REQUEST: List of current/active disputes with Dali Racing

[NSX Prime]

Lud,

Stop jerking us around. This is your forum and you catch people messing around even in minor ways pretty quickly. I don't believe for a second that you are not aware of the exact extent and degree to which Mark Johnson arbitrarily screws members of our community over and never resolves anything himself. Don't insult our intelligence by playing the "I don't know enough, tell me more," part.

Either ban the guy or don't, but don't pretend it's our responsibility to figure things out for you. You've had more than enough feedback and there's more than enough information already on this thread to damn Mark Johnson.

(Personally, I would think the link to the issue with scamming Guus Toth, even post-mortem, would be enough to make your mind up. But, apparently it's not...?)

Seriously, Lud. Man up.

Do you really not understand the difference between moderating a forum and evaluating forum members dissatisfaction with a vendor? I will try to explain:

First, I am generally not the one to "catch people messing around in even minor ways pretty quickly." The vast majority of instances where I take moderator action are because someone used the "report post" function to alert me there was something I should take a look at. I don't even read the majority of the threads on here anymore because the rest of running the site takes up the time I used to spend participating.

Second, and most importantly, I am moderating the site based entirely on what is posted in the messages. Certainly I make judgement calls based on history, what I perceive as the person's intent, how serious an offense it is, etc, but what I am acting on is entirely in front of me.

When dealing with vendor disputes, it is FAR less clear. I have no part in the transactions. I don't see the e-mails. I don't know what else was going on in the transaction - I rarely even hear both sides of the story, much less the truth. I see some people post complaints, I see a lot of people post praise. Certainly I have seen more complaints about Dali than other vendors, but I don't know if/when/how most of the complaints are resolved and how many are based on being truly "ripped off" versus personality conflicts, poor customer service, etc.

Thus I asked for some folks to help me get a clear picture of where things really stand. The request is fairly simple, though I am sure it will take some time (which is why I asked for help). I figured some of the people who seem to care so passionately about this issue would be glad to help. If nobody is willing to even make that much effort, I am not really inclined to pursue it further at this time either.

P.S. I certainly don't expect people to kiss my butt or even necessarily agree with me, but if you can't express your disagreement without personally attacking me I'm not going to be very inclined to listen to what you have to say. Being hostile towards someone who is making a good faith effort to help is rarely going to get you the best possible result.

 

[Deltron Zero]

I have to agree with you Aiken Drum. I was banned for a month for making a duplicate profile as a joke (http://nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=105925). MJ has done much worse without any repercussions. But again, this isn't a democracy. This is one guy's forum and he can do whatever he wants.

 

[Aiken Drum]

If nobody is willing to even make that much effort, I am not really inclined to pursue it further at this time either.

I think the same comment goes the other way. If you, as the owner of the forum, can't be bothered to search for "Dali," or "Mark Johnson," and read the brutally-obvious results, I don't think anyone is going to take it on faith that their own efforts will be rewarded at all. Historically, you're disinterested at best, and snarly and dismissive at worst, when the subject comes up. As it is, you have a pretty long list of names, issues, and results compiled within this thread, and you appear to be ignoring it every time you post another lament that no one has compiled a list.

Me, I went far out of my way, and spent a lot of my time, trying to keep people aware of and away from the kind of experience I had with Dali and Mark Johnson. My reward for that was multiple scoldings and, if memory serves, a warning that I would be suspended if I didn't stop. That's not positive reinforcement for future efforts.

Being hostile towards someone who is making a good faith effort to help is rarely going to get you the best possible result.

See, there's the problem. You do not give the appearance of making a good faith effort. You give the appearance of someone setting up and maintaining an ongoing excuse for themself in the face of a potential decision they don't seem to want to make.

If you find these comments bristly or even hostile, well, all I can say is that maybe you get back what you put out. Your own posts tend to contain ample scorn and disdain, and often a fair bit of sneering. Take your own comments to heart, maybe.

 

[NSX Prime]

There appears to be no point in continuing this discussion as you seem to have made up your mind that I am full of crap, don't want to help, and am generally an ass.

