3mos Later and Not Happy!!!

[olynn77]

Hello! Does anyone know of any phone numbers in North American that I can call for a dispute with a dearlership? I purchased mt CPO NSX 2 1/2 mos ago with 19,518mi. I've put less than 2100 miles on it. Now it needs a new clutch. The service manager said it a wear and tear item that's not covered under warranty. It's going to cost $4600, but they'll reduce it to $4100. I don't think it was throughly inspected during the cert. process. I could be wrong. Wouldn't be the 1st time. I don't think that I should be here so soon for a car that costed $66,000. I have driven the car normally, no racing, or hard driving. Just summer cruising around town and to work. I've had an '89 Accord, a '04 TSX and a'04 6spd TL and haven't had a single problem with any of them. I finally get the Ultimate Honda and less than 3 months a new clutch! I'm not here to bad mouth the dealer or anyone associated with it. I'm just not happy with laying out all of this money! So I like to see what my options are. Maybe I don't have any? So if anyone knows of any numbers I can call, it would help. Maybe this won't get me anywhere, but I'm going to try! This will determine if there will ever be another Honda purchase!

 

[supra2nv]

tough to prove it was not abuse though. regardless, NSX clutches from what I remember dont have long life? can someone chime in on this one?

 

[DocL]

tough to prove it was not abuse though. regardless, NSX clutches from what I remember dont have long life? can someone chime in on this one?

Tough to say. It is difficult to determine how many more miles a clutch has left on it when buying a used car. I bought my NSX with 4,100 miles on the odo and I now have 68,xxx on the original clutch.

 

[s14_tat]

hmmmm, I have 92K miles on what I believe to be the original clutch. rev matching on down shifts and not burning the hell out of it on start ups does wonders.

 

[I Grok NSX]

One of the pitfalls of buying a used car from an unknown previous owner.

 

[scorp965]

If you only purchased the car 3 months ago, and have put under 2k miles on it, it seems like some degree of complaining to either the service manager or Honda NA would be effective, especially if the car is CPO. Perhaps, if they are unwilling to cover this item, you could ask for some kind of goodwill gesture, where you split the costs of the clutch service. 20k miles is very low for a clutch service, so perhaps the unit itself was defective to begin with.

Under 'average' use most nsx clutches seem to last ~60k miles, this is low compared to other cars (I had a BMW with 160k on the OEM clutch), but it is also much higher than 20k miles. It seems like the quote for clutch service is also high, it should be around $3k, AFAIK.

 

[MJK]

$4100 to change your clutch is beyond rape.

FWIW, I know the parts side of this can be:
- $300 for an NSX-R main
- $1125 for an OEM 5 speed clutch
- (optional) $430 for a light flywheel
= $1425-$1830 + Labor
Even if the labor rate is $100/hr, you should be out the door at well under $3k.


Also, for what it is worth I replaced my OE clutch at ~50k and it was not even half worn.

 

[MoogieBoogie]

The clutch is one of the items that should have been checked. Which dealership is this? I realize that it's a wear and tear item, but assuming that they checked the clutch and found it to be ok, is it even possible to burn out the factory clutch in 2100 miles?

If nothing works out, you're close enough to LarryB that you can probably get the clutch done right for much less than the dealer's quote.

-Brian.

 

[olynn77]

Thx MoogieBoogie, but they fixed it already. I'm a first time NSX owner, I figured the dealer would be the right way to go. Plus I've only had the car for 3 mos. I don't know of any mechanics the specialize in NSX's. Maybe I should've asked around here first! I've never had car problems before. I guess that's why we lease. But I had to get an NSX. If they can't do a lot better with the price, I won't recommend them. That's for sure!

 

[olynn77]

If you only purchased the car 3 months ago, and have put under 2k miles on it, it seems like some degree of complaining to either the service manager or Honda NA would be effective, especially if the car is CPO. Perhaps, if they are unwilling to cover this item, you could ask for some kind of goodwill gesture, where you split the costs of the clutch service. 20k miles is very low for a clutch service, so perhaps the unit itself was defective to begin with.

Under 'average' use most nsx clutches seem to last ~60k miles, this is low compared to other cars (I had a BMW with 160k on the OEM clutch), but it is also much higher than 20k miles. It seems like the quote for clutch service is also high, it should be around $3k, AFAIK.

Do you have a number for Honda N.A., I can't seem to find one.

 

[MoogieBoogie]

Ah - so they fixed it already and are waiting for you to pay them the full amount? Has the dealership already gone through the normal channels (contacted Acura / regional/district manager) to try to help you get it covered under warranty or goodwilled?

The local NSX specialist in our area is Larry Bastanza. His name is also his username on the forums - contact him if you need help.

-Brian.

 

[s14_tat]

Do you have a number for Honda N.A., I can't seem to find one.

Your in New Jersey. Look for Larry Bastanza, he is the NSX guru in the north east. He lives upstates not too far from northern new jersey and he frequents this forum a lot. Try looking him up and shoot him a PM.

 

[Acura NsX Pilot]

Even thou you already had it repaired I would have also mentioned Davis Acura who has one of the best Nsx techs in the northeast. They did my clutch for a very reasonable price I remember.

 

[goldNSX]

Having to change the clutch within 3 months of ownership is simply bad luck.

But $4600 is simply rip-off! It even doesn't cost that much with the doubled Europe-prices for parts.

