Because a Corvette offers performance which rivals or ECLIPSES many exotics out there.... the Current Z06 is probably the best car for the money on the market.
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Supercar or not to supercar is the question..
- Thread starter VegasSpeed
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Because a Corvette offers performance which rivals or ECLIPSES many exotics out there.... the Current Z06 is probably the best car for the money on the market.
The root cause of this debate is that nobody has a coherent definition of what a "supercar" is. Indeed, it is possibly an undefinable quality.
That said, one aspect of supercarness that I feel is part of the definition is exclusivity. Corvettes, despite their acknowledged performance, do not have this quality.
That said, one aspect of supercarness that I feel is part of the definition is exclusivity. Corvettes, despite their acknowledged performance, do not have this quality.
No, I'll resolve that one. Just round up all of the pictures taken with that car and use this equation:
IF the number pictures with hot model-quality chicks posing in front of the car is greater than the number pictures with ugly dudes plus busted looking car show tramps posing with the car, then it's a supercar. :tongue::biggrin:
ILL END THIS DEBATE VERY FAST...IVE HAD A CAMARO/VETTE/NSX AND A FEW VIPERS....
WHEN I OWNED MY CAMARO..I WOULDNT DRIVE AROUND IN MY TRUCK AND SEE ANOTHER CAMARO AND SAY OH MY GOD ANOTHER CAMARO..
WHEN I OWNED MY 2004 VETTE AND WAS DRIVING MY TRUCK I WOULDNT SEE ANOTHER C5 OR C6 OR Z06 AND SAY OH MY GOD ANOTHER VETTE!!!
I NOW OWN A NSX AND VIPER..FEW WEEKS AGO I WAS WITH MY FAMILY IN THE VAN..WE SAW A WHITE NSX AND MY WIFE AND KIDS DECIDED TO FOLLOW IT ON THE FREEWAY AND TAKE PICS..WE WERE ALL SAYING OH MY GOD A NSX...AND WE HAVE ONE SITTING RIGHT IN OUR DRIVE WAY...BUT IT'S A RARE TO SEE 90K CAR WITH A ENGINE IN THE BACK..IT'S KOOL AS HELL TO SEE ONE..THEIRS ONLY 25k OR SO IN THE WORLD..
SAME THING WITH MY VIPER...GOT ONE SITTING IN MY DRIVEWAY.BUT IVE SEEN 2 ON THE ROAD IN THE PAST TWO YEARS..ONE WAS A RED SRT10 A MONTH AGO...I ROLLED DOWN MY TRUCK WINDOW AND PULLED BESIDE HIM JUST TO LET HIM KNOW I HAD ONE TWO AND WE SHOULD CRUISE....A RARE OPPERTUNITY AND I WASNT GONNA PASS IT UP..
90K VIPERS AND 90K NSX'S ARE THE BOTTOM RUNG OF THE EXOTIC/SUPERCAR LADDER...BUT THEY ARE NONE THE LESS STILL A STEP ON THE LADDER......CANT DRIVE EIGHTER ONE THROUGH A GAS STATION WITHOUT HAVEING ATLEASTE SOMEONE SAY SOMTHING
WHEN I OWNED MY CAMARO..I WOULDNT DRIVE AROUND IN MY TRUCK AND SEE ANOTHER CAMARO AND SAY OH MY GOD ANOTHER CAMARO..
WHEN I OWNED MY 2004 VETTE AND WAS DRIVING MY TRUCK I WOULDNT SEE ANOTHER C5 OR C6 OR Z06 AND SAY OH MY GOD ANOTHER VETTE!!!
I NOW OWN A NSX AND VIPER..FEW WEEKS AGO I WAS WITH MY FAMILY IN THE VAN..WE SAW A WHITE NSX AND MY WIFE AND KIDS DECIDED TO FOLLOW IT ON THE FREEWAY AND TAKE PICS..WE WERE ALL SAYING OH MY GOD A NSX...AND WE HAVE ONE SITTING RIGHT IN OUR DRIVE WAY...BUT IT'S A RARE TO SEE 90K CAR WITH A ENGINE IN THE BACK..IT'S KOOL AS HELL TO SEE ONE..THEIRS ONLY 25k OR SO IN THE WORLD..
SAME THING WITH MY VIPER...GOT ONE SITTING IN MY DRIVEWAY.BUT IVE SEEN 2 ON THE ROAD IN THE PAST TWO YEARS..ONE WAS A RED SRT10 A MONTH AGO...I ROLLED DOWN MY TRUCK WINDOW AND PULLED BESIDE HIM JUST TO LET HIM KNOW I HAD ONE TWO AND WE SHOULD CRUISE....A RARE OPPERTUNITY AND I WASNT GONNA PASS IT UP..
