Why the 2022 NSX Type-S May Be a Sham

[Nero Tenebre]

That would be a big swing from $50k off sticker for an NC1 to $50k over sticker for the Type S. Can’t see this package as that compelling but some payed over sticker for the NC1 too until the bottom fell out… I don’t see them selling this out personally. There’s just all sorts of attractive cars for $200K+ but, we are in a red hot market for fun cars right now. It will definitely be an improved car so a shame they are only doing one model year. Where’s the targa!?


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[Bricks and Bio]

An member we all know here just informed me his local dealer wants $50k over. I think he got totally put off by that. I'll leave the rest up to him to share (or not).

Like I said, some of the reason for this version existing is to give the dealers who participated in the program one last chance to stab and grab (and to use the bumpers they sunk a bunch of coin into)

 

[miguel]

Tustin Acura in SoCal just called me back. I was 1st on the list. They left a voicemail. I called back. No answer. Finally called me back in the afternoon. Said they sold their 2 slots. 10k cashier checks. Had 15 people on the waitlist. Not sure what this means, but seems like the car will be sold out quick unlike the standard one.

Is it the 1/350 limited badge or is it the refresh that is contributing to the hype...

 

[Esprit9]

Heard all of that before… they will sell 50 units over sticker then sell another 50 at sticker then incentivize the crap out of it for the remaining 250 units… seen it too many times before… good luck.. I’m out..


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[nis350]

I think those who really wanted one already bought one during the past years. I would consider one but not at the msrp.

Tustin Acura in SoCal just called me back. I was 1st on the list. They left a voicemail. I called back. No answer. Finally called me back in the afternoon. Said they sold their 2 slots. 10k cashier checks. Had 15 people on the waitlist. Not sure what this means, but seems like the car will be sold out quick unlike the standard one.

Is it the 1/350 limited badge or is it the refresh that is contributing to the hype...

 

[VTACH]

My personal opinion is that many who already own this generation of car are vastly underestimating the demand for a more powerful, mechanically and cosmetically updated final petrol NSX. I know for a 100% fact that my local dealership cannot meet local demand. I think this a good thing for the entire NC1 run. Only time will tell.

 

[N Spec]

If you think the ~$70mil investment is gonna go to waste... new integra might be s2000 midship sucessor LoL

 

[Heavymetals]

Just for S&G, I sat down and did some figuring.

If I sold my 17 for $130k, to replace it with a 22 model would cost around $90k (tax & license (Calif) plus options).

I don't think I will do it.

 

[RYU]

Just for S&G, I sat down and did some figuring.

If I sold my 17 for $130k, to replace it with a 22 model would cost around $90k (tax & license (Calif) plus options).

I don't think I will do it.

I've done quite a few similar analysis on other models. I usually come to your same conclusion. The incremental performance improvement is typically not worth the bigger incremental cost and it's usually because of our taxes!

 

[RYU]

Happy to report another local owner got an allocation for a Grey Type S with NO markup

 

[nis350]

markup will disappear after the initial hype fades.... definitely wouldn't trade in the 2019+ model for it.

the front end definitely looks better, but the Honda interior is so dated/cheap for a car in that price range.

 

[The Kid]

Happy to report another local owner got an allocation for a Grey Type S with NO markup

Pretty sure there is no guarantee at this point on those cars. You're mandated to pick a second color choice when selecting it.

 

[VTACH]

I can certainly understand not trading up for ‘22 S if one already owns a ‘17 etc. But in fairness, when performing your analysis one must keep in mind a 5 year newer car with warranty, all of the updates AND future resale vs the ‘17. It will certainly be more expensive but it may not be as expensive and you can enjoy it.

Also, there is big difference between people not upgrading (probably not their primary sales target for this car) vs people who have always wanted the car, they were just waiting for an updated version and / or a signal that if they don’t buy now they won’t be able to going forward. I believe most of the demand for this car will be in the latter group—we just don’t know how many people happen to be in that group!

As always, just my opinion(s)!

 

[drmanny3]

While I know that a few dealers are asking over MSRP, I believe very quickly most will sell without a markup. As for the number. Keep in mind that there are about 30 Dealers who qualify for a two car allotment. Once they have the two cars sold then any additional order can be entered and Acura will determine who (Dealership) gets those cars. I believe there are another 30 or so who will qualify for one car. All dealers must be certified to work on the car. If they lost their mechanic or sales specialist, they are required to identify a new person to take their place-otherwise no new NSXs. That still leaves us with a number of cars~200. They will not jam them out any faster than they can reasonably manufacture the cars. I suspect that starting in September/October they can begin to make cars. I would think maybe 20 to 25 in the first month followed by an increase. Very dependent on supply chain getting all the components in. So by the end of the year I would think that the second series of cars can be allocated. Acura will make sure things go in a positive way. So if a dealership takes 20 plus orders beyond the first allotments, one will have to wait for their spot in line.

