Test drove a "gated" Ferrari 360 today.....comparing it to my Turbocharged NA2

[blue_myriddn]

360 is the best "value" buy you can get in exotic cars at the moment.

I will actually play devil's advocate with that statement as I don't think the 360 is the best value at the moment, it is still too close in price to the 430 and the upgrades in the 430 are by in large well worth it. For roughly a 25% bump in price you can get a F430 and if you own the car for more than 2 years the depreciation difference is going to help make up that cost.

I would consider the Gallardo to be a stronger value, especially next summer when the Huracan starts pushing lots of used Gallardo's on to the market. Then of course you have the heavily discounted Lotus Evora which is a solid car that never found a market, but then we are starting to talk about all sorts of different "exotics" rather than just the major marquees (for example the NSX, which remains a better value than the 360 due to be roughly 40% cheaper).

As far as value Ferraris go though, I think the 360 has a way to travel down the curve before it truly becomes a "value". Right now a good 348 or 355 (cross your fingers on maintenance) are the value Ferraris as they are pretty much sitting on the bottom of their depreciation curves.

 

[RPM217]

I own both an 04 360 and now just picked up an 04 NSX.

Objectively the NSX doesn't outshine the Ferrari in the ways you describe, but you are obviously posting from an NSX fanatics perspective on an NSX board so nothing makes people happier then to hear their cars are better then a Ferrari.

Ferrari interrior is better then NSX, and Ferrari sound (especially with a tubi) 9.8/10 people will agree sounds better then any nsx exhaust. Ferrari gets more street cred, in that everyone thinks you are a millionaire.

Both drive equally as nice, NSX obviously is more reliable but a manual box 360 won't hurt you in maintenance as others have suggested. $2500/ year is a plentiful budget for a 360 assuming 5000 miles of driving.

NSX is more of a daily driver and does have a smoother gear box, but the gated shifter feel of the ferrari is smooth and part of the experience.

360 is the best "value" buy you can get in exotic cars at the moment.

Rob, good to see you on here. Fellow primers probably don't realize that you have more "seat time" and knowledge of "exotic cars" cost and maintenance. Rob can be a great resource to everyone here, his information isn't based on conjecture, it's based on first hand knowledge. He's a good guy, don't abuse him, and you'll be glad if he chooses to be an active participant here.

 

[AZNSX001]

I will actually play devil's advocate with that statement as I don't think the 360 is the best value at the moment, it is still too close in price to the 430 and the upgrades in the 430 are by in large well worth it. For roughly a 25% bump in price you can get a F430 and if you own the car for more than 2 years the depreciation difference is going to help make up that cost.

Hmmm, good car vs. good car I'd say the 25% premium of one to the to other keeps the 360 as a value. I don't think 360's are headed too much further down the ladder given 355's have been stable in the high 50's-60's (good cars only here) for a while and better ones are heading to the very high 60's (actual sales). You want to include junk, salvage, poorly maintained, off color (I mean way off like green/green) then maybe, but I don't shop those types of cars.

I would consider the Gallardo to be a stronger value, especially next summer when the Huracan starts pushing lots of used Gallardo's on to the market. Then of course you have the heavily discounted Lotus Evora which is a solid car that never found a market, but then we are starting to talk about all sorts of different "exotics" rather than just the major marquees (for example the NSX, which remains a better value than the 360 due to be roughly 40% cheaper).

Gallardo = Audi + better noise = eh. Now a UGR TT SL Gallardo, there you have something fun, but so far from the value part of our discussion at $350K that it's not in the conversation. And to be fair this is a F360 conversation so I'm trying to stick to that as much as possible.

As far as value Ferraris go though, I think the 360 has a way to travel down the curve before it truly becomes a "value". Right now a good 348 or 355 (cross your fingers on maintenance) are the value Ferraris as they are pretty much sitting on the bottom of their depreciation curves.

That's a lotta finger crossing and some misplaced faith in those particular models but I love a dreamer!:encouragement: As I mentioned above, the really good 355's (1995 355 GTB's) are at high 60K mark and I've seen 2 sell at 70+ over the last few months, so not as cheap as you think. These are cars that are up to speed on ALL maint.(with ALL records), are desirable in color (red/tan, red/black) and have things like the valve guides, headers, stickies done already. I would take one of these hands down over any 360, CS included. The noise is simply so much sweeter.

