New transmission fluid breakthrough !!!!!!!!!

[NSXTASY_MD]

Hi all,


I've had been having a reoccuring grind trying to go into 3rd gear when in WOT and at higher rpms. I guess the sychro was beginning to go bad...I had asked if anyone knew of a fluid that would help this problem...(my stock fluid had NEVER been changed in 78K miles!...I purchsed the car @ ~60K). I got suggestions of redline MTL & MT-90 and BG, etc....but I hadn't heard too much about these products really helping the tranny feel like "butter." Just the name. (Just my observations...no pun intended)


I remember one individual on this forum (not to name any names *cough-nsxtasy-cough*) who told me there's no helpful fluid for this problem and I'm looking at a $$$$ repair with no way around it....he had the same issue before in his X.


....in comes the "magical snake oil", a quote from Andy V. who incidentally stated I "deserved" to have sychro problems ...and that magical oil is called GM sychromesh folks


...I can just speak for FACTS here...my third gear synchro was showing the beginning signs of going out...grinding in only the most extreme driving scenerio's. A little notchiness going into fifth too. I very much appreciate whomever it was who forwarded the thread on honda-tech.com for me to follow. It appears these guys swear by this fluid...so I tried it out.


There are two types....the "GM Synchromesh transimission fluid" and "GM synchromesh Friction Modified" ....the first one comes in a cylindrical container the latter one comes in a container which is exactly like a motor oil container....the motor oil container (Friction Modified one) is the really good stuff. Some people just use only the friction modified one. I personally used one bottle of the regular sychromesh and two bottles of the sychromesh friction modified....


Result : Absolutely NO grinding going into 3rd and NO notchiness for fifth ever. I could tell this right away...I was purposely easy on the tranny for a day or two just to let it fully coat and break in (if there's even a break in process to be had) and wala...new transmission. This is NOT psychological, I literally TRIED to make the tranny grind just to see/verify its working. Wide open throttle, drag racing shifts, powershifts, downshifts, redlines shifts of course...everything, like butter! It shifts better than my friends' with a 93' with only 9K original miles on it...and he's the orginal owner and has a perfect example. I know of several honda guys who've had this for years in their trannies with NO additional signs of wear or tear over the factory Honda MTL. I HIGHLY recommend this fluid to anyone who has even the slightest notchiness, grinding, or even a flawless transmission...proven here first folks...the NSX community has a "magic snake oil."


NSXTASY : I don't know if the nature of your transmission problems at the time were truly the same as mine or more severe...but if they were remotely similar I have NO DOUBT in my mind that the GM sychromesh friction modified fluid would have helped you, if not, solved your problem completely. Its been three weeks now and as i said before...shifts better than new.

 

[NetViper]

Where do you buy that stuff? My tranny is a little notchy sometimes. I would like it to be like butta...

 

[nsxtasy]

NSXTASY : I don't know if the nature of your transmission problems at the time were truly the same as mine or more severe...but if they were remotely similar I have NO DOUBT in my mind that the GM sychromesh friction modified fluid would have helped you, if not, solved your problem completely. Its been three weeks now and as i said before...shifts better than new.

Well, there's no doubt that when they opened up my transmission, they found that the teeth on the third gear hub selector (and, to a lesser extent, the synchro) were worn. Could the fluid have helped? No way to know. Glad to hear that it worked for you - replacing the fluid is a lot less expensive than opening up the tranny. Try the cheaper, easier things first, and if they work - great!

 

[fangtl]

GM Synchromesh is also:

AC Delco Synchromesh
Penzoil Synchromesh
Quaker State Synchromesh
Texaco Synchromesh

all are equivalent but marketed under different brands, Synchromesh and Synchromesh Friction Modified are available at any GM dealership (the branded versions are available at your local NAPA, Autozone, CarQuest etc).

There are several length discussions on various DSM and Honda/Acura (search s2ki) boards about this product and the general consensus is that the product will alleviate the grinding symptoms for a set amount of time but WILL NOT magically fix damaged synchros, the grinding will ALWAYS come back. I've personally tried it on a Acura Integra and a Mazda Miata, both showed smoother shifting for about 5-7K miles before the grinding returned.

 

[NetViper]

How many quarts do we need for the NSX?

 

[fangtl]

If I remember correctly, it's around 3 qts, but keep adding fluid until it starts to trickle out of the fill hole.

 

[NSXTASY_MD]

Netviper,

If you're going to use it remember to also use at least one quart of the "friction modified" version...the one that comes in a regular motor oil bottle container. The NSX transmission use exactly 3 quarts total. You can buy the stuff at your local GM dealership...mine carries it at $10 a quart...$30 is A LOT cheaper than a whole new tranny. However you may have to search around or call the dealership in advance...the word is out on this stuff and they are often sold out becuase of a lot of import guys ironically coming in and ran-sacking their supplies, lol.

