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My track NSX conundrum, looking for advise.

Joined
19 January 2011
Messages
715
So I've reached a conundrum of sorts and I guess I am looking for a bit of advise from older and wiser people that share the same trackday addiction.

I bought my NSX as a gift to myself almost three years ago when I finally landed a gig i was shooting for.

It has always been, hands down, my favorite car, likely for same reasons that bring all of you to this forum. I searched and searched and researched and researched and settled on my low 40k mile formula red 92 5 speed. Honeymoon period till now nothing has been too good for it, All services and preventive maintenance are carried out to the 't'.
Around a year into my ownership I decided to move from the suburbs to be closer to said gig, I sold my then current s2000 track car and some motorcycles to cut the fat and squeeze in to the new urban digs. It was also around this time that I noticed the NSX gets a TON of attention around Los Angeles. I'd say 80% of this attention is the unwanted kind either from cops or rice boys following me to parking lots to 'look' at the car. Fellow enthusiasts aside, I am astute enough to know when people have some sort of shady intention and I was getting that vibe more than I was comfortable with.
This and the fact that no one can drive in LA. Yes, thats a fact. Friend after friend has had cars totaled by some moron not paying attention then add to that awful pitted roads and steep parking lots, the NSX started to rarely even see a weekend end drive around town.

Now, currently, the only time i've been taking it out has been the 4am leave time for track days, of which I do about 3-5 times a month. The car has progressed, somewhat unwittingly, into more or less a track-day only machine with all the trappings that go along. Low, full race seat (only drivers so I can fit wheels and splitter in the pasenger space) stiff coilovers, sump, HUGE wing, harsh pads, LOUD exhaust, test pipes, no stereo, 3 sets of wheels- 2 with R componds... this only further 86's the thought of driving it anywhere around town.

Dont get me wrong, I LOVE it. There is nothing like it. Driving and learning every nuance of my dream car is very gratifying and 'worth it'. The looks from people after pulling in to the paddock after screaming down the straight or being sideways through a corner- it seems to really fire people up the same way it does for me. Ive met plenty of great people because of it and they more or less say "Its SO cool that you are out here driving that thing how it was designed to be driven" If im honest that's been somewhat of a point of pride.

I should give a little preface. For 15 years I have either owned a daily that I tracked or, as i got older and could afford it, had dedicated track car. In the past, my dedicated track cars have always been dear to me but not something that would cause me an palpitations if I shunted.

So here we are three years on and Ive easily put another 13-15k on TOP of the cars value on track related upgrades and am more or less planning to spend another 10k this coming few months. For perspective, My daily driver costs half what the nsx track day base value is... This all sort of dawned on me as I was filing my NSX receipts. To make matters 'worse' (as if this isnt the epitome of a first world problem) I have reached a point where I really need upgrades to safety before driving any of the faster tracks out here again. With the mods and seat time I'm starting to dip into some pretty fast times and some high speeds in sketchy areas. After seeing some pretty bad 'unavoidable' wrecks this year and data logging some track days its become apparent I need to invest in some more serious safety devices; kill switch, revamped harnesses and seat, halon, and most importantly.. cage.

Now, this has been my traditional stepping off point in the past. Whatever the car has been up to that point- its now a tool. No more street driving unless very unique and rare situation, creature comforts make way for safety and speed.. and then just like a beautiful butterfly going back into a cocoon it reemerges a less frail more capable and bad ass utilitarian car.

This is my dilemma.

When I remove emotion and the nearsighted 'YOLO commentary' I get from friends- it dosn't take me long to start seeing how having such a monetarily and emotionally invested 'track car' is somewhat of a double negative.

I know that there are many people on here that bought an nsx BECAUSE it was the cheapest option for a track car within their substantial means. I am not one of those people, It wouldn't ruin me, but I would have a difficult time walking away from what I have invested. also insurance dosent pay for track damage:frown:. Caging and gutting by nature makes the car more or less a 'lifer' and that's a big commitment too.

I guess I'm at the point where I can stop sell the mods and just deal with rarely enjoying the car till i move. If I did that id have to get another 'cheaper' track tool and store it and spend on it. ORRRR I drive the NSX directly to the roll cage fabricator, guns blazing exhaust blaring and hundred dollar bills wafting out the open hatch.

thoughts?
 
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Track prep it and enjoy. Sell your DD and buy a second mostly-stock high-mileage NSX for the street.

Done :biggrin:
 
This is why I bought an NSX that was NOT pristine, lol.

