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Need some guidance on suspension set ups

Joined
15 February 2015
Messages
4,472
Location
Coral ridge, Ft. Lauderdale
I run on BC racing coils with 10/10 spring rates on 18/19 tires for about 2 years. I HATE THEM! If the road is as smooth as glass, they are rock stars but I live in the real world and I am looking for comfort with milder performance. I'd rather be the guy riding comfortably versus crossing a line faster. I have spent days researching this on prime. Any advice would be extremely helpful. Or better yet, any locals willing to test set ups.
I just recently swapped over to Michelin pss tires and that helped out tremendously in ride comfort but I am in quite a confusing decision here. After long talks with Shad, he said to buy nothing but the KW v3. Here is my problem, I hate tuning the suspension. Suspension is not like engine tuning. It takes countless adjusting and then it is only set for 1 type of road. It is nice to be able to adjust as needed but I don't track the car yet. I am starting to come around and realize that Senna built this suspension and it should be kept that way, OEM.Changing anything on this cars suspension requires finesse which I don't have time or patience for. Here are a few set ups I am considering...

1- KW with oem top hats. I hear they are awesome but they are noisy just like the BC prior to warm up. I don't like that. But you get a specifically Dyno tuned shock for our cars abnormal suspension.
2- Bilsteins with oem springs on lower perch. That shortens shock travel- harsher ride
3- Bilsteins on top perch with tein s-tech springs. Springs are no longer matched to shocks.
4- H&R cup kit. Might be way too low extreme drop at 1.5". Might be far too extreme for a 225 front tire.
5- Koni with stock springs, way shorter than oem Shock just like the BC. Shorter shock travel once again.
6- All oem shocks brand new with lowering springs. This I am strongly considering. Honda knows the car and I am slowly realizing this. You change 1 thing and something else changes.Cause and affect. I'm tired of that.
But still, no longer is the spring matched to the shock.
7- In a last ditch effort, BC can custom make extended shock bodies for 100$ a peice or I can change spring rates for 100$ a peice. That's pretty awesome for a suspension company offering a full custom set up but the problem is, it's a NSX not a freaking Lancer or a WRX. The suspension components in our cars are like NOTHING on the streets and aftermarket suspension companies don't really factor this in.

Sounds like enough choices to make a head spin like the exorcist and mine has.
ALSO, I am looking to sell these BC coil overs once I decide and I have a WTT posting in the parts wanted threads. These have less than 5,000 miles on them. I think they would be far better for 17/18 set up. Even Shad says they aren't as bad as most. But there are better.
 
my experience with the BCs are completely different than yours but that probably doesnt matter to you. I would question why you chose an 18/19 set up if you wanted comfort. also why do you have coilovers in the first place? Are you going to track? Maybe you should get yourself a Bilstein set up (#2) and be done.

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BTW - You do realize the NSX is a sportcar right?? not a friggin Cadillac
 
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i found this thread very helpful in deciding to go with stock shocks and Tien S-Tech springs,which give slight lowering. This gentleman tried many different combinations before finding that suited him best-
http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/122696-A-Tale-of-Suspense(shun)

i have been happy with the setup,which is close to oem,which seems to be the way you are looking to go now.i don't track,but drive aggressively on the street when I can,and don't want a super-harsh ride.

this was his option 6,coincidentally the same as your option 6.i felt like he knew what he was talking about,and he noted he had some racing experience.

i would urge you to read the whole thread,there's a lot of info relevant to your situation
 
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I had my bilsteins/tanabe springs for years and loved them. I only switched out because I didn't care for them at the track.

My kw clubsports with custom spring rate fronts have been one of the best upgraded outside my turbo. Once dialed in they run just as comfortable over bumps as my bilstein but with a lot more potential.

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Also adjusting them isn't really an issue for me. I just followed what coz recommended and that was it. I've left them the same. Pm him.

To also add I had some time in bc coils and they were just bumpy. Unsure what you can adjust but they didn't ride great compared to just riding in the kw.

I will voice my opinion and whomever actually runs their car hard will agree, oem suspension is not bad depending on what model/year/spring combination but to say it's the best is absurd and how things are meant to be. Most oem items are useless for me and by now there are a lot better options out there with newer technology. Pairing that with other aftermarket mods and you'll have a great balanced car. As some have said before, you need other supporting mods to play with your suspension and play in harmony as well.
 
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ah nice thread link....Jinks do you want to have any adjustment on the suspension or install and forget?
 
my experience with the BCs are completely different than yours but that probably doesnt matter to you. I would question why you chose an 18/19 set up if you wanted comfort. also why do you have coilovers in the first place? Are you going to track? Maybe you should get yourself a Bilstein set up (#2) and be done.