90K VIPERS AND 90K NSX'S ARE THE BOTTOM RUNG OF THE EXOTIC/SUPERCAR LADDER...BUT THEY ARE NONE THE LESS STILL A STEP ON THE LADDER......CANT DRIVE EIGHTER ONE THROUGH A GAS STATION WITHOUT HAVEING ATLEASTE SOMEONE SAY SOMTHING
They were 90k cars when sold new in the last series of the NSX run. 89k is pretty close. They may not be worth that now but there you have it. I bet his viper isn't worth 90k anymore either. That's my guess. There surely is a rarety issue with our cars. I never see em, well hardly ever. There are some here in Atlanta but it is rare to see them out.
But you know when it gets right down to it - who cares what others think - I didn't buy mine for the rare, wow, supercar, exotic handle idea. I bought it cause I know what it is and I've read about it and it performs and it's fun to drive and it is like a race car - well it's not as fast as some might want it but it is for me. You surely sit in it like it's a race car. It's just got all the stuff just right for me and I consider it an amazing piece of art on wheels, like I used to think of the XKE and actually still do, like a lot of beautiful cars out there. But like I said I bought it for me - if others like it and get a kick out of seeing one - I surely understand that cause that's the way I felt when I saw one before I bought one! I still get a kick out of seeing one on the road.
It's just a great car! Rare, exotic, supercar - let others worry themselves over that - I just enjoy mine and hopefully will for a long time to come! :biggrin:
But you know when it gets right down to it - who cares what others think - I didn't buy mine for the rare, wow, supercar, exotic handle idea. I bought it cause I know what it is and I've read about it and it performs and it's fun to drive and it is like a race car - well it's not as fast as some might want it but it is for me. You surely sit in it like it's a race car. It's just got all the stuff just right for me and I consider it an amazing piece of art on wheels, like I used to think of the XKE and actually still do, like a lot of beautiful cars out there. But like I said I bought it for me - if others like it and get a kick out of seeing one - I surely understand that cause that's the way I felt when I saw one before I bought one! I still get a kick out of seeing one on the road.
It's just a great car! Rare, exotic, supercar - let others worry themselves over that - I just enjoy mine and hopefully will for a long time to come! :biggrin:
C'mon, yours wasn't that when new or, when you bought it and neither was mine.
The value of a car is what it can be bought for now.
I love my NSX and mine stickered for the low 80's when new BUT I didn't pay that and neither did the guy that owned it before me.
I paid 54k in 1999 and it isn't worth that anymore.
You won't hear me saying I own a 80k or 90k car, that would just be posing. It's a >35k car... IF I'm lucky.
I have a 35k car ..... you want it? :biggrin:
Nope. I know you drove it in the rain so it's not worth considering.:biggrin:
You're right of course. They are only worth what you can sell em for now. However, when I think of autos for sale in similar price catagories I still think of NSXs and Porsches as cars that are in a higher bracket because of what they sold for new. A WRSsti isn't going to excite me cause it costs what mine is worth now. I like the idea that I have a depreciated high 60k car or late models would be almost 90k when new. Now they're worth 34 to 55 or less, whatever but they were still built and sold new as expensive cars and that puts them in a special catagory. I guess that's what I was trying to say. To me a depreciated high dollar car is a better car than another sports car sold right now new for what mine is worth. Does that make sense?
In my opinion I think the term supercar has to be relative to year in which the car was designed and subsequently released. Many past super cars can easily be out performed by family cars of today. Does that make them no longer a supercar or just a supercar of the past.
In this case, the NSX, it's still a grey area, it was better than most every car out there when it was released but still had a few competitors, in Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini...however it still runs and was better built than any other car from that time, which in and off itself makes it a super car:wink:
I actually think this debate would not occur so often if the NSX production was stopped in the mid 90's as opposed to keeping the same car and roughly same power output all the way through 2005, while other car companies were making leaps and bounds in terms of performance.
Here's an interesting article.
http://ezinearticles.com/?What-Makes-a-Car-a-Supercar?&id=481183
In this case, the NSX, it's still a grey area, it was better than most every car out there when it was released but still had a few competitors, in Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini...however it still runs and was better built than any other car from that time, which in and off itself makes it a super car:wink:
I actually think this debate would not occur so often if the NSX production was stopped in the mid 90's as opposed to keeping the same car and roughly same power output all the way through 2005, while other car companies were making leaps and bounds in terms of performance.
