The GTR is'nt that quick what Nissan claims

[NetViper]

If the GTR was made by Honda instead of Nissan,

I wonder if the criticism about the car would drop within this community

I think the potential transmission problems would be a major cause for concern regardless of who made the car.

Other than that, the car is incredible IMO. It could weigh less and look better, but the performance on the track speaks for itself.

 

[NSX GT]

Were comparing apples and oranges when comparing GTR / NSX. Even with CTSC, the GTR will kick a$$ on the NSX by far. Although heavier, can't compete with a Nissan GTR Twin Turbo. Even with the speed and handling I still don't care too much for the bulky body style. Still would keep the NSX.

 

[NSXkkk]

I think the potential transmission problems would be a major cause for concern regardless of who made the car.

Other than that, the car is incredible IMO. It could weigh less and look better, but the performance on the track speaks for itself.

agreed.

they spent 5 years to develop it. their R&D, marketing, and engineering departments were all serious on that project. their CEO knows what he was doing. Does anyone think that he knows more than the whole Nissan company?

 

[BD]

What do you mean you will be able to drive around the GTR for twice the price? The GTR will be faster than a CTSC around a racetrack. Take the latest R&T. The SPOON NSX-R GT turbo -- the ultimate NSX - was slower around the track than a stock GTR. Stock GTR- 1:26, Spoon NSX 1:31.

Maybe in a straight line you will keep up - it will be close, but who buys a NSX to drag race?

It may be faster the first few laps, but the tranny will not hold up. I was amazed to see two BMI battles with both GTR's tranny busted by lap three.

In fact, kill the R35, bring back the R34 with extra boost and all problem will be solved.

 

[BD]

agreed.

they spent 5 years to develop it. their R&D, marketing, and engineering departments were all serious on that project. their CEO knows what he was doing. Does anyone think that he knows more than the whole Nissan company?

Mhhh. NO, you have AMG creating trannys that can hold up not only huge HP but massive torque. What Nissan did was to wow the world with on the paper performance vs. price.

That's what happen when they slapped every thing into a G37 and call it a day. It is really shame, I thought it was a cool car to have, and even considered one, but now, I'll pass. There is absolutely no point to buy this car with $20k reserve on the side so I can afford "1" tranny replacement.

 

[NetViper]

It may be faster the first few laps, but the tranny will not hold up. I was amazed to see two BMI battles with both GTR's tranny busted by lap three.

In fact, kill the R35, bring back the R34 with extra boost and all problem will be solved.

So far I am only reading about tranny failures due to the hard launching of the car. Is it failing on the track too?

 

[BD]

So far I am only reading about tranny failures due to the hard launching of the car. Is it failing on the track too?

Go to you tube, look under BMI R35 vs. NSX

There are two events when both R35 tranny failed half way though the race.

 

[NSXkkk]

i understand. the tranny is no good. since it's their first time to try that kind of technology, it will not be perfect.
GT-R is a direct threat to porsche turbo. if everyone chooses to buy GT-R later, porsche's turbo will have no market. this is why they acutally fighting each other. one saying that it's not fast as they claimed, and another will say that a driving lession can be provided. LOL.:biggrin:

 

[BD]

i understand. the tranny is no good. since it's their first time to try that kind of technology, it will not be perfect.
GT-R is a direct threat to porsche turbo. if everyone chooses to buy GT-R later, porsche's turbo will have no market. this is why they acutally fighting each other. one saying that it's not fast as they claimed, and another will say that a driving lession can be provided. LOL.:biggrin:

Performance wise, GTR is a threat to Porsche, on Paper. However, few Porsche drivers will buy that car. That is why GTR demand has dropped to MSRP level just couple of months after introduction. GTR's biggest fans are JDM lovers, they come from Civic, EVO, STI, S2k, 240SX, and they can't afford that car.

Nissan shot them self in the foot for doing this - A car that is very well priced but still over priced for average ricer, and with Ferrari Maintenance cost. Even if a guy squeeze every penny out of his ass to buy the GTR, You will them dumping their barely used GTRs to avoid any potential out of warrantee repair bills. When that happens, new GTR price will come down down. By this time next year, you will be able to buy a brand new GTR at invoice and probably with 0.9% interest; in fact, Nissan dealers will be so desperate in moving this car off the lot because they don't want to sit on $70 grand credit.

