Costco gas OK for NSX?

[Yellow Rose]

Hello genius.

Hello.

Isn't there the possibility of sediment and water getting into the tanks.

Absolutely, but that was not your assertion. Your pretense was on only different gasolines being in the same tank - it made no mention of water nor sediment. None.

I've never seen a refinery, I don't know the standards by which the tanks are filled.

I used work at a Shell refinery in the fuels tank farm.....I believe I know what I am talking about when it comes to gasoline.

but I do know the basic laws of physics and different liquids have different densities.

Care to tell me what the difference in specific gravity is, between low octane gasoline and high octane gasoline? While there is a difference to nine digits right of the decimal, for practical purposes there is virtually no difference, thus they will mix for the short period of time they are in the underground storage tank.

On the other hand, if you store 150,000 BBL of different grades of gasoline in an aboveground storage tank for long periods of time, there will be some stratification. However, just like you originally did not mention sediment or water, this type of storage is not what your posted was predicated upon.

So, in theory, there can be water in a holding tank that can get pumped out if there is a pump on the bottom of the tank. Right???

That is correct, but again, that is not what you said the first time.

And by the way, they are called mixed drinks because you shake/stir/blend to mix them.

Hogwash. The way I pour my bourbon-n-coke, the elixir mixes by itself as each component exits its respective container into the drinking glass.

I think your statement is just as absurd.

Well you may have a point there, albeit a very weak one.

there are different densities for oil, which is what gasoline is refined from. Right??

That is also correct.

 

[KGP]

Care to tell me what the difference in specific gravity is, between low octane gasoline and high octane gasoline?

I'll take a stab: 0.020?

 

[DocL]

Care to tell me what the difference in specific gravity is, between low octane gasoline and high octane gasoline?

Well I sent a question to a person I know at Sunoco and here was the response.

"Thank you very much for writing to us. Sunoco gasolines have a density spec reported in kg/m3 @ 15 Celsius, although there is no national standard for this property. All Sunoco gasoline has the same density range from 702-771. However, batches will vary. Typically, the density is slightly lower in the wintertime and higher in the summer season. In general, our highest octane fuel, Ultra 94, will have the highest density in the 735-770 range, and our lowest octane fuel, Regular (87.0 R+M/2 octane), will have a lower density in the 720-755 range. Our mid-grade gasoline densities would typically fall in between these two grades."

Do I win anything?

 

[Yellow Rose]

Do I win anything?

Yes, a free tank of gasoline. :smile:

My point of gasoline’s specific gravity being irrelevant beyond nine decimal places was just me being sarcastic. Gasoline density will vary, depending if the gasoline was distilled from crude oil A or crude oil B. The point I was harping on, is that for small-volume or short-duration storage (such as a bellow-ground storage tank at the gas station or in you vehicle's gas tank) gasolines of different density (octane) will blend.

Do I win anything?

Yes, a mixed drink of your choosing. :smile:

 

[whiteNSXs]

Well I sent a question to a person I know at Sunoco and here was the response.

"Thank you very much for writing to us. Sunoco gasolines have a density spec reported in kg/m3 @ 15 Celsius, although there is no national standard for this property. All Sunoco gasoline has the same density range from 702-771. However, batches will vary. Typically, the density is slightly lower in the wintertime and higher in the summer season. In general, our highest octane fuel, Ultra 94, will have the highest density in the 735-770 range, and our lowest octane fuel, Regular (87.0 R+M/2 octane), will have a lower density in the 720-755 range. Our mid-grade gasoline densities would typically fall in between these two grades."

Do I win anything?

Not a physicist nor chemist but was top of class in many physics and chemistry classes. I probably should have become a physicist instead. It is only relevant to talk about specific gravities in a mixtures of non-mixable liquids. If they dissolve in each other, then they become ONE liquid with ONE specific gravity. Your vintage wine will not have the top part stronger in alcohol nor the bottom watered down for the same reason. All grades of gasoline mix to one gasoline.
Andy wins a mixed drink. :biggrin:
Steve

 

[DocL]

Yes, a mixed drink of your choosing. :smile:

I respectfully pass on the mixed drink and I appreciate the generous offer for a free tank of gas. :smile:

With my backgound in science I always appreciate a good debate. No harm intended on my part.

