stick with OEM Yokos all around for as long as I can afford them.
While more knowledgeable owners can switch out of the OEM Yokos or Potenzas and go through the needed realignment & toe adjustments, I am too much of a wimp to risk a bad job as I don't understand the subject well enough.
In the past I've switched 2 of my Porsches to Dunlop SPs, and while I could certainly tell a difference it wasn't night and day.
On the other hand, I just replaced a damaged tire with the same (OEM Yoko) and gotta tell you that driving with one tire at ~70% tread vs. the new one with 100% tread changed the whole complexion of the car. Twitchy & unnatural, very dramatic difference.
Point is my feel is that the NSX is special in that it is a "package". Besides eventually making some mods to increase forward speed (i.e. SC) I really don't want to unbalance anything in the car.
Just my 2 cents.
There is no question that the OEM Yokos are supposed to be used on this car, if you want the very best handling performance and money is no object.
For me at this time, however, money IS something of an object. Because the Yoko's tread life is >4 times less than the Dunlap 9000s, it would cost me about 4X more $/mile to run the Yokos than the Dunlaps, assuming similar prices.
Over the lifetime of the car, let's say 150K miles, one would have used up 30 sets! of rear Yokos and only 7.5 sets of rear Dunlaps. I estimate an overall cost difference of $20,000 at current prices over 150K miles. $20K is nothing to some people and a lot to others.
Another point is that using Dunlaps does not turn the NSX into a ponderous Toyota Tundra 4X4. It's still an NSX! With the Dunlaps the car still kicks ass in the straight away and handles extremely well in the corners, albeit not as responsive and precise in the corners as with OEMs. I use stock alignment settings throughout.
If and when I can get to a financial situation where I can burn money logs in the fireplace, I'll go back to the Yokos, because I've driven them, and they help make this car one remarkable experience.
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NSXY
95 NSX-T, 5 sp, Red/Tan, Stock, except Dunlaptya SP9000s
Over the lifetime of the car, let's say 150K miles, one would have used up 30 sets! of rear Yokos and only 7.5 sets of rear Dunlaps. I estimate an overall cost difference of $20,000 at current prices over 150K miles
Better re-check your math. At the current Tire Rack price of $225 per tire for Yokohama A022H in your stock 245/40ZR17 size, 30 sets of rear Yokos cost $13,500 so I don't see how the cost difference can be $20,000. http://www.nsxprime.com/ubb/wink.gif
Also, for an extra few thousand bucks over the life of the car, getting the best performing tires you can is probably better value for the money than any mod you can buy.
NSXTACY:
Do it yourself calculating the difference when replacing BOTH the fronts and the rears.
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NSXY
95 NSX-T, 5 sp, Red/Tan, Stock, except Dunlaptya SP9000s
ChopsJazz
02-01-2001, 19:46
NSXY, I hope I didn't imply that my NSX feels like a 4X4. It just isn't the same NSX that I used to know and love. Not nearly as crisp in the handling department on the Dunlops. But I really don't think that a new set of tires every 10K to 12K miles is that much of an issue (and I'm just a school teacher!). I chalk it up to "cost-of-ownership". Kind of like premium gas, insurance costs, and all that money and time I spend washing the damn thing!
And Kevin, who're you calling old?
JazzChops:
If I could get 10K miles out of Yokos, I'd use them, but I don't. I got exactly 5k miles out of the rears, and the fronts were so badly worn on the insides, that it wasn't worth keeping them. I had the alignment specs checked using the Hunter machine, and the car specs were exactly stock, so I had no alignment problem to account for the rapid wear. Believe me, I do want to use the Yokos, but I don't want to pay for two sets of tires a year, at about $900 a pop, that's all.
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NSXY
95 NSX-T, 5 sp, Red/Tan, Stock, except Dunlaptya SP9000s
[This message has been edited by NSXY (edited 01 February 2001).]
Andrie Hartanto
02-01-2001, 22:26
I can't justify that much money for a tire that I mainly use for the street either. I tried Nitto NT555 before and quite happy with them The Yoko still better, but for the street, barely feel it. And in the track, it's all about the driver. Ask Kevin, or Northwest guys http://www.nsxprime.com/ubb/smile.gif Last time I was out in thunderhill was using the Nitto NT 555.
I'm trying Kumho 712 now.
But this is mainly for street use, I usually use track tires on the track.
Flying Low
02-01-2001, 22:46
Eric,
If you have decided on the OEM Yokos I advise that you change all four tires. Mixing the OEM yokos with Bridgstones up front might not be good.
Does anyone know for sure?
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94 Red & Tan NSX 5spd
1999 Cosmos BMW M Coupe 5spd
Mixing the OEM yokos with Bridgstones up front might not be good.[/QUOTE]
I actually wondered about that. Anyone? I want to order my tires soon as I have very little tread left.
And Flying Low...you need to update your signature to reflect certain changes in your car collection http://www.nsxprime.com/ubb/wink.gif
[This message has been edited by akira3d (edited 01 February 2001).]
If you have decided on the OEM Yokos I advise that you change all four tires. Mixing the OEM yokos with Bridgstones up front might not be good.
