Factor X Engineering Turbo Kit FX3.0T

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19 March 2002
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Hello all,


We have received many e-mails and phone calls in the past few months regarding our Turbo Kit, so for times sake we will post information about FX3.0T here.

We have been developing the FX 3.0T for quite sometime now. The task has been time consuming and has not come with out sacrifice. In order for our company to release a turbo kit to the NSX community, we needed to know what are the safe and reliable limits of a stock NSX engine running boost. Anybody can say a kit is safe, but we put our time and money where our mouth was, and intentionally pushed not one but three of our own NSX motors to the edge and beyond. In addition to putting the engine through intensive testing, we also tested many engine management systems, ran various forms of Forced Induction and Compression, and various kit components. From this expensive and time-consuming process, we determined the engine’s limits, and its weaknesses. These engine failures were not a result of improper tuning but rather pushing the limits of the stock NSX in terms, of Engine Management, Fuel System, Oiling System, Airflow, Internal Engine Components, and Drive Train. As the saying goes “Knowledge is Power” so we anticipated the fact that these things were going to happen. With this knowledge we are confident that we can offer the NSX community a turbo system that will surpass existing FI solutions in terms of reliability, serviceability, drivability, and power.

Even though our R&D process took longer than we originally planned, and other kits have been released. We decided at the inception of this project that we are not in a race (For once:)) and therefore would not be the first forced induction kit on the market. Our goal when developing this Turbo kit was to offer a kit that would be the best in the market. The original NSX engineers took countless hours designing this exotic, and we owed it to them to release an equally refined kit. We are fortunate to have some very talented individuals who have put an incredible amount of thought into the design our kit, an awesome facility that can accommodate the R&D process, and a location that provides us with track time right within our own facility. For those of you who have waited, we promise not to disappoint.

In the coming months we will also be releasing the FX3.2T turbo kit, a Normally Aspirated Platform, and a slew of other track tested go-fast parts. If you have any questions or concerns feel free to ask and we will do our best to answer them.

p.s. We appreciate the fact those of you out there that have seen/ridden in the FX3.0T honored your word about keeping this project quiet. It is truly a joy being a part of the NSX community.
 
OK, I'll bite. So what have you ended up with for fuel management and timing control? Not asking for any trade secrets, mind you, just what your approach is and what components you have used. A few comments on your ability to get A/F's reliably across your test cars would also be helpful.
 
And I'll nibble too.....how is the FX's engine management controlled on OBD-II cars, which have throttle-by-wire?

The reason I ask is because three prominent EMS manufacturers have told me that the T-B-W feature of the OBD-II cars is a programming challenge.

Further to kpond's question - is your box programmable or is it "gated" ala Cybernation's?

Joke mode - ok, we've had enough threads that slam the three supercharger kits against each other, how 'bout pitting the three turbocharger kits against each other? :p
 
AndyVecsey said:
And I'll nibble too.....how is the FX's engine management controlled on OBD-II cars, which have throttle-by-wire?

The reason I ask is because three prominent EMS manufacturers have told me that the T-B-W feature of the OBD-II cars is a programming challenge.

Further to kpond's question - is your box programmable or is it "gated" ala Cybernation's?

Joke mode - ok, we've had enough threads that slam the three supercharger kits against each other, how 'bout pitting the three turbocharger kits against each other? :p


Also what about price, power, and what has to be modded, and some pics as well?
 
Teaser Photo

Here is a teaser picture of our turbo system. http://www.factorxengineering.com/photos/fxturboteaser.jpg


In response to the questions mentioned above we are a bit hesitant to respond to them until we can provide the community with definitive answers. However, in regards to fuel management we have been to AEM for training and have been asked back to participate in the advanced session. In addition, we are also official tuners and distributors for the NSX AEM unit in the Nevada region. If you are in need of an EMS feel free to call. There is a new software revision coming in the next few weeks so we would like to see what improvements they made on the previous version before we commit that EMS to our turbo kit. If the AEM does not satisfy our requirements, we have worked out a deal with Motec to provide the NSX community with a more cost effective solution.
 
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Factor X-

Very slick! Looks like things are coming along quite nicely.

Out of curiosity, are you concerned at all about the heat from the exhaust affecting the turbo housing and/or the intercooler?

