OWS - The shocking truth about the crackdown on Occupy

[enkrypt3d]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentis...ocking-truth-about-crackdown-occupy?fb=optOut

Kind of surprised there is no discussion about this...... or did it already get removed?

Anyways this new development is pretty upsetting. I think they've touched a nerve. The media blackout and the crack down is beyond words.

 

[NSXrebel]

I've said it before, this country needs a revolution, and we might just get that sooner or later. One thing for sure, it's gonna get ugly. :frown:

 

[pgilliam1]

Revolt and Reform? How do you reform the guys that make the laws? Only an act of congress can do that. I rest my case .

 

[enkrypt3d]

seems to me DHS etc is trying to prevent an "American Spring" at all costs......

 

[jonas1jp]

Revolt and Reform? How do you reform the guys that make the laws? Only an act of congress can do that. I rest my case .

Prime Post of the Month!!!!!!! Well played, sir!!

 

[docjohn]

I can't defend every police action,but seems to me that some of those peppered protesters refused to listen to police orders to disperse and resisted nonviolent atempts to do same.So you want a voice/want to get some message across do so ,but when its time to go home(if you have one) its time to go.

 

[Juice]

I know how to resolve this issue once and for all. But first I need to smoke this reefer and have a jam session on my bongos.

 

[queenlives]

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentis...ocking-truth-about-crackdown-occupy?fb=optOut

Kind of surprised there is no discussion about this...... or did it already get removed?

Anyways this new development is pretty upsetting. I think they've touched a nerve. The media blackout and the crack down is beyond words.

imho: "truth" and the guardian rarely go hand-in-hand.

 

[bee_are_bee]

seems to me DHS etc is trying to prevent an "American Spring" at all costs......

Right, because life in our country sucks so much as is. I'm just 15 minutes up the road from UC Davis. The students were given ample warning before being sprayed. They were even told that they were going to get sprayed if they didn't disperse. They stayed, got sprayed. I don't agree with the action per se, but if a cop asks me to move from where I sit because I'm violating a law or in this case, campus policy, my ass is moved. Period.

 

[bigbadberry]

"The american revolution was illegal, but we are taught to love it," - OWS slogan.

 

[Gansan]

Right, because life in our country sucks so much as is. I'm just 15 minutes up the road from UC Davis. The students were given ample warning before being sprayed. They were even told that they were going to get sprayed if they didn't disperse. They stayed, got sprayed. I don't agree with the action per se, but if a cop asks me to move from where I sit because I'm violating a law or in this case, campus policy, my ass is moved. Period.

So you are saying if you yourself were protesting in a cause you believed in, you would leave immediately when the cops asked nicely the first time? If everyone in your protest group did that, would your protest have any effect at all?

It wouldn't. Instead, it would be a waste of time, and everyone would laugh at the useless protesters.

 

[enkrypt3d]

imho: "truth" and the guardian rarely go hand-in-hand.

who's giving the cops their marching orders? The mayor. Who gives the Mayors their orders? DHS. Who gives DHS their oders? The president.....

Read between the lines man...........................

Every police force can't be acting on their own without direction from higher ups.... the question is, why? OWS really isn't doing anything wrong and since when is it illegal to protest? I guess we've reverted to 1960... Break out the water canons!

 

[bee_are_bee]

OWS really isn't doing anything wrong and since when is it illegal to protest? I guess we've reverted to 1960... Break out the water canons!

It's not illegal to protest. It's illegal to destroy public and private property while protesting. OWS protests all over are disrupting the lives of law abiding, tax paying citizens, in some cases costing local businesses in the form of damage and lost business. OWS is a farce because it completely misses the point. As I've said before, these fools should be on the steps of Congress and the White House, not littering our city streets. It's not even close to the 60s. To equate the two is myopic and ignorant. The demonstrations themselves are a temper tantrum that is costing municipalities millions.

 

[enkrypt3d]

It's not illegal to protest. It's illegal to destroy public and private property while protesting. OWS protests all over are disrupting the lives of law abiding, tax paying citizens, in some cases costing local businesses in the form of damage and lost business. OWS is a farce because it completely misses the point. As I've said before, these fools should be on the steps of Congress and the White House, not littering our city streets. It's not even close to the 60s. To equate the two is myopic and ignorant. The demonstrations themselves are a temper tantrum that is costing municipalities millions.

so sitting in zuccotti park (which is all concrete by the way) destroys it?

The city and NYPD is using loop holes to evict peaceful protests in which it threatens the status quo. Did they do this with the tea party? No, because the tea party was mostly conservative and did not threaten big banks etc with action....

What's myopic about saying that the cops are over reacting? They are.

Yes they could use more direction and organization, but with the media blackout that's happening (even tho the NYPD says its not), it doesn't lend itself very well to disseminating their message. It's been a smear campaign since day one.

I personally agree that the system needs an over haul. This is something Obama promised to do but hasn't... whats wrong w/ holding them accountable?

