View Full Version : NSX and 360 Modena running the track.
On saturday, I had an opportunity to went to a track here in San Diego with three of my friends, also NSX owners. Lo and behold, to our disbelief, we saw an NSX and a 360 lined up against one another. The NSX was a early coupe with a great driver; the 360 was a Challenger model, also with a fast pilot on board.
They ran three times together. To my amazament, the NSX and the 360 crossed the finish line in pretty close time in all three tries, with the Ferrari leading the NSX on every single run by about one second, like 74.25 and 75.50.
This spoke very highly of the NSX's capability, holding off a car like the 360 Challenger with very respectable time. When I saw this, I was wondering of how well a Zanardi edition, hence, more power (290 vs 270), better suspension, and lighter would hold up against the Ferrari. It would be fun, I would think. Also, I love the 360 Modena, it is just like an NSX almost with its aluminum construction, high rpm, mid-engined; a great car to have, in addition to the NSX.
Take care everyone.
Sorry, Deqle, but a bone stock early model Nsx has no chance of even being remotely close to a 360 Challange car. Maybe if Mario Andretti was driving the Nsx, and my 90 year old grandma was in the 360.
Allan,
Maybe you are right, but there were quite a few people on board here that were with me yesterday. nzo-who, gomaidy, and W. Like I said, it was a good race, or maybe the other explaination might be that the driver of the 360 might not be as good as that of the NSX. You take care, bro.
Jonathan
04-20-2003, 14:09
Nothing in his original post indicated the early coupe was bone stock.
It is reasonable to assume that an apparently good driver who would take the opportunity to line up with a 360 on the track could have a heavily modded early coupe.
Either way I am sure it was entertaining.
JS
It is unclear from your post,1)what track?2)what format,hpde,time trial ect.3)tires?4)was the nsx stock,and was the 360 a real challenge?5)if the venue was an auto-x then they might be close.I've been on track with 360 challenge and they are much quicker than 355 challenge as well as most street nsx.Oh and if you had posted this to the track talk forum like so many others should then I would'nt have to defend its status!
De,
Where is there a track in the San Diego area that allows you to run times like that? Those numbers seem off for X-cross times.
When you say track racing, i assume you mean with lots of cornering and turns. I believe the NSX would have an advantage if it's got lots of cornering.
Also were they REALLY racing or just having a spin around the track? The 360 owner especially might have been cautious about pushing his car too hard; it's worth a lot of pennies.
Hope you can provide more details Deqle coz i want to believe! Honestly, I WANT TO BELIEVE! :D
I would'nt have to defend its status!
Amen, preach it brother. This is the EXACT type of post that should have went to the track forum.
Although, I think it'd be pretty hard for a modified NSX to compete favorably against a 360 Challenge car I'm sure given a much better driver it could be done. Still, that's a tall order.
I think it would take a very highly modified NSX with a very good driver to beat a 360 Challenge car. The 360 Challenge cars are way lighter and way more powerful...they are purpose-built race cars and the NSX is a street car. I think the 360 driver was being very careful with his very valuable car.
maomaonsx
04-20-2003, 23:24
Two things, unless you know both driver's abilities, it's pretty much a useless comparasion; also, do you really mean an auto-cross? Those times sounds more like auto-X, and I know there is no real track in San Diego(Hotville definately do not count as a track)...oh the pain~
The race was set up at Qualcomm stadium's parking lot, there are two of them, one was set up for the Porsche club, the other was for mixed vehicles. The NSX as far as I can tell, have a HKS exhaust on it with the early 5-spoke set up wheels. The suspension was also a good set up. That was all I can tell from visually inspecting the vehicle.
Randy, you should know who drove the vehicle, because they shown up at Mark Johnson OTC send off party. They are Paul and Heidi driving a white NSX.
Take care gentlemen.
You guys are right, it is not exactly a full time track, but the stadium was set up for drag racing and lots of corner carving on the weekend. I am not used to this type of racing before, so there were probably mistakes made when I tried to name the event. Hey, who knows,maybe the 360's driver could have been careful with his car.
Anyhow, it was entertaining to see all the vehicles racing. Hope I don't see Will's ZO6 down there because he will get smoke by all the good drivers down there. Yes, he just traded his S2000 for a bright red ZO6, good lord. It's time to up the ante on the sport car scene here in San Diego.
Randy,
What's happened? you are a hard man to get a hold off. Been wondering where the pictures were for the OTC send-off party. Also, I tried to contact you on the day that Will came with the ZO6, so we can all get together and go out for dinner.
On the other hand, don't even think about what I said here. Like i said at the time of the party; I really appreciate what you did when I was down; It means a lot to me even now. Know that if you ever need anything, don't hesitate to ask.
For the rest of you guys on this board, you do not know how much I appreciate talking to you guys. I should be in Iraq right now with the rest of my unit, but I am not because of an unfortunate incident. No matter, if the situation in Iraq drag out, or other scenarios develope around the world with North Korea, Iran, and Syria, I will volunteer myself.
Please everyone, let's not argue too much over topic like this, there are more important things and people in our lives that need to be tend to. Tell you guys what, for whoever that disagree with me. Everything that I said was a lie, under false pretense. I hope that it makes you guys feel better, because I rather make the community better from people coming together rather than arguing with each other. After all, I have encounter quite a few patriots and smart people up on this board. Honestly, I rather us to be on the same side rather than arguing with one another.
De,
Sorry, I haven't uploaded any of those OTC sendoff pics yet. Heck, they're still on my camera's memory stick. Work has been hammering me.
-Randy
Originally posted by FuryNSX
De,
Work has been hammering me.