What ever the marketing strategy they called "GTR Certified dealers" will loose their slogan because all of the none GTR certified dealerships will start to get GTR in stock, just so Nissan can move the cars out of the production line. This car will hit the same fate as the NSX, except couple of years sooner.

 

[shrddr]

Performance wise, GTR is a threat to Porsche, on Paper. However, few Porsche drivers will buy that car. That is why GTR demand has dropped to MSRP level just couple of months after introduction. GTR's biggest fans are JDM lovers, they come from Civic, EVO, STI, S2k, 240SX, and they can't afford that car.

Nissan shot them self in the foot for doing this - A car that is very well priced but still over priced for average ricer, and with Ferrari Maintenance cost. Even if a guy squeeze every penny out of his ass to buy the GTR, You will them dumping their barely used GTRs to avoid any potential out of warrantee repair bills. When that happens, new GTR price will come down down. By this time next year, you will be able to buy a brand new GTR at invoice and probably with 0.9% interest; in fact, Nissan dealers will be so desperate in moving this car off the lot because they don't want to sit on $70 grand credit.

What ever the marketing strategy they called "GTR Certified dealers" will loose their slogan because all of the none GTR certified dealerships will start to get GTR in stock, just so Nissan can move the cars out of the production line. This car will hit the same fate as the NSX, except couple of years faster.

while i respect your opinion and most of what you generally post... i disagree with you on this topic.

everything you have said about the GTR applies to the NSX as well. performance wise the NSX may have been a threat to ferrari... but few ferrari drivers will buy a honda.

the NSX had snap ring issues when it first came out... there is no reason to jump the gun and pass grand judgment that the GTR is crap because a handful of them have had transmission trouble.

i think your forecast about people dumping their GTR's to avoid repair bills, falling prices, etc... is pretty baseless speculation.

you are entitled to your opinion... but so far man... your logic hasn't really been solid.

 

[FrEsHaZzBuRu]

the NSX had snap ring issues when it first came out... there is no reason to jump the gun and pass grand judgment that the GTR is crap because a handful of them have had transmission trouble.

Compare fixing the snap ring issue with the NSX to fixing the tranny issue with the GTR. Which one was covered under warranty? Warranty aside, how much would it cost to fix out of warranty (to go further, use the cost of the fix as a percentage to the price of the car)?

Let's say the NSX was advertised with new VTEC technology, but the cylinders couldn't handle the increased volumes of air for long peiords of time which would lead to detonation. So a disclaimer was written to keep owners out of being in the VTEC range for extended periods (like on a track) because it would be considered abuse. If the ecu recorded the data and it broke the dealer wouldn't cover a new engine under warranty and the owner would have to fork out 20k for a new one. Because of this the NSX's peak output went from 270 to 240. How would the less than ideal market for the NSX now respond?

 

[BD]

while i respect your opinion and most of what you generally post... i disagree with you on this topic.

everything you have said about the GTR applies to the NSX as well. performance wise the NSX may have been a threat to ferrari... but few ferrari drivers will buy a honda.

the NSX had snap ring issues when it first came out... there is no reason to jump the gun and pass grand judgment that the GTR is crap because a handful of them have had transmission trouble.

i think your forecast about people dumping their GTR's to avoid repair bills, falling prices, etc... is pretty baseless speculation.

you are entitled to your opinion... but so far man... your logic hasn't really been solid.

The logic is simple. Snap ring was manufactured out of spec by secondary party. Honda covered it under warrantee. Nissan reportedly design the tranny NOT to handle the power.

Tell me this, if you buy a GTR, do you think it is within your right to "occasionally" drive the car the way Nissan advertised? What's the point of buying a car with great performance on paper, but the owners can't exercise the performance? This is what I called a complete waste of money - As I have indicated, imaging you married a super model but you don't get to bang her - The blue ball effect. Yes, people pay $70k so they can have blue balls. Don't get me wrong, I think what Nissan do is slap a six speed manual box and all problems will be solved, like what they did with R34.