That said, I've had similar thoughts. I don't think I'll take my car too far beyond where it is currently on the slippery slope to "racecar". I'm going to run a season of TT with it for giggles, and then find something disposable to take wheel-to-wheel (e-30/old Datsun/MR2).

My quandry then, given the nature of my car will be to justify keeping it if I'm not going to "play" with it. Such is life I suppose.
 
I'd say that there are better track cars out there than the NSX. S2000 comes to mind. It's cheaper to maintain, fix and buy parts for.
Don't get me wrong, the NSX is super rewarding while driving but I wouldn't consider it a competitive car. You'll end up pouring tons of money into it.
I track mine only occasionally though, I highly doubt I'll ever get to point where I'd consider making it a dedicated track car.

Anyway, the choice is ultimately yours, but I'd say stay at the level you're at now and buy another car if you plan to go all out..

But before you retire.. be sure to give me some pointers next track day.
 
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I've seen you at that track on that car and it was a pleasure to see. You were pulling VERY impressive lap times where my supercharged nsx couldn't even get close to touching (plus you are a much better driver...much better than I am).
I would leave it as it is because while the NSX is home on the track, it begs to be driven in public eye to be shown off like a hot girlfriend.
 
Have a baby! I was at your point for last few years, and my daily driver is in fact cheaper than my brakes on the nsx (including insurance and gas :) ). There are many times I asked myself the point of even have the nsx sitting in garage.

I have not touched my nsx for last couple months and finally gave it a little drive last Friday... it's as bothersome as always to drive at the street, but I love it!

I seriously don't think cage is necessary unless you are engaging yourself in sactioned competitions. On the other hand, I totally understand after you reached your bottle neck of certain level of speed and lap time; you can't see the point of "doing laps" within your limit at the same speed you are comfortable with, but then you are seriously going into the danger zone (in terms of safety concerns of what-ifs) if you pushing the envelop a little further.

my baby is not officially born yet, and many told me after i have my child, I will grow up and start to not doing things recklessly.... give me couple months and Stay tuned!!!:biggrin:
 
I just watched you're videos and rely enjoyed them, it looks like you have been stung by the race bug and you need you're fix and that is at the track, you just have to make up you're mind and decide if the NSX is the one, or like others have mentioned, spare the NSX and get a different platform, but for some reason I think you already decided and just want that extra push; It must be cool to kick ass at the track in a NSX.:wink:
 
when it comes to our recreation and passion reason is often clouded.....If you can muster the willpower then from reading your post the nsx is not the car for your full time track aspirations.You need a track car that is cheaper to run and cheaper to replace,therfore you iether keep the nsx as a street car or sell it.I track my nsx because I'm ok with where it is mod wise and I just can't get to the track as much as I would like.You seem to have more time to track,but for $ and emotional reasons(not wanting to wad it up) you have second thoughts about the nsx as a dedicated track car.There will always be nsx for sale in the future.
 
I know exactly how you feel. I was modding my car and came to a point of no return.

The biggest reason to go all out was that I didn't enjoy driving it on the streets anymore. It drew too much unwanted attention, it was loud, uncomfortable and I feared for my front bumper at every speed bump. This made me only take it out maybe four times a year.

I have ordered a cage and lexan windows now, but I will keep her street legal. I can afford to track and mod it, but if I total it, it will probably be the end of it.. But I'd rather crash the car while having fun, then to have someone crashing into me who's not paying attention while being stuck in traffic. Of course, I'm doing my best to keep her in one piece :D

My DD is my bicycle and when it rains I take the tram. For trips and groceries we have a Nissan Qashqai. Nothing fancy or fast.. Although I try to overtake every other bicyclists on my way to work ;)
 
I can relate, although I didn't quite commit as much as you have. I started tracking the NSX and never felt comfortable in it for a couple of reasons: one, I didn't want to wad it up. (You said the same thing: "not something that would cause me an palpitations if I shunted".) It's not exactly a commodity, and yes, I do develop emotional attachments to my cars. Two, it didn't have the requisite safety equipment to start pushing really hard. True, anything can happen at any time, even running 9/10s, but to get that satisfaction from track driving, 10/10s, or maybe even 11/10s once in a while, is required.

That's why I took the NSX off track duty and purchased a Spec Miata to play with in HPDE. And truth be told, I have more fun in the Miata than I did in the NSX: no worries. (Although I will admit that if the NSX was prepped like the Miata is I'm sure it would be TONS of fun but I'd still be thinking "you don't want to total an NSX!")