I hope you find something about the site to be useful despite that, have good luck with any future transactions, and generally enjoy your NSX ownership experience.

Take care.

 

[Erik B]

Re: REQUEST: List of disputes with Dali Racing

Here is a quick list from my memory to start people off with filling in additional information.

1. Sennihana
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=116705
OPEN

2. Macready
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=112849

3. Hagasan
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=113944

4. KingsCourt
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=113109

5. Aiken Drum
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103100
FILED DISPUTE

6. Squid2004
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=96818

7. Matt337
could not find link - taken from vendor rating

8. SaberX
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?p=677204#post677204

9. Yellow-Scorpion
could not find link - taken from vendor rating

10. Ponyboy
could not find link - taken from vendor rating

11. Nsxnut
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=39598

12. Pixelhaus
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20947

13. BITeR
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=33519

14. Russ
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=26211

15. Dash Rip Rock
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23281

16. Buddyatlga
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=23272

17. Robin
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24032

18. SSMS2000
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=19914

19. RSO 34
managed to get $1200 charge reversed by credit card company after paypal dispute time ran out


AND THE ALL TIME BRASS ONES AWARD FOR STEALING FROM A DEAD NSX OWNER:

20. Gerard Van Santen
http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=32166

If I had all those topics started on me...would I still be allowed to use Prime to rip NSX owners off? Serious question. Your right about not hearing both sides...i went thru ever single one of those topics (a lot of the have "Im waiting on this product too" from other users in them as well, FYI) and NONE of them have a response from this guy.

Ive seen guys banned for making 2 of the same for sale topics in the marketplace subforum section.

 

[Aiken Drum]

There appears to be no point in continuing this discussion as you seem to have made up your mind that I am full of crap, don't want to help, and am generally an ass.

Ah. So, you can dish it out, but you can't take it.

Well, whatever. I wasn't expecting anything else to come of this.

Oh, and feel free to ignore the list again. You know, the one right above this post that someone has kindly quoted for you, from a post very early in this thread. And don't forget to tell us how we're all hypocritical slackers for not making up a list for you.

 

[LJSB]

I gather the Administrator of NSX Prime is not, and does not want to be, "The Catcher in the Rye". He owns and maintains the field for all to run and play, leaving us to be responsible for ourselves if we decide to heed Dali's Siren's call and throw our money over the edge.

We, as a potential buyers, have to be silly to deal with someone whose signature mocks unhappy customers, calling them "sheeple". How plain must it be?

 

[SOURCE 1]

Lud,


Enough of all this back and forth. It is this simple. Can you please forward a link to this thread and ask MJ to come forward to discuss it? You say you want both sides to the stories however you will never get it because this guy wont come out of hiding.

I think it is only fair for those of us that have been "screwed" stolen from however you want to put it be at least spoken to in the same discussion thread about this vendor by the vendor.

Tell him to step up and explain its that simple.

However I know he wont, But when that happens seriously do you think we are all in the wrong and were not speaking truth if the vendor wil not come forward?? I think when he doesn't come forward it will be pretty cut and dry as to what the situation is.

I vote that if he does not come forward and try to rectify some of this he should be banned. It is only fair. And I understand your not moderating this but looking into a bunch of people being screwed and I respect you for taking the time to look at all of the proof, But something needs to be done or a year from now this will all be happening again and then again etc...

I think we rely on vendors from this site to be trustworthy and honest and they should be. Unfortunately you have the responsibility to make sure they are if they want to do business on this site. I am sure MJ will still get customers but selling directly on here should not happen if these are his practices.

Sorry for the ramble I am sure punctuation grammar etc... It is early and i had a long night

 

[NSX Prime]

Enough of all this back and forth. It is this simple.

It is simple, but we do not necessarily agree on the simple course of action. What I am looking for is the list as outlined in my original post in this thread - a list that verifies the current status of the old disputes. Not just a list that links all the old disputes that may or may not still be current. That seems simple to me, if time consuming. If others do not think that is needed, fine, but I do and I am the one people are asking to do something.

I think we rely on vendors from this site to be trustworthy and honest and they should be. Unfortunately you have the responsibility to make sure they are if they want to do business on this site.

