I think my recent NSX purchase became more expensive... (pics+video inside)

[charlee]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

From not being there, it is hard to tell the source of the problem.

It sounds too high of a pitch to be a rod bearing.

If your oil pressure increases with rpm, then your rod bearing may NOT be the culprit.

Is a bent exhaust valve a possibility?

Drop the oil pan to see how extent of metal shavings.

Regardless, do not let the dealer get away with this. Make this public so other will not get dupped.

 

[bizlipkick]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

From not being there, it is hard to tell the source of the problem.

It sounds too high of a pitch to be a rod bearing.

If your oil pressure increases with rpm, then your rod bearing may NOT be the culprit.

Is a bent exhaust valve a possibility?

Drop the oil pan to see how extent of metal shavings.

Regardless, do not let the dealer get away with this. Make this public so other will not get dupped.

yea, oil pressure does increase with rpm. Goes up with speed and maintains as well. Still talking to dealer now, if he rectify's then the situation is taken care of, but if he doesn't, (which I should know soon) then Ill not just be letting the board know, everyone in his state will. Interesting about the exhaust valve, ill look into it. I guess another question is what causes the greenish silver liquid in the oil- my first thought is blown headgasket, or leaking headgasket...

 

[nis350]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

yea, oil pressure does increase with rpm. Goes up with speed and maintains as well. Still talking to dealer now, if he rectify's then the situation is taken care of, but if he doesn't, (which I should know soon) then Ill not just be letting the board know, everyone in his state will. Interesting about the exhaust valve, ill look into it. I guess another question is what causes the greenish silver liquid in the oil- my first thought is blown headgasket, or leaking headgasket...

Rent a compression gauge and that should tell you if you have valve or head gasket problems. I doubt you have bent valve, it would run like crap if you did. Did you see any oil in the coolant?

In case you can't return the car, perhaps you can get the dealer to pay for part of the repair, but either way, you really need to have an NSX mechanic verify the problem(s) first.

Good luck.

 

[bizlipkick]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Rent a compression gauge and that should tell you if you have valve or head gasket problems. I doubt you have bent valve, it would run like crap if you did. Did you see any oil in the coolant?

I think you really need to have an NSX mechanic verify the problem(s).

Checked, didn't see any oil in the coolant. It shakes pretty bad from 1-3k rpm's, then smoothed out after that. Working on getting it diagnosed now.

 

[Rob4092xx]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Absolutely untrue! That is what the contract may say but if they are a member of the Better Business Bureau, you will most likely get them to buy it back so long as you lodge a formal complaint. I have been a BBB Hearing Officer for over 20 years. Call your local BBB and see if they are registered then PM me if you need more info.

I don't know where the op is from, but here in TX, the "as is no warranty" sticker pretty much releases the dealer from liability if something like this happens after you sign the paperwork.

 

[BD]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Being in the car business for a while, all I can tell you is when "as is" is on the contract, they are not liable in any ways, shape, or form. You as a consumer had the right to have the car go through PPI before signing the purchase agreement.

Don't want to sound like a downer. When things like this happens, a good vender will take care of you out of good faith, most of them however, will not.

Good luck on that. Better Biz Bureau will not do anything because it is a used car, purchased "as is" as part of the agreement.

 

[Rob4092xx]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Bizlipkit and I have been chatting on e-mail. There is an "Agreement to Arbitrate" in his contract (like most reputable dealers place in their contracts.) This allows organizations such as BBB to hear and Arbitrate these types of issues. Has nothing to do with suing anyone or any "liability" by anyone. It is all about Arbitration.

The key is going to be the wording in the contract regarding "Arbitration." If the contract states the seller gets to choose who Arbitrates, it could get sticky unless they use the BBB. If the contract states both the "buyer and seller must agree on who to Arbitrate," Biz should be okay. If it states the "seller must select who Arbitrates," Biz is in the gold! He needs to use the BBB.

Now, once Arbitration is completed, the seller and buyer, by law, must accept the decision of the Hearing Officer and get on with their life. If they don't abide by the Hearing Officer's decision, the winning party can now sue the losing party and will win in civil court...every time!

Personally, in the hundreds of cases I have heard, about 80% go in favor of the dealer as most (not all) bend over backwards to make things right with the seller. Frequently, the buyer loses perspective and makes their decisions based upon emotion and not what is reasonable. Dealers rarely make decisions by emotion and just make them as "doing business." These types of buyers will never be satisfied so they take it to Hearing. At this point, buyers seldom win as the Hearing Officer will see what the real issue is.

