Possible buy, need advice

[Burny-B]

Hi all, i'm Nico, from Belgium.

Hopefully you guys can give me some good advice.
I went to see an NSX, a '91 red/black 5spd manual, 125K km.
Asking price in the lower 30's EUR.
I'm just an enthousiast, not in any way a mecanic, so any input is appreciated.
These are my findings:




From afar, shining in the sun, the car looked excellent.
However, when i got closer i noticed excessive chipping damage on the front bumper.
There even was a hole the size of my pink.
I also noticed the rear bumper not perfectly aligned with the fender on the drivers side.
TThe rear bumper also had scratches on that side, probably from the source what caused the misalignment.
That same fender had a bubbly spot under the paint on the wheel arch.
It looked exactly as a spot of rust on a normal car. A bit farther to the rear there was another spot.
Both a fingernail in size.
I took the mudguard off to feel the inside of the fender. It felt perfectly smooth, so the problem is under the paint, not from the inside of the fender.
Aside from those problems, all panels/doors ligned up perfectly.


Underside of the car looked ok, aside from a greasy sump.
An oildrip was also forming there.
Engine was sweating a bit from the valve cover seals.
When idling, the engine made a ticking sound.
I'm not sure if it's the valves or something with the VTEC mechanism?
Starting took a second longer than my other Honda's, perhaps it needs a valve adjustment or new sparkplugs.


During the testdrive the car felt great.
Rocksteady under hard acceleration and high speed. Judging by the sound and feel, VTEC kicked in as expected.
However on the way back to the sellers house when nearing redline in 3th the engine check light came on.
So i continued back at a slow speed.
In his manual it was explained it had something to do with airpollution, so i linked it to the green 'cone' airfilter that he had installed. When i turned the ignition off and back on, the warning light was gone.
Tried the ignition on/off several times, it didn't come back.


To be sure i checked for error codes.
I got 3. Engine check gave me code 22 (VTEC pressure witch, not too serious?) TCS gave codes 31 and 34.
http://www.nsxprime.com/wiki/Trouble_Codes
I could only clearly find code 22, as 31 seems to be for an automatic? And 34 is not on the list.
These might be older codes, in the ECU for a long time.


Short:


Pro:


Clutch recently replaced
Timing belt and waterpump recently replaced
A/C recently refilled and works great
Chassis and body are collision free (as far as i can tell, except the rear bumper issue)
Car is stock except for the Remus exhaust. Original airfilter housing is included
Interior is quite good
Electronics all work (like the powerwindows, seat adjustments, except for the well known stereo issue)
No trace of oil in the exhaust tips
Gearbox not in snapring range


Contra:


Error codes
rear fender corrosion
sweaty engine
needs new or repaired front bumper
rear bumper needs fixing
Paintjob (car in general actually) needs lots of TLC

 

[tof]

I don't know how prices tend to run in Europe but if I was shopping and looked at that car in the U.S. I would walk away. It sounds like a high 20s (US Dollars) car to me. Everybody with a dogged out 91 NSX thinks it should sell in the 30s because prices have gone up.

Ticking sounds like out of adjustment valve lash or possibly failed lost motion assemblies. That's ok because it sounds like you would need to replace all the valve cover gaskets and seals anyway.

The bodywork would concern me. I would expect better for low 30 Euros, especially given the mileage. Ditto for the oil leaks. This isn't a Triumph or MG. It's an Acura and should not be dripping oil even at that age. Not sure what the VTEC pressure switch issue might be but I would want it figured out before I took ownership.

One thing I wouldn't worry about is the slightly slower startup compared to other Hondas. Hondas start about the time you think about turning the key! NSXs, especially older ones, may have to turn over a couple of times at least. You can turn on the ignition but not start for a few seconds...giving the fuel pump time to prime the system...and see if that makes a difference.

 

[Burny-B]

Thanks for your reply.

As far as i know, prices in Europe are higher than in the U.S.
Probably because they are rarer here.
The only NSX'es under 30K euro are usually salvaged cars.
And prices here are rising year by year.
I thought about importing one from the U.S., but customs and VAT add another ~35% so the price difference would be virtually none.

The bodywork is also my major concern, but thanks to an NSXCE member i found somebody who's a specialist in bodywork on the NSX.

I thought the sweaty engine would be considered normal, so it's actually good someone pointing out it isn't.
Could it be caused by absue? High revs when the engine is not warmed up yet?

It will be hard to figure out the VTEC pressure switch error. There is no Honda dealer near the seller, and the seller is also not inclined to make an effort.
He's throwing all the salesman tricks at me he can think of. Doesn't help that he's actually a.. salesman.

Glad to hear the starting 'delay' is quite normal.
Besides, it will only get better with new sparkplugs and a valve adjustment.

I'm in no rush to buy this NSX, so i'm glad to hear no reasons why i should be

 

[1991NSX]

LOW 30k's EUR would be around or over $40k USD...

 

[tof]

BTW, not sure what you meant by "sweaty" engine. Moisture? Oil? I assumed you meant some oil leaking from somewhere onto the block.

