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Love Fab Vs Ctsc

I have never had a manual car with a blower, only a turbo, the lag never bothered me in a turbo, but the Evo was really slow on the highway up at speed, but was a rocket from 0-80. Small turbo, instant boost, power to be desired uptop. Much like an american V8

The GTI was the opposite. as it was really quick on the highway but kind of a dog around town under 40 mph.
Keep in mind the EVO is only a 2.0L 4 cylinder. Were you on the stock turbo?

EVOs are really quick to about 80 or 100. But due to their short gearing and AWD drivetrain loss they loose a lot of their steam at higher speeds (as you have stated).

Your GTI is also only 1.8 or 2.0L. What size turbo were you running on that?

The smaller your displacement, the longer it takes for the exhaust gasses to spool up a turbo. But for the NSX, even a 500whp capable turbo dosn't feel dead slow then hit hard like a small displacement 4-cylinder, because it has enough HP and displacement to spool the turbo quicker.


I agree with RON98 about "if you have too much lag, you're in the wrong gear",

-but 550AWD whp from a 2.0L, with a powerband between 6,000-8,500rpm isn't very usable, is useless on the street (for fun), and must be kept in that small window for performance around a track...
 
Can the comptech (auto rotor) be built up to have 400WHP?
.

Many guys using California dynos are there, above it, or just just below it with the base kit and maybe some tuning. Most other dynos show the base kit at 360ish whp, which is what mine dyno'd at.

I believe that if you:
1) go to a minimum sized pully
2) have a proper tune using the new AEM FMU
3) have some type of cooling, ie intercooler or water injection

that yes, you will be at least 400 whp with the new autorotor
 
Keep in mind the EVO is only a 2.0L 4 cylinder. Were you on the stock turbo?

EVOs are really quick to about 80 or 100. But due to their short gearing and AWD drivetrain loss they loose a lot of their steam at higher speeds (as you have stated).

Your GTI is also only 1.8 or 2.0L. What size turbo were you running on that?

The smaller your displacement, the longer it takes for the exhaust gasses to spool up a turbo. But for the NSX, even a 500whp capable turbo dosn't feel dead slow then hit hard like a small displacement 4-cylinder, because it has enough HP and displacement to spool the turbo quicker.


I agree with RON98 about "if you have too much lag, you're in the wrong gear",

-but 550AWD whp from a 2.0L, with a powerband between 6,000-8,500rpm isn't very usable, is useless on the street (for fun), and must be kept in that small window for performance around a track...


The GTI had a stock K03 Turbo, To keep in the stock class at auto cross. But IT would hang with E46 M3's on the highway as long as the rpm was between 3K and 5k. Evo was stock G16 turbo too but a small motor to push it.

Love Fab I am sure has a reliable system that works very well and produces some great numbers.

Comptech is proven reliable but I am afraid of not getting the output out of it that I want.
 
If you have a reputable tuner who has successfully tuned Turbo NSXs (that have lasted) in the area... go turbo! I guarantee you'll be happy with a Tubo NSX setup.
 
Comptech is proven reliable but I am afraid of not getting the output out of it that I want.

My car dyno'ed at 249 on a very conservative dyno stock. I installed a CTSC and a GT-One header and 5.0 exhaust, a uni-filter and the same car on the same dyno put down 368. On a dynojet dyno I put down 392. My car runs a hair on the rich side, totally flat A/F ratios with no engine management. Stock injectors, pump, etc. I am basically, 20 some odd HP from being over 400 at the wheels. I know that with a higher boost pulley, injectors, and engine management the car will be over 400 on a real dyno. You already factored that cost in with your original post, you know that right?

But no one has done this on the autorotor yet. I don't know why, maybe people are happy. I am conservative, and safety is very important to me. I didn't like the AEM because I didn't want to lose my CEL functionality, and I didn't want to not pass smog. I have considered the HKS Vpro, Factor X would do that for a pretty good deal for me including flying here and tuning the car, injectors, pump and pulley. The Vpro keeps CEL functionality and it is also a more advanced setup than the AEM. I am waiting to see an intercooler first before going for it all. I think that the CTSC intercooled and managed will be an amazing system.

For me it all still boils down to the same thing. I love turbos and thing they are efficient and they give great power. They also give you better MPG if that matters at all. It is why Acura's RDX and the Mini Cooper S are now turbo. It makes for a more efficient engine. But.... I just personally prefer a roots type SC for a track car, and I consider the NSX a factory track car.

