The Negatives of the NSX 2.0

[Valkyrie Pilot]

Good points all.

It would appear that HONDA is trying to be all things to all people....except being true to it's own roots.

HONDA had a superlative sports car in the 1st Gen NSX, it had the formula right...light weight, exceptional handling, just enough power, great looks.
It has given up on that formula and taken the easy way out. It has gone the way of the GTR.

HONDA has jammed the car with all the gizmos and some more, made it heavy in the name of improving performance[?... they must have had the GTR as their main target and not the 458 as they had promised]. They promised the best handling super car ever...this pig despite all technology designed to do the opposite..... understeers! One of the greatest attributes of any sports car and one that the 1st Gen was particularly know for, steering feel....is gone; blame it on the need to make the steering wheel dead so as to not rip it out of your hands with all the torque being sent to the front wheels! So they added tech to achieve an end and took away a crucial quality that makes a desirable sports car!! That does not compute.

The greatest and most loved sports cars, irrespective of price, have one formula for success....they are light, they do not compromise their sporting nature in the name of convenience of the daily commute, they are great handling, they have excellent steering feel, they sound the part .... be it a 488, the 911 or the superb Miata.

The NSX was one of these superb machines. The NSX is now in the same category as the GTR. Amazing numbers, no soul.
Soichiro Honda would not approve of this car.

HONDA should have kept the NSX single minded and brutal. It should have an exhaust that would cause the neighborhood dogs to whimper. It should have an interior that would make you say wow every time you saw it. It should have a powerful engine and a light body that would make it a delight to handle and not under steer to keep the wannabe's safe, it should have a look that makes you want to wake up in the middle of the night and go look at it, once again.

HONDA should keep their formula of all things to all people, for their Accords, Civics , Pilots and Odysseys. They should have kept the NSX free. The NSX should have been the beast that stood apart. They have killed it.

The thing that i feel keeps getting forgotten in all this is Hondas move with a view to the long term. Emissions regulations are a huge concern for all manufactures and even Ferrari is feeling the pinch As evidenced by their move toward forced induction engines. Porsche is in the same boat. Ferrari is even talking about making a move from v-8s to v-6s. And they are all paying attention to Tesla.

So the technology isn't perfected yet. But how long will it take before batteries get much lighter and pack much more energy? And do you doubt that Honda won't be able to eventually engineer steering feel back in without sacrificing torque vectoring?

 

[liftcontrol]

So the technology isn't perfected yet. But how long will it take before batteries get much lighter and pack much more energy? And do you doubt that Honda won't be able to eventually engineer steering feel back in without sacrificing torque vectoring?

For the sake of HONDA, a company I greatly admire, I hope that they are able to perfect the technology and bring about changes to make the NSX what it deserves to be.
I do not have any doubt about the engineering capabilities of HONDA.

For the moment however, HONDA seems to have lost it's way.
Unless they realize that, they are not going to want to make changes that matter to car enthusiasts.

 

[Tom239]

The original NSX came out at an opportune moment. There were a lot of things ready to be done that Honda stepped up and did. The most innovative thing Honda points to in the next NSX is a new ablative casting technology; compare that to the list of firsts in the original.

And in 1990, a car didn't need 500 HP in order to make a splash. I liked that; the supercar game has since become more of a horsepower contest. But to each his own; I mean no disrespect to those who are twice as happy with twice the horsepower.

I also liked how the original NSX could be a daily driver for many of us. The new one is for those who don't mind that the trunk is even smaller and there's no spare tire.

 

[N Spec]

For the sake of HONDA, a company I greatly admire, I hope that they are able to perfect the technology and bring about changes to make the NSX what it deserves to be.
I do not have any doubt about the engineering capabilities of HONDA.

For the moment however, HONDA seems to have lost it's way.
Unless they realize that, they are not going to want to make changes that matter to car enthusiasts.

I totally disagree with the easy route statement you made earlier. The easy way is do what exactly Ferrari did, but for cheaper. Make a lighter V8 (In terms of power level) mid-engine car that is more accessible to Honda buyers. The hard way which is what they took is making an extremely complex car in the guise that it's worth the complications.

I don't think they've lost their way. I think they are rekindling their competitiveness even if some directions are questionable. I think it's just the fact that the car on paper is 800 lbs heavier than the original that many people are griping about ultimately. The steering feeling is subjective as electronic steering or numbing is going the be same argument as DCT vs manual tranny.