 

[docjohn]

I have been watching the supercars exposed series on speed,and one of them showcased tanner driving the gtr.He explained how launch control worked,he pressed the buttons and voila blasted away,,but boy did the whole car shake and vibrate as he did.I can see why the trannie would protest or explode if that is repeated

 

[BD]

I have been watching the supercars exposed series on speed,and one of them showcased tanner driving the gtr.He explained how launch control worked,he pressed the buttons and voila blasted away,,but boy did the whole car shake and vibrate as he did.I can see why the trannie would protest or explode if that is repeated

Here is the other problem, the launch control drop the clutch at 4k rpm, Nissan will not allow you to use it unless you want to void the warrantee, but they let you do it safely at 3k. By drop at 3k, the 0-60 time maybe in high 4 second range. An EVO can do that at half the price.

The other thing I'm really curious about the GTR is the tire wear. That will be an interesting one to see.

 

[NSXkkk]

maybe 2 years later, they will make improvement on GT-R. same as 350z.
Nissan did better than Honda on sportcar. 350z's sales owned S2000. Infiniti's models were sold more than Acura.

 

[BD]

maybe 2 years later, they will make improvement on GT-R. same as 350z.
Nissan did better than Honda on sportcar. 350z's sales owned S2000. Infiniti's models were sold more than Acura.

Dude, the writing is on the wall. You can already buy a GTR at MSRP if you bargain hard enough, two months after it was introduced. On ebay, the premium package are going for only couple of grand over sticker for premium colors. Most of the over priced cars don't even have bids on them.

NSX over the sticker mark up lasted more than a year at rate of 9000 (world wide) cars built in 1990/1991.

 

[shrddr]

The logic is simple. Snap ring was manufactured out of spec by secondary party. Honda covered it under warrantee. Nissan reportedly design the tranny NOT to handle the power.

Tell me this, if you buy a GTR, do you think it is within your right to "occasionally" drive the car the way Nissan advertised? What's the point of buying a car with great performance on paper, but the owners can't exercise the performance? This is what I called a complete waste of money - As I have indicated, imaging you married a super model but you don't get to bang her - The blue ball effect. Yes, people pay $70k so they can have blue balls. Don't get me wrong, I think what Nissan do is slap a six speed manual box and all problems will be solved, like what they did with R34.

of course i would think it is within my right to occasionally (often) drive the car hard. and i do not believe that anything bad is going to happen to the car by doing so. essentially... the anecdotal evidence from a handful of cars is not of sufficient concern to me

 

[shrddr]

Here is the other problem, the launch control drop the clutch at 4k rpm, Nissan will not allow you to use it unless you want to void the warrantee, but they let you do it safely at 3k. By drop at 3k, the 0-60 time maybe in high 4 second range. An EVO can do that at half the price.

The other thing I'm really curious about the GTR is the tire wear. That will be an interesting one to see.

awww come on man! as an NSX owner especially surely you know that performance is more than 0-60 times. even if an EVO can keep up for the initial 0-60... i dont think we need to debate the superiority of the GTR at every velocity beyond and at every turn.

 

[NSX GT]

Dude, the writing is on the wall. You can already buy a GTR at MSRP if you bargain hard enough, two months after it was introduced. On ebay, the premium package are going for only couple of grand over sticker for premium colors. Most of the over priced cars don't even have bids on them.

NSX over the sticker mark up lasted more than a year at rate of 9000 (world wide) cars built in 1990/1991.

I actually know of a dealership in the area that had offered MSRP on the GTR a couple month ago $70K+

 

[Timpo]

Nissan Offering Porsche some driver training lessons to achieve better times at Nur

In another statement by Nissan today they have officially gone on the record to defend the 7 minute 29 laptime recorded earlier in the year by the Nissan GT-R at Nurburgring. Porsche had recently called into doubt the laptime saying it could not replicate it in their own testing. Offering proof in the form of the actual tires and video footage from the laptime.

“It is clear that there are some important facts that were not accurately represented,”

Nissan go on to say that the GT-R used in the official laptime was actually at a disadvantage due to up to 50 kilograms of testing equipment along for the ride. Offering Porsche some driver training lessons if they want to give it another try.

http://www.gtrblog.com/index.php/2008/10/09/nissan-offer-porsche-proof-and-driving-t?blog=4

 

[BD]

awww come on man! as an NSX owner especially surely you know that performance is more than 0-60 times. even if an EVO can keep up for the initial 0-60... i dont think we need to debate the superiority of the GTR at every velocity beyond and at every turn.