I know that Kip's 3.8 liter supercharged engine would be perfect for me. 500 HP and a beautiful power band on very conservative boost. Shad really did his homework on that one.
 
If you have a reputable tuner who has successfully tuned Turbo NSXs (that have lasted) in the area... go turbo! I guarantee you'll be happy with a Tubo NSX setup.

I agree with stuntman, I think that having someone local is very important. If Cody is close to you that means a lot. I too think with either SC or turbo you will be very happy.
 
I also concurr.
A good tuner close by is priceless.
I would go with the turbo kit.
If turbo kits was not efficient, not reliable,
then why would most car manufactors go
with turbo setups over super charged setups.
 
. I didn't like the AEM because I didn't want to lose my CEL functionality, and I didn't want to not pass smog.

I want to clarify that the MSL is not an authorized AEM product. They "know of it", and might support any warranty issues linked to the product, but it is not and should not be branded as an AEM product.

I just want to avoid any confusion because the AEM FIC works flawlessly with the OBDII NSX's, and is a product designed for function on any OBDII application, including the NSX.

The AEM FIC should enable you to pass smog, keep CEL functionality and have a very high level of tuneability. As I stated above, we have had nothing but GREAT results from the FIC. Any tuning shop should be able to tune the FIC(this could be good or bad, do your homework), and the overall cost is quite inexpensive in comparision to the end result.

Just my $.02 as I don't think many people really know about the FIC yet.
 
I am also wondering why HP was not considered?
 
And Im planning on giving Cody my Supercharged car to see what he can do with an AEM FIC and a teeny tiny pulley.

CODY GOES BOTH WAYS

LOL... Dave what about an intercooler?
 
I know that this has been beaten to death on the boards, but I am going to be pulling the trigger on the FI on my 2003 NSX here in the spring.

LOVEFAB
400 WHP, 12k out the door installed. (budget system)
Includes Exhaust and Headers, AEM, and Tuning. Its creator is only 4 hours away for any issues or problems. Room to grow with more power as the wallet allows for it to in the future.

CTSC (auto Rotor)
350WHP, 10k investment out the door installed.
Still needs Exhaust, headers, HF Cats, High Boost kit and AEM to get the true potential of the system realized for another 6k installed and tuned. Big thing with this system is that it passes emissions, is this true?

Both of these systems need a new clutch to hold the power.

In my own mind the Love Fab turbo set up wins this comparison by quite a bit! What Am I missing, leaving out or uninformed about while making this decision?

Joe

You have a 2003, so the base line is strong to begin with. I witness few 2002 plus NSX with CTSC dyno'd above 390 with out AEM at Autowave last year. CTSC will be fine and it is a proven system. Just have to wait for Comptech to get back to business.
 
My car dyno'ed at 249 on a very conservative dyno stock. I installed a CTSC and a GT-One header and 5.0 exhaust, a uni-filter and the same car on the same dyno put down 368. On a dynojet dyno I put down 392. My car runs a hair on the rich side, totally flat A/F ratios with no engine management. Stock injectors, pump, etc. I am basically, 20 some odd HP from being over 400 at the wheels. I know that with a higher boost pulley, injectors, and engine management the car will be over 400 on a real dyno. You already factored that cost in with your original post, you know that right?

But no one has done this on the autorotor yet. I don't know why, maybe people are happy. I am conservative, and safety is very important to me. I didn't like the AEM because I didn't want to lose my CEL functionality, and I didn't want to not pass smog. I have considered the HKS Vpro, Factor X would do that for a pretty good deal for me including flying here and tuning the car, injectors, pump and pulley. The Vpro keeps CEL functionality and it is also a more advanced setup than the AEM. I am waiting to see an intercooler first before going for it all. I think that the CTSC intercooled and managed will be an amazing system.

For me it all still boils down to the same thing. I love turbos and thing they are efficient and they give great power. They also give you better MPG if that matters at all. It is why Acura's RDX and the Mini Cooper S are now turbo. It makes for a more efficient engine. But.... I just personally prefer a roots type SC for a track car, and I consider the NSX a factory track car.

I know that Kip's 3.8 liter supercharged engine would be perfect for me. 500 HP and a beautiful power band on very conservative boost. Shad really did his homework on that one.

Dave,

Kip has a Comptech 3.5 Liter engine. Just wanted to let you know just in case you were thinking of buying one later. If you ever want a power boost with your SC I think it would be a hot set up with the AEM FIC and Driving Ambition intercooler.
 
And Im planning on giving Cody my Supercharged car to see what he can do with an AEM FIC and a teeny tiny pulley.

