hey everybody,
i've always admired the wide body nsx..... it may be something i'll pursue in the future..... but i've been dying to know....
what does this do to your handling? how does the car feel afterward?
Assuming it is a well designed track spec package... and it is installed properly on a well prepped vehicle... and the changes aggressive enough... and a few other needed elements are in place to maximize things... and you have a road course that rewards such aspects of car setup... with at least a halfway decent driver... yeah then you have a shot. Then all in all, I'd say you'll notice the difference and it is pretty freaking' fantastic in a track context in terms of feel so yes I would say it is worthwile.
Keep perspective thou. I'll start by going out on a limb here, and say that if you scan all the various tuner forums and poke your head under enough of these... I think you'll find that in general the vast majority of wide body conversions are mostly aesthetic, being put on essentially stock road cars just with bolt on parts for no other reason than because the owner fancied the look of the parts. In my experience that is why most people buy the parts.
Before I get jumped on thou.. do note that when I say 'stock road cars' keep in mind that I consider my own NSX relatively 'very minorly modified' as I haven't totally cut my trunk out, significantly re-oriented my engine, or installed a sequential tranny with dog gears yet. Thus, again this is an instance whereas you need to watch those definitions of 'fast' or 'wide' or 'stock' or you will find yourself with a range of unwieldy answers that don't add up. :wink:
IMHO, wide bodies and other extensive aero modifications are most ideal in a track environment. Ideally on properly setup club sport racers or very well prepped production race cars- as this is about the only place whereas you will be able to truely garner a quantified performance handling benefit anyway and point to it in a data log. Due to the increase in frontal area, drag, and other chassis setup factors one could easily argue that in a street/straight line context they are not as ideal anyway. Aerodynamic tuning is always a compromise and known as some-what of a black art. Their are also easier/cheaper things to be done to keep most street customers happy with handling...hence for most making suc extreme conversions entirely unneccessary.
there are people on here who don't even recommend putting bigger wheels on, let alone pushing everything out a few inches.
forgive me if this has been discussed before..... but i really don't think the search is all that great.... it always gives me all the trreads in the forum minus one.....
anyway, input is appreciated.
Purists. There are also guys that still use their stock brake pads and think the OEM wheels are the best. :wink:
One of the problems with forums in general is that it is difficult to gauge perspectives of sources- and a lot of comments tend to get taken out of context. So, I'll try to be as clear as possible.
Due to custom wide body construction characteristics such as width, visibility, ride height, maintainability, serviceability, etc... along with basic aero fundamentals... as a general rule aftermarket wide bodies tend to make very poor daily drivers which is the reason you don't see them from the OEM's very often. Nothing about them mates well with the application. Wider tires means more rolling resistance, more drag means worse fuel economy and poorer sales specs, etc...
For a weekend warrior or off-road only application they fair much better; and better handling or lower lap times can be had as a result of the increase in track and more effective aerodynamic aids. Honestly it is rudamentry motorsports fundamentals if you read most any book on handling. If the build-out has real purpose and is coupled with other high quality race prep work... and your vision is to track rat it or turn it into a custom club sport racer more similar to what I did- things can fall together very nicely and sure.. why not.
However, the problem herein is that the devil is all in the details. My experience even track side among a lot of well recognized 'tuner cars' has been that it is in no way uncommon to see builds that are likely more detrimental to overall performance than anything else. Diffusers that aren't mated smoothly to the underside, ducts in places that don't do anything (my pet peeve), no under panels, poor assembly practices, crappy hardware/brackets, poor composites, suspension isn't tuned to go with the aero, etc... and all those little issues add up and tend to make or break things out there.
Unless it is a show car to me those types of cars don't pass the sniff test. IMO if you are going to do it.. take the long road and do it right. Doing full custom bodies along with general race prep work is an absolutely huge investment in money/time. Well above and beyond throwing a few JDM pieces on... which is why they frequently run 20 grand and take hundreds of hours by the time they are done. I've been through two so far, and I've invested months in assembly work every year fine tuning things- improving on what worked and fixing what didn't from the season prior.
For example last year my under panels deflected too much under load, so this year I added a graphite core with riv nuts. My previous radiator duct design didn't straighten the air and allowed for some degree of spillage, so this year I am trying a new sealed enclosed design. By angling the radiator and placing fins to better ensure the incoming air stream remains attached longer given a shallower attack angle. This year I am trying fins under the front bumper to help keep keep air away from the front tires without hopefully inducing too much of a CD hit.
The bottom line is that a proper conversion lends itself to essentially re-building and custom fabricating numerous pieces to replace their stock counter parts- it takes a lot of time, money, tech knowledge, testing, and experience doing assembly work to get good results. It is literally like building a plane. Honestly anyone can order-up a few aero parts and pay a body shop to put them on- but having a good reliable functional body that can take the punishment at the track - event after event after event - takes a real investment. Know that pretty much everything is custom one-off and not something you can really pay to have someone do for you.
The facts are that computer simulation proves the theory, and out on a race track AMB transponders in many specific tests have proved the results. That is why the pro drop millions to exploit the rules and snag every possible advantage in this space. It is also why various classes often limit tire width. It is all about the tires first. Still, a lot of other things already need to be in place which is why most sactioned club racers tend more to shy away from such extreme modifications due to tech regs, the huge cost, and other practical factors.
My own experience is that given an aggressive enough increase in track- if the vehicle and suspension are properly setup- making full use of the added track and aero with properly designed under-trays, ducting, etc... - it can be done and done well. The difference in stability, feel, and times can be very significant in the range of several seconds a lap which is huge. Inevitably, it is but one piece of a very large go-fast puzzle as you attempt to re-balance the changes.
Hope that helps.
