Caution to potential buyers

[Mark911]

For anyone looking at buying a used NSX you'd be well advised to check out the parts catalogs shown on this site and look at the prices of some of the typical maintenance items as well as some of the usual suspects associated with high mileage cars. Most will be shocked! I'd say any price you paid for your accord or civic you better triple it at the minimum. In most cases your Acura dealer is the only place to find them, and they could care less how they gouge you. And unless you’re good with a wrench be prepared to pay double the labor as well. That's just the way it is when you buy a car like the NSX. You got to pay to play. Getting into a used NSX at a reasonable price is now quite possible; fixing it is another story. Luckily, it's a very reliable car, but no more so than other Hondas. Look before you leap.

 

[The Kid]

 

[heySkippy]

Ditto.

 

[Diablo360]

For anyone looking at buying a used NSX you'd be well advised to check out the parts catalogs shown on this site and look at the prices of some of the typical maintenance items as well as some of the usual suspects associated with high mileage cars. Most will be shocked! I'd say any price you paid for your accord or civic you better triple it at the minimum. In most cases your Acura dealer is the only place to find them, and they could care less how they gouge you. And unless you’re good with a wrench be prepared to pay double the labor as well. That's just the way it is when you buy a car like the NSX. You got to pay to play. Getting into a used NSX at a reasonable price is now quite possible; fixing it is another story. Luckily, it's a very reliable car, but no more so than other Hondas. Look before you leap.

Wow, are you sure you're talking about an NSX?

1. I don't pay dealer prices for parts. Dali has everything for at least 30-40% cheaper......

2. Labor does not cost twice as much! Last I checked the techs at a Honda dealer still charge $70-$90 per hour, no? A good NSX tech will get the Job done twice as fast as any inexperienced bonehead dealer service tech who reads out of the service manual while he's working on an NSX.

3. You're trying to compare the NSX with a Civic or an Accord? This is a world class sports car that runs with the best of them (ie: 911, Esprit, Viper, etc.....). This is funny and you will probably get flamed bigtime for this...... Of course an NSX is going to cost more to maintain than a regular 4 banger Honda, should that be any surprise?

4. You get what you pay for. If you buy a POS and don't do a PPI and don't do all the preventative maintenance then you are sure experience hell. If you buy a good car then it shouldn't be an issue.


Your post is more appropriate in an F-Car forum don't you think?

 

[djdrock]

For anyone looking at buying a used NSX you'd be well advised to check out the parts catalogs shown on this site and look at the prices of some of the typical maintenance items as well as some of the usual suspects associated with high mileage cars. Most will be shocked! I'd say any price you paid for your accord or civic you better triple it at the minimum. In most cases your Acura dealer is the only place to find them, and they could care less how they gouge you. And unless you’re good with a wrench be prepared to pay double the labor as well. That's just the way it is when you buy a car like the NSX. You got to pay to play. Getting into a used NSX at a reasonable price is now quite possible; fixing it is another story. Luckily, it's a very reliable car, but no more so than other Hondas. Look before you leap.

Thanks for the public service announcement Mr. Goodwrench! :wink: In all seriousness, it has been said on this forum (as a general rule), that the cost to replace a part on the NSX is triple that of the civic. So, yes, it is a valid post in this respect. However, your comment on the Acura dealership "caring less in how they gouge a customer" is ridiculous. In my experience, my Acura dealership has been the best dealership I have ever had service at...this includes my Toyotas and Hondas. They, like most dealerships, if you build a good raport with them, will gladly sell you parts at up to 30-35% off list. Labor, just get to know the mechanics and service advisors...this is for everywhere you go. No way should an Acura dealership be labeled as careless in how they treat customers. Frankly, they should, and in most cases, probably treat customers better vs. your average Honda/Chevy/Ford etc...dealership!

 

[NSXclear]

I'm guessing most dealers and mechanics, dealers for sure, will use some kind of software or book that tells them estimated labor hrs required (when they damn well know that it won't take this long). They usually base their quotes from there. Guess who these est. hours benefit, the consumers or the dealers that are buying the software or books? Wow, that's a hard one to figure out.

