Found this on U-Tube
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zcd_Md_jsVA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zcd_Md_jsVA
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Laguna Seca NSX Parade Lap
- Thread starter Coz
- Start date
What can be learned from this?
What did they do to loose control?
Later,
Don
What did they do to loose control?
Later,
Don
I'm still trying to figure out how anyone can even lose control in a parade lap 
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49 NSXs
who cares how they went off
who cares how they went off
As Chic Hearn would say:
"No harm, no foul, no blood, no ambulance."
As long as no NSX's were harmed. They can all spin around like tops. :wink::tongue::biggrin:
"No harm, no foul, no blood, no ambulance."
As long as no NSX's were harmed. They can all spin around like tops. :wink::tongue::biggrin:
Hard to say for sure, but I watched it several times now and this is my very informal evaluation.
First of all, it looks like he may have been offline, meaning he hit the left-hand apex too soon which left his car pointing directly into the dirt on the other side of the track that's just before the next right-hand apex. Then there's the fact that it looks like he's carrying too much speed for the line he took. So that forced him to brake while turning left to avoid running off. Braking putting weight more to a front bias as well as during turning and added to all THAT he was now pointed downhill, further unweighting the rears. That caused the original slide. The rest is over-correcting while rears were still unweighted.
A lot of my friends who track NSXs said that in an NSX you should get back on throttle in that kind of situation. I can only imagine how hard it would be to do that unless you're prepared to do so and thinking and waiting for when to get on the throttle (or unless you're a skilled driver who just has that reaction from experience).
I should be a CSI agent :biggrin:
j
First of all, it looks like he may have been offline, meaning he hit the left-hand apex too soon which left his car pointing directly into the dirt on the other side of the track that's just before the next right-hand apex. Then there's the fact that it looks like he's carrying too much speed for the line he took. So that forced him to brake while turning left to avoid running off. Braking putting weight more to a front bias as well as during turning and added to all THAT he was now pointed downhill, further unweighting the rears. That caused the original slide. The rest is over-correcting while rears were still unweighted.
A lot of my friends who track NSXs said that in an NSX you should get back on throttle in that kind of situation. I can only imagine how hard it would be to do that unless you're prepared to do so and thinking and waiting for when to get on the throttle (or unless you're a skilled driver who just has that reaction from experience).
I should be a CSI agent :biggrin:
j
People that drive black nsxs don't take the corkscrew too well!
I don't think so...
I believe the spin is completely avoidable with a little bit of training.
A stock NSX is easy to control and if driven properly would not have spun.
Who am I to say this?
At NSXPO last month there were several that were doing in excess of 100mph
down the highway & on back roads on one of the drives.
Afterwards I asked if they were going to go to the track event.
The response was NO. I don't want to hurt my car.
Let's see... Passably no formal driver training and excessive speed.
The track it is a controlled environment most HPDE groups offer in car instruction. Hint!:smile:
Just ask any of the ones that have tried it.
Don, Amen to that!!! I'd rather drive my car at an organized DE than in a spirited drive or canyon run. If the driver had any insight, you could see that approaching turn 8 to the far left will create a straight line through the corkscrew at 80 mph+. I'm sure the Porsche guys are shaking their heads.
Had he had the Zanardi suspension, then maybe he could have taken the Zanardi line through there like the first one.
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Ahh YES!!! "The Pass," made famous by Zanardi
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After the most recent re-pave you can fly through the corkscrew. :smile:
Unfortunately I had a friend that Died on a drive after a car event.
Road was wet on a corner he went off and hit a tree.
I go to the track to get all my go fast driving out of my system.
You can't begin to push the car on the street as you can on track.
EXACTLY! Which is why I get a little perturbed when Primers ask or complain about understeer or oversteer. My first question is "Is this on the track?" Of which the response is always, "no, on the street." Huh? How does one get to the limits of the NSX on the street? Power On oversteer? Drop Throttle oversteer? Well, ya... but your suspension changes won't effect this. Which goes back to how does one reach the limits of the NSX on the street? I do ALOT of track driving and I can't reach those limits on the street. But then again, I don't keep a Cougar in the car or a Kilo of Coke taped underneath.
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Re: Kids these days
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
Watching the clip over and over, I am coming to a conclusion that such behaviours were really unwarranted, and really makes a fool of the the entire NSX community. I concur with some of the comments made by the spectators.
The black one that went off course was hitting the first apex too soon too fast, if at all. The lowered suspension bottomed out (you could hear the bodywork scraping on the pavement) on the dip, and even if the driver tried to turn left, it appears to have understeered as there was little weight on the wheels. Had the suspension been left as it was, he might have had a chance to stay on course.
The second one that ended up spinning was not really anticipating the second apex. By the time its rear end started to swing over for the first time, the car was already pointed away from the second apex. Then, as someone else has already pointed out, the driver overcorrected, and probably braked, making the situation worse. Had the driver simply stayed on gas, he might have had a chance to recover.
It all comes down to driver skills. This was just a parade, guys, if you are on Prime, not a freaking race. I think we all would benefit from more training (I know I do) and if we want to go faster, $3000 invested in more training would provide much greater return than $3000 in "go-fast" or "look fast" gear.
I wouldn't be surprised if we don't get invited back the next time.
Off my soapbox, now.
The black one that went off course was hitting the first apex too soon too fast, if at all. The lowered suspension bottomed out (you could hear the bodywork scraping on the pavement) on the dip, and even if the driver tried to turn left, it appears to have understeered as there was little weight on the wheels. Had the suspension been left as it was, he might have had a chance to stay on course.
The second one that ended up spinning was not really anticipating the second apex. By the time its rear end started to swing over for the first time, the car was already pointed away from the second apex. Then, as someone else has already pointed out, the driver overcorrected, and probably braked, making the situation worse. Had the driver simply stayed on gas, he might have had a chance to recover.
