Has anyone here ever installed the Sakebomb Garage competition rear brake kit?

[Matt'sNSX]

So we're trying to install my Sakebomb Garage competition rear brake kit and have run into a problem. We ran into two problems actually. One there are two bolts that secure the rear brake caliper to the knuckle, and these bolts are flanged. When you try to install the rear caliper relocation bracket the "flange" part of those two bolts are in the way and prevent the bracket from laying flush. It looks like you would either have to install new bolts (Not included) OR grind away part of the flange. The second more critical issue is that after we ground down those two bolts the rear brake caliper does not center correctly and is rubbing against the inside of the brake rotor.

When you go to the Sakebomb Garage website, there's downloadable instructions but the one for the NSX is grayed out and is a dead link. What the link SAYS however, is "Competition Rear BBK Template" which implies (IMHO) that there is some cutting involved.

To make matters worse, my car is tying up a lift and I am losing valuable time. ANY help suggestions would be greatly appreciated!!

 

[docjohn]

they seem to respond quickly If you message them from their website..

 

[Matt'sNSX]

they seem to respond quickly If you message them from their website..

Thanks Doc! I messaged them through their website, I emailed them, called AND sent a text message. In their defense, it IS a Saturday and they are surely closed, but I'm hoping that some diligent employee will see the messages and respond. The reason for all of the urgency is because I only have the lift for today and I won't be able to get it back in for at least a month.

I suspect that we have the wrong rotors as the caliper relocation bracket is sitting perfectly flush compared to the original mounting holes but we did a "test fit" and the caliper bracket rubs against the inside of the rotor. Hopefully they'll respond and we'll have some kind of "Eureka" moment...

 

[RYU]

Did you figure this out by chance? Are you running NA2 brake caliper brackets? The NA2 brackets are a little troublesome on my RFY oversize kit but they work well once you fiddle with it. There's more clearance on the NA1 brackets. I wonder if Sake Bomb has these specific for NA1 brackets.

I assume the bracket SBG made is similar to this: https://www.rf-yamamoto.com/NSXbrake/13.html

 

[Matt'sNSX]

Did you figure this out by chance? Are you running NA2 brake caliper brackets? The NA2 brackets are a little troublesome on my RFY oversize kit but they work well once you fiddle with it. There's more clearance on the NA1 brackets. I wonder if Sake Bomb has these specific for NA1 brackets.

I assume the bracket SBG made is similar to this: https://www.rf-yamamoto.com/NSXbrake/13.html

Sorry for the delayed response Ryu, and I sincerely appreciate your input. We have not figured it out yet and as of this morning (11:50am EST on 5/3) I am waiting to hear back from Heath at SBG. The kit did not come with instructions, and although we are pretty confident that we installed everything correctly, we want to be sure that we didn't miss a step.
The brackets are similar to the RFY brackets although the SBG kit uses radially mounted calipers so their bracket, in addition to relocating the rear calipers, essentially "converts" them to a more traditional mounting location. Now as far as I know, my calipers are the OE NA1 calipers but it's interesting that you asked if they were NA2 brackets. One of the complications we ran into was that my tech had some difficulty removing the rear calipers and he feels that the caliper pin (I think he said it was the pin) is likely to break the next time we attempt to remove the rear calipers so he suggested that I get new rear calipers. The issue, as I'm sure you're aware, is that new NA1 rear calipers are all but impossible to find, but I was able to find new NA2 rear calipers, so if somehow the fix is to switch to NA2 rear calipers, I'm willing to do that!

I will keep you in the loop but any thoughts or suggestions are appreciated. At the risk of sounding like a whining, privileged cry baby, I'm pretty bummed this isn't working so far, and even though the front brakes are fine, I feel like they don't really make sense unless they are paired with "matching" rear brakes.

Anyway, thank you once again for your input!

 

[MotorMouth93]

It would be very helpful if you could post some photos of what is going on. The SBG kit just moves the OEM caliper further from the hub using an "L" shaped bracket, nothing appears to be radially mounted.

Aftermarket rotors tend to sit a little further inboard than the stock ones to try to gain some clearance between the calipers and wheels. You can put washers between the adapter bracket and the knuckle to move the caliper further inboard as well to prevent it from touching the rotor, just make sure you still have good thread engagement with the mounting bolts.