However, as many people that are aware of the current scene know, every modern super car or sports car is practically over 3,500-3,600 lbs with less tech in their cars... They don't have 3 extra motors and battery packs like the NSX. Imagine what the GTR is going to weigh when they add hybrid tech to it. I'd be surprised if it was under 4,000 lbs.

Even the 458/488 are generally near 3,500 lbs with all of the fluids as per owner's own weight analysis.

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it's been said many times, too much compromise...

This is the argument of life IMP - Balance. Everyone has varied views of what is too much or too little. You seem to embrace a more "Ferrari" or Italian Balance haha.

I can't say for sure until I drive the car myself, as I'm still skeptical more on the current state of battery tech than I am about the numb feelings or exhaust notes. I'm more worried about having it get it serviced in intervals that are not practical unlike the first NSX. However, in say a decade, battery tech will be even better and I would like to imagine one can swap out the e-motors and battery in a modular like instance for much more efficient tech... The software re-programming seems daunting tho.

 

[simplife]

The nice thing about the original NSX was the option list was minimal.....

My guess is the 2017 $156K base will turn into $175K for most builds +TTL

According to this thread a fully spec'd car is over $205 K

http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/193612-Pricing-announced

 

[sadlerau]

compromise is exactly the point. you're starting to get it.

the "too much Accord in your NSX" statement when applied to the first gen referred mainly to its reliability and livability. which aren't huge knocks really, to most they were huge pluses.

with the second gen, i think it sounds even more compromised. granted, everyone is making massive generalisations (including you N Spec) because it hasn't been compared to any of its rivals yet. but in performance, i think the second gen is decidedly less Super the Honda's first attempt.

the steering feel is non-existent
the engine noise is certainly nothing to brag about
the looks aren't especially awesome nor as striking as the first car (relative to its rivals, the era)
and it's pretty damn overweight, with not huge power


it's been said many times, too much compromise...

How can you surmise, let alone claim, anything about the NSX's performance, when by your own admission there have been no test results published? An open mind until the facts are known is always a good position to take - unless your prejudices have already convinced you of the NSX's inadequacies?

Steering feel is important, and I hope they can do something about it, but as has been discussed, with that much torque being sent to the front wheels, feel may be a compromise too far. You find that unacceptable, whereas I find it an acceptable compromise [having spent many a year with a very WOODEN feel in my '06 Legend].

Engine noise is another item of personal importance. Many on these forums are happy with the sound of their Mk I NSX's, whereas I like mine with a Taitec GTLW system. Is the NSX MkI a lesser vehicle because it's not loud enough for some?

Looks? Nothing could be more personal, so I won't discuss it further.

Weight and power....... Once again, you are making assumptions with prejudices in mind. While the metrics are known, the way the car carries that weight and "lack of power", you will not appreciate until you have driven it. I'm sure you understand the benefits of electric power and SH-AWD. The way I see it, its R35 giant killing performance [but only better] and infinitely better looks!

I appreciate the effort Honda are putting into this car, especially just the fact that they are building it! I appreciate they are building a much cheaper example of true exotica [918/La Ferrari/P1] at less than half the price! They could have gone down the MUCH simpler route of doing an NSX MkI update, but that isn't the Honda way. It's not perfect, has compromises and Honda have got some things wrong [like the inability to pick and choose performance sub-modes] but that is as it is. You obviously were anticipating an extension of the MkI with the MkII, but Honda saw it differently.

So the NSX MkII is not to your liking, fine, and to you it points to too many compromises, and that is all and good to you. But I couldn't care less what you like, I'm hoping the NSX MkII delivers on it's promise, and I await the first comparison test. I may be disappointed, but then again maybe not. I was lucky enough to own an '06 Legend, and in the time I spent in that car I came to appreciate the benefits SH-AWD can deliver to a chassis. I believe that those handling logarithms will make for a surpisingly good package, but not to those that are already convinced it can't be so [as evidence I give you the reviews of Cammisa and Harris - one wanting a modern NSX MkI, the other presenting a non-prejudiced review of a fine motorcar].

But I'm sure I haven't changed your mind, which is cool.

PS. I wonder if the time Harris spent with the real exotics helped him understand the NSX better........

 

[fastaussie]

I totally disagree with the easy route statement you made earlier. The easy way is do what exactly Ferrari did, but for cheaper. Make a lighter V8 (In terms of power level) mid-engine car that is more accessible to Honda buyers. The hard way which is what they took is making an extremely complex car in the guise that it's worth the complications.