Yes there are some homeless / hippies thrown in the mix with the more sophisticated / intelligent folks that make the entire movement look bad. So generalizing and saying the entire group is lazy or misinformed etc is myopic and ignorant.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/...-cities_n_1111094.html?ref=occupy-wall-street

You don't think the money that's going to shut these guys down could be used for something more constructive? I was drawing my comparison to the civil rights movements of the 60's when its a similar clash of social classes instead of race, it gets just as heated (or it might if this type of force continues)

 

[bee_are_bee]

So you are saying if you yourself were protesting in a cause you believed in, you would leave immediately when the cops asked nicely the first time? If everyone in your protest group did that, would your protest have any effect at all?

It wouldn't. Instead, it would be a waste of time, and everyone would laugh at the useless protesters.

That's not what I'm saying. First off I believe there are better things to do than join a group of people in protest if there is something that bothers me that damn much. So, your insinuation is neither here, nor there.

Second, you're assuming the protest would have an effect in the first place. I don't believe this it does, in the case of Davis. Rising up to create a public disturbance because you're not getting what you want is childish. This isn't the 60s, these kids and most other people in protest now are nowhere near being oppressed individuals. They don't need to disperse for it to be a waste of time, it already is and I think the overall public backlash will have the opposite consequences of what they initially set out to "achieve."

 

[enkrypt3d]

That's not what I'm saying. First off I believe there are better things to do than join a group of people in protest if there is something that bothers me that damn much. So, your insinuation is neither here, nor there.

Second, you're assuming the protest would have an effect in the first place. I don't believe this it does, in the case of Davis. Rising up to create a public disturbance because you're not getting what you want is childish. This isn't the 60s, these kids and most other people in protest now are nowhere near being oppressed individuals. They don't need to disperse for it to be a waste of time, it already is and I think the overall public backlash will have the opposite consequences of what they initially set out to "achieve."

FYI the public backlash is not against OWS, its against the police that display over use of force.

 

[bee_are_bee]

so sitting in zuccotti park (which is all concrete by the way) destroys it?

The city and NYPD is using loop holes to evict peaceful protests in which it threatens the status quo. Did they do this with the tea party? No, because the tea party was mostly conservative and did not threaten big banks etc with action....

What's myopic about saying that the cops are over reacting? They are.

Yes they could use more direction and organization, but with the media blackout that's happening (even tho the NYPD says its not), it doesn't lend itself very well to disseminating their message. It's been a smear campaign since day one.

I personally agree that the system needs an over haul. This is something Obama promised to do but hasn't... whats wrong w/ holding them accountable?

Yes there are some homeless / hippies thrown in the mix with the more sophisticated / intelligent folks that make the entire movement look bad. So generalizing and saying the entire group is lazy or misinformed etc is myopic and ignorant.

You're overlooking the property damage OWS protesters are doing to local businesses near Zuccotti park? The disruption of small businesses to go about their work has caused layoffs and in some cases closures. What's that supposed to accomplish? No they didn't do this to the Tea Party because they didn't set up camp in a public place, which by the way is not legal. Tea Party rallies were that, rallies. They paid a fee for a permit, did their rally and they went home. I'm no Tea Partier, to compare it to OWS is simply inaccurate. Threaten big banks with action?? What action? You mean depositing all their funds from the finance committee into a Wells Fargo account?? The same Wells Fargo who received bail out funds? There weren't widespread reports of rape and sexual assault at Tea Party rallies. Speakers at OWS urging other protesters to not involving police regarding these sexual assaults. What's even more telling is that local OWS camps don't attempt to remove these individuals from their camps or separate themselves from them. They simply continue to allow these things to happen. How do you defend this?

I didn't say you were myopic because you think cops are overreacting. If you read what I wrote you'd know that I called it myopic in referencing the 60s in comparison to what's happening now. You're also projecting your own thoughts onto a movement that is a farce. OWS isn't officially holding Obama accountable, that's your projection. If they were truly doing this then all of these folks would be in D.C. They aren't.

Yes, I'm saying the movement is a farce. Do I think the close relationship between government and Wall Street is a bad thing? Yes. That's not what the OWS is projecting. It's projecting themselves as speaking for the 99% when in fact they are just representing themselves. "Eat the rich", "Student loan bail-outs", "We are the 99%" is all bumper sticker rhetoric and it's childish.

Call me ignorant if you want, but your overlooking the obvious and documented transgressions of MANY OWS protesters leads me to believe you're okay with their means. That's ignorant.

 

[bee_are_bee]

FYI the public backlash is not against OWS, its against the police that display over use of force.

Okay, so the growing protest against the protesters is a figment of my imagination :wink:

 

[bigbadberry]

Go ahead and thank OWS for 5 dollars a month if you're a BofA client .

 

[enkrypt3d]

Go ahead and thank OWS for 5 dollars a month if you're a BofA client .

haha um bofa isn't doing that anymore... and you really think thats due to OWS? hah good one.