Does anyone know for sure?
As a general rule, it's best to keep all four tires the same. Given that the front tires last 2-3 times as long as the rear tires (assuming you do only highway driving; driving with some good cornering will wear the fronts fairly evenly), your best bet is this: If you still have lots of tread on the Bridgestone fronts, get another set of Bridgestones for the rear. Once those wear out, the fronts will be ready to go too, so you can replace all four at the same time.
[This message has been edited by nsxtasy (edited 01 February 2001).]
NSXTACY:
Do it yourself calculating the difference when replacing BOTH the fronts and the rears.
Okay, when you go through 30 sets of rear tires ($13,500), you'll also go through 10 to 15 sets of front tires for $3,920-5,880. They still don't cost $20,000, let alone account for a difference of $20,000 vs another tire.
Your turn. http://www.nsxprime.com/ubb/biggrin.gif
[This message has been edited by nsxtasy (edited 01 February 2001).]
I got exactly 5k miles out of the rears, and the fronts were so badly worn on the insides, that it wasn't worth keeping them. I had the alignment specs checked using the Hunter machine, and the car specs were exactly stock, so I had no alignment problem to account for the rapid wear.
That's considered normal wear for these tires on the rear.
The car is set up to expect that you will be doing some fairly hard cornering some of the time, and this will wear the fronts evenly. If you only use the car for highway driving, you may run into problems with uneven wear. This is explained in further detail in the FAQ.
Of course, if you only do highway driving, and you're willing to use lower-performance tires to save money, you might not be getting a whole lot of benefit out of the NSX's capabilities since you're probably not using them. In which case you might get more value from a lower-performance car. No flames intended; it's just that if you're looking to save some money, there are some other ways to do it than driving an NSX conservatively.
rquintero
02-02-2001, 00:05
A tad off the thread, but maybe not: I'm about to hit 4,300 miles on my NSX. Original Yokos with the exception of one newer Yoko in the front.
Rears are starting to look disturbingly low on thread, almost overnight.
The remaining tread on the original front is odd though: on the inside of the tire the "rear" (the part that hits the asphalt first going forward) of each of the notches is hugely more worn than the front end (is this called "feathered"?)
Maybe normal. Anyone know the answer?
I got about 10K on the rears w/Bridgestone OEM. Have 6K miles on Yoko OEMs and they have plenty of tread depth left. This is in 95 and 99 NSXs, respectively. Are you guys doing repeated smokey burnouts or something? Most of the mileage on the 99 NSX has been spent in the Santa Cruz mountains with lots of lateral load in a s/c car that has seen an occasional(!) smokey burnout too, but my tires look fine...
YMMV,
--twc
Ralph, I'm the same as you. My fronts feather or scallop severely on the insides of the tires.. have never checked the alignment but assumed it was normal as my last set of tires did this also....
To add another element to this thread, I have the Comptech non-compliance rear suspension member (highly recommend it), so I have been able to dial out most of the camber on my car with no impact on the handling and better tracking on the highway. In addition, I have 14,000 miles on my Pilots and they are in pretty good shape in the rear and in great shape on the front.
If you read the old articles on modified NSXs (esp. the yellow Comptech car), you will see that almost all of the testers remarked on the improvement with the non-compliance beam. No flexy bushings --> less need for camber --> better handling --> bonus of longer tire life.
Of all of the modifications to my car (and there are many), this is one of the best in the long run.
If you still have lots of tread on the Bridgestone fronts, get another set of Bridgestones for the rear. Once those wear out, the fronts will be ready to go too, so you can replace all four at the same time.
Thanks for the advice. I just ordered the Bridgestones through Tire Rack (Discount Tires Direct doesn't appear to carry them). My NEXT set will be the OEM Yokos...
As for me, I tried to order Yoko's through DTD for member discount but the right rear was not available and I need ALL four tires NOW. The fronts are worn on the inside and the rears are low and I am going to Orlando for the Exotic Auto Show next weekend. I would rather not chance putting that many miles on these tires - besides which I'll be putting about 200 on this weekend. Since the Yoko's were not available I decided to try something different and went with Toyo Proxes TS1's. These have gotten good reviews from other members and the sizes work OK. I did go plus size at 225/45/16 and 265/40/17 - should fit on OEM rims.. I hope these are not enough to mess up my acceleration too much. I'll take some times with my Gtech before/after the tires are swapped to find out.
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BobsYT
2000 Red/Black #81
The place I have always gone to is Chatsworth Tire. It's a bit out of the way, but it's an excellent place and their prices are cheap (about equal to the discount tire sites). You can tell it's a very popular place because it's absolutely PACKED on Saturdays. You see a lot of performace cars there.
The Goodyears on my vette cost $350 from Goodyear, and only $220 a piece through Chatsworth Tire, so I save $130 per tire. Plus, it saves me the trouble of ordering them and then dragging them to a shop. They give me a great price, have the tires there next day, and I just show up on Saturday to get it done. They mount them either for free or for $20-40 bucks including alignment, fcorget. You could probably find tires for slightly less on tirerack, but sometimes it's not worth the hassle. Just an additional opinion since you're in LA too.
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