Has anyone attempted to to this? How difficult (or simple :smile
of a job would replacing the OEM ones with the SOS ones be?
of a job would replacing the OEM ones with the SOS ones be?
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Lost motion assembly (LMA) install
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Has anyone attempted to to this? How difficult (or simple :smile
You will need to drop the motor to install the LMA.
Gary
Well, not sure "need" is exactly correct
. I think "want" is more like it. I have seen this done with the engine in the car. Go to: http://www.danoland.com/nsxgarage/bent/index.htm for a full pictorial of it
. In fact this DIY site shows a full valve job done with the engine in the car. With that said, dropping the engine complete with suspension and trans would be the easiest for sure. Assuming of course a proper cradle and lift. That is what I do. There are a lot of parts to remove and keep organized to do this properly. I actually have made a long 8' x 2' table I keep alongside the car to carefully remove and organize all the engine parts so no parts get mixed up. It is very important to reassemble the parts in the same positions they were in before you started.
HTH,
LarryB
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Larry, please correct me if I'm wrong, but to install the LMA the rocker tubes will need to be removed and the rocker tubes do not have room to slide out while the engine is still in the car. Anyway this is what I experienced during my engine rebuild. I'm here to learn like everybody else.
BTW, I used a furniture doll I bought at Harbor Freight as my engine dolly.
Gary
BTW, I used a furniture doll I bought at Harbor Freight as my engine dolly.
Gary
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There actually is room to get the tubes out(pull them over the transmission end). DanO did it, check his DIY. Again, I personally would pull the motor, but it is not 100% required.
Regards,
LarryB
.Regards,
LarryB
my 93 is due for a timing belt soon. is this a worthwhile thing to have the shop that does my belt throw in there while they're doing the work?
I asked my mechanics (Tom and Ramon @ Niguel Motors in SoCal) the same thing recently and he said no. He said the LMA install requires pulling the cams, which isn't something that needs to be done during the timing belt changes.
Thanks for the tip
The LMA job is significantly easier to do along with the timing belt job. We charge only 4.5 hours to remove the cams (including plugs and seals), rockershafts, and LMAs if we are doing the work with the timing belt change. This then also gives you the opportunity to change the cam seals and cam plugs with new, which are again much easier to do with the timing belt job. If this was to be done separately, it would be 8 hours. It makes sense to me to do at the same time as the timing belt because the LMAs will eventually start to stick and the cam plugs and seals will eventually start to leak.
Like others have said, this can be done in the car with out engine removal. In our time study, it only makes sense to remove the engine if you are doing the timing belt, water pump, LMAs, cam plugs & seals, and coolant hoses. However, this is purely a personal preference of the technician. I would go with whatever they feel most comfortable with.
Don't forget that we offer these services to customers out of state at reasonable rates (three such jobs were done in the past four weeks here).
cheers,
-- Chris
Like others have said, this can be done in the car with out engine removal. In our time study, it only makes sense to remove the engine if you are doing the timing belt, water pump, LMAs, cam plugs & seals, and coolant hoses. However, this is purely a personal preference of the technician. I would go with whatever they feel most comfortable with.
Don't forget that we offer these services to customers out of state at reasonable rates (three such jobs were done in the past four weeks here).
cheers,
-- Chris
Wanted to resurrect this old thread to go kind of off-topic ask this question (related to a problem I had and so have become fixated on): If you already have the engine out for all of this work (timing belt, water pump, LMAs, cam plugs & seals, and coolant hoses) - do you ever also do the head gaskets on 3.0L engines as kind of preventative maintenance (replace OEM gasket with more-reliable MLS gasket)? At this point you're almost all of the way there. Or do you always hold off until/unless HG failure?
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The consensus on the HG is that there's nothing wrong with the OEM ones (just parroting here). You'll hear a hide spread between those two extremes 'If it ain't broke, don't fix it' and 'Go for it'.
With my higher mileage I'm in the boat for a 'possible' HG replacement in the future when TB is overdue. But regarding my mostly conservative driving I'm going to replace them only when I have to, even if the HG fail only a few years after the next TB job.
Nobody wants to end in a situation like with an oil pan gasket where a new one can leak more than the old one and you don't really know why. But I'm pretty sure you'll hear different opionons on this.
With my higher mileage I'm in the boat for a 'possible' HG replacement in the future when TB is overdue. But regarding my mostly conservative driving I'm going to replace them only when I have to, even if the HG fail only a few years after the next TB job.
Nobody wants to end in a situation like with an oil pan gasket where a new one can leak more than the old one and you don't really know why. But I'm pretty sure you'll hear different opionons on this.
can be done with the engine still in the car, i did as i don't have the space to drop the engine out.... it's fiddly, but definitely do-able
http://www.nsxcb.co.uk/showthread.php?9995-My-epic-engine-service!!!-Picture-heavy!!!
it all depends on how noisy the tappets sound after you have set the valve gaps!
(right click the pic and open in new tab should get rid of the photobucket watermark.... should))
http://www.nsxcb.co.uk/showthread.php?9995-My-epic-engine-service!!!-Picture-heavy!!!
it all depends on how noisy the tappets sound after you have set the valve gaps!
(right click the pic and open in new tab should get rid of the photobucket watermark.... should))
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Advice I got from LarryB many years ago was not to remove the heads unless there is a reason. If you have the engine out for service, it might be worth adding inspection of the gasket seam and a block gas test prior to removal to your task list. If they check out ok and the compression test is good, I would not remove and just check the head bolt torque. There are many hard-use (track-only) NSXs out there running just fine on their original gaskets.
Also keep in mind that Honda did not machine the 3.0 blocks or heads for the MLS gaskets at the factory, so if you do decide to change, you have to deck the block and mill the heads. This opens up a whole new can of worms because now you are taking apart the bottom end.
Factory finish on the heads/block is more than sufficient for MLS. Only machine the heads or block if warped (mine were not). And I would agree about not replacing the HG except for failure...only occurred as a transient thought when I remembered how far you have to get for LMA (cams and rockers removed).
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Not sure I agree- OEM MLS gaskets like those on the 3.2 require around 30 Ra, which is nearly a mirror-shine. Straight out of the machine shop is more like 10 Ra. Cometic and Fel-Pro put a rubber coating on their gaskets that let you get away with about 50 Ra, but even they will tell you they prefer closer to 30. Even when carefully cleaned, the 3.0 surfaces are closer to 60 or 70 Ra. Thus, I do not recommend using the OEM metal gaskets at all on the 3.0 without proper surfacing. If you choose to go with a rubber-coated MLS like Cometic, I would at least use a light coat of Permatex copper spray to help fill in the small imperfections in the deck surface. Opinions can differ, of course.
IMO don't pull the heads unless there is evidence of a problem. And if there is, then Cometic MLS vs OEM graphite is completely up to you, plenty of people have installed Cometic gaskets without machining and just careful cleaning of the block and heads. If you're going with Cometic gaskets I would recommend ARP studs at the same time though, since cranking down bolts to higher than factory torque specs into a 30 year old aluminum block is a risky proposition, putting the price for MLS gasket conversion parts at nearly $600 for both the stud kit and the gaskets vs <$400 for an OEM gasket replacement and new head bolts.