-Randy
Construction on the death-star is behind schedule again? I though you were the one that went around hammering the troopers. ;)
Darth-Fury is busy, and Obi-Won-KEN-obi is still missing? :(
I was at the Ferrari Challenge at Road America a few years ago timming all of them most were 360s there times were in the high 2.20s the best I believe was 2.25. The Acura of Brookfield NSX no SC Track ready when owned by Mike B I beleive ran a 2.28 at the same Track I was impressed.
Steven 91 Blk/Ivory
huckster
04-21-2003, 08:16
very cool. I keep thinking that we all have a hard time believing how good our nsx is, considering the hp/torque numbers.
Werent there several F1 drivers who all commented on how easy the nsx is to drive fast?
Maybe the nsx 'sum of the whole is greater than the sum of the parts'.
:)
pixelhaus
04-21-2003, 09:37
to hucksters point, the 'sum of the whole is greater than the sum of the parts', in my opinion is precisely correct. when the nsx was developed, it was a car that revolutionized the exotic car industry. an exotic that possessed the ease of drivability and the reliability of a honda was unheard of prior to the nsx. and since then, it seems that most exotic manufacturers are following that strategy.
a well balanced machine in every aspect.
I wonder what kind of suspension the Brookefield car was running? And where is it now?
Like I said, the Ferrari won the race, but I was very impressed of how well the NSX kept up, like Stephen did. Nonetheless, it was a great experience to see the two vehicles compete against one another.
Randy,
Good to hear from you. I wish you the best of luck in everything that you do. We will see each other when we meet, ok.
For the rest of you guys on this board. Remember to take great care of yourself and your loved ones. Wish you guys all the best.
Neo,
How is the weather and scenery in Australia now? I have a friend down there and she said she is loving it in Australia. As for me, I can't complain being here in San Diego.
De
Originally posted by NeoNSX
Construction on the death-star is behind schedule again? I though you were the one that went around hammering the troopers. ;)
I don't waste my valuable time toying with stormtroopers.
I am only now taking over the Death Star's construction schedule, so that all will be in order in time for the Emperor's arrival. ;)
I really don't understand theses observations. I've had my NSX for 7 years and my 360F1 for two. I've had both on my "home" tracks and I can assure you there are many seconds of difference around a road course. For more documented proof regarding your post: The 360 Challenge car can lap Willow Springs (big track) in the mid 1m22s (that's in the F2000/S2000 range), the fastest NSX I've seen at Willow (Doug Hayashi in a S/C'd and lightened NSX) can rarely brake the 1m30s lap. Eight seconds at Willow is an eternity. I am sure Doug's modified car can compete with a stock 360 like mine but a stock NSX is still quite a few seconds slower than a stock 360, and that's my own first hand observation.
P.S. I was a PASSENGER in a 360Ch driven by Curt Wagner (Challenge champion) and we turned 1m24s at Willow.
Bbobxer,
So you are not counting the driver skills and how qualified each individual may be.
Originally posted by Ponyboy
I wonder what kind of suspension the Brookefield car was running? And where is it now?
The car was bought by another Guy from the Milwaukee area and was at NSXPO-01 I think they have Coil-Overs on it.
Steven 91 Blk/Ivory
RP-Motorsports
04-21-2003, 20:23
Steve, you for got to mention that when Mike B. ran the (almost stock) Acura of Brookfield NSX, it was 10 years old and had over 100,000 miles on it. (mostly track time). Mike B. ran a 2:28 with a passenger at the Chicago Alpha Romeo owners Club time trials. The semi-pro 360 challenge drivers ran low 2:20's. Yes that is 7-8 seconds faster, but we are talking a 4 + mile long track. Their are only 2 other makes of street legal cars in the last 5 years I have seen beat Mikes time. One is either the Mallet or the DRM C5, and the other is a Viper GTS. These examples can only beat his time by about a second. I have repeatedly seen mike hunt down C5's and Vipers at Road America with the AOB NSX. My hat is off to Ferrari for building such a perfect car, but for $25k for a 91 and a few grand in bolt ons, and you can have all the style and speed of a car 7 time the price ;)
T. Bell
Import Dynamics Performance Center
Neenah WI 54956
I really don't understand theses observations.
He just said that the 360 Challenge and the NSX he saw were very close in lap times. I doubt the guy is lying. He's just giving his observation and intrepretation of the particular event he saw. Not too hard to understand.
supercharged
04-21-2003, 22:45
Tino,
" the fastest NSX I've seen at Willow (Doug Hayashi in a S/C'd and lightened NSX) can rarely brake the 1m30s lap. Eight seconds at Willow is an eternity. I am sure Doug's modified car can compete with a stock 360 like mine but a stock NSX is still quite a few seconds slower than a stock 360, and that's my own first hand observation."
Doug turned 1:25.3 at this year's OTC
GhettoRacer
04-22-2003, 00:44
no doubt Ferrari has done a wonderful job on the 360. i can't wait to see what they got up the sleeve for the replacement.
as for NSX. the NSX-R shouldn't be far behind the 360. but when will Honda wake up and build a bigger displacement that will give lots of torque but still have the high rev power??
i've been a Honda fan since the mid 80's when i was a little boy. but I can not understand why they're always holding back.
that must have been a solo 2 event and those courses are usually very tight and not a good measure of ability for these cars. it may come down to which one had to fight the course less (i.e. less push). there are no long straights to play out horsepower advantages. what counts instead is torque on demand.
in addition to driver ability, knowing the course is imperative. you typically only get three or four runs and if you haven't walked and memorized the course prior all you see is a sea of cones. paul and heidi are experienced autocrossers. they also no doubt ran competition tires which are good for several seconds. the 360 may have been on street tires.
GhettoRacer
04-22-2003, 00:48
autox is all skills anyways and drivers makes night & day difference. it is hardly a measurement of a car's true capability. road race tracks would be a more consistant benchmark.
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