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Which tire? Star Spec, AD08 R, Ecsta LE, or s.Drive?
- Thread starter neuronbob
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[MENTION=3758]nsxtasy[/MENTION] - what is the closest we can get in terms of a Michelin Cup2 comparable in the NSX sizes or even in the 18/19 NSX sizes?
[MENTION=16375]Dhalsim[/MENTION] - don't bring a knife to a gun fight! I like the Federal for what it is but these other tires are in a different league. RSR is pretty decent for autocross though.
[MENTION=16375]Dhalsim[/MENTION] - don't bring a knife to a gun fight! I like the Federal for what it is but these other tires are in a different league. RSR is pretty decent for autocross though.
Bringing R compound track tires into the discussion opens up a lot more variables, and unfortunately, this tends to lead to a lot more answers of the sort, "you could do this, but..." To give an example of this, for street driving, the sizes that will work without rubbing are well-defined and not very numerous. But for the track, rubbing - typically when the steering wheel is at full lock - may not matter, because on the racetrack, you normally don't have the wheel at full lock. That's why some folks use R comps in a 235/40-17 front size, even though they probably wouldn't do so on the street.
I don't know offhand which oversized (i.e. larger-than-stock) sizes people may use on the track; the only size I've heard of is 235/40-17 and 275/40-17, for which the Tire Rack has R comps from BFG and Toyo. Personally, I used R comps in the '91-93 stock sizes of 205/50-15 and 225/50-16, for which many R comps are available, with the added benefit of fitting the set of wheels/tires inside the car. I'm sure people have used other sizes, but I don't know which ones or how well they work.
Hi, my 2 cents.
I killed a set of ad08s in less than 12 months on my X, once they became half worn they became very dangerous and unpredictable in the wet. I chucked them away and got z2's. Awesome tyres as they grip from cold and well priced. Haven't looked back.
Cheers
Gene
I killed a set of ad08s in less than 12 months on my X, once they became half worn they became very dangerous and unpredictable in the wet. I chucked them away and got z2's. Awesome tyres as they grip from cold and well priced. Haven't looked back.
Cheers
Gene
I do! I use them on my s2k and nsx. It gets up to temp quickly and equal grip as rs3's imo before the heat kicks in. I feel like rs3's tolerate heat better. Plus they are cheap!
I'm not up to speed on the specific categorizations these tires are placed in. For example the Cup 2's might be categorized as an DOT approved "R-Comp". R-comp being in quotes but it's certainly R-Comp level grip. I use a set of Maxxis RC-1s for the track but they are also DOT approved and I believe NT-01s are also DOT approved. However, I would not want to use RC-1s or NT-01s on the street normally BUT I would use the Cup 2's as an all year tire here in SoCal.
I'm trying to find a versatile summer/wet tire like the Cup 2s. Seems like the closest I can get are posted in #14 of this thread.
Hoping for folks to chime in and educate us on super versatile tires like the Cup2.
What other tires are out there at are offered as performance tire options for manufacturers? Trofeo? RE-71r?
The current categorization of track tires is muddled, IMHO. For example, the Tire Rack now claims four such categories:
- Racetrack & Autocross Only
- Wet Racetrack & Autocross Only
- Streetable Track & Competition
- Drag Racing Radials
Personally, I would not want to use the tires in any of these four categories on the street if I weren't tracking my car; there are too many downsides (high cost, short treadlife, need for warmup to reach performance potential, poor grip in rain) and the extreme performance tires are just as good on the street while lasting longer and costing less. So they can call them "streetable" if they want, but I would only be using them on the street while driving to and from the track, and not for everyday use. Others may disagree, and of course you're welcome to put whatever you like on your own car.
As for distinctions among them for use on the track, I'm not familiar with all of them. The Hoosier R6/R7 have a reputation as being perhaps the fastest, stickiest track tires you can get, while you'll get longer treadlife but still very good track performance with the RA1, R888, and NT01.
HTH
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It's quite confusing indeed.
It seems i'm back to writing hate mail to Michelin while trying to convince to expand their tire line up on the Cup 2s. I've have a few friends who daily drive their Cup 2s on sportscars in foggy/damp/slippery near freezing (early morning) conditions. This tire is still relatively confidence inspiring. It seems to be quite a versatile set of rubber. I know they will probably suffer in deep puddles but if I had to give, i'd give on that category.
