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"FAHRENHYPE 9/11" on DVD

nsxr1 said:
Thank God for Dick Morris. His "Fahrenhype 9/11" DVD exposes Michael Moore's film for what it is - politically motivated and full of deceptions, half-truths and outright lies. I encourage everyone to see this before accepting the demagoguery of the Left...

http://www.overstock.com/cgi-bin/d2.cgi?PAGE=PROFRAME&PROD_ID=997495&TID=FAHRENHYPE&IID=PRO:997495
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Of your 78 posts - only 20 are remotely about the NSX and most others fall under divisive issues for which you have an obvious bias. One might start to conclude your only purpose here is "politically motivated" as well. :confused:

That said, this is a board about NSXs with a little off topic banter to keep it interesting. The only thing we all have in common is the love of the NSX. I have been to NSXpo and I assure you there are liberals, conservatives, heterosexuals, homosexuals, Christians, Muslims, and atheists in attendance and I wouldn't have it any other way.

I have little tolerance or sympathy for those with little tolerance or sympathy for other's views.

BTW - before you all get your self(s) all worked up I am an independent that has a record of voting more often then not on the conservative side but never ever vote completely on any one party line nor would I ever endorse any candidate (or viewpoint for that matter) without doing a little bit of information gathering and thinking on my own.
 
matteni said:
Of your 78 posts - only 20 are remotely about the NSX and most others fall under divisive issues for which you have an obvious bias. One might start to conclude your only purpose here is "politically motivated" as well. :confused:

That said, this is a board about NSXs with a little off topic banter to keep it interesting. The only thing we all have in common is the love of the NSX. I have been to NSXpo and I assure you there are liberals, conservatives, heterosexuals, homosexuals, Christians, Muslims, and atheists in attendance and I wouldn't have it any other way.

I have little tolerance or sympathy for those with little tolerance or sympathy for other's views.

BTW - before you all get your self(s) all worked up I am an independent that has a record of voting more often then not on the conservative side but never ever vote completely on any one party line nor would I ever endorse any candidate (or viewpoint for that matter) without doing a little bit of information gathering and thinking on my own.
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Yeah! What he said!
 
At the risk of added fuel to the fire...

I only recently watched Fahrenheit 9/11 and I must say I was quite surprised and confused about many of the events surrounding 9/11 as a result. My question is this... does anyone know of a resource that can indepenantly discuss the points that Michael Moore made in his film and either confirm or dispute them?

Thanks
 
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NeSX said:
...does anyone know of a resource that can indepenantly discuss the points...
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I too would be interested to know that (I am going to watch the movie tonight and already know I am not going to believe it without doing some thinking / research on it as well).

That said - I think all of this is indicative of a bigger problem.

The problem with the media right now is how diverse it is. In the "good ole days" there were 5 or 6 TV channels, your local newspaper, and a dozen or so radio stations. To be viable in the market, these media sources had to appeal to a wide range of interests and political viewpoints.

Now we have the Internet, digital cable, XM radio, etc. So whereas people who wanted the news would have to read more "centrally focused" viewpoints and read about diverse issues - today I can subscribe to only the news I want and only written by people that express exactly my viewpoints, religious beliefs, and ideology.

I fear we are just starting to see some of the social ramifications of this. Less understanding of the "center" on issues, less tolerance for others, less breadth of understanding on issues that might not be of interest to you, etc. We seem to have become segmented to the point where only skepticism and distrust prevail.

I hope I am wrong and there is no way to go back but encourage friends to seek out news and information sources that are credible, relatively unbiased, and report on broad variety of issues - both domestic and international.

I am fairly certain the Fahrenheit 911 is not what I just described (credible, unbiased reporting) but am interested from an entertainment and cultural awareness value and doubt it will influence my thought process for voting in November.
 
NeSX said:
At the risk of added fuel to the fire...

I only recently watched Fahrenheit 9/11 and I must say I was quite surprised and confused about many of the events surrounding 9/11 as a result. My question is this... does anyone know of a resource that can indepenantly discuss the points that Michael Moore made in his film and either confirm or dispute them?

Thanks
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Well, if you are looking for a good fact database specifically on 9/11 (no Iraq stuff), then this is the mother of all websites:

Complete 911 Timeline

What is best about this website is that the author (Paul Thompson) does not express any viewpoints on the subject. I've even seen him interviewed on Fox News and baited to give his opinions and he refuses. He says he is just a researcher of facts and does not make conclusions. Just a warning though -- there is enough information here to keep one busy reading for a year...seriously!!
 
http://www.newsaic.com/f911index.html

Another possible source I just found. Not certain as to how independant it really is but some food for thought (does provide footnotes with sources of info).
 
Seems most shows do have a slant or spin one way or another. I like the Hannity and Combs show on Fox News because you always get two informed intelligent opinions on both sides of the partisan line.
 