Here's an interesting article.
http://ezinearticles.com/?What-Makes-a-Car-a-Supercar?&id=481183
I whole heartedly disagree....
Lets say you bought a brand new 2007 vette back in 2007 for 51K...
Now in 2010 it's worth 33K..
A budy of yours goes and buys a 2010 mustang with a V8 and all the options..Not a GT500..Just a regular v8 mustang with all the trimmings...He picks up his 2010 mustang for 33K..
So are you two in equal vehicles?????
They may be worth the same amount at this time..But the exterior of the vette is that of a 50K car...The handling/interior/engine every desighn element of that car is of a car made to sell at 51K..While every element of the mustang was desighned to sell at 33K...
The vette is surely the nicer car despite them being worth the same at that point....
I bought my 2003 viper back in 2006 for aound 60K...The origional owner before me paid 90K back in 2003 brand new...In 2006 you could still by the same exact car as my 2003 as a 2006 model for 80 plus K...
Now my 2003 Viper is only worth 40K...But every desighn element of that car was desighned to be sold at 90K..From the 510 hp engine to everything being hand built to the low production numbers ect...
Sure you could buy a used 2009 435 HP vette for 40K the same as you could buy a used 2003 viper for 40K...But the viper still has significant advantages in engine/handling/exterior ect..Showcaseing why it was and will forever be a 90K car....
Belieave it or not the 91 nsx's were only suppossed to sell for 50K ( wich was more like 80K back in 1991 by todays standards) but the demand was so high that the going rate for a 1991 nsx back then was 75-100K ( equivalent to 110-140K by todays standards...
The 91 nsx sold so much higher than the 50K they were asking that the very next year the price went from 50K to 60K in 1992..
My 91 supercharged nsx may be a 25-30K car by todays market..But every single detail of that car was made to be a 50K car back in 1991...From the rear mounted engine to the low sleek desghn to being desighned in part by a famous race car driver...
The fit/finish and desighn/engine /handling ect. dont depreciate the way the price of a car does...
YOU CAN GET F360'S FOR 70-80k...THAT MEAN THAT A C6Z06 IS JUST AS NICE AS A 2001 F360 FERRARI???????
IT WILL FOREVER AND ALWAYS BE A ENGINEERING MARVEL AND BEAUTY..DESPITE THE DEPECIATION..JUST LIKE THE NSX
In your dreams.
Look I know at least as much about the NSX as you. I don't need to be sold on it's attributes, I agree with what you say except for the fantasy that it is still a 90k car. It wasn't the moment it left the dealership.
Is a 1966 289 Cobra is a 5k car?
A 1962 Corvette is a 4.5k car?
That's what they listed for new.
Engineering marvel IN IT"S TIME or not, it's worth what you can buy it or sell it for now.
Someday a NSX may bring 2-times what it originally sold for but that day is a way off.
That day is well after all the fellows who bought 30k cars and tell people they're 90k cars move on.:biggrin:
Next time I have a 2001 Cadillac come in I'll try to remember it's a 47k car.
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^+1 Doc John, man is that ever true. I remember when our Director saw my car - you should have heard me poor mouthing it. Oh yeah it's nice but it's 19 years old and bla, bla, bla .....cheap cheap cheap...like a little birdie. LOL
I think if you really have to ask yourself if its a "Supercar" its probably not. I commented on this topic before and still believe that a term like supercar is created to describe a vague group of features that will be widely accepted in pop culture or a subset of industry specific car culture. Since it is vague, its not really a right or wrong situation but more of how much credibility you want to have with people you communicate with. Lets say "Jonny" convinces himself that his NSX is a Supercar. Jonny Drives to work in his NSX and tells some of his gear head coworkers "hey, I just bought a supercar, come outside to see it!"
How many of those people will be disappointed when they see he was talking about a honda with 270 horsepower? Chances are, anybody that even comprehends the term Supercar will not picture an NSX. So why label the NSX a Supercar if the car itself does not widely embody the expectations of car folk or even regular folk?
To me, the NSX is just a bad ass quasi exotic mid engine sports car.
How many of those people will be disappointed when they see he was talking about a honda with 270 horsepower? Chances are, anybody that even comprehends the term Supercar will not picture an NSX. So why label the NSX a Supercar if the car itself does not widely embody the expectations of car folk or even regular folk?
To me, the NSX is just a bad ass quasi exotic mid engine sports car.
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