I don't think they've lost their way. I think they are rekindling their competitiveness even if some directions are questionable. I think it's just the fact that the car on paper is 800 lbs heavier than the original that many people are griping about ultimately. The steering feeling is subjective as electronic steering or numbing is going the be same argument as DCT vs manual tranny.

However, as many people that are aware of the current scene know, every modern super car or sports car is practically over 3,500-3,600 lbs with less tech in their cars... They don't have 3 extra motors and battery packs like the NSX. Imagine what the GTR is going to weigh when they add hybrid tech to it. I'd be surprised if it was under 4,000 lbs.

Even the 458/488 are generally near 3,500 lbs with all of the fluids as per owner's own weight analysis.

Honda could build a 6,000 lbs. car with a turbo 3-cylinder and a squirrel driving each front wheel and you'd undoubtedly fully endorse it.

This is the argument of life IMP - Balance. Everyone has varied views of what is too much or too little. You seem to embrace a more "Ferrari" or Italian Balance haha.

I can't say for sure until I drive the car myself, as I'm still skeptical more on the current state of battery tech than I am about the numb feelings or exhaust notes. I'm more worried about having it get it serviced in intervals that are not practical unlike the first NSX. However, in say a decade, battery tech will be even better and I would like to imagine one can swap out the e-motors and battery in a modular like instance for much more efficient tech... The software re-programming seems daunting tho.

you are however absolutely right that i do embrace a certain attitude towards the engineering and production of a Supercar. as evidenced by other replies on this forum, i'm also certainly not the only one who believes a Supercar shouldn't be pedestrian. or Accord-like if you will, as several professional journalists have stated lately.

a Supercar should be farking Super! end of story.

raw, unadulterated, striking and breathtaking in design and execution, and uncompromising in the pursuit of being bloody super! it should raise the blood pressure of anyone in its vicinity. that's my take. it just so happens that the Italians are very good at this style of Supercar building. God bless them.

i'm gonna put the Ferrari 458 and (especially) 488 at between 3300 and 3400 lbs. based on what i've seen. and the 488 is now producing almost 100 horsepower more than the new NSX. the Huracan is sitting at a bit above 3400 lbs. and also with more power. the new rear drive Huracan will be lighter still, and is apparently a much funner ride and a good bit cheaper.

while you may not be too concerned about the NSX's completely numb steering and lackluster exhaust note, those are two massive points on a Supercar checklist. and steering feel is not subjective. it's completely and absolutely tangible. it is fantastic, mediocre, or in the case of the new NSX apparently completely numb. the sounds, slighty more subjective, but i've heard a lot of complaints and a few "it's not terrible"s". while these things don't mean much to you, i'm wondering how much they mean to others. 800 cars aren't being sold to Prime members. they need to be sold to people who will also be checking out V10 Audi's and screaming Ferrari's.

How can you surmise, let alone claim, anything about the NSX's performance, when by your own admission there have been no test results published? An open mind until the facts are known is always a good position to take - unless your prejudices have already convinced you of the NSX's inadequacies?

Steering feel is important, and I hope they can do something about it, but as has been discussed, with that much torque being sent to the front wheels, feel may be a compromise too far. You find that unacceptable, whereas I find it an acceptable compromise [having spent many a year with a very WOODEN feel in my '06 Legend].

Engine noise is another item of personal importance. Many on these forums are happy with the sound of their Mk I NSX's, whereas I like mine with a Taitec GTLW system. Is the NSX MkI a lesser vehicle because it's not loud enough for some?

Looks? Nothing could be more personal, so I won't discuss it further.

Weight and power....... Once again, you are making assumptions with prejudices in mind. While the metrics are known, the way the car carries that weight and "lack of power", you will not appreciate until you have driven it. I'm sure you understand the benefits of electric power and SH-AWD. The way I see it, its R35 giant killing performance [but only better] and infinitely better looks!

I appreciate the effort Honda are putting into this car, especially just the fact that they are building it! I appreciate they are building a much cheaper example of true exotica [918/La Ferrari/P1] at less than half the price! They could have gone down the MUCH simpler route of doing an NSX MkI update, but that isn't the Honda way. It's not perfect, has compromises and Honda have got some things wrong [like the inability to pick and choose performance sub-modes] but that is as it is. You obviously were anticipating an extension of the MkI with the MkII, but Honda saw it differently.