How do they come up with these estimated hours anyways; do they ask the 3 laziest mechanics known to man and ask them how long it takes, average the 3 times, and assume it takes an average mechanic the same time! Do those estimated hours include smoke breaks, coffee breaks, bathroom runs. etc.?

Sorry, just had to vent. I'm not trying to bash the honest mechanics out there, I know you are out there. But I've come across some estimate hours that make me laugh. My little sister can do it faster than that, and she's only got one arm and is blind in one eye!!!!!! :biggrin:

 

[Diablo360]

I'm guessing most dealers and mechanics, dealers for sure, will use some kind of software or book that tells them estimated labor hrs required (when they damn well know that it won't take this long). They usually base their quotes from there. Guess who these est. hours benefit, the consumers or the dealers that are buying the software or books? Wow, that's a hard one to figure out.

How do they come up with these estimated hours anyways; do they ask the 3 laziest mechanics known to man and ask them how long it takes, average the 3 times, and assume it takes an average mechanic the same time! Do those estimated hours include smoke breaks, coffee breaks, bathroom runs. etc.?

Sorry, just had to vent. I'm not trying to bash the honest mechanics out there, I know you are out there. But I've come across some estimate hours that make me laugh. My little sister can do it faster than that, and she's only got one arm and is blind in one eye!!!!!! :biggrin:

I hear you on that one. Before I picked up my car I had bought a set of Eibach springs, so I called some dealers down there and up in OC and LA to get quotes on the install, the quotes ranged from 4-8 hours, and that's without the alignment I know Ramon can do it in less than an hour, and when Jerry installed my R suspension I came back in 2.5 hours and he was just finishing up the alignment.....

 

[clr1024]

I think all Mark is saying is that while the NSX is now in the affordable range of a new Honda, if something goes wrong can you afford to fix it at higher than typical honda repair costs? An example, I had my timing belt and water pump, all belts replaced on my integra from an independant mechanic for $250, for the NSX it was over $1000. So just because you can afford to buy the car does not mean you can afford to drive the car. Tires cost 3-4X as much and you will chew through them much much faster. Its basic economics but some people don't get past the purchase price.

 

[mickeylex]

I think all Mark is saying is that while the NSX is now in the affordable range of a new Honda, if something goes wrong can you afford to fix it at higher than typical honda repair costs? An example, I had my timing belt and water pump, all belts replaced on my integra from an independant mechanic for $250, for the NSX it was over $1000. So just because you can afford to buy the car does not mean you can afford to drive the car. Tires cost 3-4X as much and you will chew through them much much faster. Its basic economics but some people don't get past the purchase price.

That's a good clarification.

My Integra and S2000 cost less to maintain, but its expected.

The thread should probably read "Caution to potential NSX buyers coming from a non-exotic car"

 

[theman1990]

GUNN ACURA of San Antonio has TRIED to screw me EVERY single time, most recently by aligning my entire suspension full right, then trying to convice me the control arms were bent and I needed new ones. Last time they told me my O2 sensor bung was stripped, and needed a replacement. I walked back in the shop and WATCHED as they replaced it, with NO problems (the sensor, not the bung).

That said, SOME dealers ARE very unscrupulous!!!!!

 

[djdrock]

GUNN ACURA of San Antonio has TRIED to screw me EVERY single time, most recently by aligning my entire suspension full right, then trying to convice me the control arms were bent and I needed new ones. Last time they told me my O2 sensor bung was stripped, and needed a replacement. I walked back in the shop and WATCHED as they replaced it, with NO problems (the sensor, not the bung).

That said, SOME dealers ARE very unscrupulous!!!!!

Next time, go somewhere else. And, tell as many people as you can about the business practices of a place like this. Sickening what people will do these days.