- - - Updated - - -

Rob, good to see you on here. Fellow primers probably don't realize that you have more "seat time" and knowledge of "exotic cars" cost and maintenance. Rob can be a great resource to everyone here, his information isn't based on conjecture, it's based on first hand knowledge. He's a good guy, don't abuse him, and you'll be glad if he chooses to be an active participant here.

Always great to get owners in with a more varied garage to share their own experiences and possibly bring newcomers to other brands, that said it's not unheard of for two people to have completely different experiences with the same marquee. I've seen Rob's name on Fchat for a while now. This is the only board I use the AZNSX001 user name since my usual (AZCarguy) profile had issues here on Prime.

 

[unknownpharoah]

I own both an 04 360 and now just picked up an 04 NSX.

Objectively the NSX doesn't outshine the Ferrari in the ways you describe, but you are obviously posting from an NSX fanatics perspective on an NSX board so nothing makes people happier then to hear their cars are better then a Ferrari.

Ferrari interrior is better then NSX, and Ferrari sound (especially with a tubi) 9.8/10 people will agree sounds better then any nsx exhaust. Ferrari gets more street cred, in that everyone thinks you are a millionaire.

Both drive equally as nice, NSX obviously is more reliable but a manual box 360 won't hurt you in maintenance as others have suggested. $2500/ year is a plentiful budget for a 360 assuming 5000 miles of driving.

NSX is more of a daily driver and does have a smoother gear box, but the gated shifter feel of the ferrari is smooth and part of the experience.

360 is the best "value" buy you can get in exotic cars at the moment.

I was hoping to see you weigh in on this subject. This is a great thread and in this instance Robs comment is more of an expert opinion if there is such a thing on a forum. Definitely worth listening to.

 

[WillErickson]

I own both an 04 360 and now just picked up an 04 NSX.

Objectively the NSX doesn't outshine the Ferrari in the ways you describe, but you are obviously posting from an NSX fanatics perspective on an NSX board so nothing makes people happier then to hear their cars are better then a Ferrari.

Ferrari interrior is better then NSX, and Ferrari sound (especially with a tubi) 9.8/10 people will agree sounds better then any nsx exhaust. Ferrari gets more street cred, in that everyone thinks you are a millionaire.

Both drive equally as nice, NSX obviously is more reliable but a manual box 360 won't hurt you in maintenance as others have suggested. $2500/ year is a plentiful budget for a 360 assuming 5000 miles of driving.

NSX is more of a daily driver and does have a smoother gear box, but the gated shifter feel of the ferrari is smooth and part of the experience.

360 is the best "value" buy you can get in exotic cars at the moment.

Hi Rob, I really enjoy your videos. Someday I hope to have an F car too, if I can stomach the upkeep they require.

Stock for stock you may be right (I’ve never driven a 360, or any Ferrari), but Aaron’s (the OP) NSX is far from stock, and sounds amazing. He’s turbo’d, test piped, and has a custom exhaust. If I didn’t hear it with my own ears I wouldn’t have believed it came from an NSX. Also, an NSX with some aftermarket suspension components drives quite a bit differently than stock, not just stiffer, but much tighter as well. Also being at altitude (Denver) helps give an advantage to a turbo car than anything n/a.

Looking forward to seeing your NSX in some videos.

 

[robiferretti]

Sure everyone is entitled to their opinion. I was just trying to offer a less biased one. Just posted up the first NSX video i've made. Shipping that car to Denver with me in 3 weeks to throw a few thousand miles on it. No matter how much confidence I have in the Ferrari, I've got more confidence in trouble free road trip from the NSX.

Also agree with long term high volume wear of the NSX is better then the Ferrari. Although the interior on the Fcar is nicer the longevity of its appearance is always questionable, leather routinely peels and buttons get sticky an require replacement or refinishing.

 

[WillErickson]

Sure everyone is entitled to their opinion. I was just trying to offer a less biased one. Just posted up the first NSX video i've made. Shipping that car to Denver with me in 3 weeks to throw a few thousand miles on it. No matter how much confidence I have in the Ferrari, I've got more confidence in trouble free road trip from the NSX.