So the NSX MkII is not to your liking, fine, and to you it points to too many compromises, and that is all and good to you. But I couldn't care less what you like, I'm hoping the NSX MkII delivers on it's promise, and I await the first comparison test. I may be disappointed, but then again maybe not. I was lucky enough to own an '06 Legend, and in the time I spent in that car I came to appreciate the benefits SH-AWD can deliver to a chassis. I believe that those handling logarithms will make for a surpisingly good package, but not to those that are already convinced it can't be so [as evidence I give you the reviews of Cammisa and Harris - one wanting a modern NSX MkI, the other presenting a non-prejudiced review of a fine motorcar].

But I'm sure I haven't changed your mind, which is cool.

PS. I wonder if the time Harris spent with the real exotics helped him understand the NSX better........

i haven't driven this car yet, you are correct. however, i do personally know several who have. i know them, and they know me. and we've all driven some amazing cars, and certainly everything this car is up against. some of us were part of the NSX Development team, and some of us the R8 Development team. so i do feel i have a decent idea of what this car is about. some of us work for Porsche and Ferrari too. i've been fortunate to drive every single one of the cars the new NSX is competing against. i've driven them quite extensively, and quite hard. some times cruised through Napa wine country, and other times flogged the shit out of them around the race tracks of the world. so it's not prejudices, it's first hand knowledge.

you spoke of compromised steering feel in a 2006 Acura Legend. i don't feel that's a legit comparison here.

engine noise can be subjective, looks also. no arguing with that. but i think the general consensus is that both could be better.

on to the GTR, which i have also driven quite a bit. and, i am really not a fan of. quick street car, electronic wonder. as several people stated in this thread, "fast car, no soul". and when wrestling that thing around the track, you feel every single one of those 4,000 pounds. there is no hiding the weight. i hear Acura did a good job of hiding it with the new NSX. but weight is still weight, it takes a lot of torque to move it, especially at slower speeds. which is why i surmise the new NSX has a 9 speed gearbox. i'll bet the lower gears are super short.

you won't be changing my mind, no. and it doesn't matter. you and everyone else who wants to will buy the car. i've seen Harris' review, and i've seen all the others. i've yet to see Chris jumping up and down about the NSX like he occasionally does in other cars. and many of the other reviews were rather hom hum or lukewarm.

honestly, i believe it'll be a very nice car, i have no doubts. i don't find it gorgeous to look at, or incredibly inspiring the way i found the first model, but it's much prettier than the new R8 or a plain Jane 911. it definitely won't be slow, nothing with over 500 horsepower is. i'll even enjoy driving it quite much one of these days, it'll certainly be heaps better than my NSX.

like many others, i just feel Honda could have done a wee bit better. similar to F1, i expected big things, and was bitterly disappointed...

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p.s. let me reiterate that last statement. moderately disappointed in the new NSX, completely disappointed in the F1 embarrassment...

 

[sadlerau]

I was right on one score at least - I didn't change your mind. ��

I still believe SH-AWD will endow the NSX MkII with track speed conventional cars won't match, especially in the hands of less experienced drivers, but it remains to be seen how involving it will be as a daily driver. I expect the better chassis will make it vastly better than the R35?

F1, the less said about 2015 the better! Here's to 2016!

 

[liftcontrol]

It is only when you really like or even love a car that you want and hope its second coming to be even better if not at least as exceptional as the first.
At the time the 1st Gen came out, there was much less competent competition and the superb NSX taught established exotic car builders a lesson or two.

Two things happened in the decades since.

1. The competition got way better because unlike HONDA they had not abandoned their baby....HONDA realized it.....and in order to knock the ball out of the park, once again....in desperation...

2. HONDA decided to change the formula that made the NSX so loved....they joined the competition in order to beat them...adding complexity, adding weight, forgetting about steering feel, compromising exhaust note....going after achieving numbers that look good on paper....they forgot the 1st Gen had a soul and a connection with the driver that made it a winner;

Unfortunately HONDA forgot one critical fact.

The "average" sports car these days, the M3, M4, C63, etc. etc. are incredibly capable and perfectly good DAILY DRIVERS as well. The NSX claim to fame of being a daily drivable
super car that is easy to drive day in and day out, is quiet around the neighborhood etc. etc. is no longer a rare thing. A 488, R10, 911GT3/Turbo etc are all perfectly good daily drivers too.

The NSX needed to be a standout in attitude in addition to posting good numbers on paper.

