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Oil Change - Royal Purple

Red

Legendary Member
Joined
25 August 2005
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Toronto
So, I just changed my oil (well actually Garrick did most of the work, I poured...) with Royal Purple Racing Oil.

Its my first day with it, but I have to say the motor sounds more like kittens than a bag of hammers.

In doing a LOT of research, it seems that Mobile 1 has changed their formulation and, as a result, the new formula is more marketing than quality (I know some race guys that have had SERIOUS issues) - hence my desire to switch.

In looking around, I found a store that is selling RP and will offer it to NSX Club members at a discount - he will also offer other stuff - but I have no idea what to ask for...

I know many of you will be changing oil shortly, and I urge you to not only do it, but if you aren't doing it yourself, do it at one of our Sponsors - but consider supplying the oil yourself and grabbing some Royal Purple.

Please provide feedback as to what you'd like to this thread, and if you'd like RP the Club Exec will look into a group buy to get the price down even more...
 
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CAN YOU PICK UP PONIES JUST BY CHANGING YOUR OIL?

Virtually every synthetic oil manufacturer boasts that its product is the best, that it will give you extra power, increase mileage, last almost forever, etc. Royal Purple synthetic oil claims to be the “performance oil that outperforms.” The company also boasts that their synthetic oil will measurably increase horsepower and torque. In a world filled with exaggerated claims and advertising hype, we decided to put Royal Purple’s claims to the test.

I gave SLP Performance Parts in Toms River, New Jersey, a call, explained what I wanted to do and arranged to get some time reserved on their chassis dynamometer. The plan was simple and straightforward: We’d run a couple of dyno passes on a 1998 Corvette with a fresh fill of Mobil 1®, drain it and fill it with Royal Purple using a new filter and run a couple of dyno passes to see if there was any difference in the hp or torque output. Brian Reese, SLP’s director of engineering, suggested that we do the oil change with the C5 still harnessed on the dyno to virtually eliminate the chance for any variation due to harness tension between tests. With that, the C5 was tethered and the first dyno tests began. A second dyno pass was run to check for consistency of results and the second test result overlaid the first one exactly. The oil temperature was 200° when the tests were run.

The Mobil 1® was drained and the C5 filled with Royal Purple 5W30 with a new K & N filter. Two dyno passes were run after letting the Royal Purple warm up to 200°. Lo and behold, Royal Purple lived up to its claim as you can see from the actual dynamometer printout here. The actual dyno test numbers were as follows:



Oil...............SAE Power (HP)......... SAE Torque (Lb-Ft)
Mobil 1®............344.5........................ 358.0
Royal Purple........348.3........................362.8
Total Gains.............3.8..........................4.8
 
Cool findings! I stopped using Mobil1 when I developed a consumption problem a little while back. Not sure why they changed the formulation but from what I understand now it’s not the same. I've been using BG Hi-L0W30 (0W30) on recommendation from a Mechanic friend and haven't had any consumption problems since. He also noted they had 2 turbo built motors blow up on Mobil1 but never had issues with BG.

From Trev's post... http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=133641
 
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I'd be interested, even though I have a stockpile of oil, it's a consumable that will ALWAYS be used!

Costco is selling Castrol Syntex at $39 for 6L which is approx. $6.50 before taxes per bottle. Not a bad price given my oil analysis between Castrol and Mobil 1 shows Castrol having almost twice the amount of additive (the important one that resists breakdown).

Redline was similar to Castrol (but more expensive)

Of course this is not Castrol Racing oil...

I'd love to so some lab testing on the Royal Purple but the lab isn't taking my orders anymore. I guess they realized that I just don't pre-purchase enough testing for them to return my calls... :frown:
 
In doing a LOT of research, it seems that Mobile 1 has changed their formulation and, as a result, the new formula is more marketing than quality
That's simply not true. I've spoken at length with the engineers from Mobil responsible for their oils. It is true that they occasionally change the formulation - they've done so six times since it was introduced - but they are adamant that they have only done so when technical innovations and discoveries have enabled them to improve their formulation in some way. This is not only because they want to, but also because they are required to only improve the formulation, according to contracts with auto manufacturers who recommend Mobil 1 for certain high-performance vehicles and who use it as the factory fill.
 
That's simply not true. I've spoken at length with the engineers from Mobil responsible for their oils.

