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Best way to Tune a NA1 NA ??
- Thread starter Roguena1
- Start date
Honestly, if you want a faster car it would be better to just buy a different car.
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Tuning the NA1 NA NSX is difficult and expensive. But it can be done.
Your major limiting factor is the 240cc fuel injector. It maxes out around 290 crank hp. Adding aftermarket headers and exhaust will put you there without any tuning needed. After that, it's $$$.
The hardware formula is well known: camshafts, 36mm intake valves, bigger injectors. Also, if you raise the RPM limit past 8,000, you MUST get a billet oil pump gear. The OEM ECU is tunable with some modification. Honestly, I'd probably just get a Haltech Elite and tune it that way. You can get up to 330-340 crank hp with the stock intake manifold. ITB can get you closer to 360-370 or more depending on cylinder compression and rev limit.
Thanks guys I have headers and few other things. Im asking about actually tuning the ecu. I seen there is a way to do it via oem ECM and of course I know about standalone or even piggy back. I gues im asking about the ecu tuning as i wnt in a rabbit hole trying to understand. I know back in the day we used to burn a rom for the 300zx to make them fast .
Any advice on tuning the stock ecu?? Ive seen you post in the tuning section but that rabbit hole lost me . ALos how do i raise the RPM. LOL . Looks like i need a billet pump now. Time to search some .
The NSX ECU wasn't ever cracked the same way a lot of others were back in the day. If you follow the ECU tuning threads you'll see that they have really made some progress in the last few years, but it's not as simple as just burning a new ROM to get X tune with a bunch of features.
When I went down the same rabbit hole as you I realized that bolt-ons were the best option for a little bump in power but unless you were trying to prove a point about the NA capabilities of the NSX the money you would spend would end up being better used for FI.
For example, looking at the Toda A cams you're looking at $2400 just for the cams before any work and you'll gain 20hp. The B cams are about $2800 but you'll need a full valvetrain, new injectors, and a standalone, and I think they are basically VTEC-killer type cams, truly designed for track use only. The NA cost to gains ratio is really low on this car.
I was beeing a little fatalistic
I am an NA fan , it is hard, honorable ,noble, and more of a mod of concept and ethos..I went comptech IEM back in the day, that got me 298 rwh on a dynojet. that was on a 3.0 L. If you want morrr than there are guys running bored out strokers in the 3.5-3.8 L range, ponyboy comes to mind. If you decide to go NA than you should also add lightness....You can get a 2750 lb coupe , that plus a lighter flywheel and maybe some R gears and a modern coilover and you will be in love..
I am an NA fan , it is hard, honorable ,noble, and more of a mod of concept and ethos..I went comptech IEM back in the day, that got me 298 rwh on a dynojet. that was on a 3.0 L. If you want morrr than there are guys running bored out strokers in the 3.5-3.8 L range, ponyboy comes to mind. If you decide to go NA than you should also add lightness....You can get a 2750 lb coupe , that plus a lighter flywheel and maybe some R gears and a modern coilover and you will be in love..
Tuning the stock ECU is only possible using a EPROM emulator like the Moates Demon II or a piggyback solution like the HKS Fcon V-Pro. Here is my ECU with the Demon.
The emulator allows the tuning software to talk to the ECU. Then, you need to get a copy of Tunerpro RT to tune the car and a wideband O2 sensor. Once you get a tune dialed in, you can burn a chip and remove all of the tuning hardware. You should DM @MotorMouth93 who is the overlord of all things ECU. It's because of him that we have come so far.
As mentioned above, chips don't really do anything for the NSX with bolt-ons. The car was Honda's flagship supercar, so it was already tuned to the max versus a Civic or Integra that had a lot of room for improvements. In order to take advantage of tuning, you need to size up the injectors at a minimum. Even then, you're only looking at about 10-20 extra hp under the curve. The cost threshold for the NSX is high- to get the max benefit, you'll need some expensive engine mods. My car essentially has the IEM package (including Docjohn's cams) and it is very quick. But it cost a lot of money to get there. That's why most people say to add headers and exhaust and call it a day. No chip needed.
I've been there done that on NA farther than most have here - see my build thread. The best mod for NA is a 6spd with a short final
Regan and John are exploring the outer bounds of the NA 3.0 NSX, which is the 1994-95 LM GT2 NSX. That engine produced over 400 hp at 10,000 rpm in qualifying form. Us mere mortals can get close and those awesome guys are trying. 
