Question about OEM Wheels: 91-92 1st Gen NSX

[Cogito Ergo Zoom]

Hey guys,

I'm currently in the market for a 1st Gen, early model 91-92 car. I'm looking for a "time machine" quality vehicle that's unmodified and low miles. I've found a few cars on the market that fit this bill, but unfortunately I let the best slip away by being a little slow.

I've found another potential option that has everything I want with the exception of the wheels: it has the (IMHO) ugly chromed wheels option from the factory that just really dates the car and not in a good way.

A couple of questions:

1) I'm assuming I could have the chrome removed by a reputable shop and painted in the factory satin / silver finish?
2) I notice that for the chrome wheel option, Acura fitted a different center cap for those wheels. Can you get replacement center caps in the satin / cc style?
3) Failing the above, are there OEM wheels available from reputable sources?

Basically I want this:


Not this:


Thanks in advance for your help. This looks like a great forum.

 

[brettowen]

OEM wheels for early NSXs are a dime a dozen (not literally). IMHO, you could probably pick up a second hand set cheaper than you could refinish the ones you have. There's almost always a set or two up for grabs in the parts for sale forum. If not, just put a post in the parts wanted forum and I'm certain you'd get a response fairly quickly. I'm currently running a set of '02-'05 OEM which I think look MUCH better on my '91 but I've kept my original wheels if/when I should ever choose to go back to stock. Hope this helps.

 

[WillErickson]

If you live near the ocean check out a marina, many owners use them as boat anchors.

 

[brettowen]

If you live near the ocean check out a marina, many owners use them as boat anchors.

You joke but with so many early NSX owners literally throwing these wheels out, I do envision a time in the not too distant future where these early OEM wheels will be worth something. Just my take.

 

[NSX2398]

Hey guys,
This looks like a great forum.

It appears you're relatively new to the site so you may not have found the NSX Wiki yet. It provides a wealth of information in a form slightly different from Forum searches and can be found off the red action bar at the top of most pages. It is organized into sections .. one of which is "Modifying your NSX" where you will find various subsections, one of which is Exterior Mods which has a whole section on wheel information. Unfortunately, the Wiki is currently in a frozen state so the information isn't as current as it was .. but quite often you'll find the Wiki has a link to an active Forum discussion where you can see current information. For example, the "Wheel-Tire" experiences topic points to ongoing discussion led by Prime user Angus about larger wheel tire combinations. As brettowen has already said, a popular route for early NSX owners is to upgrade to the 7 spoke wheels that came out in '94. Under OEM Wheels, there's a section called Technical Specs which documents the changes over the years. Another use for the five spoke wheels is to keep them for use at the track and keep a newer set for daily driving.

 

[JD Cross]

It's worth noting that the early 5 spoke wheels with tires are the lightest OEM combination and gives you the lowest unsprung weight.
I have a set of 16/17 Forgelines as well as the originals and I can feel the difference when I change back to 15/16 OEM.

 

[dablackgoku1234]

Honestly, not worth the time/money/effort to refinish those fat 5's. They're ugly, small, narrow, and offsets make the car look bad. However, as JD mentioned, they are the lightest combo without having to break your wallet. But then again, it's because they are so small and narrow.

What is the intention of having silver fat 5's? If you are going for the 1991 full "stock" look, then buying a set of 1991 OEMs in silver would be your cheapest option.

 

[nsxtasy]

I've found another potential option that has everything I want with the exception of the wheels: it has the (IMHO) ugly chromed wheels option from the factory that just really dates the car and not in a good way.

Chrome wheels were never an option from the factory. All '91-93 NSX's sold in North America came from the factory with the five-spoke silver-painted wheels, with the silver plastic center caps. Any five-spoke chromed wheels were refinished by their owners, and any chrome center caps were purchased by their owners in the aftermarket.

Used sets of stock '91-93 wheels are easy to find and very affordable, although it is easier to find ones that are so-so cosmetically than pristine ones. Center caps can be a bit tougher to find, although they are still available new from Acura if you don't mind the price ($88 list, each).