In my experience, GM, Honda and Acura are absolutely the best companies out there when it comes to being reasonable during Arbitration. If any of these companies have not resolved the seller's concerns before the actual hearing, there is little chance the Hearing Officer will find in the buyer's favor. This demonstrates just how far GM, Honda and Acura will go to make things right for their customers!

Biz is going to e-mail me a copy of his contract. We will keep everyone posted!!!

Being in the car business for a while, all I can tell you is when "as is" is on the contract, they are not liable in any ways, shape, or form. You as a consumer had the right to have the car go through PPI before signing the purchase agreement.

Don't want to sound like a downer. When things like this happens, a good vender will take care of you out of good faith, most of them however, will not.

Good luck on that. Better Biz Bureau will not do anything because it is a used car, purchased "as is" as part of the agreement.

 

[KrayziE RussiaN]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Bizlipkit and I have been chatting on e-mail. There is an "Agreement to Arbitrate" in his contract (like most reputable dealers place in their contracts.) This allows organizations such as BBB to hear and Arbitrate these types of issues. Has nothing to do with suing anyone or any "liability" by anyone. It is all about Arbitration.

The key is going to be the wording in the contract regarding "Arbitration." If the contract states the seller gets to choose who Arbitrates, it could get sticky unless they use the BBB. If the contract states both the "buyer and seller must agree on who to Arbitrate," Biz should be okay. If it states the "seller must select who Arbitrates," Biz is in the gold! He needs to use the BBB.

Now, once Arbitration is completed, the seller and buyer, by law, must accept the decision of the Hearing Officer and get on with their life. If they don't abide by the Hearing Officer's decision, the winning party can now sue the losing party and will win in civil court...every time!

Personally, in the hundreds of cases I have heard, about 80% go in favor of the dealer as most (not all) bend over backwards to make things right with the seller. Frequently, the buyer loses perspective and makes their decisions based upon emotion and not what is reasonable. Dealers rarely make decisions by emotion and just make them as "doing business." These types of buyers will never be satisfied so they take it to Hearing. At this point, buyers seldom win as the Hearing Officer will see what the real issue is.

In my experience, GM, Honda and Acura are absolutely the best companies out there when it comes to being reasonable during Arbitration. If any of these companies have not resolved the seller's concerns before the actual hearing, there is little chance the Hearing Officer will find in the buyer's favor. This demonstrates just how far GM, Honda and Acura will go to make things right for their customers!

Biz is going to e-mail me a copy of his contract. We will keep everyone posted!!!

Being that I was in the car biz myself and a GM of a used car dealership... I can tell you this. The BBB cannot do anything in this situation and I've had this exact issue come up and filed with BBB. Only to be sided with us (the dealer). Although, in our case we offered the customer to repair their vehicle with free labor and them taking care of the parts and they were still not happy.

If you signed "as-is" paperwork it's really up to the dealer to rectify the situation but only if they wish to do so. They are NOT obligated by any means. Your signature just legally released them from any liability. I can tell you this, the arbitration agreement just says that the customer cannot go after the dealer in court. So that's even worse in this situation. We use to have the same thing as part of the contract. It will most likely be the dealers choice as to whom gets to arbitrate any dispute.

In this case there's really not a whole lot that can be done, unless the dealer is kind enough to help. If he's a high-end dealer, it would definitely be in his interest to do so because it would really hurt his business if people think that he sells cars that don't last. People will be less likely to shell out big money to buy from them.

Question, if they sell high-end cars are all of them sold without warranty? Usually they will sell with at least a 30/60/90 day warranty. Since they didn't that doesn't really sound like they are a reputable dealer. I understand not all sell with warranty, but if I'm buying a higher end car and shelling out a bunch of money I would expect some time of piece of mind if you're a "reputable" high-end dealer. I wouldn't expect it from the mom'n'pop cheaper car place, but someone that sells high-end cars should always offer some type of warranty.

 

[DRIFTER]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Is this the white car that went threw Mannheim a few weeks ago by chance?

 

[CL65 Captain]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Is this the white car that went threw Mannheim a few weeks ago by chance?

The car is black in his video on the first post.

 

[Rob4092xx]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Huh....I guess I don't need to go to work at BBB anymore as the hundreds of cases I have Arbitrated in the past 20 years must have been nothing more than a dream. Funny thing is I received a paycheck for these dreams. Wierd!

By the way....your explanation makes absolutely no sense as the dealer in your case wouldn't file a complaint with the BBB as you explain...the buyer does!

