Don't skip shift. Official from Acura.

[TURBO2GO]

This is what I got from my dealer today when looking for a service bulletin on bad cold 1-2 shifting. Never found that bulletin (if anyone can give guidance here that would be appreciated). But did find this interesting document from Acura. So guys, don't skip gears. Ever.

 

[The Kid]

Now I can see it, Ive had the replace syncho's in the last two 02 NSX's we've had.

 

[Ski_Banker]

Would skip shifting be the same as rowing through the gears, but not actually disengaging the clutch? Ie, in 4th [clutch in] shift to 5th, then 6th, [clutch out]

Saving the clutch and laziness would be the only reason to do it on the upshift. How bout on downshift though? For example, cruising along in 6th, come up to a decent turn that would be fun in 2nd or 3rd -- do you downshift and clutch engage/disengage into 5th, then 4th, then 3rd?? Double clutch and go straight into 3rd??

 

[drew]

This has been discussed:

http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=50916

 

[nsxtasy]

This is what I got from my dealer today when looking for a service bulletin on bad cold 1-2 shifting. Never found that bulletin (if anyone can give guidance here that would be appreciated). But did find this interesting document from Acura. So guys, don't skip gears. Ever.

Imagestation does not allow remote linking of images from other websites, so others cannot see whatever picture/graphic you're trying to display in your post (unless they happen to be logged on to their Imagestation account).

 

[drew]

actually, they just don't allow hot linking. Just right click> properties> copy/paste URL into your own browser.

But here, I've done it for you, cropped due to size limitations.

 

[nsxtasy]

actually, they just don't allow hot linking. Just right click> properties> copy/paste URL into your own browser.

That's the same thing I said; they don't allow remote linking from other websites. When you copy and paste the URL (which is a PITA and should not be necessary), you are then accessing the image directly from the Imagestation website.

 

[Klayton]

Imagestation does not allow remote linking of images from other websites, so others cannot see whatever picture/graphic you're trying to display in your post (unless they happen to be logged on to their Imagestation account).

I can see the picture and I don't have an imagestation account. Seems like the problem is on your side.


I like to shift, so I'd never skip shift. Thanks for the info anyways!

Greetings
Klayton.

 

[nsxtasy]

I can see the picture and I don't have an imagestation account. Seems like the problem is on your side.

Nope. No problem here. The picture displayed in the post is an image from the Imagestation site, which says, "Sorry... You are trying to access an image from outside of Imagestation.com" This is what Imagestation does when remote linking from another site is attempted.

EDIT: Now I can see it, too. I have no idea what changed...

 

[nsxtasy]

Getting back to the "skip shift" issue, here's what I would like to know.

Is "skip shifting" bad only for those who don't match revs? Or does the wear on the synchros occur even if you match revs perfectly?

 

[Klayton]

Well then seems like my refer link blocking firewall does its job pretty good, letting imagestation not know where the picture request is coming from. Cool.

Is "skip shifting" bad only for those who don't match revs? Or does the wear on the synchros occur even if you match revs perfectly?

I don't think you can match revs that exactly it doesn't wear on the synchronizers.

 

[NSX-Tuner]

Nope. No problem here. The picture displayed in the post is an image from the Imagestation site, which says, "Sorry... You are trying to access an image from outside of Imagestation.com" This is what Imagestation does when remote linking from another site is attempted.

EDIT: Now I can see it, too. I have no idea what changed...

FYI-

If you had right-mouse clicked->properties->copied image URL and viewed image directly in your browser, the image would have been copied locally into your browser's cache for that URL. Returning back to this post will load the image from your browser's cache. However, if you do CNTL-REFRESH on your browser, the image will not be viewable since the browser will try to pull it from Imagestation.com again.

 

[Ski_Banker]

Uh...ok...like 7 posts there of nonsense. To 2nd NSXTASY (with mine), if you rev match down shift, does that solve the synchro problem? Not really applicable on the upshifts...

 

[Hugh]

Not really applicable on the upshifts...

That's what doesn't make sense, you don't blip the throttle to match revs on upshifts yet Acura's service bulletin describes a scenario with skipped upshifts causing the problem.

I guess when upshift you need to find a way to make the engine slow down faster than normal. Kinda like the opposite of heel and toe. But if you skip shift, you obviously don't belong behind the wheel of manual car. It simply means you're a shitty driver.

 

[nsxtasy]

I don't think you can match revs so exactly that it doesn't wear on the synchronizers.

That may be true, but to the extent that it is, it's true regardless of whether or not you skip gears when shifting.

That's what doesn't make sense, you don't blip the throttle to match revs on upshifts yet Acura's service bulletin describes a scenario with skipped upshifts causing the problem.

I think they're mostly talking about upshifting. Outside of track use, I doubt that a lot of people do a lot of gear-skipping when downshifting.