 

[Dan Ciezniewzki]

the octanes mix just fine; they don;t seperate. When I get 89 at Sams for my truck it mixes 87 with 91. I know this by the 2 counters above the 87 and 91, no counter above the 89; and every two gallons that go into my truck the counter goes up one above the 87 and 91.

 

[Yellow Rose]

A Hand-Shake Extended

:smile:

 

[paladin]

If different octanes were im-miscible, (sp?) then in theory octane booster would never work. you'd still have 91 octane, then when you get low on gas run on pure booster and blow your engine.

 

[BB]

At the oil oil refinery where I work, we don't actually manufacture a so-called "mid-grade" but we do sell one. When a truck comes in and requests to load-up with mid-grade, our truck rack actually mixes the super and regular grades together, giving them a blend of both.

As for the gas itself, it's esentially all the same-- i.e. a true commodity. And even if it were different, it is often not easy or even possible to find out who actually made the gas you're purchasing at any given station. For example, much of our gas flows through pipelines where it often gets intermixed with gas from different producers. I know our gas has been sold under the 76, BP, Chevron, and Mobil brands in the past as well as many others. The only real difference between all these brands are the additive packages that are mixed in.

The real question about Costco gas is who's additive package is in the gas they're selling? And an even better question is if the difference between these various packages is significant?

Recently Honda, BWM, and GM got together and worked to promote a new standard for additive cleaners. Since I cannot see any ulterior motive for them, I'm inclined to think there must be at least a moderately significant difference between addatives.

 

[schuey1010]

Re: Drug Use Gone Wild

Think for a moment how absurd that statement is. Your friend is a hallucinating moron......and I am putting that mildly. Different grades of gasoline will blend if filled into the same tank. Do you think that putting Coke and bourbon in the same glass, that the two liquids will not mix? Hello.....that’s why they call it a “mixed drink”.

As I am having a Knob Creek and Diet Coke right now, I have to put out a little chuckle at the "mixed drink theory." Damn that was funny. Maybe your buddy was getting the gas tank mixed up with the oil and water theory.

Oh well. I can assure you that there are at least 3 different tanks at the gas station you go to. If all the gas was in the same tank here in LA, all the gas would then come out as 89 octane. 87 + 89 + 91 = 267 divided by three equals 89.

Very funny, and that reminds me that I need another whiskey and diet.

 

[bradofflorida]

This is a good little fluff piece that does manages to give a basic explanation of how gas and other fuels are made. The posting near the top was confusing the storage tank in the ground with the cracking towers where the basic fuel is makde.
http://www.exxonmobil.com/Corporate/Newsroom/Publications/c_gas_prices/c_gasolinemade_ix.html

 

[NsXMas]

My Audi dealer just told me the reason my 107,000 mile A6 has carbon deposits and needs cleaned is because I use Costco "cheap" gas.

I've used the same costco (93 octane) gas in my NSX since new. Is this just bull, or should I get gas from a name brand station. I don't want harm the NSX by feeding it substandard fuel.

I agree, the dealer is nuts. Ask them what brand they recommend, and why. Ask them for scientific proof of CostCo gas causing carbon deposits, more than any other brand. Ask them to provide the % of greater deposits that is caused by CostCo gas.

I bet they won't be able to do it.

 

[DPG]

You should get the shell mastercard. They give you 5% off on all gas at shell stations, so then you can have really good gas at a cheaper price!
Just FYI. These days it can save you like ten or twelve cents a gallon!

 

[tucsonsx]

An observation and a few thoughts about gasoline:

1. I've seen lots of injectors, valves, and pistons with performance robbing and detonation causing carbon deposits, but NEVER on a car that has used exclusively Chevron gasoline.

2. Injectors, valves, and pistons are expensive to replace and the various
cleaners, no matter how high quality, used to try to remove these deposits
after they are in place have their limitations.

3. Why exactly would Chevron ( or any other " brand name gasoline
retailer " for that matter) sell the exact same gasoline and additive package to a discounter like Costco or Sam's Club at a price so low that the discounter can then resell it for less than their own stations?