Being that I was in the car biz myself and a GM of a used car dealership... I can tell you this. The BBB cannot do anything in this situation and I've had this exact issue come up and filed with BBB. Only to be sided with us (the dealer). Although, in our case we offered the customer to repair their vehicle with free labor and them taking care of the parts and they were still not happy.

If you signed "as-is" paperwork it's really up to the dealer to rectify the situation but only if they wish to do so. They are NOT obligated by any means. Your signature just legally released them from any liability. I can tell you this, the arbitration agreement just says that the customer cannot go after the dealer in court. So that's even worse in this situation. We use to have the same thing as part of the contract. It will most likely be the dealers choice as to whom gets to arbitrate any dispute.

In this case there's really not a whole lot that can be done, unless the dealer is kind enough to help. If he's a high-end dealer, it would definitely be in his interest to do so because it would really hurt his business if people think that he sells cars that don't last. People will be less likely to shell out big money to buy from them.

Question, if they sell high-end cars are all of them sold without warranty? Usually they will sell with at least a 30/60/90 day warranty. Since they didn't that doesn't really sound like they are a reputable dealer. I understand not all sell with warranty, but if I'm buying a higher end car and shelling out a bunch of money I would expect some time of piece of mind if you're a "reputable" high-end dealer. I wouldn't expect it from the mom'n'pop cheaper car place, but someone that sells high-end cars should always offer some type of warranty.

 

[BD]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

You mentioned GM, Honda, etc. I'm going to assume they will take care of their customers on new cars, or certified used cars.

This car is 20 years old and is sold as is, no one is going to take it seriously.

BBB may look at the case but at the end like you said, 80% favors dealers.

As I have indicated, find out the problem first, if it is something wasn't disclosed by the vender when the car is sold, you may have something, but the chance of redeem is a long shot because it is still sold "as is."

 

[DRIFTER]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

"AS IS" is just that. As much as it sucks, anything you may or may not get from the dealer consider it a gift. I would refund you whatever profit I made on the car by reselling it if I were the dealer.

 

[SUNEDAZ]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

HERE'S A CHEAPER WAY TO GET RESULTS!!!

Call HIS local investigative news reporter, local news station, and tell them your story. The dealer should accept your offer of returning the car and you paying a small fee for the miles and you guys part ways no harm done. If he refuses, you relentlessly plaster your bad dealings with his business all over the web!!! Make sure you tell the TRUTH when you post negative comments.

I like the advise ROB4092XX is giving but I'm not an attorney just a guy who doesn't like bad customer service.

Good luck, and you mentioned JAG so I assume you are in the service. So thank you for your service to our country :smile:

 

[sidwac]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Does the dealer have some kind of "satisfaction Guaranteed" policy, many do. They say "sold as is" but then have the generic Satisfaction guarantee displayed in the window....an attorney may be advised here....

 

[bud777]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

I sympathize with your situation. I put a $7000 transmission into my NSX after about 150 miles. The dealer was across the country and i didn't even try to contact him. I can tell you this, if it is any consolation.....after it is fixed, you will absolutely forget about what you went through. An NSX with a new engine that you know is right will be such a joy that none of this will matter. 10 years from now, you won't even remember the money and you will still be grinning about the car. It's that good. Congratulations.

 

[SOURCE 1]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Guys, I mentioned contacting the dealer in the first or second reply on this topic but not because any of this is the dealers fault. Unless they knowingly hid the defect. And even if they did the buyer will have to prove that fact. That is very tough to do. I have been a dealer for 12 years and when bad stuff like this happens I usually take it on a case by case basis. If it was an NSX that this happened with I would gladly step up and either help the buyer with the repair or take care of it in full. It would all depend on what profit was made on the car. If I made a grand I would spend up to a grand in repairs. This just gets written off as a car I did not profit on. No big deal and it helps with the buyer not hating you. Fact is I am sure he bought the car "as-is no warranty". He deep down knows he should have had a PPI done on the car especially if the noise was seven slightly present prior to purchase.. Contacting the BBB will not somehow force the dealer to pay for it. The BBB will ask the dealer if there is anything they will do and if it goes far enough have some arbitration done. But there is no way for the BBB to make them do anything. It will just go against them as a problem not resolved and look bad for the future buyers of cars from the dealer. This has happened one time to me in 12 years on a dodge dakota. The customer called me 6 hours after buying it and told me it blew up. I sent a tow truck to the address given to tow it to our shop and have it repaired on my dollar. However when the tow driver arrived the truck was buried in about 18 inches of mud and the truck was covered in mud. Guess what? HE blew it up. Probably trying to get unstuck. NOT my problem. That was all on him. So a case by case basis is a must in these situations. Fact is you can not make everyone happy as hard as you may try. IF the dealer is a stand up dealer and wants to make sure he does what he can to make his customers happy then he will help you out. pay for parts or labor or something to make you happy and make a bad situation better. But unless he knowingly screwed you and you can prove it there is really nothing you can do. Atleast in Ohio..