I don't know what you are defending, now you're talking about the handling. Nissan Claimed the car is capable of 3.5 0-60 or better, therefore, any body who is spending the money for the car should be able to achieve that kind number, if not, close. Again, if that's the case, I'll use the old analogy. I'll just buy a low mileage NA1 NSX with CTSC, Type R suspension and some nice rubbers, this car will eat up the GTR, on the street or on the track.

 

[NSXkkk]

LOL. i see GT-R's haters and fans. :biggrin:

 

[shrddr]

I don't know what you are defending, now you're talking about the handling. Nissan Claimed the car is capable of 3.5 0-60 or better, therefore, any body who is spending the money for the car should be able to achieve that kind number, if not, close. Again, if that's the case, I'll use the old analogy. I'll just buy a low mileage NA1 NSX with CTSC, Type R suspension and some nice rubbers, this car will eat up the GTR, on the street or on the track.

hehe... dude... i am talking about overall performance. i am talking about accelerating well past 60... and sure... handling too! i dont think anyone is buying the GTR simply because of a supposed 3.5 second 0-60 run. they are buying it because it is a damn good performance car.

you are stuck on ONE aspect of the cars performance... which is basically a function of trying to launch a heavy car by dropping the clutch with a shit ton of torque coming out of the engine. get past that already.

i swear i am not a big fan of the GTR... but i do try to be objective.

(the discussion of modded cars vs. stock cars is completely pointless)

 

[BD]

hehe... dude... i am talking about overall performance. i am talking about accelerating well past 60... and sure... handling too! i dont think anyone is buying the GTR simply because of a supposed 3.5 second 0-60 run. they are buying it because it is a damn good performance car.

you are stuck on ONE aspect of the cars performance... which is basically a function of trying to launch a heavy car by dropping the clutch with a shit ton of torque coming out of the engine. get past that already.

i swear i am not a big fan of the GTR... but i do try to be objective.

(the discussion of modded cars vs. stock cars is completely pointless)

I highly suggest you go back and read the entire thread.

I'm not judging the car's over all performance. I think it is a hell of a bargain for what it can do. However, I will never buy some thing and be handicapped by the manufacture regarding ANY aspect of the performance. If Nissan claim the car can achieve certain performance number, as a consumer, I expect to exercise that number when I feel like it without having to worry about if Nissan will cover my under the warrantee. If they don't want to cover the car, don't put in the launch control and don't advertise the car with that kind of performance. It is as simple as that.

 

[N Spec]

hehe... dude... i am talking about overall performance. i am talking about accelerating well past 60... and sure... handling too! i dont think anyone is buying the GTR simply because of a supposed 3.5 second 0-60 run. they are buying it because it is a damn good performance car.

you are stuck on ONE aspect of the cars performance... which is basically a function of trying to launch a heavy car by dropping the clutch with a shit ton of torque coming out of the engine. get past that already.

i swear i am not a big fan of the GTR... but i do try to be objective.

(the discussion of modded cars vs. stock cars is completely pointless)

Vance is just trying to compensate and rationale any good reason as to why he chose not to purchase the GTR. There is a lot of attention on the GTR and most of being good as in the GTR is elevated on this pedestal. Since this issue of the trans has appeared, it has only helped Vance reinforce or rather
make him feel better about his decision of not buying one. Let it be man, let him feel better about his rationale, lol.

As far as the modded car vs. stock cars thing. It is not pointless, if anything, it's interesting. It all comes down to amount of money spent and in the long end overall worth = value. If you can purchase a low mileage NSX, CTSC, and other supporting mods to go with it, it will be for many rationale more valuable than the GTR at 70K. It performs the same while also looking better and having a better design/human factor. You probably only need to spend about $60K(which includes the NSX price) to acheive the same level of performance as the GTR with a used NSX. This argument can be tricky because the GTR is essentially a super moded G37x coupe, iow G37x plus twin turbos. Same thing with the ZR1, just a modded vette. Modding by factory and aftermarket have became really grey over the years.

I mean value and worth is relative for each individual, but there is a rationale for value. It's just not always whats the fastest i can go for x amount of dollars. It's what the fastest I can go, look good and have a sophisticated, refined and exclusive design for x dollars. Minus the sophisticated design = ZR1 and that's over 100k, might as well get a used Gallardo :biggrin:

CTSC NSX (also possibily stroked to 3.5), with full suspension package = perfect balance and harmony of the things I mentioned for under 100k, maybe... I believe it's possible.