In the photo, they all appear to be quite close to one another, perhaps there is room for some form of heat shielding.
 
Sorry to disagree with Sig, but I think FactorX is completely full of s&it. So, the first thread is brag, brag, brag, we've done everything, our kit is so good, so well tested... blah, blah, blah.

"So, what are you using for engine management??"

Uh, er, duh, well, duh, err.... what a bunch of crap. The bottom line is that you don't have any engine management. Well, maybe the AEM will work... or maybe we'll talk to motec.

Hahahahaha!

Save your bragging until your done. Write off your testing to date - it is meaningless.
 
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kpond said:
Sorry to disagree with sjs, but I think FactorX is completely full of s&it. So, the first thread is brag, brag, brag, we've done everything, our kit is so good, so well tested... blah, blah, blah.

"So, what are you using for engine management??"

Uh, er, duh, well, duh, err.... what a bunch of crap. The bottom line is that you don't have any engine management. Well, maybe the AEM will work... or maybe we'll talk to motec.

Hahahahaha!

Save your bragging until your done. Write off your testing to date - it is meaningless.

Kpond,
Were did THAT come from? Best thing to do is go back, re-read what you said and edit your post. Totally uncalled for. Have you no shame?
overpape3.gif
 
Ryanmcd2 said:
Also what about price, power, and what has to be modded, and some pics as well?



???? Also now when is it going to be done and the price? Like I said in the past what site is going to be done 1st the BBSC or yours. :rolleyes:
 
Anytime,
If Kpond's post is a little bit sensitive, and I think it was, then go ahead, and edit it yourself; don't wait. As far as I am concern, I like the way Ken at Factor X Motorsport handle any NSX related issue. Why, you ask? Speaking from experience when the shop was still here in California.
Ken, still remember the coil packs I got from you, and the motor you got from me here in San diego. I am still waiting for the nitrous kit in the NSX when the time is right for me, right now there is a couple of issues that I have to work out. Take care and good luck with your business!

De
 
Gents,

There are fundamentally two aspects to FI. On the NSX, both of them typically present challenges. One, of course, is the physical engineering, manufacturing, component selection, fitment, etc. From the picture, it appears that FactorX has done a very nice job in this department. The mid engine and overall limited space of the NSX make this part a challenge.

The second challenge - especially on the NSX, is engine management. In the response to the "where did that come from?", the opening thread of FactorX talks about all of the testing that has been done, etc. Now, perhaps I shouldn't have said that ALL of the testing is meaningless. All the physical componetry, fitment, turbo/wastegate sizing and operation are all valid. However, all is moot without the right level of engine management... for both fuel delivery and timing. In my experience, this is where the real challenge has been. The BBSC kit, from a physical design perspective, is also very good... but has continued to struggle on a engine management solution despite a broadening community of owners and "investment".

My advice to FactorX is that they are only halfway there... I agree that AEM conceptually can be the right solution but first we need to see the box configured correctly for this application and THEN some accumulation of miles, various driving conditions, etc. Oh, and let's not forget the cost of an AEM box which will likely add another $1100 - $1500 to the cost of an overall solution.

The summary is that my "reaction" was born out of the implication that FactorX had a solution that was nearing market readiness, that had a lot of testing, and that would be available soon. Now, it appears that the selection of engine management has not been done yet.

I do hope for the best for FactorX. I like the kit and I would like to own one. Minimally, I'd like to benefit from their engine management solution knowledge and expertise but it doesn't appear yet that they are advanced (with the NSX) in this topic yet.

Sig, sorry to typo sjs instead of you.
 
Kpond,
great reply. Some of the things you said does make a lot of points. However, as far as business relationship is concern, I am happy with Factor X, hope you can see where I am coming from. You take care Kpond.
 
After looking at the pic, I've got one thing to ask. Wha...??? If I didn't know any better (b/c I obviously don't) I would say this thing is a complete stand-alone bolt on. Outside of the obvious electrical and FM issues associated with such a task, it looks as though this thing will be ordered and sent in one BIG ass crate for ease of instalation. This should mean that all in-house tuning will be replicated to the consumer by bypassing all exhaust variables.

