Halfshaft boot damged

[pbl]

Hello, I’m a new member this week and very happy to finally end up buying an NSX (two year search). I received the car last week from out of state with 39,000 miles on it. Once up on a lift I noticed a lot of grimy grease on the inside RR wheel rim and suspension components. After a good cleaning I noticed the problem, very slight tear in the CV hub boot, looks like a projectile might have hit it or it was pinched during assembly, any ideals? One fix, which I would like some expert opinions on, is to inject CV grease in through the tear (not sure on how much, maybe 6 oz or so?) and alcohol clean the tear and apply RTV, than let sit for several days. No noise is coming from the CV joint during rotation however I have never drove the car yet….way to much sand on the roads in my town this time of year and I am not planning on registering it until spring time (if I can hold out). Thanks for any help/advise and I look forward to a long relationship on this board, Peter

 

[OLDMNSX]

My suggestion would be to remove the axel and replace the boot. The CV joint should be just fine to reuse. Clean all of the old grease out of the joint and then install the new boot with clean grease. DO NOT try to disconnect any of the suspension parts from the ball joints. Take the suspension arms loose from the frame with the bolts. Mark the excentric camber adjustment before you take it apart. Measure the distance from the center of the wheel to the top of the fender, or a reference point, with the car sitting on the ground. This is so when you remove the suspension arms and reinstall them you properly set the elastimeric bearings. The manual speaks of this. If you don't have a manual there is one on digits in the FAQ section. Do not follow the part about spliting the ball joints!!!

The nut that holds the axel to the rear hub is going to be real tight. I broke TWO Craftsman breaker bars taking SennaF1's rear axel off. I ended up borrowing a 3/4 in breaker bar and socket to get them off. I think it is a 32mm nut, not 100%sure though. I took a piece of steel bar 3/16 thick and 2 in wide by 36in long and drilled two holes in it to fit over two of the lug bolts and tightened down with two lug nuts. This kept the rear wheel hub from turning while loosening/tightening the axel nut.

Good Luck, let us know how it goes.
Brad

 

[RON98]

great write up brad!

just got somthing to add. make sure you have at least 1 buddy or a good vice when doing the CV joints. to line up the internals is a serious challange and you need to get them just perfect for the internals to slide in to the cv casing.

The axle rebuild kit from Honda comes with a yellow CV join grease and all the clamps and boosts. They are around 30-35$ depending on dealer.

download the nsx manual and follow the steps.

make sure to fill up the tranny.

also to take off the axle, loosen the a arms at the alignment point insteads of the lower ball join.

have fun.

rob

 

[goldNSX]

Curiosity kills the cat! Why is it not recommended to split the ball joint? Or asking further: What is you HAVE TO split them for any reason?

 

[RON98]

hey peter

looks like the cut is very very small.

I would almost recommend a patch.... :biggrin:

try a regular tire patch kit with the rubber cement.... put a little, cut off a piece of the patch rubber and see if that will seal it up!

it would definitly be much better than pulling the axle.

Also there is another fix i ment to tell you about.

there is a quick boot.

its blue and is an open boot. there are 2 version. One is using glue and the other is using small nut and bolts.

I would stay away from the glue version since it is impossable to install.

The nut and bolt is the one you way.

what a quick boot is a cv boot cut in half and it opens up. so instead of taking off the axle, you can cut the old boot off and put the quick boot around the joint and clamp it togeather ... think clam shell.

its a quick fix and works great if you dont want to pull the axle.

i would recommend for dyi since it is much much easier than pulling the axles and trying to align the internals.

Try that tire patch kit first, its un converntional, i just through of it after seeing your picture but its would be awesome fix if it works.

:smile:

Rob

ps welcome to the forum. did they send you the standard flame suit yet? j/k:wink:

 

[pbl]

Thank you all for the great replies; this forum is excellent and well experienced. I’m not to sure what I will do, I do have the time and most of the resources to take it all apart which was my first thought but everything looks so nice and secured I would hate to misalign anything for what I have to gain. Also I did not know I could download the service manual…to bad, I just order one from Helm.
Thanks again and I will let you know what I end up doing.
Peter

 

[matteni]

hey peter
Also there is another fix i ment to tell you about.

there is a quick boot.

its blue and is an open boot. there are 2 version...The nut and bolt is the one you way.

what a quick boot is a cv boot cut in half and it opens up. so instead of taking off the axle, you can cut the old boot off and put the quick boot around the joint and clamp it togeather ... think clam shell.

its a quick fix and works great if you dont want to pull the axle.

Holly Cow Rob! That sounds awesome!!! I did a quick Google search and couldn't find one but might not be looking for the right thing. Any information anyone has on the "quick boot" would be much appreciated!

 

[L8apex32]

Gotta a question about grease coming from somewhere.