All of the SOS options will be too large for stable idle on the 3.0 NA- they are designed for FI. All of us with modded NA cars use the OEM Acura RDX injector, which is 410cc. If you don't want to drill out your intake manifold, I recommend a set from RC Engineering in the 300-400cc range. Those injectors fit the NSX intake manifold without modification.
I should have been more specific, the Engine size here is 3.2L NA
Same answer
Just as a data point, I use the old ID1000 and the newer ID1050x on various engine iterations on my own personal setup. I've also used the RDX injectors. While the ID's have worked well even on a relatively stock 3.0L (albeit with ITBs) meaning idle was solid and there's enough pulse width and dead time control to be smooth in all driving conditions, if you're not looking for power adders later, i'd stick with the RDX to save on costs. There's also a reason why ID doesn't sell anything smaller than a ID1050x. They don't need to.
The RDX will max out around 300-350wHP though. I ran the RDX on my CTSC with the stock 3.0 and I was always worried that my duty cycle was near max'd out. It wasn't max'd out but i'd like there to have been more headroom.
The RDX will max out around 300-350wHP though. I ran the RDX on my CTSC with the stock 3.0 and I was always worried that my duty cycle was near max'd out. It wasn't max'd out but i'd like there to have been more headroom.
Would these ones fit without any physical modification ?
www.corsportusa.com
RC Engineering RC Engineering Honda Integra,Civic, NSX-B, D, & C Series Saturated Injectors (440cc) - CorSport
CorSport specailizes in RC Engineering RC Engineering Honda Integra,Civic, NSX-B, D, & C Series Saturated Injectors (440cc) - CorSport. Buy RC Engineering Honda Integra,Civic, NSX-B, D, & C Series Saturated Injectors (440cc) online or call 303-351-1444 to order now.
www.corsportusa.com
Did you mention how you were going to control ANY new injector that isn't stock? Without a way to modify the OEM ECU or without an aftermarket ECU of piggyback you will not be able to use anything outside of stock.Would these ones fit without any physical modification ?
RC Engineering RC Engineering Honda Integra,Civic, NSX-B, D, & C Series Saturated Injectors (440cc) - CorSport
CorSport specailizes in RC Engineering RC Engineering Honda Integra,Civic, NSX-B, D, & C Series Saturated Injectors (440cc) - CorSport. Buy RC Engineering Honda Integra,Civic, NSX-B, D, & C Series Saturated Injectors (440cc) online or call 303-351-1444 to order now.
If you have a way of adjusting dead times, etc you may want to use a modern injector like the RDX or the EV14 based injectors like the ID1050x. The RC Engineering are ancient technology and not worth the effort in my opinion. They're not a bad choice, but i'd rather save the effort and stay stock if i'm running the RC's.
Yeah I plan to go with a standalone ECU (certainly Haltech). Planning to upgrade injectors at the same time. (edit) i'm not going with ITB though, even with Adnan pushing me to do it. My car is too noisy as it is and finding a race track that wont eject me outright is difficult with my current setup...
IMHO the ID1050x is a safe option for most types of builds including keeping it stock. However, you'll pay almost double the cost of the RDX.
I’ve considered Haltech too (If I ever go ITB’s), Who do you plan to use to tune the Haltech ECU for you?
FWIW if I was to do this over again i'd also go Haltech or LinkECU for a budget solution. It really depends what you're trying to accomplish and how many features you need. Sometimes simple is best. If money was no object Motec for me.
That's the big $$ question. I have yet to find someone confident enough to tune my car, and also plug the Haltech ECU in my OBD1.5 unicorn NA2 (I'll certainly need a custom harness and/or spark plug coil adapters). I'll probably concede defeat and go to the Netherlands to have Adnan do it all but that's a huge distance... when I talked to Yamamoto-san (at NSXCE) he told me he could fly in from Japan and tune the car here but I suppose I'd need to find a local roller dyno in addition to his plane ticket and fees, another expensive proposition...
Honestly I thought about Motec too as there are racing shops in France where they use that. But the price hurts.
And goal is to get a NA tune to start with, and make it simple and clean, and keep the cruise control which is absolutely essential for me to keep my driving licence (as some NSXCE members can attest, I seldom look at the speedometer) - which rules out the AEM.
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What about Christian at ATR? He has a really good tuner.
That's maybe an option too if he can tune Haltech but also a very long (and expensive) drive. That's why I was looking in my area (around Geneva / Lyon maybe) but if there's really no one, we'll see... NA tuning doesnt give huge results on the NSX so adding the travel expenses (and maybe transporting the car) on top of the price of the ECU and tuning, the hp/$$ ratio is falling fast !