I guess when upshift you need to find a way to make the engine slow down faster than normal.

Absolutely. You need to do this to match revs. If you go from third to fifth and you do it so quick that the engine revs haven't fallen to the point where they match the road speed, then you're not matching revs.

I still would like to know the answer to my question about whether skipping gears makes any difference (in the wear on the synchros) if you are matching revs (as best you can)...

 

[Ski_Banker]

That's what doesn't make sense, you don't blip the throttle to match revs on upshifts yet Acura's service bulletin describes a scenario with skipped upshifts causing the problem.

I guess when upshift you need to find a way to make the engine slow down faster than normal. Kinda like the opposite of heel and toe. But if you skip shift, you obviously don't belong behind the wheel of manual car. It simply means you're a shitty driver.

I don't understand a word you just said. :biggrin:

 

[Hugh]

I still would like to know the answer to my question about whether skipping gears makes any difference (in the wear on the synchros) if you are matching revs (as best you can)...

I suppose the answer would be no if you are able to match the revs. But the whole concept of skipping gears on upshifts makes about as much sense as brushing every other tooth in your mouth.

 

[Ski_Banker]

I suppose the answer would be no if you are able to match the revs. But the whole concept of skipping gears on upshifts makes about as much sense as brushing every other tooth in your mouth.

That Boca air is really fogging the noggin, eh? :tongue: Heres a scenario: onramp, 95N. 2nd......8000!....3rd......8000!....look at speedo and decide 90 might be a little hot for the morning commute...

Like "Choose Your Own Adventure" do you:

a) calmly, shift into 4th, then into 5th, then into 6th -- all the while decelerating for Mamma Bear
b) go to 4th, and then [correctly??] into 6th - rev matching at the 2500 RPM cruising speed, to save the clutch
c) Drop the oil slick and smoke screen while e-braking and takin' out the bad guys with a .45 shot to their gas tanks

I choose "B" but that's 'cause mine has 6 gears, hehehe. :biggrin:

 

[john@johnhudakracing]

I suppose the answer would be no if you are able to match the revs. But the whole concept of skipping gears on upshifts makes about as much sense as brushing every other tooth in your mouth.

I go 3rd to 5th or 4th to 6th quite often, often times after shorter on-ramps as ski pointed out.. but I will give pause to allow the RPM's to drop prior to re-engagement, say from 6800 to 2900 or whatever is applicable for the driving situation.

Now, if you tack it out then immediately drop it into a higher gear and snap the clutch out, more wear is obviously far more a factor across the board for the syncros and other parts, which is likely the gist of the TSB.

Many tens of thousands of miles, and never a problem in any Honda yet.

 

[TURBO2GO]

Imagestation does not allow remote linking of images from other websites, so others cannot see whatever picture/graphic you're trying to display in your post (unless they happen to be logged on to their Imagestation account).

So what should I be doing then? can everyone else see this bulletin?

I realize this was discussed before but there were no clear answer for me, and I thought its helpful to see the TSB say "don't do it".

 

[nsxtasy]

So what should I be doing then?

Use a different site for uploading pictures, one that allows remote linking, like I've done below using the www.we-todd-did-racing.com website.

With other pictures, another option is to resize the image, using software such as mentioned in this post. If you get it down under 100 Kb, you can simply attach it to your post from your hard drive, without any uploading and linking required. But the TSB has too much detail to fit, as Drew discovered.

I thought its helpful to see the TSB say "don't do it".

It is indeed! Thank you for posting it. But it's more helpful to use a site that allows the image to be displayed in the post.

 

[TURBO2GO]

It is indeed! Thank you for posting it. But it's more helpful to use a site that allows the image to be displayed in the post.

OK man, I am sorry!!! :frown: I will never do it again... ever... I promise... :wink:

 

[DocL]

OK man, I am sorry!!! :frown: I will never do it again... ever... I promise... :wink:

Your punishment will be to drive around in NYC in a 1986 Lamborghini Countach with the biga$$ rear wing. :biggrin:

 

[Hugh]

So what should I be doing then? can everyone else see this bulletin?

I realize this was discussed before but there were no clear answer for me, and I thought its helpful to see the TSB say "don't do it".

You can also upload your photo right her on Prime to the gallery and linnk to it there.

The clear answer is to shift consecutively through the gears and break that awful habit of skip shifting.

 

[Ben]

This is what I got from my dealer today when looking for a service bulletin on bad cold 1-2 shifting. Never found that bulletin (if anyone can give guidance here that would be appreciated).

Did you ever find anything on bad cold 1-2 shifting? My '05 has had that problem since Day 1. When the car is cold, it grinds going from 1-2 about 80% of the time. My old '92, and another '94 that I'm caring for do not have this problem.