That is in fact not my responsibility at all, and there are not even vendors "from" this site. This site just provides a free listing service that is available to virtually anyone. I have no way to verify vendors or mediate disputes. Since day one (before the Marketplace was even part of the forums - back when it was a static HTML page I updated manually based on ads people e-mailed to me) I have explicitly stated that all responsibility remains solely with the parties involved in the transaction, as is the norm for any similar listing service. However that is probably diverging into a philosophical discussion about responsibilities.

Back to the specific issue at hand, I do want to run the site the best way I can - in a way that is most beneficial to the NSX community as a whole - and am certainly willing to look at a list of people who have complained about a vendor with a current status of their dispute and decide where to go from there. Again I am looking for all the items I listed in my first post in this thread to be included in a single list from which I can work.

If this does not satisfy folks, sorry, but I am not going to "shoot from the hip" on something as significant as potentially taking action against one of the largest NSX vendors in the country, who certainly has a vocal group of dissatisfied customers but also many very satisfied customers, without a clear and thorough understanding of the situation.

If some people think I am acting in bad faith, that is a shame, but I learned long ago that people assign all kinds of motives to actions they don't agree with taken by people they don't know. My decisions may not always be how someone else would tackle an issue, and heck they may not even be correct - I am far from perfect. I just try to do what I think is best for the site and the community given finite time and resources. This is what I see as the best way to work with the group of folks who take issue with this vendor being allowed to use this site.

 

[Aiken Drum]

If you spent as much time doing the research you say you want us to do as you do berating us for not doing it for you, you'd already have the information you claim to want.

Sorry, Lud. It's nice and all that you run the site, but that doesn't get you a free pass on BS.

 

[Aiken Drum]

By the way, if I count correctly, there are 12 people who have posted the current state of their own dispute with Mark/Dali to this thread. The only resolutions were through credit/paypal disputes and one instance of new order trickery. There is no record so far of Mark spontaneously resolving a dispute, or even responding to someone, ever, not even once, after something goes amiss.

You seem to be ignoring these, though. Are you just going to keep saying you don't know enough? Shouldn't ONE or TWO completely unresolved disputes be enough? Nevermind at least twelve, and let's be serious, more like dozens, that are pretty uniform in presentation. ONE bad group buy got Tamoske banned. The only difference is that Mark refuses to speak to anyone, ever, including on Prime, about a dispute. He won't even acknowledge that there are disputes, nevermind speak to the details. It's basically the equivalent of not taking the stand. If you don't say anything, then nothing you say can be used against you, and he's using it very much to his advantage here on prime, and has done for years now.

 

[Deltron Zero]

If you run a storefront on Amazon and your negative feedback gets up over 5% you are put on probation. If you can't get that rate down they drop you from their program. Dali is at about 35% negative feedback last time I checked. If he was an Amazon reseller he would have been booted long ago.

 

[heySkippy]

I wouldn't want to be hasty either, but there are a few points that just can't be ignored.

- Many of his unsatisfied customers started out as satisfied customers. I've read more than a couple "I didn't think it would happen to me" stories.

- The pattern of communication coming to a complete halt once a dispute is raised is repeated over and over.

- As far as I can tell, there has never been a successful dispute resolution with Dali. The only people who ever get anything back do so through Paypal or credit card companies.

- As far as I can tell, Mark Johnson has never attempted to defend himself here.

Lud, have you ever talked to Mark about this?

 

[SOURCE 1]

It is simple, but we do not necessarily agree on the simple course of action. What I am looking for is the list as outlined in my original post in this thread - a list that verifies the current status of the old disputes. Not just a list that links all the old disputes that may or may not still be current. That seems simple to me, if time consuming. If others do not think that is needed, fine, but I do and I am the one people are asking to do something.



That is in fact not my responsibility at all, and there are not even vendors "from" this site. This site just provides a free listing service that is available to virtually anyone. I have no way to verify vendors or mediate disputes. Since day one (before the Marketplace was even part of the forums - back when it was a static HTML page I updated manually based on ads people e-mailed to me) I have explicitly stated that all responsibility remains solely with the parties involved in the transaction, as is the norm for any similar listing service. However that is probably diverging into a philosophical discussion about responsibilities.