 

[solidol]

You can find a set in excellent shape for around 200. I downsized my 94 to these mostly because of original look and how well suspension and brakes work. With sticky tires it's great for stock na1. Tires are cheaper too. But it's just the look just like the first time I saw it.

 

[robbiedawg]

It's worth noting that the early 5 spoke wheels with tires are the lightest OEM combination and gives you the lowest unsprung weight.
I have a set of 16/17 Forgelines as well as the originals and I can feel the difference when I change back to 15/16 OEM.

low unsprung weight is very helpful,and sometimes overlooked in the bigger is better mentality.honda consciously chose small wheels as part of a design philosophy of avoiding a heavier car,which needs bigger and heavier everything.smaller wheels also helped it have a roomier interior than other supercars of the time,specifically in the footwell,where others had a skewed seating position.this is a quote from the wheel section of the wiki-

With mid-engine design and lightweight aluminum construction there is no need for more tire at the front of the car. Honda's goal was to minimal mass for this vehicle, and that the "vicious circle" of weight works in both directions (heavier vehicles require a bigger engine, which weighs more, then bigger brakes, which weigh more etc.). Using a smaller front wheel also means more room in the interior footwells, a common area of complaint with other sports cars (wheels intrude into footwell meaning pedals are skewed off straight ahead).

 

[nsxtasy]

There are two more advantages of the original 15"/16" stock '91-93 rims. One is tire availability; there's a huge selection of the stickiest tires available in the stock sizes, including "extreme performance" street tires as well as R compound track tires. Another is that you can fit a set of four wheels and tires inside the car, so you can drive to the track on your street tires and then swap to your track tires.

 

[JLCoolman]

It's worth noting that the early 5 spoke wheels with tires are the lightest OEM combination and gives you the lowest unsprung weight.
I have a set of 16/17 Forgelines as well as the originals and I can feel the difference when I change back to 15/16 OEM.

Don't forget the OEM Enkei Type R wheels.

 

[Yinzer]

What tires have you owners of 15/16's been buying, and from where? And, your usage style and opinions of them? I think I'm seeing add'l reduction in availability lately online at the usual sites in NSX sizes for 15/16's.

 

[MrScansi]

Prime and Craigslist

 

[Yinzer]

Thanks but I'm looking to hear what others have been finding for new not used tires.

Edit: Am looking to hear about their impressions on performance, noise, wear/life, quality, etc. Not just price and name of tire bought. THX!

 

[solidol]

@tirerack: dunlop direzza z2

Thanks but I'm looking to hear what others have been finding for new not used tires.

 

[imflipside]

What tires have you owners of 15/16's been buying, and from where? And, your usage style and opinions of them? I think I'm seeing add'l reduction in availability lately online at the usual sites in NSX sizes for 15/16's.

Bridgestone Potenza RE-11a

Tire Depot in Canada

 

[Yinzer]

Thanks for the replies. Do any of you have any practical comments regarding why you chose what you did? Price-wise there's not too much to think about since all the street tires available at Tire Rack for example are around $300-500, so I'm just looking for a real reason to shoot for the higher price range like the Yokohamas, or just flip a coin and buy one of the $500 sets or even consider the $300 set just because it's half the price of the high end tires and because perhaps it will suit my specific needs -- I plan very little track use except for say maybe a few fun laps at NSXPO and I'm not too aggressive out on the street other than the occasional backroad/woodsy western PA twisty road runs, so my main focus is on the general things like feel/grip, longevity, noise, and general quality/value for price, etc. No DD'ing planned, no snow use planned, and very limited rain use -- really only if I get caught in the rain. As you can tell, I have no preference to brand nor am I hung up at all on spending up on tires for any ooh aah's when parked at a cars n coffee.