This is the OFF TOPIC right?


matteni said:
Of your 78 posts - only 20 are remotely about the NSX and most others fall under divisive issues for which you have an obvious bias. One might start to conclude your only purpose here is "politically motivated" as well. :confused:

That said, this is a board about NSXs with a little off topic banter to keep it interesting. The only thing we all have in common is the love of the NSX. I have been to NSXpo and I assure you there are liberals, conservatives, heterosexuals, homosexuals, Christians, Muslims, and atheists in attendance and I wouldn't have it any other way.

I have little tolerance or sympathy for those with little tolerance or sympathy for other's views.

BTW - before you all get your self(s) all worked up I am an independent that has a record of voting more often then not on the conservative side but never ever vote completely on any one party line nor would I ever endorse any candidate (or viewpoint for that matter) without doing a little bit of information gathering and thinking on my own.
Click to expand...
 
matteni said:
Of your 78 posts - only 20 are remotely about the NSX and most others fall under divisive issues for which you have an obvious bias. One might start to conclude your only purpose here is "politically motivated" as well. :confused:
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So if I have an opinion and I express it I am "biased"??? Do you apply that irrational litmus test to everyone, or just those with whom you disagree?

matteni said:
That said, this is a board about NSXs with a little off topic banter to keep it interesting.
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This is an online information/communication resource for NSX owners. I assume the Off Topic forum exists for a reason. And who exactly put you in charge of regulating the content distribution for NSX Prime? Is the ability to post in any given forum in any way dependent on the number or content of posts in the Off Topic forum? If it is, I would love to hear the explanation.

Not that I have to justify anything to you, but since you brought it up I will respond. I have started a total of 17 threads, exactly ONE of which has been in the Off Topic category (as a matter of fact this one, and it is pretty much just pointing to a link). Since I am a relatively new NSX owner, I don't yet have much of value to offer in response to other owners' questions/comments re. the car itself (that will come with time). Almost all of my posts in the Off Topic category have been responses to posts in which other forum members have freely expressed their opinions on a variety of subjects. I myself have this silly little "free speech" tendency to voice my opinion whenever I read something with which I strongly disagree, especially when it pertains to some "divisive" issue (go figure). But never once have I initiated a personal attack on a specific forum member who's stated views I disagree with. I have, however, been forced to defend myself numerous times in response to certain members who apparently find it challenging to make their case without resorting to personal attacks.

matteni said:
The only thing we all have in common is the love of the NSX. I have been to NSXpo and I assure you there are liberals, conservatives, heterosexuals, homosexuals, Christians, Muslims, and atheists in attendance and I wouldn't have it any other way.
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I couldn't agree more. I am a firm believer that religious/cultural/racial/ethnic diversity (along with abundant natural resources and the genius of the Founding Fathers) is one of the primary reasons the United States is today a country without equal. I make every attempt to judge people solely by their actions. If you are insinuating otherwise, better get off your high horse and tread <I>very</I> carefully...

matteni said:
BTW - before you all get your self(s) all worked up I am an independent that has a record of voting more often then not on the conservative side but never ever vote completely on any one party line nor would I ever endorse any candidate (or viewpoint for that matter) without doing a little bit of information gathering and thinking on my own.
Click to expand...
I guess we have something in common after all. I have no party affiliation, but my views on social issues tend towards liberal and on most other issues lean conservative. Over the years I have probably voted more or less equally for candidates of both major parties, but never along strict party lines.

And here again, what exactly leads you to believe that I haven't done <I>"a little bit of information gathering and thinking on my own"</I>? Is it that my conclusions don't agree with yours? Is it the fact that I have arrived at a conclusion? Under what conditions would you find it acceptable to abandon your fence-sitting and take a definitive position on an issue? But a word of caution - if you ever do come to any conclusions, be aware that some people who don't know you may blindly accusing you of "bias".
 
The offtopic discussion area has more posts/threads than any of the NSX discussion forums, except General. Id' say off-topic stories and opinions are qiute popular and i don't mind NSXR1s posts (yes, i'm conservative) but if I do recall, we DID have a thread for Farenheit 9/11, so why not a 'counter' thread or a thread for Farenhype 9/11?
 
Thanks for the link. I had been meaning to order this DVD.

-J
 
NeSX said:
http://www.newsaic.com/f911index.html

Another possible source I just found. Not certain as to how independant it really is but some food for thought (does provide footnotes with sources of info).
Click to expand...

