New NSX Owner & 1st Time to the Track!

[nsx-sf]

Just a quick introduction and hello.

I finally decided to pull the trigger on a high mileage (100k+) bone stock 94 NSX, with the intention of using it on the track.

I'm new both to the NSX and to track events - relatively speaking - I've been to a couple of HPDE so far run by "Hooked on Driving", and decided it's something I want to do a lot more of!

Aside from being a dream car for the longest time, the NSX seems like a great car to learn how to drive fast in - having great handling and just the right amount of horsepower for a beginner. Not to mention, something I can mod as I get better!

I've been reading through the wealth of info here: http://www.nsxprime.com/wiki/Track_Preperation here and here http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/76200-Getting-started-In-Track-events, and it seems like I've made a good choice...

Cheers,
N

 

[DDozier]

Congrats and welcome, you have made a good choice, at least from my point of view. I have owned and tracked three NSX and they are a blast. Get some good street tires something along the lines of a Dunlop DirezzaII or with a treadware rating around 150-200. And resisit the urge to mod the car. It is always more fun to mod the driver with lots of practice and track time. Once you know and understand the car you can make changes to suit your driving style and the speed will come with time. Now adays since you just need a $20 app and an iPhone to track your lap times it is easy to measure progress and work towards new goals. My advice would be not to mod the car other than a good street tire and brake pads untill after your 10th HPDE event. Then ask for help and you will get plenty of advice here on what to change on the car.

Have fun and let us know how it is going. It is helpfull to shoot video and if possible have a buddy at the track follow you on track with a camera you can learn a lot about what the car and driver is doing with a few sessions of video.

Dave

 

[nsxalot]

I feel much safer running with "higher dollar" car clubs. They react better to out of control young high power drivers. And they normal have a school. I like the Porsche clubs track rules. Lance

 

[Nukem]

Peachtree-BMW had a 2 day HPDE that I went to(not in the NSX) at Road Atlanta. Was a lot of fun and made me a better driver on the track and everyday driving. Be suprise how much you thought you knew, and how much you have to learn. Congrats on the purchase and happy motoring

 

[nsx-sf]

Thanks all for the good starting advice and the warm welcome! It came with some relatively decent tires when I bought it; Toyo Proxes T1 Sports on the rear and Bridgestone Potenza RE010s on the front. Hopefully okay for the first couple of track days. I heard Kumho Ecsta XS are okay as well?

My first HPDE coming up on June 6 and 7 at Thunderhill Raceway in Willows - can't wait! I'll be sure to get some video and if it's not too thoroughly embarrassing I'll post some

 

[nsx-sf]

So, I got to track the NSX last weekend at Thunderhill. It was incredibly hot - outside temps 110 degrees, track temps ... insane. A pretty punishing environment for man and machine.

The track day confirmed my suspicions about this car. You can only know this car when you're pushing it on a track ... i.e. ignoring the advice of folks who would advise you to keep it under a tarp and sell it in 10 years. Conclusion: I'm utterly in love.

Even for a novice like myself, it's so easy to place this car where I want it, so much fun correcting in the turn with the throttle, and there's nothing like hearing that VTEC wail when coming through a corner and blasting down a straight. It held up in the heat beautifully, with judicious monitoring of tire pressures.

My only other observation was on brakes. My previous track day experience was in an enormous, heavy, supercharged V8 bruiser with 6 piston Brembos, and those brakes would bite hard and immediately. The stock NSX pads and brakes didn't inspire the same confidence - and as a result I wasn't often pushing more than 5/10s. I never actually experienced any fade, I was just chicken. I'm sure I'll get over it...

The guy who rents out video equipment wasn't there this weekend, but I did get some nice photos (attached, hopefully not microscopic).

 

[docjohn]

great to see another track enthusiast just beginning.Lots to read over the years on prime about hpde.....I'm happy to see you had an instructer in the R seat.Don't be afraid as you do more events to ask for an instructor with midengine car experience esp an nsx owner.Also try to go to an event with other nsx owners,you can learn alot.