I won't argue what the engineers are claiming - and Garrick has a good point (in the other thread) on the fact that if you change it often enough it doesn't really matter THAT much...with the exception that if Royal Purple does give you almost 5 lbs more torque its the cheapest performance upgrade you can make ($4 more a liter x 5 L = $20 for 5 ft/lbs...in a corvette....)

That said, some of my racing buddies who have sworn on Mobile 1 have been finding early break down of the oil as well as wear that they aren't used to seeing - not ONE guy but a few in a discussion where everyone discovered the same issues and shared them - could it be a bad batch? Who knows... (edit: It could also be the summer is hotter this year than last so the oil is working harder)

The Royal Purple Race Oil (vs regular) is always at the top of the tests and I figure I can afford the extra $20 an oil change - is Mobile 1 better? Likely its equal to the regular oil, (race oil is designed for sustained higher temps), but I have to say my engine sounds nice...and its freaken PURPLE!!! How cool is that?
 
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Thanks for the numbers and the proof. I have been using RP since I purchased my car and putting up with the smirks of others..., I can now smirk back :)
 
I have been using Mobile 1 since I got my car. I have only done two oil changes and didnt have any problems so far. I think I will change over to something better cause I thought Mobile 1 was good stuff. I wonder if my mechanic can get his hands on this purple stuff. I dont race my car or anything like that but I would like the best protection of my engine as possible. So I guess my question is just for daily driver type of car is this royal purple needed? Im thinking its probably a good idea either way.
 
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I have always used Mobile 1 on my car from day one, I would be interested in trying the RP Stuff.
If we have enough interest from members a Group Buy for the Winter Package @ Acura of Oakville on Oct 23rd would be ideal place time to make the switch to RP.


Bram
 
So, I just changed my oil (well actually Garrick did most of the work, I poured...) with Royal Purple Racing Oil.

Its my first day with it, but I have to say the motor sounds more like kittens than a bag of hammers.

In doing a LOT of research, it seems that Mobile 1 has changed their formulation and, as a result, the new formula is more marketing than quality (I know some race guys that have had SERIOUS issues) - hence my desire to switch.

In looking around, I found a store that is selling RP and will offer it to NSX Club members at a discount - he will also offer other stuff - but I have no idea what to ask for...

I know many of you will be changing oil shortly, and I urge you to not only do it, but if you aren't doing it yourself, do it at one of our Sponsors - but consider supplying the oil yourself and grabbing some Royal Purple.

Please provide feedback as to what you'd like to this thread, and if you'd like RP the Club Exec will look into a group buy to get the price down even more...


i came from a 350z known for its knotchy transmission
we countered the problem using RP shifting was like "sticking a hot knife through butter"
i'd be very interested in a group buy :)
 
Love my Royal Purple. 5000 miles on mine right now and it is still clear with no noticeable consumption according to the dipstick.

Mobil 1 is my usual fill and it is always DARK around this time.
 
Stu,
I'm not sure what Mobil 1® oil you were using for the test, but I suspect that you're not comparing apples to apples. Not all Mobil 1® oil is formulated the same. There is a reason why some of the Mobil 1® oils cost more than others.

Your typical Mobil 1® 10W30 is good enough for your daily driver and does a good job of cleaning the internal components of the engine. However it will not stand up to punishing demands if you keep your revs constant at 8000 rpm for 10 seconds (ie, flat out along Masport's back straight). The Mobil 1® 10W30 will simply shear and blow out the back of your exhaust - hence oil consumption and improper lubrication of your engine components.

If you look at the back of the Mobil 1® bottles, the ACEA (European Automobile Manufacturers' Association) designation of the 10W30 oil is different than the one found for the 0W40 or the 20W50 grade (and the price of these different grades also reflect the performance of the oil).

I wont get into the definition of what ACEA A3/B3 or ACEA A3/A5/B3/B4/B5 mean, but only SOME of the Mobil 1® oils say Porsche Approved following the ACEA designation. (Likewise, only a couple of Castrol Syntec oils only state Porsche Approved).

I used to run with Mobil 1® 10W30 at the track and would typically consume 1/2 Litre every 30 minutes on the track. Nothing to brag about when your car is burning oil. So, I would quietly top it up with more crappy 10W30 and go out again. I soon found out that I was simply running with the wrong Mobil 1® oil. After switching to another grade of Mobil 1® (that also stated Porsche Approved), my oil consumption went down to ZERO!