Look, HONDA makes enough people haulers with excellent reliability, daily livability and fuel economy for the 99% of the people who need to get from point A to point B.
That is what HONDA is known for.

They NEED a car that stands apart from this HONDA formula of being the civil servant for the masses. The Ferraris and Mclarens and Porsches already have that attitude because that is essentially all they build...cars to stir the soul. HONDA has to have a car that does the same....a no compromise fighter that screams and growls with anger when awakened, that threatens to spill your ass off the road if you do not know how to handle it's crazy power, that makes one drool over its sexy haunches.....that is what HONDA needs for the second coming of the greatest sports car to come from Japan.

HONDA needs to make a sports car, exotic or whatever you call it .... for the 1% who would LOVE to buy it and use it and the 99% who would drool over it.

 

[N Spec]

Honda could build a 6,000 lbs. car with a turbo 3-cylinder and a squirrel driving each front wheel and you'd undoubtedly fully endorse it.

wever absolutely right that i do embrace a certain attitude towards the engineering and production of a Supercar. as evidenced by other replies on this forum, i'm also certainly not the only one who believes a Supercar shouldn't be pedestrian. or Accord-like if you will, as several professional journalists have stated lately.

a Supercar should be farking Super! end of story.

raw, unadulterated, striking and breathtaking in design and execution, and uncompromising in the pursuit of being bloody super! it should raise the blood pressure of anyone in its vicinity. that's my take. it just so happens that the Italians are very good at this style of Supercar building. God bless them.

i'm gonna put the Ferrari 458 and (especially) 488 at between 3300 and 3400 lbs. based on what i've seen. and the 488 is now producing almost 100 horsepower more than the new NSX. the Huracan is sitting at a bit above 3400 lbs. and also with more power. the new rear drive Huracan will be lighter still, and is apparently a much funner ride and a good bit cheaper.

while you may not be too concerned about the NSX's completely numb steering and lackluster exhaust note, those are two massive points on a Supercar checklist. and steering feel is not subjective. it's completely and absolutely tangible. it is fantastic, mediocre, or in the case of the new NSX apparently completely numb. the sounds, slighty more subjective, but i've heard a lot of complaints and a few "it's not terrible"s". while these things don't mean much to you, i'm wondering how much they mean to others. 800 cars aren't being sold to Prime members. they need to be sold to people who will also be checking out V10 Audi's and screaming Ferrari's.

That exaggeration of weight, cylinders and endorsement can't be taken seriously.

I never said I was completely satisfied with the weight or sound of the car. If Honda made a RWD version sans hybrid tech, I'd probably be more inclined to get that model depending on how they handle it - mostly because anticipation of simplicity and costs saving.

I haven't driven it yet so I don't know of the steering feeling at all. I'd rather not get an exaggeration of numbness from reviewers and experience it myself. BTW, not all reviewers mentioned the numb steering. The new NSX won't be the first "numb" or worst steering feeling car - that's for sure. The 918 was in the same boat and many new hybrid tech cars will have the same issue to address.

What I am saying is the first gen NSX doesn't quite match Ferrari's V8 or the V10 supercar sound and certainly not performance, but it's still garnered great praise over the years. IMO this new turbo V6 sounds better than the first gen and certainly will go faster and handle better while yielding much more performance levels. The actual driving sensation is yet to be determined.

So already on paper and from what I've seen, the 2nd gen traded in some elegance and weight for more power and complexity. Those tradeoffs for a much higher level of performance and efficiency is going to be interesting to see IMO. Everyone wants a faster and better looking Ferrari for a cheaper price, but the cycle of "faster" is going to keep getting leapfrogged or spiral out of control so I'd be interested to see other attributes being maximized too.

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I can appreciate the challenge of passion from you and liftcontrol for the purist's "supercar" but I think ultimately, the horsepower or performance is what makes a car a "super car." Admittedly by the masses, it looks better than the Corvette, R8, or 911. It's mostlikely the nicer of those cars. The new NSX is certainly not underpowered or slow, so Let's see if the new NSX performs better in comparisons with it's peers than how Honda is doing in F1 recently...

 

[fastaussie]

It is only when you really like or even love a car that you want and hope its second coming to be even better if not at least as exceptional as the first.
At the time the 1st Gen came out, there was much less competent competition and the superb NSX taught established exotic car builders a lesson or two.

Two things happened in the decades since.

1. The competition got way better because unlike HONDA they had not abandoned their baby....HONDA realized it.....and in order to knock the ball out of the park, once again....in desperation...