Also agree with long term high volume wear of the NSX is better then the Ferrari. Although the interior on the Fcar is nicer the longevity of its appearance is always questionable, leather routinely peels and buttons get sticky an require replacement or refinishing.

If you're around on the 19th you should join us: http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/182966-Bishop%92s-Castle-drive-7-19

 

[robiferretti]

If you're around on the 19th you should join us: http://www.nsxprime.com/forum/showthread.php/182966-Bishop%92s-Castle-drive-7-19

July 24th Will be in Vail
July 25th Will be in Park City UT
July 26th Will be in Jackson WY
July 27th Will be in Keystone SD
July 28th Will be in Denver

 

[MileHighNSX]

Where at in Denver are you going to be on Monday the 28th? Maybe we can have a small get together depending on what you are doing?

 

[toddat]

Sure everyone is entitled to their opinion. I was just trying to offer a less biased one. Just posted up the first NSX video i've made. Shipping that car to Denver with me in 3 weeks to throw a few thousand miles on it. No matter how much confidence I have in the Ferrari, I've got more confidence in trouble free road trip from the NSX.

Also agree with long term high volume wear of the NSX is better then the Ferrari. Although the interior on the Fcar is nicer the longevity of its appearance is always questionable, leather routinely peels and buttons get sticky an require replacement or refinishing.

The sticky buttons sounds funny but it's really gross. I used Krud Kutter (like a high octane Formula 409 cleaner) to get it off mine.

 

[NSX-COLORADO]

I will actually play devil's advocate with that statement as I don't think the 360 is the best value at the moment, it is still too close in price to the 430 and the upgrades in the 430 are by in large well worth it. For roughly a 25% bump in price you can get a F430 and if you own the car for more than 2 years the depreciation difference is going to help make up that cost.

I would consider the Gallardo to be a stronger value, especially next summer when the Huracan starts pushing lots of used Gallardo's on to the market. Then of course you have the heavily discounted Lotus Evora which is a solid car that never found a market, but then we are starting to talk about all sorts of different "exotics" rather than just the major marquees (for example the NSX, which remains a better value than the 360 due to be roughly 40% cheaper).

As far as value Ferraris go though, I think the 360 has a way to travel down the curve before it truly becomes a "value". Right now a good 348 or 355 (cross your fingers on maintenance) are the value Ferraris as they are pretty much sitting on the bottom of their depreciation curves.

You must of been at the Ferrari dealership in Highlands Ranch. I met one of the Ferrari mechanics at a gas station in Highlands Ranch a few months ago. See picture.. The mechanic was driving and filling up the Ferrari next to mine. We struck up a conversation. The funny thing is he said "I want your car" .. "Seriously".. I said... " My car is over 23 years old."
He said.. Yeah.. but the cost of ownership will kill you in a Ferrari- (This was coming from the mouth of the Ferrari Mechanic"
You have to admit Ferarris are a Beautiful car..-- and if money is not an issue who wouldn't want one?

I Still love the NSX.. -- I wonder what the insurance cost is on a Ferarri!!!

 

[blue_myriddn]

Sept Valuation numbers are in on the Ferrari 360 and it is grim news. As I expected, their values are tanking across the board. Doesn't matter too much which year/model you input the graphs all look about like this:

I'd say 360s will be $50k cars in the years to come and will stay around that mark for a while.

 

[NetViper]

Why the huge drop?

 

[blue_myriddn]

Why the huge drop?

Just my opinion but:

1. They are no longer "new" with the body style being dated by the now 5 yr old 458
2. The F430 is a notable improvement
3. Over 16,000 were produced, so there are plenty of them around

Mostly though, I think it is just their time to crash in value - much like the NSX saw a nosedive in value for years.

For sale listings have yet to completely catch up with this, but it doesn't seem like these cars are moving very well at their high price. People simply don't want to spend big bucks on these cars anymore.

 

[RPM217]

Just my opinion but:

1. They are no longer "new" with the body style being dated by the now 5 yr old 458
2. The F430 is a notable improvement
3. Over 16,000 were produced, so there are plenty of them around

Mostly though, I think it is just their time to crash in value - much like the NSX saw a nosedive in value for years.

For sale listings have yet to completely catch up with this, but it doesn't seem like these cars are moving very well at their high price. People simply don't want to spend big bucks on these cars anymore.