Good question on the cats. I'm curious as to how CA residents will work with this thing. Of course, if it is easily removable because of the mounting plates that I see, and the COPS aren't around to see it...?;)

Hmmm... Sorry kpond, but you are only asking half the questions. The more I tear this thing down mechanicaly, the more questions I have on the other side of the coin. Heat deferring, oil distribution, ALL SEASON capability (looks great for the dessert though), blah blah blah.

Of course this is wasted energy and space. I'll write again when the kit is actually released. Which seems to be way off still. For now I will settle for the new wallpaper their pic provides!
 
In our humble opinion the primary and most important challenge in developing the forced induction kit for the NSX is the ENGINE MANAGEMENT. This R&D has been on going for almost 1 ½ years now and has been very educational. What have we used for Engine Management on the NSX? FMU, VAFC, E-Manage, SS R4 box, our own Hondata collaboration, AEM, and Motec. Through our experience with the above mentioned solutions, we narrowed them down to the AEM and the Motec. The Motec solution works great, however we are trying to provide the community with a premium cost effective solution. Therefore we leaned toward the AEM EMS. The EMS is going through another software update in the coming weeks. Unfortunately, we were told this update will not be backwards compatible with the current .94. This means you will have to manually input all the values from .94 to the 1.00. Due to this reason we would like to wait and see how the 1.00 runs. As per our conversation with AEM the .94 is stable and is fueling their 1000+rwhp drag car so if the 1.00 is unsatisfactory we will stay with the .94. Not wanting to put our eggs in one basket our contingency plan is to use the Motec. We have an excellent relationship with Motec USA and have worked out a deal with them to provide a more discounted solution for our kits.


The second challenge when developing the forced induction kit for the NSX is finding out the limit of the C30 with the OEM specs. Many people have perceived numbers of the limits and may have let a few C30s go however, we do not know if those motors were tuned correctly. As many people know and, we are sure it can be searched for somewhere, we have been pushing the most power for the longest period of time out of the stock C30. The last thing we want to do is release a kit that is pushing more than it can handle and have the engine fatigue on our client. If a client wishes to push in excess of the capacity FX3.0T, then they can upgrade to the FX3.2T. This is a completely built motor (Not just some off the shelf Low Comp JE’s dropped in) with the bottom half being able to hold in excess of 1,000hp.


The third challenge is properly designing the components of the turbo kit. This includes COMPRESSOR MATCHING, adequate cooling, oiling, and fueling, plumbing, lines, exhaust, ventilation, etc.


The fourth challenge is keeping things quiet with frequent visits from all of the NSXers that stop by shop our:)


Lastly, we apologize if it sounded like we were bragging. If we wanted to brag we would say:

Built and tuned World’s Fastest Civic 204+mph
Built and tuned 1000+RWHP Drag Lexus
Built and tuned 500+FWHP Eclipse
Built and tuned 600+FWHP Daily Driven Civic
Built and tuned 215+FWHP NA Daily Driven Type R
Built and tuned 300+RWHP Jeep Sahara
Tuned 455+RWHP C30NSX
Tuned 600+RWHP Viper
Tuned 500+RWHP Turbo GS 300
Tuned 550+RWHP Shelby Cobra
Tuned 5+rwhp Formula SAE Competition Car (100% increase in HP)
 
Andy,

The TBW issue is definitely a programming issue. Going back to the pre 94 set-up looks promising as does a custom manifold. We have spoken to Pectel and Motec about this issue as we are encountering it right now with another project vehicle. If anything comes about we will let the community know.
 
Ryan,

We will be posting the price, dyna graph, and modifications when they are ready. In regards to the website, we farm out that portion of our business so it is in their court now.
 
Sig,

That is an excellent point about the heat affecting the aftercooler. The space is pretty tight back there so we are currently coating the components. If this does not provide the benefit we are looking for at the next track session we will we adding a heat shield.
 
This forum and this community has never been like the Supra forum. The people over here is more mature and a bit more educated, if I might say so myself. There is nothing wrong with criticisms, as long as it is in good taste. Being criticize sometime make you better, if you know what I mean.

Factor X, if there is an opportunity for me to see my old motor, It would be great, only if I have the time. For now, being here, I can only imagine what it looks like. Dang it, why can't I take a trip to Vegas right now? On another matter, thankyou for the coils, they really help.
Regards,
De
 
Ya, and give me a heart attack along with the pictures, just joking. I can't wait to see the pictures.
All the best,
De
 
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