2. HONDA decided to change the formula that made the NSX so loved....they joined the competition in order to beat them...adding complexity, adding weight, forgetting about steering feel, compromising exhaust note....going after achieving numbers that look good on paper....they forgot the 1st Gen had a soul and a connection with the driver that made it a winner;

Unfortunately HONDA forgot one critical fact.

The "average" sports car these days, the M3, M4, C63, etc. etc. are incredibly capable and perfectly good DAILY DRIVERS as well. The NSX claim to fame of being a daily drivable
super car that is easy to drive day in and day out, is quiet around the neighborhood etc. etc. is no longer a rare thing. A 488, R10, 911GT3/Turbo etc are all perfectly good daily drivers too.

The NSX needed to be a standout in attitude in addition to posting good numbers on paper.

Look, HONDA makes enough people haulers with excellent reliability, daily livability and fuel economy for the 99% of the people who need to get from point A to point B.
That is what HONDA is known for.

They NEED a car that stands apart from this HONDA formula of being the civil servant for the masses. The Ferraris and Mclarens and Porsches already have that attitude because that is essentially all they build...cars to stir the soul. HONDA has to have a car that does the same....a no compromise fighter that screams and growls with anger when awakened, that threatens to spill your ass off the road if you do not know how to handle it's crazy power, that makes one drool over its sexy haunches.....that is what HONDA needs for the second coming of the greatest sports car to come from Japan.

HONDA needs to make a sports car, exotic or whatever you call it .... for the 1% who would LOVE to buy it and use it and the 99% who would drool over it.

That exaggeration of weight, cylinders and endorsement can't be taken seriously.

I never said I was completely satisfied with the weight or sound of the car. If Honda made a RWD version sans hybrid tech, I'd probably be more inclined to get that model depending on how they handle it - mostly because anticipation of simplicity and costs saving.

I haven't driven it yet so I don't know of the steering feeling at all. I'd rather not get an exaggeration of numbness from reviewers and experience it myself. BTW, not all reviewers mentioned the numb steering. The new NSX won't be the first "numb" or worst steering feeling car - that's for sure. The 918 was in the same boat and many new hybrid tech cars will have the same issue to address.

What I am saying is the first gen NSX doesn't quite match Ferrari's V8 or the V10 supercar sound and certainly not performance, but it's still garnered great praise over the years. IMO this new turbo V6 sounds better than the first gen and certainly will go faster and handle better while yielding much more performance levels. The actual driving sensation is yet to be determined.

So already on paper and from what I've seen, the 2nd gen traded in some elegance and weight for more power and complexity. Those tradeoffs for a much higher level of performance and efficiency is going to be interesting to see IMO. Everyone wants a faster and better looking Ferrari for a cheaper price, but the cycle of "faster" is going to keep getting leapfrogged or spiral out of control so I'd be interested to see other attributes being maximized too.

- - - Updated - - -

I can appreciate the challenge of passion from you and liftcontrol for the purist's "supercar" but I think ultimately, the horsepower or performance is what makes a car a "super car." Admittedly by the masses, it looks better than the Corvette, R8, or 911. It's mostlikely the nicer of those cars. The new NSX is certainly not underpowered or slow, so Let's see if the new NSX performs better in comparisons with it's peers than how Honda is doing in F1 recently...

i'm virtually 100% with liftcontrol on everything he said. a Supercar IS passion, and it should exude it in every way.

like he said, "HONDA makes enough people haulers with excellent reliability, daily livability and fuel economy for the 99% of the people who need to get from point A to point B. That is what HONDA is known for.

They NEED a car that stands apart from this HONDA formula of being the civil servant for the masses.

The Ferraris and Mclarens and Porsches already have that attitude because that is essentially all they build...cars to stir the soul. HONDA has to have a car that does the same....a no compromise fighter that screams and growls with anger when awakened, that threatens to spill your ass off the road if you do not know how to handle it's crazy power, that makes one drool over its sexy haunches.....that is what HONDA needs for the second coming of the greatest sports car to come from Japan.

HONDA needs to make a sports car, exotic or whatever you call it .... for the 1% who would LOVE to buy it and use it and the 99% who would drool over it."

i have to agree with him.

as per your comments about reviewers exaggerating the numbness of the steering, etc. i hate to break it to you, but those guys are usually being very nice about faults or shortcomings. the American journo's typically will always find a nice way to put something. the Brits or Aussies on the other hand, will simply rip it apart if deemed to be sub par. think of Top Gear for a prime example.

i'm sure the NSX will be a very nice car, i have no doubts. i just don't see the point of a nice Supercar?