I have since retired the NSX from its track duties, but I make sure my other track car gets the proper oil if I expect it to perform well.

I hope you're runnig "Porsche Approved" oil in your Porsche!

Daria :wink:
 
I hope you're runnig "Porsche Approved" oil in your Porsche!

Daria :wink:

Actually, I'm running Walters special oil in my Porsche, he has one with ZDDP in it - which my Porsche was designed to run with.

ZDDP makes the oil "stickier" to flat surfaces, which is good in an engine designed for it...

The problem is that ZDDP clogs cats BADLY so it was phased out of oil, but my Porsche has no cats (or dogs) and when the engine was designed, in the early 80's, ZDDP was a component in most oils, so the car likes it.

Funny thing is that they now sell it as an "Oil Treatment" and say put it in and then take it out after running the motor for an indeterminate period of time....protects them from you trying to get them to buy you new cats....
 
I'm looking at the back of a Jug of Mobil 1 Synthetic 10w-30 and it says the following:


Meets: ILSAC GF-4,GF-3 API SM, SL, CF, ACEA A1/A5, B1/B5 etc etc

Also has the following manufactures cars listed as approved Oil:
GM Corvette, Cadillac CTS,XLR,SRX, STS, MB AMG, Porsche, etc

So I take it this is the approved formula for these cars, therefore meets the higher standard.

Bram
 
I'm looking at the back of a Jug of Mobil 1 Synthetic 10w-30 and it says the following:


Meets: ILSAC GF-4,GF-3 API SM, SL, CF, ACEA A1/A5, B1/B5 etc etc

Also has the following manufactures cars listed as approved Oil:
GM Corvette, Cadillac CTS,XLR,SRX, STS, MB AMG, Porsche, etc

So I take it this is the approved formula for these cars, therefore meets the higher standard.

Bram

Not quite there yet Bram.

ACEA A1/A5 is not "Porsche Approved". It must specifically state "Porsche Approved". The higher designation of ACEA does not necessarily mean it's a better oil. The only Mobil 1 Synthetic oils I have found that state the exact wording "Porsche Approved" are 0W-40 and 5W-50. http://www.mobil.com/usa-english/motoroil/files/mobil_1_product_guide.pdf

Only one Castrol Syntect oil states "Porsche Approved" and that's either their 5W-40 or 20W-50 (can't remember exactly which one - but Canadian Tire sells it).
DK
 
Dario is correct. Not all mobil 1 oil is the same. The mobile one you buy from Canadian tire on sale (10w30) is not same as say 0w40. The 10w30 is good enough if you don't track your car or drive the he'll out of it. What you need to watch is the oil pressure gauge reading at high rpms( 7000-8000). It should be at least at 60-80 psi. This is what is important. A low oil pressure at high rpm will damage the engine.
I recently this year have been trying mobil 1 0w40 (Porsche approved) oil. The same stuff recommended for my Porsche. I noticed a higher psi on my oil pressure gauge. Also on the track my oil pressure is correct and high enough at High rpms.
It's best to look at what is in the oil as opposed to how much it costs. A lot of times your paying for advertising and marketing costs ( eg Castoroil)
 
just for daily driver type of car is this royal purple needed?
No.

I've used synthetic 10W30 oil in my NSX ever since it was new. Mostly your everyday Mobil 1, and occasionally other major brands of 100 percent synthetic (e.g. Pennzoil). I have had zero oil consumption and zero oil-related problems, with 82K total miles including over 13K of actual track miles, virtually all of them at or near redline.
 

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Found on S2Ki ..., Also a dyno test has about 4% error, and this falls within that so it is hard to use this as a fact. Even though I use RP I don't think this proves really anything.

Truth in Advertising: http://www.imakenews.com/lng/e_article001398592.cfm

Truth in Advertising: BP v. Royal Purple
By George Gill

Royal Purple Ltd. was black and blue after BP Lubricants USA took it to task over advertising claims for its synthetic motor oil, finding a receptive audience in the advertising industry’s self-regulatory forum.

The National Advertising Division of the Council of Better Business Bureaus recommended Porter, Texas-based Royal Purple modify or discontinue numerous advertising claims for its synthetic motor oil, following a challenge by Wayne, N.J.-based BP Lubricants. The NAD examined comparative performance and superiority claims in print, broadcast and Internet advertising. In some of the advertising, Royal Purple compared its performance to Castrol, Shell, Amsoil and other motor oil brands.

