1st gear

[jc77]

Searched everywhere and can't find any info on this..why does it seem nearly impossible to get this car to downshift into first gear? Even in track mode it won't downshift at anything higher than about 7mph..

 

[JD Cross]

I believe 1st and 2nd gear shifts are controlled by the ECU and you can only manually shift into 1st at very low speeds.
If you are moving slowly enough to use 1st gear for acceleration the car will automatically go there.

 

[L.L.]

The DCT can be thought of, in some ways, a manual transmission without a stick shift and clutch pedal.

If you think about it that way, what Honda manual transmission allows you to shift into first gear at speed?

None that I can remember in recent history. They have an automatic lockout for first gear and reverse once above a certain speed to prevent damage to engine and/or transmission.

If you've never driven a manual transmission, then it might be hard to understand the reasoning behind it. Can't say I've ever had the urge to do that 2-1 shift in either a DCT or MT car after feeling how harsh it is on some cars. It feels like the motor wants to fall out of the car.

 

[jc77]

What are you talking about? I've had dozens of manual and DCT cars, including a GTR an R8 and a huracan. All of them let me down shift into 1st gear with no problem

The DCT can be thought of, in some ways, a manual transmission without a stick shift and clutch pedal.

If you think about it that way, what Honda manual transmission allows you to shift into first gear at speed?

None that I can remember in recent history. They have an automatic lockout for first gear and reverse once above a certain speed to prevent damage to engine and/or transmission.

If you've never driven a manual transmission, then it might be hard to understand the reasoning behind it. Can't say I've ever had the urge to do that 2-1 shift in either a DCT or MT car after feeling how harsh it is on some cars. It feels like the motor wants to fall out of the car.

 

[L.L.]

I'm talking about the inability to shift into 1st is consistent with how Honda has historically prevented its transmissions from doing that at speed.

The 2-1 shift felt like crap in the GT-R and most did it because it sounded "cool" when asked why they wanted to do it. Just curious, what is the practical purpose of shifting into 1st above 7mph?

 

[dshinke21]

Searched everywhere and can't find any info on this..why does it seem nearly impossible to get this car to downshift into first gear? Even in track mode it won't downshift at anything higher than about 7mph..

JC while the engine does have a 9 speed dual clutch transmission the car is intended to be driven like a 7-speed. First gear is strictly a launch gear configured for maximum vehicle launch acceleration. Gears 2-8 are close ratio gears matched to make the most of the car's power band. 9th gear has been optimized for fuel efficiency and comfort in steady highway cruising. At 60mph in 9th gear the engine is revving at just 1,700 RPM.

The car actually employs a 1-way clutch for first gear, while 4 shift forks are used for 2nd through 9th gears and a 5th shift for is used for park and reverse.

A few other cool facts about the gearbox, they designed a compact electric motor as a gear shift actuator instead of the traditional hydraulic or pneumatic systems because the electric motor saved them approximately 6lbs by eliminating the need for a high pressure hydraulic pump.

Gear ratios in order from 1st to 9th: 3.838, 2.433, 1.778, 1.428, 1.211, 1.038, 0.881, 0.747, 0.634 and reverse is 3.583

Long story short, yes the car won't let you shift into first gear while the car is moving a more than a few MPH as it was intended to never need to do so and there really isn't any need for it other than maybe wanting to blip the revs rolling up to a stoplight just to ensure everyone is looking at you

 

[nsx878]

Thanks for the detailed info. The amount of time,effort ,thought, development, and technology that went into this car continues to amaze me every day.......

 

[jc77]

Great answer, thanks. While it makes sense, it is a but disappointing to not really be able to get the full acceleration effect of a rolling start in first gear

JC while the engine does have a 9 speed dual clutch transmission the car is intended to be driven like a 7-speed. First gear is strictly a launch gear configured for maximum vehicle launch acceleration. Gears 2-8 are close ratio gears matched to make the most of the car's power band. 9th gear has been optimized for fuel efficiency and comfort in steady highway cruising. At 60mph in 9th gear the engine is revving at just 1,700 RPM.

The car actually employs a 1-way clutch for first gear, while 4 shift forks are used for 2nd through 9th gears and a 5th shift for is used for park and reverse.

A few other cool facts about the gearbox, they designed a compact electric motor as a gear shift actuator instead of the traditional hydraulic or pneumatic systems because the electric motor saved them approximately 6lbs by eliminating the need for a high pressure hydraulic pump.

Gear ratios in order from 1st to 9th: 3.838, 2.433, 1.778, 1.428, 1.211, 1.038, 0.881, 0.747, 0.634 and reverse is 3.583

Long story short, yes the car won't let you shift into first gear while the car is moving a more than a few MPH as it was intended to never need to do so and there really isn't any need for it other than maybe wanting to blip the revs rolling up to a stoplight just to ensure everyone is looking at you

 

[goldNSX]

Because with so many gears available there's no need to do so. And because some people intend to drive like the this guy (1:07-1:12): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xhnQK5WsgI4 and could sue Honda if the 1st gear fails.

 

[Jinks]

I cannot see why you’d ever need to downshift into first unless your brake system completely failed.