 

[theman1990]

Yah, I now use Arrowwood Automotive, and I think they are probably the BEST shop I've EVER dealt with. If you are in the SATX area, these guys are as professional as they come.

Back on topic, guys like Arrowood are NSX certified, and about 1/2 the cost of the dealer. Some things ARE pricey, like the timing belt, but that's the nature of a midengine car. Other stuff, like the CV boots are almost the same as a civic etc.

 

[The Kid]

Back on topic, guys like Arrowood are NSX certified, and about 1/2 the cost of the dealer.

Just curious, what does that mean? I hear that alot around here, just curious how one gets "NSX Certified":biggrin:

 

[MoreRPMs]

How do they come up with these estimated hours anyways; do they ask the 3 laziest mechanics known to man and ask them how long it takes, average the 3 times, and assume it takes an average mechanic the same time! Do those estimated hours include smoke breaks, coffee breaks, bathroom runs. etc.?

Sorry, just had to vent. I'm not trying to bash the honest mechanics out there, I know you are out there. But I've come across some estimate hours that make me laugh. My little sister can do it faster than that, and she's only got one arm and is blind in one eye!!!!!! :biggrin:

In capitalism both sides are supposed to gain; one party is not supposed to lose to a massive degree. But, that's exactly what goes on at service departments across the country. (Non-dealership depts. are definitely NOT immune to the same raping.)

You're dead on balls right on the book time vs. actual time. No wonder service managers get paid at least $10,000 a month. Next, comes the service advisors; and oh what experts they are at regurgitating back what their 1-day-a-year course "taught" them. Brake job for an Integra? Yeah, that'll be $240 for a set of pads for one axle and grind down the old rotors (which will no doubt, upon inspection need replacing). This was in the late 90s when labor rates weren't yet at $100/hr so I can only imagine what an NSX's quote would come in at for for what amounts to $10-$25 blank rotors and pads for maybe $30 per axle.

Next in line are the mechanics. I imagine like the advisors that, they too, must be on some sort of commission plan. Thing is, that they are the ones doing ALL the actual work, and are probably on a pay scale of typically mid teens to low 20s per hour. And from what I've heard they have to buy their own tools (which, for complete sets of good ones are incredibly expensive).

At the top of the ladder is the proprietor who, after all is said and done, takes home anywhere from half a million a year profit to over a million smackers just from the service.

 

[The Kid]

In capitalism both sides are supposed to gain; one party is not supposed to lose to a massive degree. But, that's exactly what goes on at service departments across the country. (Non-dealership depts. are definitely NOT immune to the same raping.)

You're dead on balls right on the book time vs. actual time. No wonder service managers get paid at least $10,000 a month. Next, comes the service advisors; and oh what experts they are at regurgitating back what their 1-day-a-year course "taught" them. Brake job for an Integra? Yeah, that'll be $240 for a set of pads for one axle and grind down the old rotors (which will no doubt, upon inspection need replacing). This was in the late 90s when labor rates weren't yet at $100/hr so I can only imagine what an NSX's quote would come in at for for what amounts to $10-$25 blank rotors and pads for maybe $30 per axle.

Next in line are the mechanics. I imagine like the advisors that, they too, must be on some sort of commission plan. Thing is, that they are the ones doing ALL the actual work, and are probably on a pay scale of typically mid teens to low 20s per hour. And from what I've heard they have to buy their own tools (which, for complete sets of good ones are incredibly expensive).

At the top of the ladder is the proprietor who, after all is said and done, takes home anywhere from half a million a year profit to over a million smackers just from the service.

Sounds to me like you have all the answers:wink: Do you own a car dealership or work at one? Or are you like 99% of the rest of america who bases their car dealer knowledge off Kelly Blue Book, or "Car buying for Dummies":biggrin:

 

[Cairo94507]

It's simple, if you can't afford to own and maintain your NSX it is going to look like it. This is the collateral damage of aging cars that eventually drop in price to a point where people who likely could havenever afforded one, can now cash all of their pop cans in, break their piggy bank open and afford a high mileage NSX. Then when someone tells them $2,000 for a clutch job they freak out. I say buy a Civic and don't sweat the repairs on an NSX and you have no worries. The NSX is the cheapest supercar ever to maintain and drive, bar none.

