fuel injector/nitrous question

[Berlina]

Hello everyone...newbie here

I am interested in installing a nitrous system on my 2002 NSX. I found one from venom-performance.com that solves the potential lean fuel condition by 'pulsing' the injectors during nitrous infusion. My question is, at WOT, aren't the injectors fully open allowing maximum fuel injection? If so, won't pulsing them at this time actually REDUCE the amount of fuel injected?

Thanks in advance for any clarification...
Bob

 

[BadCarma]

Hi Bob, I dont have the time right this moment but sometime to day I can tell you what I know about the venom system (is very good but you need a pro installer if you are not up on nitrous) it requires soldering wires to the injectors. anyway I will lay it out later today.I am off to get NOS parts
best regards david

 

[Zishan]

FYI, David(BadCarma) has nitrous in his blood. He's the one to talk to about nitrous IMHO.

 

[4AU4LIFE]

FYI, David(BadCarma) has nitrous in his blood. He's the one to talk to about nitrous IMHO.

You couldn't be more right.

 

[Briank]

Brelina

Your fuel injectors really only open while the intake valves are open. For normal operation with stock injectors they can supply plenty of fuel and opening while there is air flow is always better then spraying into a closed port. Your ECU calculates the length of the pulse and the timing, longer pulse more fuel shorter pulse less fuel. The injectors should never be open all the time, if they are you have no control. Now with FI or NOS you need more fuel to go with the increased air or NOS. There are a couple of ways to do that open the injector longer and or increase the fuel pressure to get more fuel for the same pulse length. I am assuming the stock ECU may not like to pulse when the intake valve is not open. So I can believe there is time that the injectors are not being opened by the stock ECU that would allow add on controller to add additional pulse time.

It would be interesting to calculate how much fuel could be delivered by the 6 injectors if they were wide open at the standard fuel pressure. Does some one have the lb./Hr ratings of the stock injectors ??

Briank

 

[BadCarma]

Brelina

It would be interesting to calculate how much fuel could be delivered by the 6 injectors if they were wide open at the standard fuel pressure. Does some one have the lb./Hr ratings of the stock injectors ??

Briank

Wide open you dont want, 80% duty cycle is prefered. to high a duty cycle and they can lock up. AS for playing with flow rates and duty cycle and BSFC follow the link

you can do it here:

http://www.rceng.com/technical.htm

Bob, I will post your info later today...wow that sounds like what I said yesterday. I am testing a cicuit board rebuild for A/C right now and took a break. when I finish up I will post all about Venom nitrous. I have my dash apart and am adding some 'stuff' in there, after that your venom and then another NOS install. no rest for the wicked. BTW your injectors pulse with or without nitrous.
David

 

[NA1 #2853]

The Venom nitrous kit solders/taps into each of the injector leads from the ECU. the injectors are supplied power from the main PGMFI relay, and the the computer grouds the injectors to get them to open and close. When the nitrous kit does it when you spray the nitrous the venom electronics will use their own injector drivers to slightly extend the amount of time the injectors are held open to deliver more fuel.

ie:

{(OEM Pulse.......................)..Venom Pulse....}

{Total Pulse Duration Of Injector....................}

This is very similar to how the Greddy eManage's "additional injection" function works.

I believe the kit also taps into the O2 sensor, and if it sees the sensor dive towards the lean side instead of the rich side when you "jam-it" with the nitrous, it will cut the nitrous flow off.


Although you have to make sure that (OEM Pulse) + (Venom Additional Pulse) < (80ish % Duty cycle).

If you go too much past that the injector will be trigger to open and close so quickly, the pin inside the injector the "plugs" and "unplugs" the spray hole will not get a chance to open or close fully, and it will "flutter", and you get a nasty dribble out of the injector instead of a spray, and that will not burn correctly, and is dangerous.

If you get to that point maybe a "slight" upsize in the injectors (ie: accel offers 370cc), or a little boost of fuel pressure will help out a bit.

New Size = Old Size * Square(New Pressure / Old Pressure) <---- i think thats the formula....


Hope i was helpful.
-Ray

 

[BadCarma]

Bob, I have been really busy the past week to include a hands on install of the venom kit on someones car, I kept pushing them for NOS but he would not have it. it was straight forward and the instructions that came with the kit were the best I had ever seen.the instructions were like 7 pages long and covered everything. I always look at nitrous install instructions from the point of view could I do this if I had no experience and I believe I could have with ease.I spoke at length with the techs at Venom and asked many questions about the system and found them extremely technical in regard to the install and methodology.that is not always the case.
anyway as someone posted above indicating the increased duration of the pulse,he was dead on and conveyed it precisely. (I knew this but his post made me question several aspects of fuel delivery via this method) I still have reservations about tampering with the pulse duration without tuning on a dyno even if it messes with duration only when the spray is on(critical time).it is way involved and as you indicated to me needs to be discussed via a phone call. pm me the best time to call after monday. I have 5 kits to build and one local kit plus install but have the time to get with you. I am hoping to drive the venom kit car tonight and will give you feedback on that also.
Best Regards David

PS I forgot to mention this.the kit you need must be a venom 2000 and the kit # is: N-10-202

 

[raven]

David
I as well have been looking at the Venom for awhile. I'm especially interested in the linear mode of operation which allows a more turbo like feel during spray. So in your opinion someone with average mechanical skills could complete the install with no major problems? Is the programming fairly straight forward as well? Also waiting for your update on the drive evaluation of the system.
Thx

 

[DPG]

Your best bet is to get the Nitrous Express kit. I have a couple of friends that have had the kit on their NSX's and they loved it,
Get a 75 or 100 wet shot with a Gen X 2 kit. It is all you need.
No weird stuff. A fuel pill and a nitrous pill, all the proper wiring and you are off to the races. If you have any other questions you can contact Jason or Brad a Autologic Inc. in Houston TX at 713 516 2081. They can answer all your questions.

www.Auto-logic.biz