 

[Yinzer]

I drove my first NSX-T on 300+ roadtrips every month to College and back, packed with a 32 inch LCD TV...

Impressive! Was that while still working and in one piece, or in a bag after being thrown out the dorm window senior year after finals?

 

[N Spec]

Impressive! Was that while still working and in one piece, or in a bag after being thrown out the dorm window senior year after finals?

I just disconnected the TV Stand it slides right into the trunk snug. I still have the Sharp TV to this day as a secondary TV.

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I'm sure the NSX will be a very nice car, i have no doubts. i just don't see the point of a nice Supercar?

You have to agree tho that the first NSX was a "nice" supercar of it's time. Plenty of people on here see/saw the to point to the first NSX.

 

[fastaussie]

I just disconnected the TV Stand it slides right into the trunk snug. I still have the Sharp TV to this day as a secondary TV.

300+ roadtrips a month? 10 a day? is that a typo?

You have to agree tho that the first NSX was a "nice" supercar of it's time. Plenty of people on here see/saw the to point to the first NSX.

it was certainly nicer than the typical Supercar of its time, and much more reliable and accessible to drivers of lesser ability. but those attributes mean nothing now, because anyone's grandma can drive an Audi R8 V10, Porsche Turbo, or 488 as easily as their beloved Buick. and most Supercars are as reliable as a bloody Civic for the most part. the old (can we say that now?) NSX had superior balance and poise, and was very light with incredible steering for its day. when i drive a 458 most days it reminds me of the original NSX in the way it turns in and handles, until you go to the throttle or brakes that is! the 458 is of course monumentally better steering and handling, make no mistake, but it does seem like an evolution of the original NSX's handling characteristics. it was the general balance of the car that was probably its greatest achievement.

this new car seems lacking some important things in important categories...

 

[N Spec]

300+ roadtrips a month? 10 a day? is that a typo?



it was certainly nicer than the typical Supercar of its time, and much more reliable and accessible to drivers of lesser ability. but those attributes mean nothing now, because anyone's grandma can drive an Audi R8 V10, Porsche Turbo, or 488 as easily as their beloved Buick. and most Supercars are as reliable as a bloody Civic for the most part. the old (can we say that now?) NSX had superior balance and poise, and was very light with incredible steering for its day. when i drive a 458 most days it reminds me of the original NSX in the way it turns in and handles, until you go to the throttle or brakes that is! the 458 is of course monumentally better steering and handling, make no mistake, but it does seem like an evolution of the original NSX's handling characteristics. it was the general balance of the car that was probably its greatest achievement.

this new car seems lacking some important things in important categories...

300+ mile roadtrips a day to my college back then. So a trip back home would mean 600+ miles total for a weekend on the NSX.

I don't think many of the reviewers had a chance to go all out on the track mode of the car which they all pretty much liked for the lucky ones that experienced it. I think that spectrum of the new NSX will be raw and funner. I enjoy the manual steering feedback of the first NSX as much as the next guy, but I am open minded about electronic steering.

Also, I don't see how they couldn't emulate a force-feedback steering wheel of the road to give a tuned feeling of the front wheels to road. They already did it with the brakes so they could do it for the steering too. It certainly customization also, so different drivers could have different feedback sensitivity in a practical application if steering feeling is very important. Again, comes down to software tuning.

 

[fastaussie]

if the car ever comes out, we'll see how it compares to the rest of the Supercar status quo. i'm looking forward to seeing how all the new girls stack up against one another...

 

[Yinzer]

I just disconnected the TV Stand it slides right into the trunk snug. I still have the Sharp TV to this day as a secondary TV.

Oh, got it! I was thinking more of the earlier LCDs from 15-20 years ago, which I think came out around when CRTs were the norm and the early LCDs were pretty darn hefty.

 

[N Spec]

Oh, got it! I was thinking more of the earlier LCDs from 15-20 years ago, which I think came out around when CRTs were the norm and the early LCDs were pretty darn hefty.

This was back in 2006ish and may have been a 2005 model. So it's pretty heavy and clunky.

 

[JohnWayne]

http://i.imgur.com/yorfPYe.jpg
Frosty

 

[Valkyrie Pilot]

Thought the 7500 redline and turbo charged 6 was a negative until I opened up my Car and Driver and read about the 2017 base 911 Carrera S with the same specs, though the 911 doesn't produce quite as much HP per liter.

anybody know what a fully optioned 911 Carrera S with 4 wheel drive stickers for these days?

