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Short gears or NSX-R R&P? Or Both?

HDA

Experienced Member
Joined
11 May 2011
Messages
369
Location
Houston, TX
Hello primers.This question relates to the pre 96 NSX, manual.Has anyone installed only the "short" JDM gears and is disappointed? Do you wish you installed also the NSX-R R&P ? If you installed only the NSX-R R&P, do you wish you had also the JDM gears? Ultimately, if you installed both, can you link me a video of the car on a trackday? Are you happy with the setup? I have short gears and I am wondering if I should also install the R&P.In the video below 4min40s they compare a NSX with the "shorts" with an NSX R that has "shorts" + Final gear. That won me and now I am thinking if I should also get the R&P... https://youtu.be/2ZEK8WY-M3w?t=4m41sThank you, Andrea
 
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I have a JDM short gear 5spd in my car now. It's great because I feel it's the perfect balance for the mixed driving that I do (Street/Hwy, Canyons, Track). I'm supercharged which helps the balance and feel as well. I have not swapped to a 6spd for 2 reasons.. they are incredibly expensive and the 5spd is stronger for a boosted car. If I was NA a good setup is the stock 6spd, but OS Giken does not make a LSD in the stock final drive ratio anyone IIRC, nor are there any decent clutches that work with the 6spd input shaft. So therefore, the JDM 5spd, + Supercharger, + OS Giken clutch, + OS Giken LSD is my perfect setup. It's best of all worlds in my opinion and it took me 10yrs to figure this out.

I also have a JDM Type R, which is the short gears + 4.23 final drive. In an NA car it's a lot of fun in street, tight canyons, and tight tracks. It's a bit annoying on the fwy above 65mph. So depends how much hwy driving you do. The acceleration in 2nd and 3rd gear is a lot of fun in VTEC but not worth the HWY compromise to me for the driving I do. I still have this transmission collecting dust in storage. Saving it for a rainy day so I do like it enough to keep it.

I have also driven a 4.44 6spd, which has similar gearing in 1-4 gears as the JDM 5spd. It's just not for me. It can be a lot of fun but it's too busy for me when shifting.

On a side note: On my S2000 the previous owner put in an aggressive 4.71 ratio. I absolutely hate it. It's fun when you want to feel like you're rushing thru the gears but next thing you know.. it's only 45mph and you're in 5th gear and you've hit the next stop light. The part I hate the most though is at 75mph i'm at nearly 5k rpms. I also hate that because the gearing is so short.. it's makes the car really jerky on/off throttle. That's by far the most annoying when you're trying to feather the throttle mid-turn.

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btw.. I have a theory on why the Japanese like short gearing, especially short final drives. I suspect that because they tend to drive slower speeds there and the streets are generally tighter as well as tighter tracks it might suite their driving styles better. It's just a guess on my part. I have yet to rent a car and drive performance car there.

Even one of the shortest/tightest tracks here in SoCal (Streets of Willow), the stock JDM Short gears suites the layout the best. The gearing also works for Buttonwillow and Laguna Seca. Seemed fine for me at Sonoma as well. The video in my signature has some mention of gearing and it's differences.
 
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Thanks RYU, that's great info.I am not looking to supercharge my NSX no swap a 6 speed.I used to have a 2005 AP2 and I absolutely loved the gearing. I'd love to replicate that on my NSX, although with 1 gear less. Am I going to be fine with just short gears or should I also put a 4.23 final?I don't really go fast on the highway, it's usually to get to the track and back.
 
It's a bit annoying on the fwy above 65mph.
It really depends on the exhaust you're running. I'm CTSC with shorties and 4.23 AND stock exhaust: not annoying at all at 80 mph.

It's not a must but if you have the money to play with I'd go for 4.23 as well. NSX-R differential plate as well while you're there...
 
It really depends on the exhaust you're running. I'm CTSC with shorties and 4.23 AND stock exhaust: not annoying at all at 80 mph.