 

[junior40er]

congrats on the car and yes, its an amazing car to learn on. It's easy to overspend on the NSX so its good you took her on the track stock and then go from there. example, I found that by going with better pads, racing brake fluid, cooling ducts and removing rotor heat shield really improved braking power and brake fade so I saved myself lots of money by not going BBK. Instead I have used that money to improve other areas of the car.

 

[Honcho]

Thanks all for the good starting advice and the warm welcome! It came with some relatively decent tires when I bought it; Toyo Proxes T1 Sports on the rear and Bridgestone Potenza RE010s on the front. Hopefully okay for the first couple of track days. I heard Kumho Ecsta XS are okay as well?

Those tire are perfectly fine for HPDE and I am sure you had a blast on them. I track my *mostly* stock 91 on Yokohama s.drive tries and love it. Don't let the keyboard kommandos convince you to buy mega $$$ extreme or R-comp race tires. These tires are great and will provide more grip, but that is not something you need right now. Take your time and learn the car on quality street tires like your Toyos. My instructors taught me that the time to upgrade (tires, power, etc.) is when you can drive the car at 10/10 lap after lap and not feel scared or surprised at any point. Believe me- it takes a long time to reach that point so enjoy your car as is and spend your money on instruction and seat time instead.

My only other observation was on brakes. My previous track day experience was in an enormous, heavy, supercharged V8 bruiser with 6 piston Brembos, and those brakes would bite hard and immediately. The stock NSX pads and brakes didn't inspire the same confidence - and as a result I wasn't often pushing more than 5/10s. I never actually experienced any fade, I was just chicken. I'm sure I'll get over it...

The Honda pads are definitely adequate for your first few HPDE's, but if you are looking for something with more initial bite, try the Carbotech XP8 pad. This is my track pad and it provides confidence inspiring braking at speed even on the stock rotors. Definitely not a street option though- they squeal and dust like crazy, but boy do they stop.

 

[nsx-sf]

As promised, have a video from my 3rd time out ... and first time Solo, on the Bypass at Thunderhill.

I'm loving it, but I have a lot to work on. As you can tell, I'm doing quite a bit of coasting when I should be flat out in places, easing off instead of braking hard in the braking zones. Mostly, just chicken and getting to trust my brakes...

 

[shawn110975]

" got milk " I mean " got oil pan baffle "

no baffle, no oil in turns, then rebuild engine

goodluck

 

[nsx-sf]

Although I hate to mess with an otherwise stock car, I would really hate to kill that lovely engine.

1. I'm not really all that fast yet, and track on average once every 3 months or so - is this an "immediate" upgrade? (It seems like the drawbacks are minimal: http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/140254-Drawbacks-to-oil-pan-baffles)

2. Seems like SOS would be a good place to get one? (http://www.scienceofspeed.com/produ...e_products/NSX/scienceofspeed/oil_pan_baffle/)

 

[Stephen@NCAutoUSA]

Although I hate to mess with an otherwise stock car, I would really hate to kill that lovely engine.

1. I'm not really all that fast yet, and track on average once every 3 months or so - is this an "immediate" upgrade? (It seems like the drawbacks are minimal: http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/140254-Drawbacks-to-oil-pan-baffles)

2. Seems like SOS would be a good place to get one? (http://www.scienceofspeed.com/produ...e_products/NSX/scienceofspeed/oil_pan_baffle/)

Oil pan baffle would be good in the future. I would probably do a few other things like headers and exhaust when you eventually do the baffle since you need to drop that stuff anyways and paying for labor twice on that stuff will eat a hole in your pocket.

 

[DDozier]

Although I hate to mess with an otherwise stock car, I would really hate to kill that lovely engine.