As for is the car worth the money it will cost? Only you can make that decision. If you already own one, chances are good that you spent from $125k and up depending on the year. One could consider buying the components such as the front bumper and rear bumper and what ever components are required and try and go for the look. A lot of people did this to take their 91-2001 and give it the bubble headlights. Back then you had to spend around $10k to $20K to get the components. Some people choose to go with carbon fiber hoods which were much cheaper than the OEM hood. That saved a lot. Then there were the door components that were either fiberglass or OEM. That was another opportunity to save money. The headlights had to be OEM. Those components were primarily cosmetic. The seats, steering wheel and dash had contrast grey stitching.

The new NSX or S spec NSX has a bit beyond the body panels. While the front bumper and rear bumper are different, I am not sure if the hood changed. I thought some other panels changed but I checked my 2017 and the headlights are still the same as is the panel adjacent to the door handle. So I would think that a front bumper with all the stuff is going to cost around $7k to $9k. The rear bumper is in the same ballpark. If the hood is changed add for that. The difficult parts will be the software changes. Given that the transmission, struts, electric motors, traction battery, and all support components changed means those parts would not be easily purchased. Also there is the issue that in the past the R version and not sure about the S version required a Vin number before you could order those parts.

I suspect that when you really look over what has changed and why, you will see that the S spec NSX is a nicely done car. The question for many of us will be is it worth our selling what we have now for the new car. If you purchased recently like a 2019, 2020, 2021 I would think you will probably take a loss on your car. The owners of the 2017 and 2018 may be able to get much of their money back depending on what they paid. So a lot to contemplate.

 

[VTACH]

I think the prior transaction prices for NC1 cars were cheap — I don’t think the Type S is expensive, it’s just relative.

An 11 year old 458 for 200k?
A made in mass quantity GT3 for $175k?

I would MUCH rather go with the NSX and it’s not even close for me.

 

[drmanny3]

I can certainly understand not trading up for ‘22 S if one already owns a ‘17 etc. But in fairness, when performing your analysis one must keep in mind a 5 year newer car with warranty, all of the updates AND future resale vs the ‘17. It will certainly be more expensive but it may not be as expensive and you can enjoy it.

Also, there is big difference between people not upgrading (probably not their primary sales target for this car) vs people who have always wanted the car, they were just waiting for an updated version and / or a signal that if they don’t buy now they won’t be able to going forward. I believe most of the demand for this car will be in the latter group—we just don’t know how many people happen to be in that group!

As always, just my opinion(s)!

Good points. Those owners who are good candidates for the new car are more likely owners of 2017-2018 model years. They may have benefited from getting a discounted price over MSRP. They will probably not lose as much money in selling their cars as those who own later model years like 2019-2021. Also they will see major improvements over their early cars. Either way it is still a chunk of money.

As for wanting a lot more HP, I think that is really an excuse for not getting the car. In reality no matter what you buy, after a few years there will be something better. I recall how people would put off buying a computer because they wanted to make sure they had the fastest available. No matter what you have you need to enjoy it while you have it.

 

[drmanny3]

I think the prior transaction prices for NC1 cars were cheap — I don’t think the Type S is expensive, it’s just relative.

An 11 year old 458 for 200k?
A made in mass quantity GT3 for $175k?

I would MUCH rather go with the NSX and it’s not even close for me.

You have a lot of wisdom

 

[drmanny3]

Final year of US NA2 - 2005-2007, 266 units
Final year of US NC1(S) - 2022 - ?, 300 units

The next few months gives us an idea when the final one is sold.

I really like the aesthetic updates. I am not going to notice the hp increase.

I beg to differ as to whether you will notice the performance difference. If you are coming from stock, the increased torque from the electric motors and the ICE will give you a much faster launch. Of course the car is already pretty damn fast.

 

[drmanny3]

HONDA announces the end and Lambo announces their super hybrid!

https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/lamborghini-countach-lpi-800-4-annoucement-173013169.html

I think at a build of 112 units selling at well over $1million that we are talking about different customer segment and different car. Lambo seem to do well at breaking down/catching fire? I am not impressed.