Back to the specific issue at hand, I do want to run the site the best way I can - in a way that is most beneficial to the NSX community as a whole - and am certainly willing to look at a list of people who have complained about a vendor with a current status of their dispute and decide where to go from there. Again I am looking for all the items I listed in my first post in this thread to be included in a single list from which I can work.

If this does not satisfy folks, sorry, but I am not going to "shoot from the hip" on something as significant as potentially taking action against one of the largest NSX vendors in the country, who certainly has a vocal group of dissatisfied customers but also many very satisfied customers, without a clear and thorough understanding of the situation.

If some people think I am acting in bad faith, that is a shame, but I learned long ago that people assign all kinds of motives to actions they don't agree with taken by people they don't know. My decisions may not always be how someone else would tackle an issue, and heck they may not even be correct - I am far from perfect. I just try to do what I think is best for the site and the community given finite time and resources. This is what I see as the best way to work with the group of folks who take issue with this vendor being allowed to use this site.

Ok, So obviously the people that have come forward in this thread are not enough people. Or do you want me to put all the ones in this thread in a spreadsheet form or something?

What do you no agree with my course of action? Having him come forward and discuss thee things is not enough for you? That would make me happy.. Even if he came on here and said, Well Brian I know you have bought nsx parts from me since 2000 but I decided I did not want your business anymore.. Then OK!!! ATLEAST HE WOULD BE RESPONDING like a MAN!

What POSSIBLE motive could I have other than protecting people that say:

" That will never happen to me I buy from Mark all the time with no problem"

I did not realize you dont feel this is your responsibility as the main man on the site to handle..

Can you put someone in charge that will take responsibility for it?

Also if the 12-13 people that are on this thread are not enough current owners unsatisfied how many will it take? Seriously?

 

[NSX Prime]

If you run a storefront on Amazon and your negative feedback gets up over 5% you are put on probation. If you can't get that rate down they drop you from their program. Dali is at about 35% negative feedback last time I checked. If he was an Amazon reseller he would have been booted long ago.

Interesting info. What is the process for someone to work their way back off probation? It seems it would be hard to raise their feedback if they are no longer allowed to sell. Is there a % at which they are banned for good? Do you know of a link that explains how they manage this in detail?

Does anyone know how eBay handles it? Do they suspend people after a certain % negative feedback? Do they ban people for unresolved disputes?

Is there a minimum number of feedbacks before any of this kicks in? In other words can any of your first 20 customers basically blackmail you with a threat of a single negative feedback that would drop you below 95% approval and suspend your ability to sell?

Here is another question to think about: Does it make a difference in a situation like this where product is not being sold directly through the site? In other words on Amazon or eBay the sellers directly sell each product through a separate listing and the site handles billing, etc. On this site vendors simply list various products or services for sale for "marketing" purposes and the actual the sales are conducted through their own websites or directly via e-mail, phone, etc. This is clearly a different structure, but I'm not sure what the implication of that difference is for such a system.

Thanks for the feedback and I'd be interested to learn more.

 

[NSX Prime]

I wouldn't want to be hasty either, but there are a few points that just can't be ignored.

- Many of his unsatisfied customers started out as satisfied customers. I've read more than a couple "I didn't think it would happen to me" stories.

- The pattern of communication coming to a complete halt once a dispute is raised is repeated over and over.

I agree, that appears to generally be the pattern. I am not sure what that means though - meaning would it make a difference if they were first-time customers, etc.?

- As far as I can tell, there has never been a successful dispute resolution with Dali. The only people who ever get anything back do so through Paypal or credit card companies.

You are not the first person to say that, but I am quite sure at least a couple disputes have in fact been resolved by Dali because I recall approving the messages with that update in the Buyer/Seller section. That is the kind of information I was hoping to get from the list. I suspect the % of disputes resolved this way is low because I only recall a couple people posting updates to that effect, but I would like to have a better picture.

- As far as I can tell, Mark Johnson has never attempted to defend himself here.