1. I'm not really all that fast yet, and track on average once every 3 months or so - is this an "immediate" upgrade? (It seems like the drawbacks are minimal: http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/140254-Drawbacks-to-oil-pan-baffles)

2. Seems like SOS would be a good place to get one? (http://www.scienceofspeed.com/produ...e_products/NSX/scienceofspeed/oil_pan_baffle/)

Like others have said, do the Baffle when you are doing other maintenance or add-ons that will drop the exhaust or manifolds. If you are driving on street tires and are running at less than 9/10ths you will be fine without the baffle, when you start pushing harder and generating high corner loads, ussually these higher loads come with R-Comps, then the baffle becomes a must have. Make sure when you do it you use a new pan gasket. If you are not going to change the manifolds for headers anytime soon, the front bank exhaust can be disconnected from the manifold and lowered down to allow access to the pan without having to remove the front exhaust manifold or front cross brace. Done this way on a lift the oil pan can be removed, cleaned, weld in the baffle, fresh coat of paint and reinstalled with a new gasket in about 3-4 hours depending on the dry time of your paint.

Dave

 

[stuntman]

Porterfield R4S is a good trackable street pad. Congrats on the car!

 

[nsx-sf]

Thanks again everyone for the tips -- still having a blast!

I'm not sure if it's a placebo effect (or if my brake fluid just needed changing) but switching out for Motul RBF 600 racing brake fluid seemed to really improve my pedal feel quite a bit in my last track day. I was able to get into the brakes a lot harder and more confidently throughout.

I'm thinking my next step should be to switch out the tires (Toyo Proxes T1 Sports on the rear and Bridgestone Potenza RE010s on the front) with Kuhmo XS all round, and eventually the KW v3 suspension. A worthwhile investment? My goal is to have the car feel less squirrely and have less body roll on hard cornering, but perhaps I just need to invest more time on the equipment behind the steering wheel...

Along those lines, I have an interesting conundrum - in the club I run with, I'm just good enough in the Beginner's group to be the guy who usually doesn't get a coach. However, that means I think I've plateaued (hope I spelled that right). Any folks familiar with Thill have thoughts on how I can improve on the 2:39 lap time?

 

[Honcho]

My goal is to have the car feel less squirrely and have less body roll on hard cornering, but perhaps I just need to invest more time on the equipment behind the steering wheel...

By "squirrely" I assume you mean oversteer. An oversteering NSX at speed is an unsettling thing. There are a few ways to make the rear of the NSX more planted. Tire pressure is a free option, but it is a pretty small range of adjustment. Probably the cheapest way is to invest in a set of sway bars. By increasing the front bar rate and keeping your stock rear bar, you will induce more understeer into the car. You also will reduce the body roll you complain about. Next, you can invest in a big wing for the rear- this works very well, but looks silly on a street car, in my opinion. Finally, you can invest in a suspension system that is more understeer-biased, like the factory Type-S or NSX-R, or build your own. I run the BC Racing Type BR with a 10/8 F-R spring bias and find the car to be neutral to slight understeer on the track. The KW is also a great system for street and track. Also, you can upgrade your differential to the NSX-R spec. I did this and find the car to be more planted coming off the corner than with the stock differential.

But, you are right in that before you go changing the car, get some more seat time and instruction. Still the best way to spend your dollar at this stage.

 

[stuntman]

The Kumhos will be quite a bit better than your current setup and be less 'squirmy' -due to thinner tread blocks and tread squirm from less performance oriented tires.

I think you're on the right path with tires and suspension.

Street tires give a great audible notification when you start to approach the limit. Your driving was smooth and good for a beginner, but slowly increase your speeds until you start to hear tire noise. You can go through the corners quite a bit faster than you currently are.

You seemed a bit slower in T10 & T11 than your normal pace and T11 is a great place to really push the limits of your car, get the tire noise, and learn how to drive at the limit. It's slow, has a ton of run-off incase you mess up or spin, and you'll probably not even leave the asphalt even if you did spin there. -Great place to work on feeling the limit (T8 -not so much).

 

[nsx-sf]

Thanks again guys - I think I just have to trust the car more and get speeds up to the point where the tires are starting to audibly complain, then once I'm comfortable there, look at the front sway bar to neutralize oversteer so that I can add further speed. I'll definitely be taking a look at Turn 11 in particular next time I'm at Thunderhill!