Pretty much all of the parts of the caliper aside from the bare castings (bracket and main caliper) are available, so if a pin or something that isn't a casting somehow broke it would be easy and cheap to fix it. At this point I'd recommend pretty much everyone with an early year NSX to rebuild their brake calipers so everything can be properly inspected and replaced along with new seals for another few decades of service.

 

[RYU]

Basically what John said above ^^^. You can rebuild the calipers if it comes down to that. I'm also having trouble visualizing exactly what's going and I'm VERY familiar with several of the BBK's available for our car. I just haven't looked into SBG's kit nor can I find any photos on the website. Have the tech take a video of all that's going on. If I can visualize the problem that's closer to being able to help.

 

[Matt'sNSX]

Okay, I’m an idiot… You’re absolutely correct, the front brake calipers are radially mounted and the rear brake kit utilizes the stock calipers which obviously are not radially mounted. Blame it on a very busy, stressful day!

Part of the complication we ran into is that we work for Porsche Delaware and my tech came in on a weekend to work on my car. I obviously couldn’t have his lift tied up on Monday morning, so we had to put the stock rear brakes back on and put everything back together, I’ll post the couple pictures I do have, but you certainly seem to understand the issue as you’re absolutely correct in that the “offset” of the rear brake rotors are too far inboard and are rubbing against the caliper bracket.

My tech and I had thought about using washers to space the bracket back half a millimeter or so, but we figured that it wouldn’t provide a very rigid mount plus it didn’t make sense that SBG wouldn’t machine the bracket the correct size to begin with. Last, but not least, the mounting holes in the relocation bracket are perfectly flush with the OE mounting holes so I have to imagine that it was meant to be mounted perfrectly flush and the issue is either with the rotor hat or something else.

Again, hopefully once we see the instructions it will be obvious enough what went wrong or hopefully Heath at SBG will figure out that the friction disc was mated with the wrong hat and its just a matter of getting the correct hats out to us Or something equally as simple! I will keep you good ladies and gents in the loop!

Post Script: Here’s a picture of the relocation bracket installed. The first problem we ran into were the two mounting bolts. You can see how the two bolts are flanged and the flange was interfering with the bracket. We obviously used a grinder to remove part of the flange. Not an ideal solution, but being that we had such a limited window of opportunity with the lift we were using concessions were made.

I did notice on the SBG website there‘s a reference to a template which implies that’s somerthin has to be cut, but as the directions weren’t included we don’t know what that template was supposed to be. Anyway, you can see from the picture that the holes are perfectly level…

Again, and at risk of belaboring the point, hopefully someone from SBG will chime in…

 

[RYU]

I might have time to take mine apart this weekend. I'm running RFY on an NA2 caliper. As Katsuya Yamamoto told me himself, "it is troublesome for NA2" because the clearances are so tight. You have NA1 so try to keep it if you can. I have a feeling SBG has not tried this using an NA2 caliper bracket. Based on your picture, the NA2 caliper bracket would not fit at all.

I can't find an NA1 vs NA2 caliper bracket photo but here's a Racing Brake vs. NA2 photo. The NA1 would sit below the bottom bracket and would be radially closer to the center of the hub.

 

[Matt'sNSX]

Yeah, I know that it’s difficult to visualize without picture. We essentially just ran out of time and had to get everything back together fairly quickly. Heath from SBG was kind enough to reach out on Saturday evening but by that point the car was already back together. I imagine that he may want me to take everything apart so we can get pictures, but I’m really hoping to avoid that as it was difficult enough to get time on the lift and I’d hate to do it a second time, only to put everything back together again and bring it back a THIRD time to finally get it all installed correctly.

I appreciate the very kind offer to take a look at yours over the weekend but the fact of the matter is that you shouldn’t have to do that. Heath from SBG just emailed me and wants me to take some pictures/measurements so hopefully we will have it figured out soon!

As always, I appreciate all of the help gents! I will continue to keep you in the loop!

 

[RYU]

Yeah, I know that it’s difficult to visualize without picture. We essentially just ran out of time and had to get everything back together fairly quickly. Heath from SBG was kind enough to reach out on Saturday evening but by that point the car was already back together. I imagine that he may want me to take everything apart so we can get pictures, but I’m really hoping to avoid that as it was difficult enough to get time on the lift and I’d hate to do it a second time, only to put everything back together again and bring it back a THIRD time to finally get it all installed correctly.