That is correct. There are some vendors who have chosen not to respond to online complaints. Mark is one of them. If I were a vendor I don't know if I would or not. I have seen more than a few complaints that I thought were unreasonable. I've seen it against almost every vendor and shop. And on the Internet an unreasonable idiot's voice carries as much weight as the best intentioned business owner.

However I am certainly not blind and I see almost two dozen negative feedback for him, though in perspective that is out of thousands of transactions over many years.

Lud, have you ever talked to Mark about this?

No. I am willing to, but I want to go into the discussion on firm and certain ground with an list showing the current status of disputes. If the consensus of the group is they want me to go in with the ~12 disputes listed in this thread as active, I will do that, but 12 active disputes with a vendor that has probably done over 1,000 times that many transactions over a span of 15+ years is a pretty low ratio. Now if I just look at feedback that is a much worse ratio, but again you are dealing with a situation where people can go buy directly since he runs a web store, then if they are in a dispute they post a complaint and file a negative feedback.

For some thought, I will say that if I suspended every vendor who had 1 or 2 unresolved disputes a year we wouldn't have many vendors left on here at all. If anyone doesn't realize that please spend some time going through the Buyer/Seller forum and look at the thread list for the past year or two.

 

[NSX Prime]

Ok, So obviously the people that have come forward in this thread are not enough people. Or do you want me to put all the ones in this thread in a spreadsheet form or something?

Please see my previous message. If the group of people dissatisfied with Dali wants me to compile just the 12 or so from this thread and work from that I will do that. I was hoping to have a larger list.

Even if he came on here and said, Well Brian I know you have bought nsx parts from me since 2000 but I decided I did not want your business anymore.. Then OK!!! ATLEAST HE WOULD BE RESPONDING like a MAN!

It would resolve the situation to your satisfaction if he just came on here and said "I don't want to do business with those people anymore"?? That does not sound like what most people want. Perhaps I am misunderstanding you.

I did not realize you dont feel this is your responsibility as the main man on the site to handle..

Can you put someone in charge that will take responsibility for it?

This site will never be responsible for buyer/seller disputes. However if someone (maybe you?) wants to volunteer to offer an ombudsman type service for NSX Prime I would consider setting that up. I would prefer someone with related experience in mediation or arbitration but would be willing to look at anyone with a good history here, a clear logical approach, and no axes to grind.

 

[RSO 34]

I still think my earlier idea would assist with all vendors and disputes:

http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103227

After the recent flurry of activity regarding frustration over vendor disputes, may I suggest the implementation of a Public Acknowledgement Rule for vendors/sellers to abide by in exchange for free advertising of their products. This would simply require that all disputes publicly listed be responded to publicly to allow other members the opportunity to utilize the transactional history as part of their decision making process as to whether to patronize a particular vendor/seller. The Prime Administrator/Moderators will not resolve nor otherwise rule on the dispute but simply require a response be posted to allow others to make an informed opinion as to whether to risk a transaction with those parties in the future.


1. Vendors/Sellers acknowledge that listing of items for sale on Prime is a privilege and not a right.

2. In exchange for free listing/advertising of such items for sale, each Vendor/Seller agrees to abide by the Public Acknowledgement Rule for Disputes.

3. In the event of a Dispute, a Buyer may create a new thread in the Buyer, Seller & Vendor Experiences Forum and provide details of the disputed transaction.

4. Vendors/Sellers agree to post their response to the Dispute within 10 days after creation of the thread. To avoid a claim that the Vendor/Seller was unaware of the thread, the Moderator of that forum shall send a PM notification to the Vendor/Seller upon approval of the thread’s creation.

5. Each party will thereafter be permitted one additional post to respond to the other party’s contentions, after which the thread shall be locked.

6. A failure of a Vendor/Seller to respond to the posted Dispute shall result in a 30 day suspension from Prime of the Vendor/Seller. The Dispute thread in question shall be locked with an indication that the Vendor/Seller declined to respond.

7. A second failure to respond to a new posted Dispute shall result in a 60 day suspension from Prime of the Vendor/Seller. The Dispute thread in question shall be locked with an indication that the Vendor/Seller declined to respond.