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BTW - You do realize the NSX is a sportcar right?? not a friggin Cadillac
What spring do you run? Swift? What spring rates? In my opinion when swapping out to the BC coil overs you feel every single compliance part shifting and I don't want to bother redoing the whole cars suspension with aftermarket parts. But it is subjective. It does great on the highway. Not so great on rough roads.

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ah nice thread link....Jinks do you want to have any adjustment on the suspension or install and forget?
Some adjustment might be nice but I really don't want a threaded type shock adjustment. I also do not want noises coming from the dampers. I'm really thinking about doing brand new oem shocks with a tein lowering spring. I'd like a great oem type ride with a slightly lower height. The set and forget thing is a lot more my speed versus adjusting here/adjusting there. The KW seem like a hot commodity however I hear they are noisy from some and not for others.
That has me leaning towards oem.
 
What spring do you run? Swift? What spring rates? In my opinion when swapping out to the BC coil overs you feel every single compliance part shifting and I don't want to bother redoing the whole cars suspension with aftermarket parts. But it is subjective. It does great on the highway. Not so great on rough roads.

I'm running the Swift springs with the recommended 8Kg rear 10Kg front. For the damper settings I'm running 15 clicks from soft all around. For the track 20F 20R as per the recommendation on the BC Coilover thread here on Prime.
 
i found this thread very helpful in deciding to go with stock shocks and Tien S-Tech springs,which give slight lowering. This gentleman tried many different combinations before finding that suited him best-
http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/122696-A-Tale-of-Suspense(shun)

i have been happy with the setup,which is close to oem,which seems to be the way you are looking to go now.i don't track,but drive aggressively on the street when I can,and don't want a super-harsh ride.

this was his option 6,coincidentally the same as your option 6.i felt like he knew what he was talking about,and he noted he had some racing experience.

i would urge you to read the whole thread,there's a lot of info relevant to your situation
Thanks, I have read that thread a few times prior to posting this one. Which is why I think using aftermarket shocks completely changes the car. Some good changes and some bad. I'm looking for a happy medium.
 
I liked my old zanardi spring/koni yellow combo for light track /mostly street use.simple rebound only shock adjustment.
 
I'm running the Swift springs with the recommended 8Kg rear 10Kg front. For the damper settings I'm running 15 clicks from soft all around. For the track 20F 20R as per the recommendation on the BC Coilover thread here on Prime.
See the BC for me bottom out at high speed dips even at full ride height. They have always done this from the git go. I am running BC springs though. Maybe that is the issue but in my mind these coil overs seem mostly just for lowering. I didn't really feel any improvement on handling like I did when I swapped tires. The BC are super bouncy for me. Like a trampoline.
 
See the BC for me bottom out at high speed dips even at full ride height. They have always done this from the git go. I am running BC springs though. Maybe that is the issue but in my mind these coil overs seem mostly just for lowering. I didn't really feel any improvement on handling like I did when I swapped tires. The BC are super bouncy for me. Like a trampoline.
The Swift springs upgrade are probably only 10% of the equation. The biggest reason people should upgrade to Swift springs is that they are the light, they require the least amount of windings, and they are consistent and match tested so each pair has the same spring rate. It is still just a spring.

The damper is the biggest single factor to improve in your setup. The folks who buy BC springs and waste their money on the "Swift Upgrade" simply are misinformed and going with the internet hype. You can't put expensive makeup on a pig and make it look it better. The good news is the springs are still top of the line springs. You can reuse them on a different damper.

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Sorry, I don't mean to offend anyone running the BC coilover system. I have a lot of friends that do and it is a decent value for the money.
 
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See the BC for me bottom out at high speed dips even at full ride height. They have always done this from the git go. I am running BC springs though. Maybe that is the issue but in my mind these coil overs seem mostly just for lowering. I didn't really feel any improvement on handling like I did when I swapped tires. The BC are super bouncy for me. Like a trampoline.

Maybe you just got a bad batch............not sure what to tell ya. They dont work for you so you should find something else that does. All I can say is despite the elitist comment from RYU they have worked well enough for me to beat all the other NSXs at the NSXPO autocross (despite the highly inferior BC dampers which I clearly wasted my money on and can only dream of one day been as superior as RYU so that I can look down upon the peons below me) and I have been extremely competitive in other autocross events and they have worked just fine for me on the track. Could I have done even better with some elitist JRZ suspension or KWs?...........maybe................maybe not. As in many thing YMMV
 
A lot of ride comfort is subjective. Take a ride in a few NSXs with different suspension setups before you start spending money on things that might not make a difference.
 
[MENTION=16375]Dhalsim[/MENTION]. I love you buddy. I really do :) [MENTION=4034]Coz[/MENTION] thinks the JRZs are a waste of money so we all have our opinions. I'm wrong most of the time. Maybe all the time. Depends who you ask.