I appreciate the very kind offer to take a look at yours over the weekend but the fact of the matter is that you shouldn’t have to do that. Heath from SBG just emailed me and wants me to take some pictures/measurements so hopefully we will have it figured out soon!

As always, I appreciate all of the help gents! I will continue to keep you in the loop!

Hopefully you're not having to R&D anything for them. w/o some compensation for your time and efforts. Clearly it's been an ordeal. That's probably one of my biggest pet peeves with vendors. Anyhow, good luck! Hope it's an easy fix. Keep us posted!

 

[Matt'sNSX]

Hopefully you're not having to R&D anything for them. w/o some compensation for your time and efforts. Clearly it's been an ordeal. That's probably one of my biggest pet peeves with vendors. Anyhow, good luck! Hope it's an easy fix. Keep us posted!

Ruht roh!

According to Heath at Sakebomb Garage, "Everything matches up with what we have here". That was after my technician and I took a few measurements from the rear rotors that came with the kit. Heath had speculated that maybe my rear brake setup had been changed at some point with "brakes from a later model", but that of course, would mean rear brakes from an NA2. I can't imagine that being the case as the car was 100% stock when I got it and it would be a remarkable coincidence that the only components that were changed just happened to be the ones we are struggling with if that were the case. Understand that I think Heath is every bit as skeptical as I am about it, but I imagine that he just can't think of what else it could be at this point.
Heath asked me to get measurements from my rear brake rotors which unfortunately, are back on the car. Not sure how I'll get an accurate measurement but I'll try my best. I am very curious about one thing that may or may not be relevant. In the "Instructions" section of SBG's website there's a dead link for the "Competition Rear BBK Template", and it's the ONLY link that doesn't work. The word "Template" implies, in my opinion, that there's something that needs to be cut or machined as part of this kit. I've asked Heath about it a couple times but as of this moment he hasn't answered. It may or may not be anything but I have a sneaking suspicion that it may be significant.

I want to take a moment to say a very sincere "Thank you" to Ryu, John and John. Please believe me when I say that knowing that I have a few sharp, experienced and capable members available to help makes the difference between just a little stressed out and borderline despair. So again, thank you VERY much for your time and attention!

 

[Matt'sNSX]

On a side note, I’m extremely happy with both the front brakes and the Öhlins coil-overs. The car handles undulations significantly better although it doesn’t care for sharp edged bumps, such as man hole covers or when I transition from macadam to a raised section of concrete. It’s absolutely livable and I haven’t messed with the adjusters at all, so I may even be able to “tune it out”. I’ll write a more thorough review after I get this rear brake mess sorted!

Speaking of brakes, I’d definitely recommend getting the anti-rattle clips as the front brake pads have a lot of play and you can hear them rattle when going over bumps or any time you brake lightly. You also get a fair bit of brake squeal but that’s to be expected and again, it’s only when you’re braking lightly. Again, I’ll write a more thorough review/description once we get the rear brakes figured oit!

Anyway, appearance wise, I think the brakes look awesome!!

 

[MotorMouth93]

What part of the rear caliper bracket is hitting the rotor? And how far from fitting do you think it is? It really seems like they might have given you the wrong top hat for the rotor. If you set the SBG rotor down flat on a table how tall is it compared to the stock one? You can easily compare by flipping one of them over and sliding one under the other.

 

[RYU]

Love the Technomags!

 

[docjohn]

Love the Technomags!

haha ..back in the day all the fast guys had them...

 

[Matt'sNSX]

What part of the rear caliper bracket is hitting the rotor? And how far from fitting do you think it is? It really seems like they might have given you the wrong top hat for the rotor. If you set the SBG rotor down flat on a table how tall is it compared to the stock one? You can easily compare by flipping one of them over and sliding one under the other.

I think you’re right about it being the hat. At this point that’s about the only thing it can be as I was my rear calipers are stock. I can’t recall specifically which pair was hitting my tech said we only needed about a millimeter. It makes sense to do the comparison you’re talking about but unfortunately we simply ran out of time and had to put the stock brakes back on. I work for Porsche Delaware, and while we’re allowed to use the service lifts during the weekend we can’t leave the car on the lift as we have to make sure the lift is clear for Monday’s service appointments.
I definitely don’t want to take it all apart again only to have to put it all back together again while I’m waiting for replacement rotors. I think at this point I’m just going to ask Heath to send out replacement rotors and I’ll send the old ones back. Like you said, I think it has to be the hats. It was a fairly long wait when I ordered these and I’m hoping that won’t be the case now!