In light of not being to own just one tire (Michelin Cup 2 as my preference) i'm back to having a dedicated track set (Maxxis RC-1 or Nitto NT-01) and a street set (probably Conti DW, Z2, AD08R).
If someone knows of a list of OEM performance optional tires please share it. For example, I know McLaren offers the Cup 2's as an optional performance tire on the 650S. The regular performance tire are the Corsas iirc.
It seems i'm back to writing hate mail to Michelin while trying to convince to expand their tire line up on the Cup 2s. I've have a few friends who daily drive their Cup 2s on sportscars in foggy/damp/slippery near freezing (early morning) conditions. This tire is still relatively confidence inspiring. It seems to be quite a versatile set of rubber. I know they will probably suffer in deep puddles but if I had to give, i'd give on that category.
In light of not being to own just one tire (Michelin Cup 2 as my preference) i'm back to having a dedicated track set (Maxxis RC-1 or Nitto NT-01) and a street set (probably Conti DW, Z2, AD08R).
If someone knows of a list of OEM performance optional tires please share it. For example, I know McLaren offers the Cup 2's as an optional performance tire on the 650S. The regular performance tire are the Corsas iirc.
I have used the Dunlop Direzza ZII Star Spec (still have the fronts on my car actually) and the Yokohama S.Drive. I cannot vouch for the other two tires being considered in the original post.
The Dunlops are indeed are the far better tire and actually the best I have tried on my car so far in terms of grip and performance in enthusiastic driving situations. The big downside is that they are horrifically loud ~ easily the loudest tire I have ever driven on and the only time I have considered tires to be literally intolerable over certain road surfaces (pretty much any interstate in WA, rough sections of interstate in MN, HI, etc).
The Yokohama S.Drive I think are probably the worst tires I have ever had on my car and as recommended by nsxtasy, I would not have an 'ultra-high performance' tire on an NSX ever again. S.drive performance is so-so in most situations but they do badly in damp/wet conditions, especially if temps are below 40 (maybe even 50, honestly). Not a shocker. The main advantage of the S.Drives is that they are fairly long life compared to other tires that come in NSX sizing.
The Dunlops are indeed are the far better tire and actually the best I have tried on my car so far in terms of grip and performance in enthusiastic driving situations. The big downside is that they are horrifically loud ~ easily the loudest tire I have ever driven on and the only time I have considered tires to be literally intolerable over certain road surfaces (pretty much any interstate in WA, rough sections of interstate in MN, HI, etc).
The Yokohama S.Drive I think are probably the worst tires I have ever had on my car and as recommended by nsxtasy, I would not have an 'ultra-high performance' tire on an NSX ever again. S.drive performance is so-so in most situations but they do badly in damp/wet conditions, especially if temps are below 40 (maybe even 50, honestly). Not a shocker. The main advantage of the S.Drives is that they are fairly long life compared to other tires that come in NSX sizing.
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Hi, My $.02... I posted this past spring which tires to get for my 17/17 setup and NSXTASY kindly recommended the Kumho Ecsta LE. I've been running these all summer as road only tires and I think they're great. My car takes Maine mountain curves like its on rails and I'm showing only the slightest wear after 3500 miles.
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The Dunlop Z2 is a great tire on the road and track, in fact my lap times on the dunlops are not far off what I run on my track set up NT01's. They handle the rain really well and I do not find them noisy at all
Thanks for the continued discussion, which I have been tracking. With the reported tendency of NSX to chew up tires, my plan is to cycle through as many of these suggestions as I can during my ownership. As I stated a few posts up, I chose to start with the Pirellis but next time will likely try the AD-08 Rs, then the Star Specs. I must say that the selection in 17/18 OEM size is really slim, and there is a non-zero likelihood that I'll either move to 17/17 size next time, or upsize to 18/19 where there there seem to be a few more choices.
Yes and no. As a general rule, the treadlife of the S.drive is longer than that of "extreme performance" tires like the Star Spec and AD08R, but it's similar to the "maximum performance" tires like the Ecsta LE Sport (which offer better performance than the S.drive).
[MENTION=20915]RYU[/MENTION] - the MPSC2 really isn't an "all weather" tire or any better than the NT01 in wet/damp conditions. Without back to back testing, I would probably pick a full tread NT01 over a MPSC2 in standing water and for use on the street with unknown weather conditions.
IMO I still think a PSS would fit your needs the best until you can get close to the limit of its performance on track and NEED a faster tire.