 

[GBL1]

After all the bashing, it kinda dawned on me why the car is so hard for many to accept it as the new NSX...there's no missing link...no apparent parentage.

Picture how it would be if Chevy stopped making the Corvette in say, 1996...then brought it back in 2016, skipping two models that existed in between?

The two Corvettes would look as dis-similar as the original NSX and the NSX 2.0.

If NSX had produced at least one in-between model that linked the two, we may be more accepting of the 2.0.

Just my two cents. YMMV....

 

[Hothonda]

Thought the 7500 redline and turbo charged 6 was a negative until I opened up my Car and Driver and read about the 2017 base 911 Carrera S with the same specs, though the 911 doesn't produce quite as much HP per liter.

anybody know what a fully optioned 911 Carrera S with 4 wheel drive stickers for these days?

Heavily loaded around $150K + most usually can get between 5-8% off MSRP on the '17 which helps on TTL.

 

[liftcontrol]

I don't think many of the reviewers had a chance to go all out on the track mode of the car which they all pretty much liked for the lucky ones that experienced it. I think that spectrum of the new NSX will be raw and funner.

The Track mode is likely and reported to be the more fun mode in the 2nd Gen.

The 1st Gen was fun at all times. From the time you started it, crawled along or went 9/10ths...it was fun and gave you all the feedback you needed no matter what the speed or road surface.
If the 2nd Gen gives you somewhat better feedback and handling when going Track mode, 9 or 10/10th, then most of the time it will not be as much fun when just being driven in any of the other modes. Even in the track mode however the steering feel is not any better from those who have driven it.

The 911, 458/488 etc. are tactile machines and give the kind of live feedback at all speeds that the original NSX was famous for.

It makes me so frustrated [even angry with HONDA] that they killed the car while others took the best of it and improved upon it. I can only imagine what the NSX would have been were it developed and improved through the years.

Like fastaussie said, the 458 reminds one of a better and improved 1st Gen NSX...what an NSX could have been.

 

[N Spec]

The Track mode is likely and reported to be the more fun mode in the 2nd Gen.

The 1st Gen was fun at all times. From the time you started it, crawled along or went 9/10ths...it was fun and gave you all the feedback you needed no matter what the speed or road surface.
If the 2nd Gen gives you somewhat better feedback and handling when going Track mode, 9 or 10/10th, then most of the time it will not be as much fun when just being driven in any of the other modes. Even in the track mode however the steering feel is not any better from those who have driven it.

The 911, 458/488 etc. are tactile machines and give the kind of live feedback at all speeds that the original NSX was famous for.

It makes me so frustrated [even angry with HONDA] that they killed the car while others took the best of it and improved upon it. I can only imagine what the NSX would have been were it developed and improved through the years.

Like fastaussie said, the 458 reminds one of a better and improved 1st Gen NSX...what an NSX could have been.

I can't disagree with the alleged 458 to NSX connection.

However, feel is subjective as I've driven 996 and 997 911s, and while the performance were very impressive, I didn't like the feel of it personally. That's just my opinion tho.

Again, Honda should look into emulated road feedback for the new NSX or atleast steering heaviness customization...

- - - Updated - - -

After all the bashing, it kinda dawned on me why the car is so hard for many to accept it as the new NSX...there's no missing link...no apparent parentage.

Picture how it would be if Chevy stopped making the Corvette in say, 1996...then brought it back in 2016, skipping two models that existed in between?

The two Corvettes would look as dis-similar as the original NSX and the NSX 2.0.

If NSX had produced at least one in-between model that linked the two, we may be more accepting of the 2.0.

Just my two cents. YMMV....

I've said this before in an earlier post. People believe the look to be too radical. Well the NSX has been missing for over a decade now. So if there was an evolutionary consistency in those years, most people would be warmer to the result.

 

[Elistan]

Thought the 7500 redline and turbo charged 6 was a negative until I opened up my Car and Driver and read about the 2017 base 911 Carrera S with the same specs, though the 911 doesn't produce quite as much HP per liter.

anybody know what a fully optioned 911 Carrera S with 4 wheel drive stickers for these days?

I was hitting a touch over $150k for a modestly equipped C4S when I was playing with Porsche's configurator a few months ago. Basically GT3 price.