 

[steveny]

Getting into a used NSX at a reasonable price is now quite possible; fixing it is another story.

It's a catch 22. You can't buy a good NSX for cheap, and you can fix a cheap NSX to be a good one for cheap either.

The cheap turns out expensive.

 

[MoreRPMs]

Sounds to me like you have all the answers:wink: Do you own a car dealership or work at one? Or are you like 99% of the rest of america who bases their car dealer knowledge off Kelly Blue Book, or "Car buying for Dummies":biggrin:

Nope, don't work at one. I've briefly seen the financials and would absolutely love to own one!

KBB is biased toward the dealerships, why would I, as a consumer believe their drivel? :wink:

 

[The Kid]

KBB is biased toward the dealerships, why would I, as a consumer believe their drivel? :wink:

Towards the dealer? Ever check their trade in values? I guess miles dont matter?

 

[MoreRPMs]

I don't know about KBB trade-in values; you guys lowball mint trades hoping to pay the same amount as some beat-to-hell, 4 owner, run through an auction (Auction cars are all overvalued anyway due to the hype factor, among other reasons).

Take a look at "what others are paying" in the New Car category for some great amusement.

 

[Synthesis]

Wow, are you sure you're talking about an NSX?

1. I don't pay dealer prices for parts. Dali has everything for at least 30-40% cheaper......

2. Labor does not cost twice as much! Last I checked the techs at a Honda dealer still charge $70-$90 per hour, no? A good NSX tech will get the Job done twice as fast as any inexperienced bonehead dealer service tech who reads out of the service manual while he's working on an NSX.

3. You're trying to compare the NSX with a Civic or an Accord? This is a world class sports car that runs with the best of them (ie: 911, Esprit, Viper, etc.....). This is funny and you will probably get flamed bigtime for this...... Of course an NSX is going to cost more to maintain than a regular 4 banger Honda, should that be any surprise?

4. You get what you pay for. If you buy a POS and don't do a PPI and don't do all the preventative maintenance then you are sure experience hell. If you buy a good car then it shouldn't be an issue.


Your post is more appropriate in an F-Car forum don't you think?

you just got done saying that you can get parts really cheap and that labor would cost the same as a honda dealer, yet you said "of course an nsx is going to cost more to maintain than a regular 4 banger honda"

point being, even with dali's prices.... parts are still exponentially higher for the nsx, even with your "discount" (not saying that they aren't good prices... .but that's relative to the excessive price to begin with).

this being in the "new & prospective owners" section, i dont' think it's the least bit out of place.... fact of the matter is that, even though it's a honda and it's reliable, it's still a 16 year old car (referring to the ones that the original poster was talking about), and you're going to have to replace random stuff - and quite often, ones that cost a ton.

example:
1500-2000 dollars for the belts
450 bucks for a civic
yeah, it's a V6 DOHC, but i dont' think you could ever tell anybody that knew a little bit about cars that figure and not see this (even people who have to take their engine out to replace their plugs)

 

[Synthesis]

as for the quoted hours it takes a tech to do the job... i think they are just playing it safe.... there are a lot of things that can go wrong when you're working on a car - and all i know is that i would absolutely hate having a time limit to ANY work i'm doing on my car (multiply that hatred times 10 when i'm working on a car from the north )

definitely respect the techs that can do the job right in whatever the quoted time is (but... that's coming from somebody who works on their cars like once every 3 mos..... and that IS what they do all day)

 

[Ski_Banker]

Why does this thread even exist?

 

[Synthesis]

i duno, but i can tell you it has even less to do with '05 owners :smile:
wanna switch? :wink:

 

[Revhard191]

There are the wishers and then there are the builders.

What it really comes down too is....You gotta pay to play!

Revhard191