8. A third failure to respond to a new posted Dispute shall result in the Vendor/Seller being banned permanently from Prime. The Dispute thread in question shall be locked with an indication that the Vendor/Seller declined to respond.

9. The Administrator/Moderators of Prime will not intervene otherwise in any disputes and remind all parties that the rule of Caveat Emptor applies in all transactions on Prime.

10. The Administrator/Moderators will not mediate nor attempt to resolve the differences between the parties to a Dispute and this Public Acknowledgement Rule is designed simply to provide background information to be utilized by other Prime members in making their voluntary choice of doing business with any Vendors/Sellers. All Buyers are still encouraged to utilize the Trader Rating System as part of their investigation into whether to do business with a Vendor/Seller and to consult with other members as part of their investigation of a Vendor/Seller.

 

[Deltron Zero]

Interesting info. What is the process for someone to work their way back off probation? It seems it would be hard to raise their feedback if they are no longer allowed to sell. Is there a % at which they are banned for good? Do you know of a link that explains how they manage this in detail?

I couldn't find a page that explains their feedback consequences in detail, probably because they are subjective and are willing to work with you if you get in trouble.

When you are on probation you can still operate your storefront. They just give you 30 or 60 days to improve your feedback score. They might de-prioritize your listings during this period.

I don't know exactly what percentage of negative feedback would get you banned for good, but if you were at about 15% or higher for a significant period of time with no sign of improvement I'm sure that would do it.

Is there a minimum number of feedbacks before any of this kicks in? In other words can any of your first 20 customers basically blackmail you with a threat of a single negative feedback that would drop you below 95% approval and suspend your ability to sell?

There is no minimum, but it's not that black and white - they would be willing to work with you if they saw this happening, especially if you were new. Some buyers know how important feedback is to sellers and they'll use it to their advantage unfairly. It's just a part of doing business on Amazon. I think people on Prime are a much more ethical bunch.

Here is another question to think about: Does it make a difference in a situation like this where product is not being sold directly through the site? In other words on Amazon or eBay the sellers directly sell each product through a separate listing and the site handles billing, etc. On this site vendors simply list various products or services for sale for "marketing" purposes and the actual the sales are conducted through their own websites or directly via e-mail, phone, etc. This is clearly a different structure, but I'm not sure what the implication of that difference is for such a system.

Thanks for the feedback and I'd be interested to learn more.

That's a good thing to consider. The fact that Prime is so little involved in the transaction gives the buyers and sellers a greater opportunity to screw things up. Definitely something to keep in mind when setting up any metrics.

 

[SOURCE 1]

Please see my previous message. If the group of people dissatisfied with Dali wants me to compile just the 12 or so from this thread and work from that I will do that. I was hoping to have a larger list.

I think the ones here are the ones that activly want something done about the actions this person takes against our community.



It would resolve the situation to your satisfaction if he just came on here and said "I don't want to do business with those people anymore"?? That does not sound like what most people want. Perhaps I am misunderstanding you.

I would just like him to respond to this thread with a statement.. I have accepted the fact that i will not be getting my parts or money.. As I have said a bunch of times this is not about the money but the principal of one vendor doing this! I understand that every vendor has an issue here and there... BUT no other vendor just ends communication with the buyer and ignores them completely!! NO OTHER VENDOR! They try to rectify the issue and make it alright again. He blatently ignores after he realizes that he does not have the part or something. No clue but he is THE ONLY one who does that!



This site will never be responsible for buyer/seller disputes. However if someone (maybe you?) wants to volunteer to offer an ombudsman type service for NSX Prime I would consider setting that up. I would prefer someone with related experience in mediation or arbitration but would be willing to look at anyone with a good history here, a clear logical approach, and no axes to grind.

I would love to:biggrin:

I have years of arbitration skills behind me:biggrin:

I have a good history on prime

I have only DALI axe to grind

I can and will be logical.