I'm high mileage and I know I have cam seals and whatever the other common leaks are from the top of the engine. I can't see where they are coming from for sure, but whatever they are, I know I have them. They'll be fixed, perhaps when I do my timing belt.

In addition, above the right rear CV/axle, you know that little 1/4 circle radius shield above the axle? There is a line of grease shot on it from the bottom. The line of grease lines up with the outer edge of the outer boot. However, there is no grease on the axle or boot and I don't see anyway for grease to get out.

With 145k miles, I have had to replace one rear bearing, but no other maintenance has been done. I track it a lot.

Ideas or suggestions as to what that line of grease could be? I almost wonder if it go there from dripping down from above but I don't see any obvious evidince to lead me to any good conclusions.

 

[OLDMNSX]

Gotta a question about grease coming from somewhere.

There is a line of grease shot on it from the bottom. The line of grease lines up with the outer edge of the outer boot. However, there is no grease on the axle or boot and I don't see anyway for grease to get out.

Are you the original owner? If not, that CV boot may have been changed before and the mechanic didn't clean up the mess. I seem to find a lot of cars that have maintenance done on them that the "mess" isn't cleaned up, just left. I would just clean up the "mess" and watch to see if the grease reappears. If it does look closer for the leak/seep.

Brad

 

[OLDMNSX]

Curiosity kills the cat! Why is it not recommended to split the ball joint? Or asking further: What is you HAVE TO split them for any reason?

Thomas,
In order to remove the axel from the car you have to remove the rear hub to get the axel out. You can't get the axel out of the hub with out removing the hub, not enough room.

With the suspension parts made out of aluminum they are quite soft compaired to steel parts and so are deformed and mared by prying on them to separate the ball joint. Worst yet by beating on them with a hammer to get the job done. The suspension parts are VERY EXPENSIVE to damage, as you well know.

Removing the both "A" arm and rear "Toe" adjustment at the bolt attachments is the best, and really quite easy. Be sure to remove the brake caliper and rotor to save weight in handling the hub and "A" arms. I just hang the caliper on the frame with a piece of safety wire. Don't disconnect the brake line.

I hope that answered your question.
Brad

 

[RON98]

Holly Cow Rob! That sounds awesome!!! I did a quick Google search and couldn't find one but might not be looking for the right thing. Any information anyone has on the "quick boot" would be much appreciated!

you can get the blue ones from autozone.

make sure its the kind that attaches with the little screws and hex bolts! :biggrin:

 

[RON98]

Thank you all for the great replies; this forum is excellent and well experienced. I’m not to sure what I will do, I do have the time and most of the resources to take it all apart which was my first thought but everything looks so nice and secured I would hate to misalign anything for what I have to gain. Also I did not know I could download the service manual…to bad, I just order one from Helm.
Thanks again and I will let you know what I end up doing.
Peter

hey peter when it comes to alignment, white out is your best friend.

take a dab of white out and mark the alignment bolts. when the white out brakes, it leaves a nice edge that you can use to match the alignment back to stock. i did many cars and the alignment has always been spot on.

 

[Larry Bastanza]

Gotta a question about grease coming from somewhere.

I'm high mileage and I know I have cam seals and whatever the other common leaks are from the top of the engine. I can't see where they are coming from for sure, but whatever they are, I know I have them. They'll be fixed, perhaps when I do my timing belt.

In addition, above the right rear CV/axle, you know that little 1/4 circle radius shield above the axle? There is a line of grease shot on it from the bottom. The line of grease lines up with the outer edge of the outer boot. However, there is no grease on the axle or boot and I don't see anyway for grease to get out.

With 145k miles, I have had to replace one rear bearing, but no other maintenance has been done. I track it a lot.

Ideas or suggestions as to what that line of grease could be? I almost wonder if it go there from dripping down from above but I don't see any obvious evidince to lead me to any good conclusions.

This is the classic issue with the inner right side CV. This area is very hot due to the location of the CV Joint. The grease breaks down and gets like melted ice cream. The boot is not designed to hold that consistency and it starts to creep out of the boot. You need to disassembly it, clean/ regrease/ reaplce boot. I typically do both since I have the axle out anyway.

Like Rob said, this is a little bit of a juggling act to get these back together properly. There are two things to be conserned about, the orientation of the inner and outer spiders(180 degrees apart) and getting the entire assembly back together.

HTH,
LarryB

 

[alverman]

I recommend you take your time to inspect both driveshafts while you are into it. I just came in from the garage and found a split roller on the inboard right. (I put it in the wanted adds) Some metal pins from the roller assembly were swimming around in the grease, but otherwise there was no damage (yet). I wasn't aware if it at all and happened to see it while inspecting the driveshaft assembly, since I was renewing the right outboard boot anyway as it had a little tear in it. You can see the split circle at the bottom left, the pins top right.

 

[nsxhk]

Man.... I wish my mechanic is this thorough with my x :frown:


Henry.