Thanks a lot, I really appreciate it. Otherwise I flip a coin and spend ~$500 and go enjoy my car w/o a second thought even if I may be leaving money on the table for my particular priorites.

 

[nsxtasy]

In the stock 15"/16" sizes, there's plenty of selection of the supersticky "extreme performance" tires on the market. The best of these are the BFGoodrich g-Force Rival, Bridgestone Potenza RE-11A, Dunlop Direzza ZII, and Yokohama ADVAN Neova AD08R. Terrific traction, and not terribly expensive ($500-600 per set). Their only downside is that they won't last as long as some other tires, but those other tires won't give anywhere near the level of performance that these will.

If you're trying to choose one tire out of this group, check out this side-by-side comparison test on the Tire Rack website.

 

[imflipside]

Thanks for the replies. Do any of you have any practical comments regarding why you chose what you did? Price-wise there's not too much to think about since all the street tires available at Tire Rack for example are around $300-500, so I'm just looking for a real reason to shoot for the higher price range like the Yokohamas, or just flip a coin and buy one of the $500 sets or even consider the $300 set just because it's half the price of the high end tires and because perhaps it will suit my specific needs -- I plan very little track use except for say maybe a few fun laps at NSXPO and I'm not too aggressive out on the street other than the occasional backroad/woodsy western PA twisty road runs, so my main focus is on the general things like feel/grip, longevity, noise, and general quality/value for price, etc. No DD'ing planned, no snow use planned, and very limited rain use -- really only if I get caught in the rain. As you can tell, I have no preference to brand nor am I hung up at all on spending up on tires for any ooh aah's when parked at a cars n coffee.

Thanks a lot, I really appreciate it. Otherwise I flip a coin and spend ~$500 and go enjoy my car w/o a second thought even if I may be leaving money on the table for my particular priorites.

A few years ago when I first looked at which tires to use I read every review I could find. Because my NSX is my DD I wanted tires that performed really well when dry and in the wet. I also wanted a quiet tire at the limit and during normal driving. Back then Bridgestone Potenza RE-11's appeared to have the best wet and dry performance in one tire and few trade-offs so I bought a set. They performed as well if not better than expected. I put about 50,000 km on them before I wore them out (no track use) and they wore really evenly (I think excellent alignment can be thanked for that). In the past on other cars I used Yokohama tires so I thought I'd get a set because Advan Neova AD08 are supposedly on par (some say better) than the Bridgestones (although maybe not in the rain). I ordered a set, but when they arrived they were all 3-4 years old so I sent them back. Yokohama couldn't tell the tire dealer when they'd get new ones and I got sick of waiting so I purchased the Bridgestones instead. Not only were they less expensive, the updated Potenza RE-11a's performed even better than my RE-11's did so I'm thrilled. Are they as good (or better) than AD08's? Don't know, but I'm really happy with them.

FYI: Not sure if this is just a R compound thing or it's specific to the Bridgestones, but below 15 degrees C. they'll create a little vibration in the steering wheel until they warm up. It goes away fast. At 20 degrees C. there's none. This isn't as big a deal as it sounds, it lets you know when the tires are at their operating temperature which is a good thing.

As for other extreme performance tires; I have no experience with them, I just know what works for me. The grip extreme performance tires provide is so impressive you'll never go back to regular tires again after you feel them, even if all you do is drive to work every day. They make the car feel great and provide a high degree of safety; nothing like great grip on dry and wet surfaces to keep you in control. They're worth every penny extra it costs you to buy them.

For what it's worth.:smile:

Darren.

 

[nsxtasy]

In the stock 15"/16" sizes, there's plenty of selection of the supersticky "extreme performance" tires on the market.

Incidentally, there's also plenty of selection of R compound tires for the racetrack in those sizes. However, the selection of tires in the lower performance categories (for non-sports cars and for those who are looking to trade off performance in exchange for longer treadlife) has greatly diminished as the market has moved to larger-diameter wheels, even on economy cars and family sedans. In 205/50-15, the Tire Rack only carries one max performance summer tire, three ultra high performance summer tires, and two all-seasons of any kind, along with seven extreme performance choices and twelve for the track.