 

[enkrypt3d]

You're overlooking the property damage OWS protesters are doing to local businesses near Zuccotti park? The disruption of small businesses to go about their work has caused layoffs and in some cases closures. What's that supposed to accomplish? No they didn't do this to the Tea Party because they didn't set up camp in a public place, which by the way is not legal. Tea Party rallies were that, rallies. They paid a fee for a permit, did their rally and they went home. I'm no Tea Partier, to compare it to OWS is simply inaccurate. Threaten big banks with action?? What action? You mean depositing all their funds from the finance committee into a Wells Fargo account?? The same Wells Fargo who received bail out funds? There weren't widespread reports of rape and sexual assault at Tea Party rallies. Speakers at OWS urging other protesters to not involving police regarding these sexual assaults. What's even more telling is that local OWS camps don't attempt to remove these individuals from their camps or separate themselves from them. They simply continue to allow these things to happen. How do you defend this?

I didn't say you were myopic because you think cops are overreacting. If you read what I wrote you'd know that I called it myopic in referencing the 60s in comparison to what's happening now. You're also projecting your own thoughts onto a movement that is a farce. OWS isn't officially holding Obama accountable, that's your projection. If they were truly doing this then all of these folks would be in D.C. They aren't.

Yes, I'm saying the movement is a farce. Do I think the close relationship between government and Wall Street is a bad thing? Yes. That's not what the OWS is projecting. It's projecting themselves as speaking for the 99% when in fact they are just representing themselves. "Eat the rich", "Student loan bail-outs", "We are the 99%" is all bumper sticker rhetoric and it's childish.

Call me ignorant if you want, but your overlooking the obvious and documented transgressions of MANY OWS protesters leads me to believe you're okay with their means. That's ignorant.

Ha that's rich... saying I'm defending the rapists? Really? Are you serious?

I've never defended such actions and never would.

And the "growing protests against the protesters" - that's just what you're watching on FOX news which isn't news, its commentary with very little fact or substance.

Anyways all I am saying is you can't generalize the entire movement based on the actions or crimes of a few, and that's exactly what you're doing. Demonizing the entire protest b/c of some bad apples. Yes there is crime but that happens everywhere. What's new with that? At any public event there will be crime - does that mean the entire crowd is guilty? NO.

I never said they were trying to hold Obama accountable. I said what's wrong with doing that? I personally think that politics and wall st are in bed together and its time for them to be separated permanently. But unfortunately that will never happen.

Also since when is racial oppression any worse than economic oppression? Can you explain that to me?

 

[docjohn]

cmon...I find it a stretch to equate the civil rights movement where it was illegal for African Americans to share the same benefits as whites with this ...... Is it illegal for any of these protesters to get a job,go to school , better oneself,just like I did,or you did.I applaud your differing opinion,or else this thread would sound like fox....but a lawfull safe protest is a far cry from this glorified squating going on.When you setup a tent city/small bivwac village you create a new "town" who or what is supposed to protect the inocent/ maintain order and provide sanitation/nutrition?

 

[bigbadberry]

haha um bofa isn't doing that anymore... and you really think thats due to OWS? hah good one.

You misunderstood, you should THANK OWS for BofA backing down. OWS is spreading that exact type of message.

 

[peiserg]

I'm still scratching my head over the "media blackout." Every day in the news they cover some OWS story.

Error 404 No Media Blackout Found

And, as it stands, I pay (when including sales tax) about 48% of my income to taxes. If they want me to kick in a little more, when most of them most likely don't pay jack, they aren't going to make me a fan.

 

[TURBO2GO]

cmon...I find it a stretch to equate the civil rights movement where it was illegal for African Americans to share the same benefits as whites with this ...... Is it illegal for any of these protesters to get a job,go to school , better oneself,just like I did,or you did.I applaud your differing opinion,or else this thread would sound like fox....but a lawfull safe protest is a far cry from this glorified squating going on.When you setup a tent city/small bivwac village you create a new "town" who or what is supposed to protect the inocent/ maintain order and provide sanitation/nutrition?

Doc you are right, it isn't the same TYPE of movement exactly, but few movements are ever the same. That doesn't make them false in any way, these kinds of things happen all over the world. When you don't hold power, your only choice is to protest, and people protest in all sorts of ways. Some set themselves on fire. Of course many will look at that and not care, but some will care because they will sense the desperation and have a second look at what the protester was saying. This is just how protests work. In some countries everyone OWS would be in prison or shot. Here, they can protest. As for sanitation and nutrition, they seem to be taking care of feeding themselves, they are not holding out food bowls. Some have decided to help them as they believe in their cause. As for sanitation... it's a protest done through occupation. I don't think it is any more of a public health hazard than a whole host of other things we put up with and are exposed to every single day. I think we should keep things in perspective.

Who gives DHS their oders? The president.....

No, the president does not give DHS their orders. These protesters and Obama share some common ground. I am surprised that you don't see that.