It's not a must but if you have the money to play with I'd go for 4.23 as well. NSX-R differential plate as well while you're there...
It's not the exhaust at all, though a drony exhaust would be incredibly annoying at various RPMs. My exhaust is valved.. it doesn't drone at all when not in VTEC. Some exhaust will drone at 2500.. some drone at 3000. Some drone elsewhere. Depends on your exhaust design.

Also, "annoying" is relative. Your car at 80mph with Type R gears would be annoying for me because the cruising RPM is too high. MPG isn't great. Engine noise is higher. Harder time relaxing and hearing the radio. Harder time being on the phone. ETC...

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Also throttle response is a just a tad touchy and less smooth. This probably doesn't bother most people but I certainly notice the difference.

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Thanks RYU, that's great info.I am not looking to supercharge my NSX no swap a 6 speed.I used to have a 2005 AP2 and I absolutely loved the gearing. I'd love to replicate that on my NSX, although with 1 gear less. Am I going to be fine with just short gears or should I also put a 4.23 final?I don't really go fast on the highway, it's usually to get to the track and back.
If you don't do need to prioritize hwy driving I think the Type R (JDM gears + 4.23) would be quite fun for you. Also, if you're not looking for the absolute best and most optimal shift points around a track the Type R gears would be more fun I reckon but depends on your local track layout. On our local tracks it appears the JDM short gears are just a slightly bit more optimal.. it's probably a minor difference and you'd have to be Billy Johnson to notice a laptime difference.
 
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At 80 mph the tires are making the most (annoying) noise. 3500 instead of 3000 rpm at 80 mph. Not a really big hit on MPG. 22-23 mpg ain't that bad anyway and I didn't buy the car for its mpg (have an ZE1 with 78 mpg to compensate :wink:). Staying in boost or tracking it has a much bigger impact. :D

Also check the rear tire size. Some people are mounting tires with bigger circumference which works in the other direction of a lower gearing. Big wheels and long gearing definitely sucks. :)
 
I have the 4.44 with stock gears on my track car. It is great. And the OS Giken LSD is awesome. As you do not use 1st at the track, the gap between 1st and 2nd is not a problem. 2nd to 3 rd is ok as the drop is not as important.

But on a street driven NSX, I would rather go JDM gears to get rid of these drops in rpm and the need to redline to fall in the right power band.
 
Well it's mostly a trackday car, so I think I will go ahead and just do a full NSX-r 5-speed transmission.
 
FOUR THOUSAND DOLLARS?! Do you know how many trackdays are those!? :)4.23 and NSXR plates for the LSD.
Its your money. You spend it how you want to or don't spend it at all :)

I'm just providing feedback to help.. and that feedback is... the NSX-R plates and higher torque adjustment makes little to no difference in actual feel and traction. I've rebuilt my trans 3 times and have tried all these already. Take it with a grain of salt.

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FOUR THOUSAND DOLLARS?! Do you know how many trackdays are those!? :)4.23 and NSXR plates for the LSD.
And check your pricing... The OSG LSD was around $1500 I thought.. it's been a while so double check that pricing.
 
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if it's mostly a track car... you might give the OS Giken LSD serious consideration
[MENTION=20915]RYU[/MENTION] is correct if it's mostly a track car go for the OSG or the ATS 4.4. My car came factory with the short gears I then upgraded to the NSX R final ring & pinion and LSD plates I have since ditched that and have got the OSG 4.4 and I can tell you especially if you have gone to bigger wheel/tire combo that just brings you back to where you started originally so it keeps everything in that sweet spot. I have the 235/275 Nitto setup and when I throw on my 215/265 setup you can tell the response is different with bigger wheels so adjusting the final drive brings the gearing back where it belongs
 
Ryu is correct with all the technical data the OSG is optimal for grip. absolutely. But remember, Is it necessary to have for you to enjoy your car at the occasional trackday? No. Building and upgrading everysingle part to be optimal on track is VERY tempting- but in the end do you NEED IT to enjoy the car on track. No. Is it something to throw into the mix and consider, sure. When i rebuilt my trans I opted for the NSX-R plate/shim on the oem LSD and *i think* swapped for the JDM gears but left the oem 4.4, : /... i think. It was the best of both worlds too me and im happy with it. Do whatever will keep you enjoying your car and going to the track. Hell, trans flushes 3 times a year and stock everything will do the trick too.
 