The CS is holding it's value quite well, still a "desirable" car. My objection to it, is that it only comes with "flappies". I do like the look of the 360, I think even more than the 430, that being said, I like my NSX better!!

 

[NetViper]

The CS is holding it's value quite well, still a "desirable" car. My objection to it, is that it only comes with "flappies". I do like the look of the 360, I think even more than the 430, that being said, I like my NSX better!!

The CS is a special car. I like the look for the 360 more than the 430 also. If they fall to $50K, I will have one eventually. They are still fast enough, and man they sound good.

 

[Yinzer]

These articles on the 360 I saw yesterday were pretty fun reads.

http://jalopnik.com/owning-a-ferrari-for-a-year-was-a-disappointment-1668355120

That one is interesting first because it touches upon some of the ownership aspects that I and many of us experience who don't DD our cars. They're such point A to A cars that it's silly sometimes. So impractical but so never leaving my garage. Every drive still seems like an event. And I love the talk about occasionally feeling conspicuousness out in public. Reminds me about how much I love the chameleon aspect of the NSX -- can be both rare/special and not too "look at me" at the same time. But it's interesting that the above article sounds pretty negative on the maintenance costs, yet a later article (below) really downplays them. Maybe Doug went thru a little of the inner rationale-making we all do at times to convince ourselves that certain purchases were ok and really didn't cost us THAT much.

http://jalopnik.com/heres-what-it-cost-me-to-own-a-ferrari-for-a-year-1669923931

I'm not at all a hater on Ferrari for the maintenance costs, I think it's all just relative. A 20 year old college student in a $2500 civic thinks an NSX is awfully expensive to keep, and most of us owners of the "smart affordable supercar" will probably always have a hard time rationalizing $400 oil changes and $5000 maintenances every 4 years.

 

[NSX-COLORADO]

These articles on the 360 I saw yesterday were pretty fun reads.

http://jalopnik.com/owning-a-ferrari-for-a-year-was-a-disappointment-1668355120

That one is interesting first because it touches upon some of the ownership aspects that I and many of us experience who don't DD our cars. They're such point A to A cars that it's silly sometimes. So impractical but so never leaving my garage. Every drive still seems like an event. And I love the talk about occasionally feeling conspicuousness out in public. Reminds me about how much I love the chameleon aspect of the NSX -- can be both rare/special and not too "look at me" at the same time. But it's interesting that the above article sounds pretty negative on the maintenance costs, yet a later article (below) really downplays them. Maybe Doug went thru a little of the inner rationale-making we all do at times to convince ourselves that certain purchases were ok and really didn't cost us THAT much.

http://jalopnik.com/heres-what-it-cost-me-to-own-a-ferrari-for-a-year-1669923931

I'm not at all a hater on Ferrari for the maintenance costs, I think it's all just relative. A 20 year old college student in a $2500 civic thinks an NSX is awfully expensive to keep, and most of us owners of the "smart affordable supercar" will probably always have a hard time rationalizing $400 oil changes and $5000 maintenances every 4 years.

_______________
The article is laughable. REASON BEING.. HE ONLY OWNED THE CAR FOR ONE YEAR? - Who doesn't love a Ferarri.. The NSX was designed to beat em.. so you have to say Ferarri's are well respected in any car community.. But for the author of the artile to say "All the maintence fears/realiablity fears are "Bullshit" is just laugable.. The author owned the car for one year and put a paltry 5000 on it. Own it for 20 years plus and then tell me all of it is BS.. Bottom line is Ferraris are expensive to BUY-- and over time become expensive to OWN-- (insurance, maint. parts etc) But to say that its "BS" is just "BS"
I have two friends that own F430 and they say its "Pricey" to own.. --- But no one denies that..

Own is for 5-10 years then tell me its all BS.. -- same thing goes for almost any exotic. Parts are rare and few know how to really work on them.

 

[Yinzer]

How funny, that was one of my first thoughts too but I forgot to say. Agreed, how can one say anything + or - so definitively after just one year. I like the writer's stuff but found all the justification and downplaying in the second article kind of odd and funny. Then again he's not a "normal" owner but a writer 1st and owner 2nd, with way different motives than any of us for getting in & out of certain cars, no matter how much of a car nut he is.