The love is strong among NSX owners...............Coz is right BTW but that doesn't deter me from wanting to be RYU when I grow up.
 
I'll just leave this though... Happy to debate next time I see you guys. Would love to do it over a beer! <iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/-G4FzRnqQX4" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

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The love is strong among NSX owners...............Coz is right BTW but that doesn't deter me from wanting to be RYU when I grow up.
The love might be too strong. We argue like married people. LMAO
 
I know it would be impossible but I would love to be able to drive my car on the track and set a consistent time and then swap out my coilover for a KW and run again and then swap out for a JRZ and run again and over and over and see just which one felt the best and which one made the best time. If it were just that easy............sigh


BTW - I'm not going to watch that video posted above because I'm 100% sure its just elitist propaganda :smile:
 
OK, let me clarify....JRZ are a waste of money for 95% of those out there. There are very few that are ever going to drive their NSX's at the limit that they would be able to tell the difference between a KW ClubSport or probably even a V3 and a JRZ, let alone understand how to set them up.
V3's, about 2300.00, Clubsports, about 3300.00, JRZ's 5000.00+.
Now if you have nothing else to spend your money on, then by all means, buy JRZ's so you can tell everyone you have them on your show and garage queen.
At least Regan does use them what they are meant for :)

[MENTION=16375]Dhalsim[/MENTION]. I love you buddy. I really do :) [MENTION=4034]Coz[/MENTION] thinks the JRZs are a waste of money so we all have our opinions. I'm wrong most of the time. Maybe all the time. Depends who you ask.
 
As my education and seat time increases i'm more in-tune with my car and i'm more sensitive to nuances. Those nuances become the size of the Grand Canyon the better of a driver you become and the more sensitive you get to your setup. The thing about JRZs I like the most is the availability of such a wide range of adjustment. Watch the video.. they talk about it. This means I can cater it to a particular driving condition better. I'm all about obsessing about the proper setup for any given condition. The analytics of that is what gets me up in the morning. Some people don't care and want something that's more "average" in performance that they don't want to screw around with the settings. I can respect that mindset as well. Also, the service from JRZ is absolutely unparalleled. I contact my distributor directly here in SoCal and he made himself available to refill my nitrogen cannisters for free at my leisure. He can also revalve as needed (but i'm not there yet). He also had no issues giving me the dyno sheets so I could better setup my car. The service level is simply outstanding. Again, most people don't need this amount of service. Most people won't find value in this. While I didn't pay nearly $5k for my JRZ RS Pros the service and support is well worth the money. Did I mention that I can call him anytime i'm at the track and he gives me trackside support? How awesome is that....! I'm finally able to work on my driving. The car is becoming so predictable and confidence inspiring that i'm focused on learning how to drive the car. Learning braking points, learning to trail-brake, learning the racing lines, etc. I get to do this w/o worrying setup. It's is extremely satisfying and rewarding. How much is that worth to you?I do think that the JRZs are not perfect. It makes me wish I got the 3-ways. The range is worth it's weight in gold though. It addresses [MENTION=16375]Dhalsim[/MENTION] 's concern with wanting to try different setups. Just imagine if you can simply adjust the knobs and have your car react completely differently. That's where I think the money is worth it on better Dampers. If you have just a racecar and spend a lot of time on the track I'm pretty sure you can setup even a set of BC Racing to be pretty darn good... will it have the flexibility and range to also be good on the street? Probably not.
 
Read carefully

As my education and eat time increases I'm more in-tune with my stomach and I'm more sensitive to nuances. Those nuances become the size of the Grand Canyon the better of an eater you become and the more sensitive you get to your food. The thing about tacos I like the most is the availability of such a wide range of condiments. Watch the Mexicans.. they talk about it. This means I can cater it to a particular eating condition better. I'm all about obsessing about the proper taco for any given condition. The analytics of that is what gets me up in the morning. Some people don't care and want something that's more "average" in taste that they don't want to screw around with the condiments. I can respect that mindset as well. Also, the satisfaction from tacos is absolutely unparalleled. I contact Mexiricer directly here in SoCal and he made himself available to refill my taco cannisters for free at my leisure. He can also provide salsas as needed (but i'm not hungry yet). He also had no issues giving me the salsas so I could better setup my taco. The service level is simply outstanding. Again, most people don't need this amount of service. Most people won't find value in this. While I didn't pay nearly $5 for my tacos the service and support is well worth the money. Did I mention that I can call Mexiricer anytime I'm at the track and he gives me trackside support? How awesome is that....! I'm finally able to eat on the track. The taco is becoming so predictable and confidence inspiring that i'm focused on learning how to enjoy the taco. Learning eating points, learning to savor, learning my eating limits, etc. I get to do this w/o worrying setup. It's is extremely satisfying and rewarding. How much is that worth to you? I do think that the Mexiricer tacos are not perfect. It makes me wish I got the tamales. The range is worth it's weight in gold though. It addresses [MENTION=16375]Dhalsim[/MENTION] 's concern with wanting to try different tacos. Just imagine if you can simply adjust the salsas and have your taco taste completely differently. That's where I think the money is worth it on better salsas. If you have just a taco and spend a lot of time eating I'm pretty sure you can setup even aTijuana taco to be pretty darn good... will it have the flexibility and range to also be as good as Mexiricers? Probably not.
 