I haven't looked through this site thoroughly, but just a quick glance and I found a lot of wrong information on this page:

http://www.newsaic.com/f911chap2-1a.html

Iraq's use of chemical weapons against Iran does appear to have been a concern to the United States at the time. Official documents indicate that the United States did know that Iraq had used chemical weapons against Iran and had warned Iraq against doing so as early as November 1983. According to official documents available on-line here, Rumsfeld did not raise concerns about chemical weapons in his December 1983 meeting with Saddam Hussein, but did tell Iraqi Foreign Minister Tariq Aziz that the United States' "efforts to assist were inhibited by certain things that made it difficult for us[,] citing the use of chemical weapons, possible escalation in the Gulf, and human rights."

What the author completely ignores the various well-documented sales to Iraq of chemical weapons from American companies during this period with documented congressional approval. Apparently the author has not read the congressional report released in 1994 by the committee that investigated Iraqgate.
 
nsxr1 said:
Thank God for Dick Morris. His "Fahrenhype 9/11" DVD exposes Michael Moore's film for what it is - politically motivated and full of deceptions, half-truths and outright lies. I encourage everyone to see this before accepting the demagoguery of the Left...

http://www.overstock.com/cgi-bin/d2.cgi?PAGE=PROFRAME&PROD_ID=997495&TID=FAHRENHYPE&IID=PRO:997495
Click to expand...

Hmmm.. given Dick Morris' checkered past (remember the call girl in the hotel room while he was talking to President Clinton), I find it hard to take his word on anything.
As a matter of fact, when it comes to W's record, I will take Moore's word on it before I take Morris'.
 
Ahhh...so I guess you totally distrusted Clinton as well.

:D
 
JSMDMD said:
Hmmm.. given Dick Morris' checkered past (remember the call girl in the hotel room while he was talking to President Clinton), I find it hard to take his word on anything.
As a matter of fact, when it comes to W's record, I will take Moore's word on it before I take Morris'.
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So marital fidelity is your litmus test for a man's integrity? Then you no doubt considered Clinton unfit for office immediately upon learning of the Lewinski affair.

You are obviously free to believe whomever you find most credible. Leftist propaganda can be very effective, especially in the hands of professional Hollywood film makers.
 
Jimbo said:
Ahhh...so I guess you totally distrusted Clinton as well.

:D
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Not at all... Morris has an ax to grind with the Clintons and the Democratic party for his downfall.
And Clinton has come clean as far as his affair.... at a cost of $70 million...and two years of wasted time for our country..... thanks to Ken, Tom, etc...
So now, Morris is the darling of the right.
They deserve each other.
 
And Clinton has come clean...
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It's amazing how good that dry cleaning was on that blue dress.

:D

So, you're claiming that Dick Morris' points about Michael Moore are invalid because he doesn't like the Clintons anymore?

LOL!!!!
 
JSMDMD said:
And Clinton has come clean as far as his affair.... at a cost of $70 million...and two years of wasted time for our country..... thanks to Ken, Tom, etc...
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The Lewinski scandal was not about infidelity, in the Oval Office or otherwise. It was about lying UNDER OATH. Bill Clinton - while chief executive of the United States no less - willfully and knowingly lied to a federal judge and a federal grand jury in response to a legitimate sexual harrassment lawsuit brought against him. He swore to tell the truth, the <I>whole</I> truth and <I>nothing but</I> the truth, then proceeded to smugly violate that oath. This, in case you didn't realize, is an extremely serious crime. His personal rationale for lying is absolutely irrelevant.
 
I received the 'HYPE' dvd yesterday and watched it last night. It made some good points and appeared to have some strong factual rebutals to the original movie.
 
nsxr1 said:
The Lewinski scandal was not about infidelity, in the Oval Office or otherwise. It was about lying UNDER OATH. Bill Clinton - while chief executive of the United States no less - willfully and knowingly lied to a federal judge and a federal grand jury in response to a legitimate sexual harrassment lawsuit brought against him. He swore to tell the truth, the <I>whole</I> truth and <I>nothing but</I> the truth, then proceeded to smugly violate that oath. This, in case you didn't realize, is an extremely serious crime. His personal rationale for lying is absolutely irrelevant.
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That would be fine except the investigation was supposed to about Whitewater. A $70 million dollar, tax payer funded investigation about an old real estate investment in which no wrongdoing was found. Since Ken Starr could find nothing there, he proceded to investigate Clinton's personal life and thus the Lewinski incident. I'd personally say that lying to the Congress, the citizens of the US and world as well as the UN about the reasons for going to war is a little more serious than lying about sexual indiscretions. Remember indiscretions? They are not just for the "youthful" as in W's cocaine use and drunk driving. Last I recall, those were crimes as well. I won't comment on W being AWOL during a time of war though, because that has not been proven beyond a doubt yet. What has been proven is that while Cheney was at the helm, Halliburton defrauded the US government of millions of dollars. Halliburton recently paid a $7.5 million dollar fine for that. Where are your complaints about that "serious crime"? Once again, defrauding the US government and thus US taxpayers, of millions of dollars would seem a bit more serious that lying about a BJ, but that's just me.
 
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