Thanks for the input as always and I’ll keep you in the loop!

 

[Matt'sNSX]

Love the Technomags!

Thanks!

Overall I’m pretty happy with them. Unfortunately, in my excitement of having found a somewhat clean set of Tecnomagnesio wheels (I had to have them refinished/repainted) I never bothered to ask how wide the wheels were. The seller said “Perfect for a stock body NSX“ and in my delirium I took that as stock width.

I know, I know, what can I say, I was excited…

They wound up being 17x8 and 18x10 ‘s which are were a half inch wider than what I wanted for the front and a full inch wider than I wanted for the rears. The wider wheels necessitated a 225 width front and 275 width rear tire, and while I think it looks cool, it’s far too wide for a 270hp car. The wheel and tire combo wound up being 4-5lbs heavier for each wheel and tire than my previous set-up of Mitamotorsport 7S wheels with 215’s and 255’s. Kind of defeats the purpose of magnesium wheels, but oh well…

P.S.) In retrospect I think I may have been able to keep the 215 width front and 255 width rears, but was concerned about a “Stance Nation Yo!” stretched look.

 

[D Baggins]

Hey did you ever get the rear brakes installed on your car? I just installed this kit last week on my 91 and ended up having to shim the bracket to get it to center up on the rotor properly. I just found some random washers laying around and they ended up working perfectly. Also had to massage the stock bracket a tiny little bit to clear the stock dust shield

 

[Matt'sNSX]

Hey did you ever get the rear brakes installed on your car? I just installed this kit last week on my 91 and ended up having to shim the bracket to get it to center up on the rotor properly. I just found some random washers laying around and they ended up working perfectly. Also had to massage the stock bracket a tiny little bit to clear the stock dust shield

Wow, remarkable timing! I did indeed get them installed finally after how many months? Our initial attempt was back in April, and I didn't get them installed until late last month. Having said that a significant part of that delay was finding the time where my tech could get it done. We're allowed to work on our personal vehicles here at work but we have to do it after hours, so it definitely took a while to get back in the shop. Regarding the installation, we had to do the same thing. My tech fabricated spacers from a thin piece of sheet metal as the inside of the brake rotor was contacting the caliper bracket. It's curious as it was closer after SakeBomb Garage sent the brakes back to me, but they were still off my a millimeter or so.
Having said all of that, I was very happy with the end result. When I was running their AP Racing front serty-up with the stock rears I noticed little, if any improvement, but I noticed a significant improvement once the rears were installed. The car simply stops quicker and with less pedal effort! I told Heath at SakeBomb Garage to not let only get the fronts only as the rears apparently make all of the difference. Anyway, glad to hear you worked it out!

 

[D Baggins]

Wow, remarkable timing! I did indeed get them installed finally after how many months? Our initial attempt was back in April, and I didn't get them installed until late last month. Having said that a significant part of that delay was finding the time where my tech could get it done. We're allowed to work on our personal vehicles here at work but we have to do it after hours, so it definitely took a while to get back in the shop. Regarding the installation, we had to do the same thing. My tech fabricated spacers from a thin piece of sheet metal as the inside of the brake rotor was contacting the caliper bracket. It's curious as it was closer after SakeBomb Garage sent the brakes back to me, but they were still off my a millimeter or so.
Having said all of that, I was very happy with the end result. When I was running their AP Racing front serty-up with the stock rears I noticed little, if any improvement, but I noticed a significant improvement once the rears were installed. The car simply stops quicker and with less pedal effort! I told Heath at SakeBomb Garage to not let only get the fronts only as the rears apparently make all of the difference. Anyway, glad to hear you worked it out!

Good to hear, I installed everything all at once so I didn’t feel the brakes being off balance like that, it was pretty much night and day for me going from stock brakes with a dead ALB to the sakebomb front and rears with ap1 abs update. I got the wheels off and took a few pictures of the rears so just gonna post them here in case someone else runs into the clearance issues we both had.