 

[Yinzer]

Thanks imflipside and others for the replies. Ken is always my ace of tire info and prior sidebar conversations with him convinced me to stick with a good extreme performance tire for the best of all worlds, which is what I'll likely do.... Still, my curiousity will remain however about the true tangible real-world payoff for spending $250 more for those vs. ultra high performance tires (four 15/16 Direzza DZ102's are available for $292 after rebate at tire rack...) given two things: 1) my usage style, which is relatively low-key compared to some, and 2) the question of where's the best place to put your money if we're talking handling: suspension, driver training, tires, etc... I've always been a bigger fan of spending $ on training and lessons first and then high-performance equipment second..... I should go searching for that tire comparison in C&D or one of those magazines a few years ago...anyone have that link? Also there was a Fifth Gear episode I think where Jason took a novice on a track and they swapped out tires & suspension and then he gave her some lessons. I remember lessons being the main factor towards improved handling or speed around the track (as I'd expect).....

I'm not too embarrassed to ask this in the name of science and feel that I can't be accused of trying to go "slumming" on tires for an NSX since I'm already happy with my 15/16 wheels, non-FI base engine, base suspension, base choker exhaust, and tall 5spd gearing which are likely considered slumming by many who have more aggressive performance preferences! I'd be super willing to throw $400 on some tracktime driver education, especially if I had happened to save $250 on tires.

 

[nsxtasy]

I've always been a bigger fan of spending $ on training and lessons first and then high-performance equipment second.....
.
.
.
I'd be super willing to throw $400 on some tracktime driver education, especially if I had happened to save $250 on tires.

On a racetrack, a faster, more experienced driver in a slower car will turn quicker lap times than a slower, less experienced driver in a faster car. Approximately ten times out of ten.

That being said, it's up to you whether you prefer to save money by buying cars with lower performance capabilities. Tires are usually the most important performance parts on the car, so getting stickier tires are typically more important to performance than modifications which add power or change the suspension.

If you can swing it, spend money on maximizing the capabilities of your car as well as on maximizing the capabilities of the nut behind the wheel.

 

[Yinzer]

On a racetrack, a faster, more experienced driver in a slower car will turn quicker lap times than a slower, less experienced driver in a faster car. Approximately ten times out of ten.

Bob Bondurant convinced me that the answer may be more like 9.9 times out of 10. He taught us green engineers fresh out of college some hands-on vehicle dynamics during our first few weeks at Ford. After classroom work we went to Ford's dearborn handling track. Had various FWD, RWD, family cars, performance cars, etc., available for laps on the short handling track and to try some of our steer with the throttle and other new techniques. We're all definitely feeling more competent and much faster than we were at the beginning. Then he takes 7 of us in an Econoline van and beats ALL our times with little tire squeal and while looking back and forth at us and the windshield, talking and instructing the entire time. Unforgettable, and some simple lessons that I still use today on the road.

Tires are usually the most important performance parts on the car, so getting stickier tires are typically more important to performance than modifications which add power or change the suspension.

That's what I was looking to read. I was lazy and didn't search for more of this online. I read so much about FI mods & engine mods & suspension & hellaflush/lowering mods that I forget the importance of where the rubber meets the road.

 

[robbiedawg]

i had dunlop direzza dz-101's,the predecessor tire.if they had had a little less ultimate grip than the extreme performance tires like the potenza re-11's that i have now,but otherwise decent handling characteristics,i think they would have made a lot of sense and been a good way to save some money.i'm not a good enough driver to take the re-11's past their limit.

the problem was that they didn't have otherwise decent handling-they were terrible.they had this frightening wiggle if you came into a curve even moderately fast,that made you feel like you were going to lose control.i got rid of them,they were a bad thing to do to this great car.i don't know about the new dz-102's except that i know i won't be getting them.