 

[Synthesis]

Curiosity kills the cat! Why is it not recommended to split the ball joint? Or asking further: What is you HAVE TO split them for any reason?

it is not recommended to "split" the ball joints, because you might damage them in the process (bent stud, etc.). if this occurs, you cannot replace the ball joint, you have to replace either the control arm, or the knuckle - which are both big bucks.

also, it is possible to accidentally dislocate the ball joint from the control arm or knuckle during removal (steel parts in an aluminum base), which puts you in the same situation.

if you absolutely need to separate the ball joints, USE THE RIGHT TOOL (see service manual), and make sure it is the right size so you don't bend the studs. the way the tool holds the ball joint also prevents it from coming out of the control arm. again, USE THE RIGHT TOOL.

 

[Synthesis]

as for the cv boot.... replace them. sounds like you haven't damaged any parts as of right now, so why risk it? do it right. this is an expensive part.

 

[NSXBill2]

I did all four of mine last year with the help of Larry's NSX Driver DIY. That article shows you all the tricks. Buy a back issue from the NSXCA. It is worth the $5. I think the boot kits are like $23 ea from Tim.

Not splitting the ball joint like the manual shows is in a service bulletin somewhere on here and Larry's article shows how the service bulletin says to do it.

I was surprised to find that my crappy Northern impact wrench took the bolt off (36mm I think), and I borrowed a 250 lb torque wrench from AutoZone to put them back on.

This is not an easy job.

Lot of work, but "closer" to my NSX now.

Bill

 

[matteni]

Hi Bill!

I wrote Larry B and he didn't have his copy of the article he wrote. I tore my house apart and couldn't find it. Can you scan and email me a copy? I would be greatly in your debt!

My NSXCA# is 59 if you want to validate it.

Thanks if you can help me out! / happy holidays!

Nick Matteucci // [email protected]

I did all four of mine last year with the help of Larry's NSX Driver DIY. That article shows you all the tricks. Buy a back issue from the NSXCA. It is worth the $5. I think the boot kits are like $23 ea from Tim.

Not splitting the ball joint like the manual shows is in a service bulletin somewhere on here and Larry's article shows how the service bulletin says to do it.

I was surprised to find that my crappy Northern impact wrench took the bolt off (36mm I think), and I borrowed a 250 lb torque wrench from AutoZone to put them back on.

This is not an easy job.

Lot of work, but "closer" to my NSX now.

Bill

 

[matteni]

you can get the blue ones from autozone.

make sure its the kind that attaches with the little screws and hex bolts! :biggrin:

I was thinking of going this route but I read bad things and got scared. Every time I take a shortcut it comes back to bite me in the a__. I guess I know what they mean when they say "older but wiser"

:redface:

 

[MJK]

Can you scan and email me a copy? I would be greatly in your debt!

Me too, please!

I don't have my number handy, but I was at Xpo this past year. Can't go w/o being a member.

 

[RON98]

do the quick boot if you can get your hands on it.

for my customers, i always rebuild with OEM honda boot kit.

on my own car when i dont mind a little sling of grease here and there, i do quick boot :biggrin:

 

[pbl]

Re: Halfshaft boot damaged

Hi guys, once again thanks for all the reply’s and great advise. I finally decided to go ahead and remove the half shaft and replace the damaged boot since I was taking off all the rotors to do a complete brake service. It was quite easy to remove the shaft following all your instructions along with the manual. As an FYI my new manual does not mention to separate the lower ball joint, it is exactly as you have all explained by taking the alignment bolts off…. maybe a newer revision.
Now that I got the shaft on my bench and will start to mark the locations of all the rollers to spider I have a new question. Looking at the replacement boot straps (excellent replacement kit BTW…all necessary replacement parts come with it for $21) the new straps are different than the originals and the manual instructions are referring to the older strap design. I’m not sure how to apply enough pressure on these clamps and secure them, this will be key to keep them from leaking; it does not look like my friends standard strap compression pliers will work on these. Any suggestions from someone who has done this would be a big help?
Thanks,
Pete

 

[RON98]

Hi pete

if you dont have the strap compresion plyers here is a trick.

you can take normal plyers, cut off all the excess on the tie cable. save about 3 inches.

now take your plyers, grip the strap at the end furthest away from the clasp and start spinning the plyers towards the clasp.

once you get to the clasp the spinning action will give you enough torque to tighten up the strap and then you pull the strap over the clasp and now you can loosen the plyers by unspinning and hit the clasp with a hammer lightly to clamp down on the strap.

happy motoring

Rob:smile:

 

[NSXBill2]

I bought the strap tool and promptly broke a strap with it (as others have, but I'm no Larry). I would use pliers next time (sure hope there isn't a next time). You have to actually use pliers on the small one anyway, if I recall.

I would be willing to sell my strap breaking...um...tightening tool. Its the same one in the service bulletin and Larry's article.

Bill