 

[nis350]

It's a Ferrari.... not quite in the same league.

I think the prior transaction prices for NC1 cars were cheap — I don’t think the Type S is expensive, it’s just relative.

An 11 year old 458 for 200k?
A made in mass quantity GT3 for $175k?

I would MUCH rather go with the NSX and it’s not even close for me.

 

[VTACH]

It's a Ferrari.... not quite in the same league.

They benchmarked the development of the NSX against the 458 (even tearing one apart) and the GT3. Many customers cross shop the cars prior to purchasing. They have similar performance and price point. In my opinion that puts them in the same league.

Now when you talk about reliability and pain in the ass to own factor, they are definitely not in the same league!

 

[LO 21]

Hey guys. New member here (used to spend time on the Lexus forum).

A few comments above seem to be spot on in terms of target buyers for the new Type S (myself included). As a huge JDM enthusiast, I’ve always wanted an NSX, but I was always put off by the wide availability at discounted prices and never got one. I probably would’ve gotten one at some point, but with the 2022 model being the final year, limited to 350, upgraded to previous years, and a lower MSRP than previous years, it was a no-brainer.

I was able to get an allocated dealer slot at MSRP from one of the top dealers that received 2 slots. I think it was mentioned, but word is the top 30 dealers got 2 slots, and the next 40 dealers got 1 slot. Totaling 100. No need to pay over MSRP as some users mentioned some dealerships were trying to charge, but I also felt these won’t be discounted, especially since it seems they’ll sell all 350, and MSRP on the Type S is bizarrely less than previous years’ MSRP.

I picked matte gray with orchid interior and all options/accessories. They made everyone pick a second color choice in case the matte gray runs out, since apparently those will be limited (I heard limited to 50.)

 

[nis350]

That's your opinion and I respect that.

Not to say the NSX is a bad car and in fact I would consider buying one at the right price, but I doubt that there are many who cross-shop Ferrari and Lambo with the Acura. If one has to consider reliability or cost of maintenance in the purchase decision of an Ferrari probably can't really afford it. People buy them simply because they are Ferrari and Lambo. :wink:

They benchmarked the development of the NSX against the 458 (even tearing one apart) and the GT3. Many customers cross shop the cars prior to purchasing. They have similar performance and price point. In my opinion that puts them in the same league.

Now when you talk about reliability and pain in the ass to own factor, they are definitely not in the same league!

 

[drmanny3]

That's your opinion and I respect that.

Not to say the NSX is a bad car and in fact I would consider buying one at the right price, but I doubt that there are many who cross-shop Ferrari and Lambo with the Acura. If one has to consider reliability or cost of maintenance in the purchase decision of an Ferrari probably can't really afford it. People buy them simply because they are Ferrari and Lambo. :wink:

I assume you own a NSX of some year, obviously pre 2017? I find it interesting that you might consider buying one at the right price. Pray tell what do you consider the right price for the S spec NSX?

Probably true, people who purchase Ferraris are not as concerned about upkeep as might a person purchasing a $35,000 family car. Most people who purchase Ferraris new do not purchase used Ferraris unless it is a special car. That is something I observed over the years-generally people who purchase expensive new cars do not buy used cars. Having said that people who have money are not stupid either. If a car falls apart as you drive it away there is not much to brag about with respect to your skill set.

I personally have never liked the look of the Lambo. Not my cup of tea. I have not heard wonderful things about Lambos. I am sure I do not hear all the relevant information as to their reliability and performance. As for Ferrari I think they look grand. However, I am not into that particular image. Porsches kind of have that "I am special" image that I don't particularly like. McLarens look great but, again I have not heard great things about them.

The NSX is a pragmatic car that is well engineered, holds up really well, and is very balanced. i can drive it relatively fast and not look like a complete ass. It is not the most expensive of sports cars, though it is a league above the more common reasonably priced sports cars like Miata, BMW/Toyota, Fiat, Corvette, Nissan Z, Lotus, and some of the Porsches.

It is almost like Trader Joe’s best customer-an unemployed PhD. Someone who is cost conscious and appreciates things that are special.

In the end it really is personal preference. Everyone who posts can say what they want.

 

[sbkim]

If you purchased recently like a 2019, 2020, 2021 I would think you will probably take a loss on your car. The owners of the 2017 and 2018 may be able to get much of their money back depending on what they paid. So a lot to contemplate.

Curious why you think owners of 2019-2021 would take a loss? I presume many of these owners also benefited from rebates and other discounts.