4. Yes, I've heard the argument that discounters just sell gasoline at cost to get you into the store, but it stretches my imagination to think of a company
like Costco, operating on razor thin margins, taking the risk of a fuel leak and the huge costs of the consequential environmental cleanup without marking up the gasoline when they sell it.

 

[bradofflorida]

The reason a Chevron ( or any other " brand name gasoline retailer ") would sell the same gas to Costco is that if they don’t, someone else would. Either way, they lose the direct business.

There are no magic additives that get added to gas. It is a very established science. If one major company has it, you can bet that the others will get it quickly.

Optional gasoline additives are an extremely small cost relative to the price of a tank of gasoline. I would be shocked if it was more than one penny per gallon, and it is probably a lot less.

The public humiliation that Costco or any other of the huge retailers would face for getting caught selling below standard gasoline means they would not do it. Don’t you think they would write it into their supply contract? And hire a lab to occaisionally verify it. On our little message board, we already recognize the risk and proposed a solution. You can be sure the buyers at Costco put months or years of man-hours into making sure they are not getting screwed.

Remember the commercial from the late 70's/early 80's from one of the big gas companies that showed the car with their gas running further on a tank of gas than the other car without the "special" additives? The government forced the commercial off the air as misleading because, surprise!, all the competitors used the same additives.

 

[slashmatt]

It certainly didn't look like a half million dollars sitting there, but then I don't see a half-million very often, especially if it's not a house

I guess you aren't impressed by the fact that you're basically looking at a Le Mans prototype with a full carbon chassis, inboard suspension, and a high revving V10 by Porsche.

Of course, I'm the kind of a guy that thinks a house and a second car would just be good accessories for my NSX .

 

[DPG]

I guess you aren't impressed by the fact that you're basically looking at a Le Mans prototype with a full carbon chassis, inboard suspension, and a high revving V10 by Porsche.

Of course, I'm the kind of a guy that thinks a house and a second car would just be good accessories for my NSX .

No, you've got it all wrong. (Except the Porsche comment). The perfect accessories would be another car, yes, but a house...no no...a garage...preferably a 5 car garage! :biggrin:

 

[NSXLNT]

I have always been under the impression that the "no-name" gas retailers purchase their supplies from the refineries' left-over stocks, thus getting the fuel at a savings, and passing it along to the consumer. One week they may get Gas that was slated for Mobil, another week for Shell, etc.... Am I correct?

 

[ANYTIME]

I have always been under the impression that the "no-name" gas retailers purchase their supplies from the refineries' left-over stocks, thus getting the fuel at a savings, and passing it along to the consumer. One week they may get Gas that was slated for Mobil, another week for Shell, etc.... Am I correct?

Read post #2

 

[Yellow Rose]

Where Do People Come Up With This Stuff

I have always been under the impression that the "no-name" gas retailers purchase their supplies from the refineries' left-over stocks, thus getting the fuel at a savings, and passing it along to the consumer.

In today's economy and for many years to come, as crude oil is depleted from Mother Earth, it is a rarity for a refinery have too much gasoline in its inventory. If that happens, because refinery’s margin are so thin, the refinery manager will not be looked upon very highly from his upper management. What in the world made you think of the above comment? Please, let's think for a moment. Who has greater overhead - a major oil company or a "no name" convenience store.......thus the lower selling price of gasoline.

One week they may get gas that was slated for Mobil, another week for Shell, etc.... Am I correct?

No.

 

[Carguy!]

I was told that by 'Frank' the highly skilled, well trained service advisor.

btw.. I did get to see a black Carrera GT up close in the show room. No fence or ropes, but a gentle sign asking you not to touch it, open doors, or sit in it. And the price? "substantually over list" of $448,000.

It certainly didn't look like a half million dollars sitting there, but then I don't see a half-million very often, especially if it's not a house

You might want to find another dealer, I don't believe Costco's gas to be any inferior to any other brand.

Also the Carrera GT at substantially over list is a joke, I just bought one and paid substantially under list.

 

[e_nsx]

How about Safeway gas? The last couple of weeks there has been a new gas station being constructed. Today it was open and it was a Safeway gas station. I didn't see any advertising of known gas suppliers and the attendant didn't know (young kid). Safeway card holders even get .03 discount. Does anyone know who supplies Safeway with fuel?