CODY GOES BOTH WAYS


Why don't you just remove the SC pulley and machine serpentine grooves into the shaft where the pulley attaches ? :biggrin:
 
I am getting lost with some of the names being thrown around

Cody I know and have talked to
Who is:
Shad
Factor X
Autowave
HP designs

Factor X Enginering: Tuner in Las Vegas that specializes in NSXs. Customizes turbo kits to your liking, but most notably is their FX500 kit which will generate about 500 whp. Also participates heavily in racing events, winning several of the last few they participated in. SN: Stuntman is their driver.
 
Supercharge it and It seems like turbo guys are still in the R&D stage on the NSX's. Alot of debate about having it on the hot side or not. Lot of systems made now are on the hot side, causing real high IAT's. Even with the meth/water injection, real high temps were found. Also I know alot of people selling thier personal turbo kits lately, there's got to be a reason. The supercharger is easier to maintain, and has a long track record and I haven't heard many problems with them. But these guys above actuallly have a turbo/supercharger on thier nsx and they should know better than I, I don't have either. But with deep pockets you will be happy eitherway.
 
I am getting lost with some of the names being thrown around

Cody I know and have talked to
Who is:
Shad
Factor X
Autowave
HP designs
Shad is Driving Ambition in Gold River CA. Ex-Comptech, knows more about roots superchargers on the NSX than any other person on the planet! He designed and built Kip Olsen's stupid fast 3.5L High boost, 2.3 L SC NSX. He is also responsible for Steve Ghent's White turbo'ed race car that took second(to Factor X) at the Laguna Seca Time attach, driven by Kip(Damn good for a guy who drive a tractor for a living).

He is the most 'straight shooting' guy in this community. His strongest point is he is great at matching products to peoples wants. He won't sell you stuff you don't need and can't use! Just the things that will help you reach your goals!
 
The supercharger will only keep you happy until you drive one of the turbo cars.

Supercharge it and It seems like turbo guys are still in the R&D stage on the NSX's. Alot of debate about having it on the hot side or not. Lot of systems made now are on the hot side, causing real high IAT's. Even with the meth/water injection, real high temps were found. Also I know alot of people selling thier personal turbo kits lately, there's got to be a reason. The supercharger is easier to maintain....

Posts like this just irritate me. What is so sorted out about the CTSC? They were tinkering with it over its entire life cycle, including replacing the crappy, poorly-thought-out choice for the original blower. And, they never got past their half-assed 'engine management.' Got oil all over your hatch? Thank the 'production' version of the CTSC. How about the lame boost-a-pump instead of a real fuel pump upgrade? Wow, there's some fine engineering. Now get the belt tight enough not to slip at all with the 'high-boost' pulley and see how long it lasts. More fine engineering there.

Overall, Cody's kit (the subject of this thread) is more complete and more fully developed than ANY version of the blower kit Comptech sold. And, please elaborate on high-IATs with his system - where did you find out about them and which car are they on? Or, are you just injecting hearsay from some home-made kit into the discussion for no reason? BTW, you might want to check out the IATs from the 'high-boost' CTSC - they can be worse than many turbo systems, including the LoveFab. I've seen over 200 on them here in the summer. My 600hp turbo system didn't get close to that, even on hard track days.

And you think maintenance is worse with the LoveFab kit? How? Please be specific as to what you will need to do extra regarding maintenance that you wouldn't do to any well-cared-for car. For starters, you won't need to swap out belts or blower oil. . . .
 
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Well said! My current IAT's don't exceed 140
 
I own a CTSCed NSX, it is a 92 using the Whipple SC. I have ridden in both Cody's and Woody's cars and just want to state for the record: "There is NO COMPARISON, when speaking of HP output". These turbos are FAR more powerful than than my SCed car on its best day.

Woody's car is so dependable he uses it as his daily driver and I have seem him in Chicago "Rush Hour" traffic IN THE SNOW. If I recall correctly, he has logged over 30K on the car since the turbo install.

I am NOT a turbo guy but I can not deny the shear power of Cody's car or the incredible performance coupled with the dependability of Woody's. I, like Ken Sampson, am following the SC path because I like it, not because I am searching for the the most HP. If it was a quest for HP, just look at the posts on Prime concerning dyno #s. Turbos just produce bigger #s.:eek:

This is just my opinion based on my experiences and each must decide what they want to accomplish with their car; I just try to remember we do this for FUN. :wink: :biggrin: Which ever way you decide to go Best of Luck and I hope it turns out to be as much FUN as I am having.:cool:
 
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