Stock Seat with 5 point harness

I could swear there was a website or post with pictures and DIY on this. Does anyone have this setup?? Can someone post some pics?

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an alternative

Do you already have the harness bar and belts? If not, you might look at the new Simpson Platinum 6 point belts. They work well with a CT bar with no modifications to the stock seat. I'll post some pics if you're interested in that route.

Otherwise, Chris of SOS has the seat modification and floor attachment on his site.


Ted

92 white 0650:
I'd be interested in seeing those pics. Please post when you're able.

TIA

Simpson 6 pt harness

Here's what it looks like open and laid out. The anti-sub straps come thru the slot between the seat cushion and the back and you sit on them. The lap belts come around the sides of the seat. The seat is completely unaltered.

This is connected. Note that the anti-sub straps thread thru the lap belts and the shoulder belt tabs where they enter the cam-lock. Takes a bit longer to get into than the conventional 5 or 6 tab cam-lock. FWIW, these are the newest Simpsons, and about $20 more than standard red, black or blue Simpsons.

With the CT bar, everything can go behind the seat for daily driving with the stock seat belt which is unaltered. Pull the anti-sub belts back thru to where just a little of each end is showing, throw the lap belts behind the seat and either fold the shoulder belts back over the seat or pull them out from the headrest where they just hang behind the seat. All completely out of the way.

Thanks for posting the pics. Do you keep them installed in the car at all times, or do you just install for raceday? I'm curious how long it takes.

edit: I jumped the gun here, your last post answers the question.

Looks like a malfunction of the attachment. I don't do a lot of daily driving around town, just spirited drives up in the hills using the stock belt. So I don't care much how it looks, I just fold the shoulder belt over the back like it shows.

Thanks for the pics. BTW, is the kit you speak of this one? http://solar.innercite.com/comptech/750120.html

The belts that they will send, is it 5 point or 6 point harness belts?

How do those 5th and 6th points (anti-sub belts) work in that setup? You're not wrapping them around your thighs are you??

Which harness bar are you using and how is the harness attached? Do you have a picture?

thank you

Lud said:

How do those 5th and 6th points (anti-sub belts) work in that setup? You're not wrapping them around your thighs are you??

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Lud,

I believe they go from the lower lumber area of his back under his butt in between his legs to the camlock. Very anti-submarine, but I would be afraid they could still cut off blood supply or damage a femoral nerve in a true compaction type wreck where the seat bottom was forced upward.

ncdogdoc said:

Lud,

I believe they go from the lower lumber area of his back under his butt in between his legs to the camlock. Very anti-submarine, but I would be afraid they could still cut off blood supply or damage a femoral nerve in a true compaction type wreck where the seat bottom was forced upward.

Click to expand...

I fly in a jet for a living with an ejection seat. The rocket motor that I'm sitting on can eject me out of it at greater than 50 times the force of gravity. I wear a parachute harness with leg straps very similar to these, and I've never heard about any problems with this type of setup. I'd think that a "compaction" type wreck that forces the seat bottom upward would be very similar to the forces encountered in an ejection.

Just my .02. I'm not sure if we're talking about the same thing or not.

Chuck

The belts that they will send, is it 5 point or 6 point harness belts?

Click to expand...

CT doesn't carry these platinum belts which are newer and slightly stiffer stronger material. They sell the standard 6 point belts in red black or blue that have the anti-sub straps attached to a single cam lock tab. I had to buy these belts from a Simpson supplier. Too bad, I would've have supported CT if they had them.

How do those 5th and 6th points (anti-sub belts) work in that setup? You're not wrapping them around your thighs are you??

Click to expand...

ncdogdoc has it right, they come in to the camlock at the normal angle, between your legs, but you do sit on them. As to risk, I think the main risk is not being able to move your head much in a slow roll over. Without a rollcage the A pillers will collapse. Draw a line from the top of the front tire to the back of the B piller and that part of your head that is above that line is what the upside down car could be resting on. Big debate on the degree of that risk vs. the added protection of a 6 point in the majority of crashes. This subject has been beat up pretty well on old threads. I highly recommend you do a search and weigh the odds.

Which harness bar are you using and how is the harness attached? Do you have a picture?

Click to expand...

It's the CT bar, with the standard mounting points. These are lower hard points for the lap belt and the anti-sub strap. Shoulder belt pic to follow.

Ted

Ted

shoulder belt attachment

92 white 0650,

Thank for your info and time to post the pictures. I like the idea of retaining the stock seat and seat belt. I might go with the same set up.

Thank you,
Taj

I have a 5 point set-up with the stock seat but had the 5th point installed differently. I used the Dali bar and it came with a fire extinguisher mount. The mount supplied by Dali is too light so it was brought to a local iron work shop and fabricated to the same specs as the extinguisher mount.

The fabricated mounts had the bolt for the 5th point installed into them and then attached without any drilling, etc. into the floor.

I can take photos later and post them after I get home to show you how this works. When not on the track, I tuck the anti-sub belt under the floor mats and the other 4 points behind the seat and on the sides. The OEM belts are retained intact and used for street driving.

Bob

Please post your pic RSO34 thanks.

Here are some photos. Let me know if you want any other angles taken.

http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4289885367


Bob

Bob, I am concerned about the way you have that belt mounted. Mounting the 5th point like that defeats the purpose and intended function of the anti-sub belt. I have seen more than a few people do it because they don't want to cut the seat or use aftermarket seats, but it is completely ineffective to mount an anti-sub belt in such a way that it runs forward along the stock seat cushion and then down around the front of the seat. The belt may as well not be there, and in fact if you tighten the belt the way it is supposed to be tightened, it will pull the cam lock away from your body which is dangerous, and it will probably also wear your seat in a hurry.

It definitely is a compromise if you don't want to switch to a Recaro type seat. It has worked very well for me and I have not experienced the anti-sub belt pulling the lock away from my body. Originally, I was going to install only 4 point belts but the concern was that the belts would ride up on me without the 5th point attached. Combining this set-up with the Dali cushion containing the hole cutout for the anti-sub belt works better than just a 4 point system with the understanding that it is not the perfect setup.

I have always tightened the lap belts first and the anti-sub last more as a precaution against the 4 points riding up on me. My other concern is that with the anti-sub belt it could cause more potential harm in a rollover because as a tall driver (6'1") there would be no ability to try to "move" in the event of the roof collapsing in.

The most obvious solution is to avoid any incidents on the track and then this becomes academic. Obviously, there are better ways to install 5 point systems but this compromise was the best solution I could come up with considering I didn't want to rely solely on the OEM belts.

Thanks for your concern, Lud!

Bob

anti-sub belt install

Is there any way to install the anti-sub belt without drilling the floor pan?

Re: anti-sub belt install

ak said:

Is there any way to install the anti-sub belt without drilling the floor pan?

Click to expand...

not that i know of; it's not that big of a hole.

Have been doing some research, and came up with this: http://www.simpsonraceproducts.com/safety/safety.aspx?page=restinfo_seating#popUpright

Click on the left image and it will zoom. Read the details regarding the mounting location of the sub belts.

And this from DaliRacing's website: http://www.daliracing.com/v666-5/info/restraint-info/restinfo.html

and,

http://daliracing.com/v666-5/download/pdf_article/harness-install-and-replacement.pdf

Interestingly Simpson appears to offer two different recommendations based on the diagrams albeit they offer a caveat of variables ....... perhaps the difference is due to the type of seat shown (OEM vs. actual racing seat)?

YMMV.