IMO I still think a PSS would fit your needs the best until you can get close to the limit of its performance on track and NEED a faster tire.
You're spot on [MENTION=16531]stuntman[/MENTION]. Thanks for the advice! It helps quite a bit.
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It's such a shame that the PSS is available only in one size for the NSX. No 17/18 combo possible at all.
What would be the next best [MENTION=16531]stuntman[/MENTION]? I'm guessing I'm back to the Z2 or the AD08R. I know I sound like a broken record. Choosing tires use to be much easier.
For street tires in 17"/18" sizes, the ZII Star Spec and the AD08R will give the best performance. For longer treadlife at the expense of slightly worse performance (still very good, just not quite as good as the Star Spec or AD08R), the Kumho Ecsta LE Sport or the Pirelli PZero Nero GT.
If you want to stick with 17/18 then Z2 or AD08R. I'm impatiently waiting for the FXMD flared fenders to be finished to easily fit a 235/40-18 and 275-295/35-19 PSS under it, or later a 245/35-18 and 305/30-19. In the meantime, the 225/35-18 PSS could fit under stock fenders and sounds like a good option.
Doc/Ken/Billy, thanks for sharing your knowledge and experience gents. Happy Holidays!
I might try the AD08R's just for that extra bit of hwy livability. It was a no brainer when the Z2 was much cheaper. I think this year sometime they raised the price of the Z2 so its not hundreds cheaper than the AD08R's anymore.
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[MENTION=16531]stuntman[/MENTION] please let me know when those fenders are done. I would be really keen on those.
I might try the AD08R's just for that extra bit of hwy livability. It was a no brainer when the Z2 was much cheaper. I think this year sometime they raised the price of the Z2 so its not hundreds cheaper than the AD08R's anymore.
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[MENTION=16531]stuntman[/MENTION] please let me know when those fenders are done. I would be really keen on those.
My saga started after I discovered that I could not procure PSS in my chosen wheel size. I have these on my CTS-V wagon and they are simply amazing for both street and limited track, wet or dry. I would be ecstatic to find them in the size I need for the NSX.
For 18"/19" wheels, try the Sumitomo HTR Z III. It's really an excellent "max performance" tire, and it's very reasonably priced ($112 front, $170-182 rear). Plus the front comes in 215/35-18, so you don't have to worry about issues with rubbing on the fender liners like you do with the 225/35-18 size.
Don't get too hung up with any one brand or model of tire. There are usually alternatives that are just as good.
Don't get too hung up with any one brand or model of tire. There are usually alternatives that are just as good.
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There is another combination that no one has mentionned i.e. the Pirelli P Zero Corsa.
It comes as OEM equipment on the 400 HP Lotus Exige V6 here in Europe.
The sizes are 205/45*17 and 265/35*18.
Allthough the dimension upfront is slightly smaller than OEM for the NSX, I really like the tires.
With my unassisted steering the feel is far more pleasant than the Toyo R888 235/40 I had previously.
Without a back to back test I can't compare the grip level on track but it must be below a real R compound tire.
The good news is that there is also The P Zero Trofeo in the same dimensions that's a true R compound tire.
The Sport Auto magazine in France tested a Lamborghini Huracan with these tires and were amazed to manage their 4 th best ever lap time at the Bugatti Le Mans circuit.
It was faster than the Radical SR3 SL and the Mc Laren 650 S Coupe to name a few.
It comes as OEM equipment on the 400 HP Lotus Exige V6 here in Europe.
The sizes are 205/45*17 and 265/35*18.
Allthough the dimension upfront is slightly smaller than OEM for the NSX, I really like the tires.
With my unassisted steering the feel is far more pleasant than the Toyo R888 235/40 I had previously.
Without a back to back test I can't compare the grip level on track but it must be below a real R compound tire.
The good news is that there is also The P Zero Trofeo in the same dimensions that's a true R compound tire.
The Sport Auto magazine in France tested a Lamborghini Huracan with these tires and were amazed to manage their 4 th best ever lap time at the Bugatti Le Mans circuit.
It was faster than the Radical SR3 SL and the Mc Laren 650 S Coupe to name a few.
A while ago it occurred to me to store the car on these blocks to be nice to the springs [I have KW V3's and the car is low]. The center jack [rail] point on my car is 4" off the ground. These blocks are 5", so I'm just taking a little weight off. I drive year round but mainly on weekends. It makes me sleep better at night knowing that the full weight is not just sitting on tires and springs all the time - thoughts?