 

[The King]

It has mudguards?

 

[Burny-B]

LOW 30k's EUR would be around or over $40k USD...

True. If this was in the US, i would probably not even consider this car.

BTW, not sure what you meant by "sweaty" engine. Moisture? Oil? I assumed you meant some oil leaking from somewhere onto the block.

It's an expression we use here, i'm not sure how it translates into english.
What i meant is indeed a little bit of oil leaking from the valvecover seals.
Since there was also an oil drip forming on the sump, i assume the sump seal also needs a replacement.

It has mudguards?

Inside the wheel arches, not behind the wheel like a rallycar

 

[Burny-B]

Today i inspected another NSX for a possible buy. ('91 manual)
The car was in good condition, everything looked and felt good.
Except for 2 things:

5 tot 10 minutes after a spirited drive, i noticed the coolant tank was slowly releasing pressure through the cap.
Just a little stream with a high pitched tone, but i assume it had been releasing that pressure for 5 tot 10 minutes, maybe more.
Is this normal?

Both the radio and climate control were completely dead.
The owner insisted that this was because when he changed the battery, there was a spark.
So he's sure it's just a blown fuse. But the little fuses all checked out ok. Could it be one of the bigger fuses?
Or is there another component/wire that those 2 things have in common, which could cause this problem?

Thanks for reading.

 

[JD Cross]

My experience has been that after 20-22 years the following needs to be done.

1) Repair of the three Bose amps in the sound system and repair of the climate control unit circuit board.
briank here on Prime does those repairs at reasonable cost.
2) conversion of the r12 a/c to r134a and replace the a/c compressor and a/c belt tensioner.
It sounds like you may be needing #1
Was there any noise at all from the radio?
Did you check the a/c to see if it works?

The pressure escaping from the coolant reservoir could be a defective cap or a sign the engine is overheating
What did the temperature gauge show when you were driving?
If the engine is overheating it could be from a low coolant condition caused by a fluid leak, or possibly a failed water pump.
Did you check the coolant level or look under the car for evidence of leaks?
If a water pump is suspect that also makes you wonder when the timing belt was last done?

Could use more info from you in order to help.

 

[blue_myriddn]

get an experienced mechanic to look at the vehicle. Everything else will be guesswork, but hands on from a knowledgable mechanic will be invaluable to you

 

[Burny-B]

My experience has been that after 20-22 years the following needs to be done.

1) Repair of the three Bose amps in the sound system and repair of the climate control unit circuit board.
briank here on Prime does those repairs at reasonable cost.
2) conversion of the r12 a/c to r134a and replace the a/c compressor and a/c belt tensioner.
It sounds like you may be needing #1
Was there any noise at all from the radio?
Did you check the a/c to see if it works?

The pressure escaping from the coolant reservoir could be a defective cap or a sign the engine is overheating
What did the temperature gauge show when you were driving?
If the engine is overheating it could be from a low coolant condition caused by a fluid leak, or possibly a failed water pump.
Did you check the coolant level or look under the car for evidence of leaks?
If a water pump is suspect that also makes you wonder when the timing belt was last done?

Could use more info from you in order to help.

Well, both the radio and A/C control were completely dead.
So whatever buttons i pushed and turned, nothing happend. The displays remained dead.
So it does sound plausible there is a problem with the powersupply for both units?

I'm also pretty sure the A/C circuitry needs a repair.
The seller told me, when the A/C still worked (so before the battery-spark incident) the A/C would only work on maximum or not at all

As for the second question: the temp gauge remained steady just a little bit under 'halfway'.
No fluctuations, it took about 5 minutes to warm up.
Bottom of the car was dry, no leak spot on the floor where it was parked.
However there was a tiny bit of coolant on the rim of the tank, before the drive. Not after the drive.
After the drive it was completely dry.
Coolant level was in the middle between high and low.
Both coolant and oil looked normal. If it would be a defective head gasket, i assume i would see something in the coolant, or oil? Or white smoke from the exhaust.

The seller has invoices for timing belt and waterpump replacement, done 3,5 years ago.


@ blue_myriddn: Yes, that would be the best thing to do. I'll see if there is a way to arrange that.

 

[Speedmaster]

I will second the recommendation on having the circuit board (and amps) done by BrianK. Seeing that you are in Belgium, maybe the better play is to simply buy the boards outright (I think he charges for the core) but that would save you the money on shipping. Center and side speakers will be a solid 10 pounds in weight.

 

[brettowen]

get an experienced mechanic to look at the vehicle. Everything else will be guesswork, but hands on from a knowledgable mechanic will be invaluable to you

+1!

 

[JD Cross]

@ blue_myriddn: Yes, that would be the best thing to do. I'll see if there is a way to arrange that.

It sounds like complex issues.
blue_myriddn is right, find a good NSX technician and have them go over the car

 

[docjohn]

my 96 radio is dead and my ac fan only woks on the high setting....very common circuit board age related issues......

 

[Burny-B]

Thanks for the input guys!
I'll keep you up to date.