 

[bizlipkick]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

HERE'S A CHEAPER WAY TO GET RESULTS!!!

Call HIS local investigative news reporter, local news station, and tell them your story. The dealer should accept your offer of returning the car and you paying a small fee for the miles and you guys part ways no harm done. If he refuses, you relentlessly plaster your bad dealings with his business all over the web!!! Make sure you tell the TRUTH when you post negative comments.

I like the advise ROB4092XX is giving but I'm not an attorney just a guy who doesn't like bad customer service.

Good luck, and you mentioned JAG so I assume you are in the service. So thank you for your service to our country :smile:

Thanks and I appreciate it. Compared with deployments and stuff, this sucks but it can be much worse. and to source, yea should have done the ppi. Absolutely- thought it was a deal to god to pass up- and I jumped a little quicker then I should. But, as I said, life gets much worse then my toy's breaking. Thanks for all your help guys, this community is nuts with how helpful people are, and the people who have reached out to help. Says allot of the NSX as a car and the people who drive them (you guys, I just stare at mine and drool ;-) )

 

[GBL1]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Dealer was a little one that sells "higher end" cars, but after talking to him for about 20 minutes I am sure this is going to go nowhere. He swears up and down it was fine, etc. etc.

Who is the dealer? Tell us his company name & website. Out him so nobody else falls victim.

This does not sound like an authorized Acura dealer. It sounds like one of MANY "high-end" car dealers that I have seen. Many are legit, but many more are nothing more that "Honest John Gypo We-Tote-the-Note" lot owners that buy their inventory from insurance salvage, repo, or lease return auctions, do a quickie reconditioning (putting as little money into the car as possible), keeping it for a few weeks to get their own personal jollies dogging the crud out of the car, then selling it for some poor buyer that has always wanted such a car and possibly has stars in their eyes.

I've test driven a few NSXs under these circumstances. When I quiz them about something on the car (after they advertised it as "runs prefect"), they always get all dumbed-down on me like, "No, it should be fine."..."That's the way they all are."..."I don't know anything about that."..."Don't worry, I'll have my mechanic take a look at it....so do you want to buy it or not?"

By all means, put a stop payment on that check ASAP! THAT will get the selling dealer's attention. When he freaks & threatens to call the police, tell him, "Fine, come get the car."

If he is any kind of reputable dealer, he will pony up to assist with the repair cost...if out of nothing else but a genuine good-will gesture.

If he decides to try taking YOU to court for damaging the vehicle and backing out of the deal after you signed for it "as-is"...let him. I bet it'll be a bluff...even if it's not, there's probably not a judge or jury that will side with the dealer...as many in the public already hold a low opinion view of used car salesmen in general.

Get out while you can and find another one....in better condition.


Addition:

Just read the rest of the thread. If you can't stop the check, forget the BBB (they're useless).

Call the State Attorney General's Office. This dealer might have a record already; if he screwed you in a cover-up, who else has he done this to...it ain't his first rodeo.

Attorney General can probably scare the dealer straight...

BUT...TELL US WHO THE DEALER IS...(inquiring minds want to know.)

>

 

[latzke]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

I don't know where the op is from, but here in TX, the "as is no warranty" sticker pretty much releases the dealer from liability if something like this happens after you sign the paperwork.

Last time I bought a used vehicle from a dealer (MDX from Honda dealer) I tried to hedge against this. I think it was suggested by a friend in the business as a good last concession to ask for.

When we were pretty much settled on a bottom line I reminded the salesman of his statements about how clean the car was and that it would be reliable...and my lack of certainty. He reiterated that it was a good car. I then asked for them to back this up and warranty the drive-train (specifically engine, transmission, engine/emissions controls - nothing else) for something like 60-90 days. Little stuff that might fail or I may have overlooked as being bad were on me...but I didn't want to be on the line for thousands of dollars if the engine/transmission were bum. They agreed, wrote something up or used a form they already had for this and the deal was done.

They did reimburse me for a bad O2 sensor that needed replacing during that period (emissions control). I imagine I would have have faced resistance had I experienced a more-costly "covered" issue...but at least would have had something in writing besides "no warranty" going for me in such a case. Either way it was worth asking for. Would have been worth a lot more had the climate control system been covered.