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LOL...leave it to Roger...

Read carefully

As my education and eat time increases I'm more in-tune with my stomach and I'm more sensitive to nuances. Those nuances become the size of the Grand Canyon the better of an eater you become and the more sensitive you get to your food. The thing about tacos I like the most is the availability of such a wide range of condiments. Watch the Mexicans.. they talk about it. This means I can cater it to a particular eating condition better. I'm all about obsessing about the proper taco for any given condition. The analytics of that is what gets me up in the morning. Some people don't care and want something that's more "average" in taste that they don't want to screw around with the condiments. I can respect that mindset as well. Also, the satisfaction from tacos is absolutely unparalleled. I contact Mexiricer directly here in SoCal and he made himself available to refill my taco cannisters for free at my leisure. He can also provide salsas as needed (but i'm not hungry yet). He also had no issues giving me the salsas so I could better setup my taco. The service level is simply outstanding. Again, most people don't need this amount of service. Most people won't find value in this. While I didn't pay nearly $5 for my tacos the service and support is well worth the money. Did I mention that I can call Mexiricer anytime I'm at the track and he gives me trackside support? How awesome is that....! I'm finally able to eat on the track. The taco is becoming so predictable and confidence inspiring that i'm focused on learning how to enjoy the taco. Learning eating points, learning to savor, learning my eating limits, etc. I get to do this w/o worrying setup. It's is extremely satisfying and rewarding. How much is that worth to you? I do think that the Mexiricer tacos are not perfect. It makes me wish I got the tamales. The range is worth it's weight in gold though. It addresses [MENTION=16375]Dhalsim[/MENTION] 's concern with wanting to try different tacos. Just imagine if you can simply adjust the salsas and have your taco taste completely differently. That's where I think the money is worth it on better salsas. If you have just a taco and spend a lot of time eating I'm pretty sure you can setup even aTijuana taco to be pretty darn good... will it have the flexibility and range to also be as good as Mexiricers? Probably not.

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You should come out and start tracking with us at NASA TT events Regan....
This will make you a better driver....It has me, Nick, Jawn, Ravi and everyone else we know as drivers ourselves and those we have taught as instructors.
You're already a good driver, this I can assure you will make you better by far.

As my education and seat time increases i'm more in-tune with my car and i'm more sensitive to nuances. Those nuances become the size of the Grand Canyon the better of a driver you become and the more sensitive you get to your setup. The thing about JRZs I like the most is the availability of such a wide range of adjustment. Watch the video.. they talk about it. This means I can cater it to a particular driving condition better. I'm all about obsessing about the proper setup for any given condition. The analytics of that is what gets me up in the morning. Some people don't care and want something that's more "average" in performance that they don't want to screw around with the settings. I can respect that mindset as well. Also, the service from JRZ is absolutely unparalleled. I contact my distributor directly here in SoCal and he made himself available to refill my nitrogen cannisters for free at my leisure. He can also revalve as needed (but i'm not there yet). He also had no issues giving me the dyno sheets so I could better setup my car. The service level is simply outstanding. Again, most people don't need this amount of service. Most people won't find value in this. While I didn't pay nearly $5k for my JRZ RS Pros the service and support is well worth the money. Did I mention that I can call him anytime i'm at the track and he gives me trackside support? How awesome is that....! I'm finally able to work on my driving. The car is becoming so predictable and confidence inspiring that i'm focused on learning how to drive the car. Learning braking points, learning to trail-brake, learning the racing lines, etc. I get to do this w/o worrying setup. It's is extremely satisfying and rewarding. How much is that worth to you?I do think that the JRZs are not perfect. It makes me wish I got the 3-ways. The range is worth it's weight in gold though. It addresses [MENTION=16375]Dhalsim[/MENTION] 's concern with wanting to try different setups. Just imagine if you can simply adjust the knobs and have your car react completely differently. That's where I think the money is worth it on better Dampers. If you have just a racecar and spend a lot of time on the track I'm pretty sure you can setup even a set of BC Racing to be pretty darn good... will it have the flexibility and range to also be good on the street? Probably not.
 
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I appreciate everyones input but now I am hungry for tacos...
 
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