It all comes down to driver skills. This was just a parade, guys, if you are on Prime, not a freaking race. I think we all would benefit from more training (I know I do) and if we want to go faster, $3000 invested in more training would provide much greater return than $3000 in "go-fast" or "look fast" gear.
I wouldn't be surprised if we don't get invited back the next time.
Off my soapbox, now.
Yes...I concur. I was the 7th car in the the pack, and while I didn't take the initial left as tight as I should have, at least I know how to drive my car. I don't track my NSX, but I have upgraded the suspension pretty well and I do my "training" on uneven pavement and twisty roads. I bought the car to drive her, not to be a garage queen.
This was a parade, and we should treat it as such...in fact we were generously given a "pace lap" instead of a parade lap since it was assumed by SCRAMP that "we all knew how to drive our cars". I hope we get invited back for a lap, but who knows what will happen.
In the meanwhile, I have Bondurant in my future in 2009. The better I know how to drive, the better I can use the NSX to her utmost abilities, giving both of us enjoyment.
OMG: you guys need to get a life. FUN was had by all and it was on a track so it was much better than the 100+ on winding open roads at Expo :tongue:
Sure, it was all fun, but next year's fun could be spoiled by a couple of the yahoos we had. If I were managing the event, I wouldn't invite the group, or it will be a 35 mph parade lap, not a fast lap, as we enjoyed.
Invited
The tickets were ~$75 right. I didn't see ANY overcrowding so as always "follow the money" :smile:
The tickets were ~$75 right. I didn't see ANY overcrowding so as always "follow the money" :smile:
I wish I had something meaningful to say in response to this vid.
Firstly, I laughed pretty hard at the sight of the off and the spin. The reaction of the crowd was pretty good too.
Second, I can't understand how anyone can lose control of their car on a parade/"pace" lap. I feel embarrassed and a little happy that I missed the registration deadline and was relegated to watching the day from turn 1.
I'm willing to bet that the people who lost control in the corkscrew push their cars hard on public roads. Please guys, take some driving lessons. And be safe out there.
Firstly, I laughed pretty hard at the sight of the off and the spin. The reaction of the crowd was pretty good too.
Second, I can't understand how anyone can lose control of their car on a parade/"pace" lap. I feel embarrassed and a little happy that I missed the registration deadline and was relegated to watching the day from turn 1.
I'm willing to bet that the people who lost control in the corkscrew push their cars hard on public roads. Please guys, take some driving lessons. And be safe out there.
I thought the guy was trying to drift? Thank goodness it only has a 6 banger. It's time to invest in a $500.00+ Skip Barber driving control class. It may save your life and your car.
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How closed is it to the GT4?? Could those guys already practiced a lot with GT and then came to realize their hands and feet are a little slower than their fingers?
If I ever go to Laguna Seca, I will probably drive a lot faster than, say, Thunder Hill or Streets of Willow since I have countless hours on the Laguan Seca on GT3 and GT4...
I do agree that it's unbelievable of how people drives in the streets yet "afraid" to go to the track.
But then I see the other side of it too, generally, Track people thinks nsx limit being at x speed at certain corner, and with high rpm running the whole day. no doubt you are really pushing the car especially after the tires are warmed up. "Street" enthusiast worrying if the engine/tranny/tires/brakes holding up, and in reality, we all know how steep the hill is once you addicted to track driving.
The way I see it, there's no difference pushing the car with cold tires in canyon roads. Of course you don't even come closed to track driving latereal acceleration"G", you are not taking the whole road and you have to hold back in some corners vesus you could "cut" a few corners safely. That makes mountain roads fun, as long as you know what you are doing. Often times, people who drives fast on mountain road have good car control and they'd do well with track drivings. (But then I have to admit I enjoyed driving my miata than my nsx, just that to get the same level of excitement, my nsx is in a no mistake margin, I know one mishap will kill me or someone instantly)
and I don't even want to bring up the insurance issues....
My opinion is a little swayed as back side of my local track, the Pacific Raceway isn't so different than mountain roads up here. Bumpy, Narrow, no margin for mistakes.
** Looks like I missed the great nsxpo drive. 100 mph cruise??:biggrin:
If I ever go to Laguna Seca, I will probably drive a lot faster than, say, Thunder Hill or Streets of Willow since I have countless hours on the Laguan Seca on GT3 and GT4...
I do agree that it's unbelievable of how people drives in the streets yet "afraid" to go to the track.
But then I see the other side of it too, generally, Track people thinks nsx limit being at x speed at certain corner, and with high rpm running the whole day. no doubt you are really pushing the car especially after the tires are warmed up. "Street" enthusiast worrying if the engine/tranny/tires/brakes holding up, and in reality, we all know how steep the hill is once you addicted to track driving.
The way I see it, there's no difference pushing the car with cold tires in canyon roads. Of course you don't even come closed to track driving latereal acceleration"G", you are not taking the whole road and you have to hold back in some corners vesus you could "cut" a few corners safely. That makes mountain roads fun, as long as you know what you are doing. Often times, people who drives fast on mountain road have good car control and they'd do well with track drivings. (But then I have to admit I enjoyed driving my miata than my nsx, just that to get the same level of excitement, my nsx is in a no mistake margin, I know one mishap will kill me or someone instantly)
and I don't even want to bring up the insurance issues....
My opinion is a little swayed as back side of my local track, the Pacific Raceway isn't so different than mountain roads up here. Bumpy, Narrow, no margin for mistakes.
** Looks like I missed the great nsxpo drive. 100 mph cruise??:biggrin:
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It all comes down to driver skills. This was just a parade said:
