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Reasons for the differences in hardcore factor of S2K vs. NSX folks

kenjiMR

kenjiMR

Experienced Member
Joined
28 April 2000
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SF Bay Area / Boston MA
Has anyone been to S2ki.com recently? Their racing and track events section is awesome.
There are some great and inspiring drivers over there. I was just reading through davepk's brake design analysis thread... and realized that we never have anything like that here. Is it the difference in image of our car, the cost, the owner base, or what? I'm no engineer, but I wish our community had more crazy nuts like our other Honda bretheren.

Check these threads for example:

http://www.s2ki.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=123981
http://www.s2ki.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=11

Kenji "Someday on Pulp Racing Hall of Fame" MR
 
I gotta tell ya, I just don't agree. The S2000 guys and the NSX guys have a lot in common (and there is some overlap among the two groups). We have at least as much driver talent and in-depth engineering expertise as that illustrated in the topic linked above. However, it's not all displayed in one place; in addition to that shown on NSXprime, of course, we have lengthy technical articles in NSX Driver (the S2KCA doesn't have a hard-copy print newsletter), some interesting info still crops up from time to time on the NSX e-mail lists, and we have vendors such as Dali Racing and Science of Speed who are using their expertise to put products on the market for our cars (and theirs, too). NSXPO is far larger and more varied than their events, and puts our driver and engineering expertise on display. We also have the NSX FAQ, which flat out rocks!

This is not disrespect for the S2000 folks in any way, shape, or form; I have some good friends in their community. I am only noting that I think we have similar talents in both groups. However, the NSX community may have more outlets where that expertise can be applied. Furthermore, the NSX community is also older and more established, which is why we have been able to provide behind-the-scenes assistance to our S2000 brethren in developing their own community.
 
Nsxtsy, you may be right, but here on the west coast the NSX doesn't seem to be representing when compared to the S2000 guys. We are consistantly getting are behinds kicked at most track events by many of the S2000 guys. We had a good showing in OTC, but outside of that we are not really coming close. It seems that our track nuts members can be counted on one hand. Having proof of your laptimes like Doug H says is the only way to properly gauge hardcore factor IMO. Anyway, I'm just trying to start some smack talk so that we get more NSXers out there to put their hardware to the test!
 
You're all over the map with this rant... On the one hand, you're talking about representing at the track, on the other, you're talking about engineering knowledge and interest.

Why is it only laptimes that demonstrate "hardcore factor" (whatever that means)???

The S2000 may simply be easier to drive at speed, OR, it may be that, in the limited range of events you're personally attending, the S2000 drivers happen to be more naturally gifted. I'm not sure I understand what that proves. If Z06 drivers were continuously kicking EVERYONE's buts at those events, would that mean the Z06 community is somehow "more hardcore" than either the NSX or S2000? I don't get the connection.

Looking at the totality of it (the depth of knowledge and interest displayed by the two communities) I've got to agree with Ken big time...
 
Originally posted by kenjiMR
Nsxtsy, you may be right, but here on the west coast the NSX doesn't seem to be representing when compared to the S2000 guys. We are consistantly getting are behinds kicked at most track events by many of the S2000 guys. We had a good showing in OTC, but outside of that we are not really coming close. It seems that our track nuts members can be counted on one hand. Having proof of your laptimes like Doug H says is the only way to properly gauge hardcore factor IMO. Anyway, I'm just trying to start some smack talk so that we get more NSXers out there to put their hardware to the test!
Click to expand...

I rarely see the S2000 at the track around the Midwest, whereas we have a bunch of NSX guys who are generally among the fastest guys out there. Part of that is because many of my events are with BMW CCA, which doesn't allow convertibles, but even at CGI Motorsports events, which allows them, there are lots of NSXs, usually a few Integra Type Rs, but rarely more than one S2000.

Also, remember NSXPO; there, everyone drives an NSX - with 60-100 drivers. We usually divide the run groups based on experience, and the last few years we have had three run groups. The top third of the drivers typically had 20 or more track events. That's a lot of very experienced drivers driving NSXs!

kenjiMR, have you been to the track events at Thunderhill that the Sacramento Chapter has been holding the past few years? I keep hearing that they have quite a few drivers who are developing a fair amount of experience.

Of course, the more people who want to do this, the better! And NSXPO 2003 will be the best way to get more NSXers interested in it!
 
nsxtasy said:
Part of that is because many of my events are with BMW CCA, which doesn't allow convertibles...
Click to expand...
Hmm, sure was plenty of them at our BMW CCA event last month.
 
Attending a track event and being a fast driver are totally different things. There are very few fast NSX drivers... Hardcore engineering or not, we have very few _fast NSX drivers_. To me, learning how to drive fast in conjunction with the know-how to make it happen is hardcore. Our NSX is no longer a top contender at most track events, but I know that the NSX has a ton of potential... we should show them what it can really do.

At least there are more S2000 and Z06 guys that disclose their laptimes at their local HPDE and time trial events. Safety and keeping our cars shiny is one thing, but parading your car around a race track a few times a year just doesn't cut it.

I will be at NSXPO with my hotlap timer, bring yours too!
 
Zuerst said:
Can someone remind me how many NSXs are made in relation to all the S2000s, Z06s...etc? :confused: :D
Click to expand...

Is that what our excuse is going to be? 8000 NSXs in the US... thats not that small of number. I saw an Ultima GTR at Thunderhill on friday doing its thing, and there are only 2 of them in California. So 8000 should be plenty.
 
kenjiMR said:
Is that what our excuse is going to be? 8000 NSXs in the US... thats not that small of number. I saw an Ultima GTR at Thunderhill on friday doing its thing, and there are only 2 of them in California. So 8000 should be plenty.
Click to expand...

It's not an excuse. It's a simple fact.
 
kenjiMR said:
Is that what our excuse is going to be? 8000 NSXs in the US... thats not that small of number. I saw an Ultima GTR at Thunderhill on friday doing its thing, and there are only 2 of them in California. So 8000 should be plenty.
Click to expand...

That is not fair. Are Ultima street legal in CA?
I assume that an Ultima buyer drives at the track alot more than the "average sportcar drivers"(tm) does... where else can he drive? :D
 
No flame intended, but I don't see the point of your post.

It sounds, as if because you respect people that track their cars more than others, the S2K owners are cooler?? Correct me if I misunderstood.

Some us are happy not pimping, but driving our cars (NSX), by ourselves, through (in my case the Green Mountains of VT) any mountain or twistie road for that matter.

Most people who own sports cars, never track their car for a number of reasons.

Not cool,
RCH
:confused:
 
In Europe we have our own NSX-events as organised by the Swiss NSX-club. Visit their site at www.nsx.ch.
However, for the last few years, the event has been opened to allow all Honda's to compete and we see more and more Civic Type R, Integra's, S2000 and Accords showing up. One of the reasons for that is off course the limited number of NSX's around and the limited number of owners who are willing to put them at risk (at their own expense) on the track. We all know how expensive the NSX is to repair. We do hoever,
FWIW, I agree that having attended one or more track events does not equal driver experience. Personally, I tend to be very careful when driving my car. Just to keep it in one piece.
 
nsxtasy[/i] [B]Part of that is because many of my events are with BMW CCA said:
There are very few fast NSX drivers...
Click to expand...

Around here, that statement is absolutely untrue.

Have you been to any NSXPOs? Have you been to any NSX Club track events? Or are you just basing your observations on events held by other groups who don't attract many NSXs?

kenjiMR said:
Our NSX is no longer a top contender at most track events
Click to expand...

Around here, that statement is absolutely untrue.

Have you been to any NSXPOs? Have you been to any NSX Club track events? Or are you just basing your observations on events held by other groups who don't attract many NSXs?

You're welcome to come to the Windy City BMW track event at Grattan Raceway, near Grand Rapids, Michigan, September 5-7, to see for yourself. And, of course, NSXPO 2003 a month later!
 
nsxtasy said:
I don't know why the St. Louis BMW Club would allow them (convertibles); perhaps it was because they cooperate with the local chapter of PCA and hold them as joint events
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Yes, the BMW and PCA clubs cooperate for track events here. I suppose that is why.
 
"Not until you put a HUGE wing to keep up the needed drag and the stickers to help people visualize it in the race group! "

Its all part of the same equation = wing = stick = corner speed = fast laps = sponsers= stickers
 

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Ain't representin'?
 

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hahahaha

That is the funniest thing I have ever seen!!!!!!!!!!!!! :)
 
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