Ryu is correct with all the technical data the OSG is optimal for grip. absolutely. But remember, Is it necessary to have for you to enjoy your car at the occasional trackday? No. Building and upgrading everysingle part to be optimal on track is VERY tempting- but in the end do you NEED IT to enjoy the car on track. No. Is it something to throw into the mix and consider, sure. When i rebuilt my trans I opted for the NSX-R plate/shim on the oem LSD and *i think* swapped for the JDM gears but left the oem 4.4, : /... i think. It was the best of both worlds too me and im happy with it. Do whatever will keep you enjoying your car and going to the track. Hell, trans flushes 3 times a year and stock everything will do the trick too.

you are my guy then!
Got any videos to share? I suppose you are still NA?

I 100% agree with your philosophy. I want to have fun, not race. A clunking OSG would drive me nuts
 
Here's my YouTube channel https://www.youtube.com/user/16vcoffin here's my racecar/track blog; http://illvillains.blogspot.com/

Yeah I am stock power-ish I/H/E and a chipped ECU. I focused strictly on just suspension mods which is where the NSX shines.

Here's some vids. With the stock power the car does really really well around the SoCal tracks. Even has the NA record at some.

<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/Fnro2kQnb3Q" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="560"></iframe>

<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/X9B9hzvSnqI" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="560"></iframe>

<iframe src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/WGLJeEh4ogw" allowfullscreen="" frameborder="0" height="315" width="560"></iframe>
 
I got tired of the 4.55 with shorties went to type R R&P...I'm na....5 speed.
 
With 4.55 top speed is limited and I remember a few of them broke also.
 
I had short gears only and stock 4.06 R&P. I found it was perfect for the street (you keep a lower highway rpm in 5th) and the gears matched my local track perfectly.
 
Thanks RYU, that's great info.I am not looking to supercharge my NSX no swap a 6 speed.I used to have a 2005 AP2 and I absolutely loved the gearing. I'd love to replicate that on my NSX, although with 1 gear less. Am I going to be fine with just short gears or should I also put a 4.23 final?I don't really go fast on the highway, it's usually to get to the track and back.

If you order the ATS Carbon LSD then you will have to choose either the 4.235FD or the 4.429FD. You have a shop local to you that is an ATS dealer and I would tell you the wait for me on shipment came in from Japan was about a week. You can get everything from ATS and even the short gears can be sourced through one of their dealers. Problem right now is that second gear(I think) is on back order until the end of October in Japan.
 
On my street driven (NA) 92 I have short gears, the NSX-R R&P, and the stock diff is torqued to NSX-R spec. The car drives fantastic love combo really wakes the car up w/ no issues on the highway. Been running it that way for 5-6 years now.
 
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If you order the ATS Carbon LSD then you will have to choose either the 4.235FD or the 4.429FD. You have a shop local to you that is an ATS dealer and I would tell you the wait for me on shipment came in from Japan was about a week. You can get everything from ATS and even the short gears can be sourced through one of their dealers. Problem right now is that second gear(I think) is on back order until the end of October in Japan.
Do you know if they have a version that will bolt up to the stock 4.06 R&P?

I felt like I just won the lottery when after years of searching an OS Giken LSD showed up for sale. Brand new no less. Sitting on a shelf as part of old stock.

The ATS 4.235 FD seems like a great option especially for the NA guys. Maybe one day i'll read up on the differences on the OSG LSD vs. ATS LSD. It would be interesting if ATS has a 4.23 LSD option for the 6spd guys as well. The 6spd guys only have the 4.44 OSG and I believe that is still on some kind of long lead time backorder. [MENTION=15293]mcano[/MENTION] would know...
 
[MENTION=20915]RYU[/MENTION] ATS does offer a 4.235 for the 6 speed as well. They don't have a version that works with the stock 4.06 from what I was told and discussed.


I'm not advertising for ATS, but I would love to see if anyone can tell the difference between the OSG and the ATS LSD. There are plenty of race wins for both LSD.
 
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