 

[robfenn]

If you haven't already paid i'd do a quick ring around of people listed above and get a quote. If they come out cheaper, show the dealer the quotes. Also work harder on them for a goodwill gesture...

If i'm honest i think covering a couple of thousand miles on the car isn't good for you, so i'd only push for a discount, but haggle hard!

 

[davidf]

I'm assuming the car is out of factory warranty by year model and not mileage right. A factory warranty would cover this in most cases. If you have to shell out of pocket money then I would pm RJP, as he had a complete twin disc OEM clutch for around $1100.00. SOS sells the input shaft to use the twin disc w/6 speeds which I've been told is better than the 6spd single unit.

 

[Paul91]

The good news is that you own a Honda. Meaning, that this is a good company and will try to take care of their customers. Complain, complain, and complain some more. They will eventually cut you a deal or take care of you completely. If you had a BMW, Audi, or Mercedes, I wouldn't even advise you to call and b*tch about it. Since it's Honda/Acura, you have a better chance. GL.

 

[tosugrad]

I have seen and driven several NSXs with bad clutches in the 20k miles range. The last one I owned was replaced at 25k before I bought it.

Who knows how it was driven? Doesnt mean it was driven hard but maybe someone liked to rest their foot on the pedal.

Should ALWAYS include that in your test drive. Get up to about 30mph and put it in 5th or 6th then give it gas. Its an easy test to do and ruled out many a car for me when I bought the first time around.

 

[EIFFEL]

I'm assuming the car is out of factory warranty by year model and not mileage right. A factory warranty would cover this in most cases. If you have to shell out of pocket money then I would pm RJP, as he had a complete twin disc OEM clutch for around $1100.00. SOS sells the input shaft to use the twin disc w/6 speeds which I've been told is better than the 6spd single unit.

The car is CPO, Clutch is never covered due to wear/tear item. Open the case up would void the warranty on the trans. Not recommended on a late model 6 spd. under warranty. Dealership also will not match prices with internet vendors for the most part.

 

[davidf]

Hmm, my 350Z clutch was replaced @25,000 under warranty, but then again maybe the dealer did it before realizing it's not a warranty item. I consider myself lucky then.

 

[nsxman2001]

Sorry to hear this but I've had better luck with cars not under warranty.. Just my.02 cents Good luck and I hope everything works out

 

[Easy_Goin']

Clutch is wear and tare, but if you said you drove it normal when u had it, it was probably abused before you got it. This is kinda hard to diagnose, so unless you took it apart, it's hard to tell when it will give up on you. With such less miles driven by yourself, I would speak to the store manager for a free labour charge. Part should cost you around $3g's. $4000+ is beating you with shit-on-a-stick and expecting you to like it. You most likely bought the most expensive car they had on the lot. Unless they were dumping the vehicle, they should have made enough on you to let this slide. This happened to me after driving 15,000km at reaching 45k kms, and they gave me the clutch+labour at $3g's flat(CDN $4yrs ago). Bitch like hell...they may not like you, but your wife or gf will love you for the money saved!
...BTW...your rear tires may be near it's life's end...LOL...welcome to the world of the NSX!

 

[drew]

I am certain that "pre certified" or "certified used car" or "certified [whatever]" is a meaningless term. It means they looked at it and documented that fact, but makes absolutely no warranty or obligation.

Take a look at this incident:
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81864

**

I recommend changing out ONLY the friction disc ($250) this time around. The cost of the flywheel is $2k alone for this car.

Drew

 

[davidf]

I am certain that "pre certified" or "certified used car" or "certified [whatever]" is a meaningless term. It means they looked at it and documented that fact, but makes absolutely no warranty or obligation.

Take a look at this incident:
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=81864

**

I recommend changing out ONLY the friction disc ($250) this time around. The cost of the flywheel is $2k alone for this car.

Drew

Funny I was just reading that thread 5 min. ago thinking the whole time, holy sh!t.

 

[nsxtasy]

There's a lot of missing and inaccurate information posted in this topic. People are jumping to conclusions without even knowing the full story.

First, what model year NSX is this? People claiming a given cost of a clutch replacement are ignoring the fact that the six-speed clutch of the '97-05 is a lot more expensive than the five-speed clutch of the '91-96. A six-speed clutch replacement typically goes for around $3500 or thereabouts; a five-speed for $2000-2500. If it's a six-speed, $4100 sounds a bit on the high side, but not ridiculously so. And I bet it would cost you significantly less if you have Larry Bastanza replace it. (Bernie at Davis is equally competent, but pricewise you'll find that there's no comparison.)

Second, NSX clutch life varies. Many NSX clutches need replacement at 35-50K miles. Some last longer than that range (in some cases, a lot longer) while others don't even make it to that range. IMHO the biggest variable in clutch lifespan is driver technique; those who conscientiously match revs (and do it well) are likely to have the longest lasting clutches. When you buy a used car, you have no idea how hard the previous owner was on the clutch. The possibility of less-than-gentle care is one of the risks of buying a new car, risks that you take on in exchange for the benefit of a lower purchase price than buying a car brand new. It's something to seriously consider when deciding whether to buy a used car or a new one.

Now, taking this information into account, what would I do in your situation? Frankly, I wouldn't expect the selling dealer to give me anything towards a clutch replacement, except maybe a slight lowering of the price of the service. Given what they're asking, I would check with Larry Bastanza, and if his price is less than theirs - I'm betting it is - I would have Larry replace it.