 

[NetViper]

Netviper,

If you're going to use it remember to also use at least one quart of the "friction modified" version....

Why would I not use 3 quarts of FM?

 

[nsxtasy]

$30 is A LOT cheaper than a whole new tranny.

If you want to take care of this problem for good, you don't need to replace the whole transmission, only the parts that are worn, which are relatively inexpensive. The major expense is to open up the transmission to access them, which takes 8-12 hours for a reasonably experienced NSX tech.

 

[NSXTASY_MD]

Why would I not use 3 quarts of FM?

You can...many have used the full 3 quarts of FM with no unusual signs of wear or tear. But some say, in theory, the "FM" wears internal components **slightly** more than the regular fluid becuase of its "friction modifier." You see, this fluid purposely INCREASES friction (as oppose to being more lubricative as most think) so the sychro's "catch" better + less notchiness. Any talk of the fluid wearing down the internals of the tranny is highly exaggerated however (if there ever were to be that kind of negative talk)...there has NEVER been a cited case of this in ANY tranny (import or domestic) that even full "FM" fluid was in....even after 70+K miles of hard use in cases.


...I did 2 of the "FM" and 1 regular sychromesh personally and it certainly did the trick.

 

[NetViper]

I think I will go 2 and 1 also if that would do the trick. I am getting an oil change shortly and will have that done at the same time.

I have no idea when the last time the transmission fluid was changed. How often is it supposed to be changed?

 

[Forums Nazi]

How often is it supposed to be changed?

You'll find the answer in the FAQ under the Maintenance heading, in the Schedule section.

 

[NetViper]

You'll find the answer in the FAQ under the Maintenance heading, in the Schedule section.

Thanks K.... uh Forums Nazi.....

I am still 7K away from the schedule change, but I am going to try it anyway.

 

[nsxtasy]

I am still 7K away from the schedule change

I thought you've had your car for two years...

 

[NetViper]

I thought you've had your car for two years...

I bought it with 69K, it has 83 now. Small town, low miles.

 

[nsxtasy]

The service recommendation is every 30K miles or 2 years, whichever comes first.

I think the time interval is particularly important for the fluid change services.

 

[NetViper]

The service recommendation is every 30K miles or 2 years, whichever comes first.

I think the time interval is particularly important for the fluid change services.

OK. I'm on it

 

[NetViper]

I just called HONDA to change the transmission fluid and they said they had to do a complete flush and needed something like 11 qt's to do it and it would cost 160 bucks. Is this what I need?

From what I read, all I need to do is drain it and refill it. He was talking about tq converters etc etc...??

 

[NSXTASY_MD]

I just called HONDA to change the transmission fluid and they said they had to do a complete flush and needed something like 11 qt's to do it and it would cost 160 bucks. Is this what I need?

From what I read, all I need to do is drain it and refill it. He was talking about tq converters etc etc...??

WTF?? The moron you spoke to who told you that has no clue what he's talking about. The drain and refill needs ONLY 3 quarts for the manuel tranny's and my local Acura dealership only charged me $45 to do it...as it's only pulling a drain plug and refilling by inserting it in the filler plug. Technically, its an easy DIY, but I was having my whole new aftermarket suspension installed at the same time so I just had that added to the service as well (while the car was already going to be up on a lift and all).

 

[Ponyboy]

Maybe he wanted to do a double flush...something along those lines?

Sounds fishy though.

 

[fangtl]

For those who have notichiness and/or grinding, you mind as well try the product and see if it works for you in the short run, but realize that this product will not prevent synchro wear, nor will it fix a worn out synchro. Sooner or later you'll have to drop the trans and replace the synchro. As for the 11qts and $150 labor charge, that's bogus, you can change the trans fluid while you are doing an oil change. 17mm (for the fill) and a 3/8" rachet (for the drain) if you wanna DIY.

 

[ffffanman]

Canadian prices and part numbers

Canadian Prices here in Edmonton at one GM dealer.
GM synchromesh fluid - #89021808 - $10.56/Litre - Stock
GM Friction Modified - #12377916 - $16.32/Litre - Stock
I guess a guy should replace both fill and drain washers!
I have Redline from the PO thats one year old but want to try this stuff out this week or next. Let you know what I think!
Trev

 

[DanO]

DIY

www.danoland.com/nsxgarage/transoil/index.htm

DanO

 

[rogers]

Thanks, i plan to try this asap. Well when the snow stops.

 

[SCS2k]

I just called HONDA to change the transmission fluid and they said they had to do a complete flush and needed something like 11 qt's to do it and it would cost 160 bucks. Is this what I need?

From what I read, all I need to do is drain it and refill it. He was talking about tq converters etc etc...??

Torque converters? In a manual transmission? Go somewhere else!