NAD recommended that Royal Purple discontinue its use of consumer testimonials reporting specific performance attributes in the absence of reliable independent evidence showing performance capability.

“Anecdotal evidence based solely on the experiences of individual consumers is insufficient to support product efficacy claims, including claims related to horsepower, torque, fuel economy or engine heat,” the organization stated. “While the advertiser may quote from published articles if it provides clear and conspicuous attribution to the publisher, it may not rely on such articles to support efficacy claims for which it has no reliable independent validation.”

NAD recommended Royal Purple discontinue claims such as “Increases horsepower and torque by as much as 3 percent,” “Reduces Engine Wear by 80 percent,” “Superior Oxidation Stability” and “Provides Film Strength Up to 400 Percent.”

“If industry-standard tests or tests with carefully documented controls were abandoned, there would be no basis whatsoever for making any meaningful claims about the relative efficacy of motor oils,” BP said in its challenge.

NAD recommended that Royal Purple discontinue claims that stated, “Improves fuel economy by as much as 5 percent” and “Fuel economy improvement up to 5 percent or more” because its Environmental Protection Agency testing was inconclusive and the “Oklahoma State Study” and single cylinder Labeco CLR diesel engine testing cited in Royal Purple’s advertising was not relevant. The NAD noted the 1997 OSU Study was “outdated and nothing in the record demonstrated that the formulations of the competitors’ oils were similar to those available for sale on the market today.”

BP Lubricants said it hired the independent laboratory Southwest Research Institute, in San Antonio, to analyze power output of gasoline engines with Royal Purple Oil and with BP’s Castrol oil for comparisons. “The results were provided to the challenger’s expert statistician who was not informed of the identity of the candidate oils,” NAD stated. “The challenger’s [BP’s] expert determined a 0.9 percent difference in power between the oils, which did not rise to the level of statistical significance, and is well below the 3 percent claim made by the advertiser.”

SwRI did additional tests to independently determine the differences in fuel economy, emissions data and engine temperature between Royal Purple and Castrol motor oils. According to SwRI, “there was no statistically significant difference between the fuel economy, emissions data or engine temperature between the two candidate oils,” NAD said.

Following its review of the non-anecdotal evidence in the record, NAD recommended that Royal Purple discontinue the claims, “Reduces emissions up to 20 percent or more” and “Reductions in emissions of 20 percent or more” because the studies on which the claims were based were outdated and not consumer-relevant.

NAD also recommended the advertiser discontinue its unsupported claim that Royal purple motor oil is “API/ILSAC Certified.” Noting that API and ILSAC licenses and certifications have many categories with different meanings, the NAD recommended that the company discontinue its claim that its synthetic oils are “generally ‘API/ILSAC Certified.’”

In fact, no Royal Purple products are certified to current ILSAC specifications.

The American Petroleum Institute licenses its trademarked Service Symbol, or ‘donut,’ for display on qualified engine oils, and also licenses the ILSAC ‘starburst’ logo for oils that meet the auto industry’s latest energy-conserving standards. In API’s online directory of licensees for its Engine Oil Licensing and Certification Program, Royal Purple has a total of 23 passenger car and diesel engine oil products listed, all licensed to use the API donut. Five of these may additionally display the words ‘energy conserving’ within the donut logo, but none of the Royal Purple products are licensable to the current ILSAC GF-4 specification and they cannot display the starburst logo.

Royal Purple also voluntarily agreed to discontinue the claims, “most advanced,” “unsurpassed performance” and “unparalleled performance,” steps the NAD said were necessary and proper to avoid confusion in the marketplace.

“While Royal Purple also believes that the tests and testimonials it supplied as evidence accurately portray the benefits of using its synthetic oil in a wide variety of applications, it defers to the NAD’s position that those tests and testimonials alone are insufficient to support specific performance attribute claims in consumer advertising,” the company said in its response to NAD. “... [Royal Purple] has already made changes to its advertising in accordance with the NAD recommendations and will continue to implement NAD’s recommendations and analysis in developing Royal Purple’s future advertising.”

BP Lubricants did not return phone calls from Lube Report requesting comment on NAD’s decision.
 
Oh I'm sorry I thought that you had tried this out yourself. This article is straight from the RP people.

No, I grabbed the version from the RP Web site - the Corvette article came from the Vette site and was copied to RP's site.

I didn't dyno my vette, cuz I don't have one!:tongue:
 
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