To OP, sorry about your experience...but glad you have an NSX out of it.

 

[GBL1]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Last time I bought a used vehicle from a dealer (MDX from Honda dealer) I tried to hedge against this. I think it was suggested by a friend in the business as a good last concession to ask for.

When we were pretty much settled on a bottom line I reminded the salesman of his statements about how clean the car was and that it would be reliable...and my lack of certainty. He reiterated that it was a good car. I then asked for them to back this up and warranty the drive-train (specifically engine, transmission, engine/emissions controls - nothing else) for something like 60-90 days. Little stuff that might fail or I may have overlooked as being bad were on me...but I didn't want to be on the line for thousands of dollars if the engine/transmission were bum. They agreed, wrote something up or used a form they already had for this and the deal was done.

Great idea! I'll certainly keep that advice in mind for the future...and to pass around to friends who are shopping and/or for when I, on occasion, go along to help them negotiate or broker a car deal...basically just helping them navigate the shark-infested waters that buying a car usually entails. It's actually helpful in that I have no emotions in the deal.

 

[GO KRT]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Pardon me for saying this but all of this seems a bit premature without knowing for a fact that there is actually a problem that needs to be addressed. It sure seems like there might be a problem but I haven't seen the evidence yet??? Or did I miss it?? IF/WHEN you can factually support that you have an issue that needs to be addressed and if/when the dealer refuses or accepts THAT is the time to take up arms or get satisfaction. This reminds me too much of one of my favorite sayings: "Worry is paying interest on your problem before the debt becomes due". What's the limit for small claims court in your area? Good luck and I hope everything turns out well for you.

 

[bigbadberry]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

In for update?

 

[nbuch001]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Huh....I guess I don't need to go to work at BBB anymore as the hundreds of cases I have Arbitrated in the past 20 years must have been nothing more than a dream. Funny thing is I received a paycheck for these dreams. Wierd!

By the way....your explanation makes absolutely no sense as the dealer in your case wouldn't file a complaint with the BBB as you explain...the buyer does!

Rob,

I am sure your experiences providing services for the BBB have resolved many disputes and it is a great resource for parties willing to arbitrate. However, I think there is a confusion with the legal issues here and what the BBB is capable of doing for an unsatisfied customer.

First lets point one thing out the BBB is not an enforcement agency. In other words they cannot enforce complaince of arbitration. Only a court can do that. In fact here is a direct quote from the BBB:

"Although BBB does not have legal and policing powers, we provide information about marketplace fraud through alerts on scams to the public.

BBB works closely with local, state and federal law enforcement agencies, providing them with valuable information on potential frauds. Many times we are the first organization to know about a developing scam and alert authorities and the public. When a scam develops in one part of the country, the news travels quickly between BBBs in the U.S., Canada and Puerto Rico that in turn alert the public in their communities."

Second for each state there are specific contract regulations. Generally speaking if you enter into a contract that declares an "as is" sale the seller is purchasing the merchandise without warranty, expressed or implied. This exempts the seller from any liability for defect within the product. The reason for this is that we all have the right to contract as we see fit so long as it does not violate what the court would consider public policy. This is actually a constitutional right which protects our right to contract from government intrusion, to a certian extent (there is extensive case interpretation on this issue). Never the less, in an "as is" matter there is no required arbitration or mediation for the most logical of reasons (released liability).

Now if there is not an "as is" provision then we have a whole different story. Let's say the contract stated that upon breach both parties must arbitrate with (insert arbitrating entity) before a law suit can be filed. Then under the terms of the contract the court may choose to enforce the arbitration before a law suit may be filed.

The case law on this issue is vast an complicated. Your advise may be wise but it isn't necessarily how the issue is assessed from a legal stand point and certaintly isn't even close to any case law. If you are suggesting that the BBB will forceably resolve the issue for the OP that is incorrect. Both parties must be willing participants. I think what other people are implying on this issue is that if the seller is unwilling to work with the buyer through arbitration or any other outlet and the purchase agreement was an "as is" basis there are really no other options.

Nick

 

[nis350]

Re: I think my recent NSX purchase became mor eexpensive... (pics+video inside)

Pardon me for saying this but all of this seems a bit premature without knowing for a fact that there is actually a problem that needs to be addressed.

I really feel bad for the OP, but this is what I was thinking as well. I know anything is possible, but it is just unusual to have this type of major engine problems with such low mileage.

I hope this won't turn out to be a rod bearing failure. GL OP.