Relevance? Dunno, I'm rambling. :biggrin:
 
When I remove emotion and the nearsighted 'YOLO commentary' I get from friends- it dosn't take me long to start seeing how having such a monetarily and emotionally invested 'track car' is somewhat of a double negative.
^^ This. It is a double negative.

The NSX is a very satisfying car to drive well. However, it sucks in just about everything else that really matters in a track car. Namely, maintenance costs and repairs. You know what they say.. You should never track a car if you're not willing to roll it over or put it into the wall. I've had some 'oh shit' moments in my NSX and earlier this season I blew my trans. Also being supercharged required me to explore better ($$$) longevity options. It's a slippery slope I decided to avoid. Having accepted where i'm at in mods I'm content no longer trying to achieve that extra hp, tq, and seconds with those incremental additions like that extra lip spoiler, that little bigger wing, those incrementally stickier tires, those harder bushings, that 5lb lighter battery.. etc. I just work on myself and my driving. I'm much happier with my NSX ownership experience as a result. YMMV depending on your personality I suspect...

I'm like you. It wouldn't kill me financially to roll up my NSX into a big wad of aluminum (assuming I survive!) but like Hapa88 said... There are better, more sensible cars to track. One that was cheap (for you), parts are available, with much more pervasive aftermarket support. I bought my "Under Warranty" BRZ daily-driver with the intent to thrash the way I had hoped to do with my NSX.
 
I am reading this thread with a lot of personal interest... I have a stock '94 and I took it to the track about 6 months ago. I was impressed with its capabilities but noticed a lot of understeer and brake fade. I caught the bug and decided to tip my toe in the mod pool. After a lot of hand-wringing, "research," and- oh- a lot of coin, I special-ordered larger (17" front and 18" rear) Advan wheels (which took 4 months to arrive) and larger tires, upgraded the brake fluid and got better pads. Wheels look great, BUT the tires rub the wheel wells not at lock, as expected, but at 3/4 lock. Needless to say, I felt like someone had kicked me in the gut. Maybe it was my own ego that did the kicking! All in the name of better track performance, which I'll use 2-3 times a year. And aesthetics. Yikes. Now these plans for further mods seem more ludicrous than they did a month ago. Exhaust? Intake? Supercharging? Seems like diminishing returns for a car that 99.9% of the time I use to enjoy spirited weekend driving ON THE STREET. Let's face it, none of us wants to have all these mods only to end up crumpled on a wall or wrapped around a tree... Or unable to make a U-turn.
 
I wasn't going to Mod my NSX. Now it gets more track time then street time. And is VERY competitive.

Puts a smile on my face.

Enough said.
 
Wheels look great, BUT the tires rub the wheel wells not at lock, as expected, but at 3/4 lock. Needless to say, I felt like someone had kicked me in the gut. Maybe it was my own ego that did the kicking!

Did you get 215/40/17s for the front? You shouldn't have any rubbing with that fitment.
 
I got 17x8" front wheels and put 235/40-17's on them... I know it's aggressive and about 3% larger in circumference and obviously 2 cm wider than the stock setup, but I had discussed the wheel offset and tire size with SOS and was advised that there would be rubbing at lock. It's not their fault, I know, but there's some disappointment there nonetheless. Options are to live with it and see if it's really a major issue; put the tires up for sale and downsize to 215's; or try to modify the wheel wells with a heat gun or some other way. Cheapest way is to live with it.
 
I got 17x8" front wheels and put 235/40-17's on them... I know it's aggressive and about 3% larger in circumference and obviously 2 cm wider than the stock setup, but I had discussed the wheel offset and tire size with SOS and was advised that there would be rubbing at lock. It's not their fault, I know, but there's some disappointment there nonetheless. Options are to live with it and see if it's really a major issue; put the tires up for sale and downsize to 215's; or try to modify the wheel wells with a heat gun or some other way. Cheapest way is to live with it.

You won't have any rubbing issues whatsoever with a 215/40/17.
My advice is to go that in the front and a 265/35/18 or 255/35/18 in the rear.
 
I've certainly had all the same thoughts. Love my NSX, got into tracking (I've not tracked it near as much as you), and the car is blazingly fast on the track now... no problem keeping up with the fastest of fast cars. It makes up for many of my errors. It's also beautiful, I've literarily driven off the track went to a car wash and gone to a dinner date in it. Gets the front valet spot.

I also do think it is a significant investment, and I am into mine north of 120K, and if I hit a wall it is not covered.

I've realized I have to minimize my track risks, and this is not a good car to learn track skills in. But the most fun I have in the car is at the track. So what do you do.

