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For the pilots here.....

"Pilot Annette Saunders shouted and pushed hard on her executive jet steering wheel"

steering wheel LOL

Glider was close to Class A airspace but still legal I guess, just one of those things.
 
I assume both planes were flying VFR, which means that both were responsible for watching out for other traffic. While there are rules that govern such situations (e.g. traffic approaching from the right has right of way, just like with cars), it ought to be a whole lot easier for the pilot of an airplane to see slower traffic like a glider than vice versa.

Disclaimer: I have a pilot's license with ratings for both airplanes and gliders.
 
"it ought to be a whole lot easier for the pilot of an airplane to see slower traffic like a glider than vice versa"


ummm yeeah right. easier. no transponder in them gliders therefore no show uppy on tcas or controllers scope (at least not with any viable information). easier hmmmm. big ass jet or tiny little spec. it's not often we cruise around vfr either.

all kidding aside

annette did a fantastic job handling the situation, hands down.
 
My comments...

1. It's a miracle no-one died!

2. Why would the Jet have to land on its belly? ie Gear up?

3. This was uncontrolled airspace... BOTH aircraft were obviously unaware of the aircraft operating in the area. This is a breakdown in radio communication.
The glider had a transponder that would have enabled airport radar to track it, but it was not turned on because Hirao was trying to save battery electricity for his radio, the report said

Either one or both pilots are at fault. Was his radio turned on? Did the jet bother to make any calls to verify aircraft operating in the area? Is it a known glider operating area?

Report gives answers on plane-glider crash
I see no answers given in this journalist STEVE TIMKO's article!

Second point using the term "steering wheel" only goes to prove that he hasn't even quoted the NTSB report correctly. I bet he didn't even read the NTSB report before writing this article... :rolleyes:

Why do journalists keep reinforcing the general opinion I have of them! There was a journalism faculty at my university... The journalism students were really not that bright. In fact they were the dumbest of all students at the university. Even the Art students were smarter!
 
I guess I would not expect to see a glider at 18,000 but I have had a chance to fly a 172SP with the G1000 glass cockpit. It is real easy to not spend much time looking out the window with all the info available with the G1000 System. Not many gliders here is Wisconsin but have had to dodge a few ultra-lights.

Disclaimer: I am student pilot with about 30 hours
 
AU_NSX said:
3. This was uncontrolled airspace... BOTH aircraft were obviously unaware of the aircraft operating in the area. This is a breakdown in radio communication.
I don't understand how you reach that conclusion. Since it's uncontrolled airspace, neither aircraft is required to use radios. But (again, assuming VFR) both aircraft are required to watch out for traffic. And to take actions to avoid other traffic (actions which generally include far more options for an airplane pilot than a glider pilot).
 
The un-powered airplane has the right of way over a powered airplane. Radios only work if they are set to the same frequency and speaking from my limited experience is unlikely unless the 2 aircraft are in the same airport air space.

Also the Glider was at lower limit of IFR air space and I assume the Jet was flying IFR under ATC control. An operating transponder on the glider would have been very helpful in this situation ATC may have had enough info to warn the Jet.

Ken; do gliders have altitude on there transponder signal.
 
A transponder with mode c will display the altitude. This would have given the Hawker a TCAS alert and then a warning with corrective action.... climb, increase vertical rate, etc. This would have probably prevented the collision. I have had several TCAS alerts, one of which was real close. TCAS is not fullproof but it sure does help.

In the real world, see and avoid .... 480kts TAS is 8 miles a minute or 1/8 mil a second!
 
nsxtasy said:
I don't understand how you reach that conclusion. Since it's uncontrolled airspace, neither aircraft is required to use radios. But (again, assuming VFR) both aircraft are required to watch out for traffic. And to take actions to avoid other traffic (actions which generally include far more options for an airplane pilot than a glider pilot).

I have a British CAA Private Pilots Licence.

In my experience, although it is uncontrolled airspace ATC does still provide different types of services in uncontrolled airspace because you are still flying within a Flight Information Region. Flight information ranges from weather related data and pilot reports, to the one of the most important issues called alerting service. If you don't depart within a certain amount of time from your proposed departure time, land roughly when expected to (normally considered at an airport without an ATC or FSS facility) or even report over a certain fix within a given amount of time of the estimate for that fix, ATC will alert authorities with pertinent information and they'll send someone out to look for you.

I experience this when leaving controlled airspace and ATC will advise of the frequency to change to as well as brief description of other aircraft operating in that sector. It is up to me to look out for and identify those aircraft. ATC may have more detailed information for me as well like our distance apart but I should not expect it.

It is also good R/T practice to advise ATC of your heading, altitude, and ETA every 15mins enroute.

When entering an airport without an ATC or FSS facility, then you give a blind radio call advising your position, altitude and what you are doing...

Certain R/T procedures whilst not required, are good airmanship! After all, the idea of a radio is to let the folks both on the ground and in the air know where you are, and what you're doing.

TCAS, radar etc are luxuries I learnt to fly without.
 
THE bottom line is the glider has the right of way "having NO motor" vs's having a motor.

Yes there are things that could have been done to eliminate the chance of this happening in the 1st place.In that case both can be found at fault.:wink:

Nethertheless every "choice"(assuming they both knew every choice available) made by either pilot to NOT exercise(transponder in the glider,not visually scanning through windshield for the jet etc etc.) increases the risks inherent in flight (which is terriblbly unforgiving) when even though remote chances of this happening in the 1st place or ever again exist the factors that made this happen WILL be repeated hundreds if not thousands of times a day based on my experience.:wink:

MY355/MYNSX
 
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