My decision has become that I will keep my nsx and continue to track it, RARELY. At those times I will not even go 9/10 let alone 10/10. I will do it because the car is sheer joy on a track and I want to continue to experience that. So it will be neither a street car only, nor my regular track car. I will buy a clunker for the track to learn and get better in. As my skills improve, my chances of losing it are reduced. I will then on good days, just for fun, run the nsx. It is the best solution I could come up with.
 
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Thanks for all the insight from everyone I have been reading and deliberating carefully.

So far, my game plan:

1) Move- I like my place but hate the area, its time I took care of that. I've started the ball rolling on moving somewhere quieter and with more garage space.

2) Stop modding the car for now- I've put the brakes on spending anymore money on track upgrades for the NSX. Its already very well set up and just about anything that I do to it from this point on is excess. There little tweaks and stuff here and there but spending big bucks on anything isnt needed to have fun.

3) Im selling a motorcycle and buying a track car- Selling one of the Bikes and freeing up some cash and space. I'm the market now for a track car that is around 10k I have a few ideas, well see what happens. Im still going to drive the NSX out there every few track days but the real battle duty is going to be in whatever front engine RWD car I end up getting, I miss being able to go drifting occasion.

Im not hurting keeping the NSX so i'm in no rush to sell or part out things on it. The plan is leave it how it is and take car of it like always. Once I see how things go with the new place and the new track car ill more easily be able to make up my mind on what to do.


That being said-- Ill be out at Streets in the NSX the 24th if anyone else wants to join me :]]]
 
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Thanks for all the insight from everyone I have been reading and deliberating carefully.

So far, my game plan:

1) Move- I like my place but hate the area, its time I took care of that. I've started the ball rolling on moving somewhere quieter and with more garage space.

2) Stop modding the car for now- I've put the brakes on spending anymore money on track upgrades for the NSX. Its already very well set up and just about anything that I do to it from this point on is excess. There little tweaks and stuff here and there but spending big bucks on anything isnt needed to have fun.

3) Im selling a motorcycle and buying a track car- Selling one of the Bikes and freeing up some cash and space. I'm the market now for a track car that is around 10k I have a few ideas, well see what happens. Im still going to drive the NSX out there every few track days but the real battle duty is going to be in whatever front engine RWD car I end up getting, I miss being able to go drifting occasion.

Im not hurting keeping the NSX so i'm in no rush to sell or part out things on it. The plan is leave it how it is and take car of it like always. Once I see how things go with the new place and the new track car ill more easily be able to make up my mind on what to do.


That being said-- Ill be out at Streets in the NSX the 24th if anyone else wants to join me :]]]
I'm with you on #2.

I also took a slightly different path. I bought a GSX-R 750 to get my track day fix. It's a heck of a lot cheaper and yields a whole new dimension of learning.

This and the BRZ should hold me off for a few years. What's interesting is I long to bring the NSX to the track again but i'll only be driving it 8/10ths at best.
p1260237.jpg


Come up to Buttonwillow this Sunday! It might be a mud fest!
 
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Nice! I know I have learned more for HPDE from track riding the bike than driving a car.


Heres the bike thats gotta go.. I know ill be sad
<a href="http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v680/xburnitallx/?action=view&current=1352850978.jpg" target="_blank"><img src="http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v680/xburnitallx/1352850978.jpg" border="0" alt="Photobucket"></a>
 
I agree with you that it's a good idea to stop modding the car where you are at now. It's quick but still streetable. To go much faster requires costly things that will change the car in a significant way; forced induction, cage, gutting etc.

My mods are similar to yours, but without the aero. What I like about my car is that it's modded just enough to make it quicker and more reliable. I drive it 9/10-10/10's every lap which is a true joy. I take it home, wash it and change the oil after every event. I can still drive it to work and my wife can drive it too. This, plus the fact that it looks nearly stock is priceless.

I might be at SOW on Saturday as well.
 
Nice, itll be awesome to see another NSX out there. hah Junior40er KILLING me with the pictures, makes me not want to stop. I was out working on the car this week getting it ready for the event and was thinking how awesome it is to drive what is basically a factory race car. I have been looking at a few cars this last week too to take the place of this NSX at the track. It reminded me of how picky I am about certain things about cars when im a potential buyer, Ive looked at 5 cars but passed becasue im super anal about frame rails and pick up points I dont want to waste a ton on money caging something that can never align properly. Ive found It's almost impossible to fine a good condition 240sx or 350z that hasn't been abused and beaten to death
 
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