 

[SOURCE 1]

I still think my earlier idea would assist with all vendors and disputes:

http://www.nsxprime.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103227

After the recent flurry of activity regarding frustration over vendor disputes, may I suggest the implementation of a Public Acknowledgement Rule for vendors/sellers to abide by in exchange for free advertising of their products. This would simply require that all disputes publicly listed be responded to publicly to allow other members the opportunity to utilize the transactional history as part of their decision making process as to whether to patronize a particular vendor/seller. The Prime Administrator/Moderators will not resolve nor otherwise rule on the dispute but simply require a response be posted to allow others to make an informed opinion as to whether to risk a transaction with those parties in the future.


1. Vendors/Sellers acknowledge that listing of items for sale on Prime is a privilege and not a right.

2. In exchange for free listing/advertising of such items for sale, each Vendor/Seller agrees to abide by the Public Acknowledgement Rule for Disputes.

3. In the event of a Dispute, a Buyer may create a new thread in the Buyer, Seller & Vendor Experiences Forum and provide details of the disputed transaction.

4. Vendors/Sellers agree to post their response to the Dispute within 10 days after creation of the thread. To avoid a claim that the Vendor/Seller was unaware of the thread, the Moderator of that forum shall send a PM notification to the Vendor/Seller upon approval of the thread’s creation.

5. Each party will thereafter be permitted one additional post to respond to the other party’s contentions, after which the thread shall be locked.

6. A failure of a Vendor/Seller to respond to the posted Dispute shall result in a 30 day suspension from Prime of the Vendor/Seller. The Dispute thread in question shall be locked with an indication that the Vendor/Seller declined to respond.

7. A second failure to respond to a new posted Dispute shall result in a 60 day suspension from Prime of the Vendor/Seller. The Dispute thread in question shall be locked with an indication that the Vendor/Seller declined to respond.

8. A third failure to respond to a new posted Dispute shall result in the Vendor/Seller being banned permanently from Prime. The Dispute thread in question shall be locked with an indication that the Vendor/Seller declined to respond.

9. The Administrator/Moderators of Prime will not intervene otherwise in any disputes and remind all parties that the rule of Caveat Emptor applies in all transactions on Prime.

10. The Administrator/Moderators will not mediate nor attempt to resolve the differences between the parties to a Dispute and this Public Acknowledgement Rule is designed simply to provide background information to be utilized by other Prime members in making their voluntary choice of doing business with any Vendors/Sellers. All Buyers are still encouraged to utilize the Trader Rating System as part of their investigation into whether to do business with a Vendor/Seller and to consult with other members as part of their investigation of a Vendor/Seller.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

That is GREAT!!! I agree 100%

 

[UnhuZ]

Hi,

There is no minimum, but it's not that black and white - they would be willing to work with you if they saw this happening, especially if you were new. Some buyers know how important feedback is to sellers and they'll use it to their advantage unfairly. It's just a part of doing business on Amazon. I think people on Prime are a much more ethical bunch.

let's just say that if i had a iTrader rating for every transaction here, my iTrader rating would be twice what it is now... what i find is that when everything is fine, either a buyer or a seller don't feel the need to post some positive feedback, but if is negative then either one will start freeking out...

In all these years i only had one transaction where what i bought didn't get to my hands... no tracking number, nothing.... i filed a paypal dispute just before my 45 days timeframe elapsed, the seller was a bit shocked and ask me why i did that, to which i answered that with no PM or email answers, no tracking number, i had to use the only resource i had... he refunded me and i ended the dispute.
The result... i left him positive feedback for the refund because in the end, the business ended good... it's been almost a year now, and i didn't receive the parts, if i did i had returned him the money (were about $75 for parts AND shipping).

what i see is some lack of good judgement and good old common sense...
i mean, i have saw personnaly in many stores buyers freeking out pretty badly when things are not done their way, and they were far away from being right... a lot of buyers don't have a racional way of looking at the deal, they think that if they are the buyer then they are always right no matter what.

I try to be reasonable every way i can... Example: i bought a part about 15 days ago something from a member here, i paypalled him $325, he said he would shipp it the next day... never heard from him again through PM or email, he don't log to prime since the day i paypalled him, and i'm waiting for one of 2 things to happen: he get back at me or i'm near the 45 days paypal limit.

And more examples... lot's of primers selling stuff say to me that they will get me a shipping quote, then all of the sudden they tell me that they sold it to someone else, because it was a neiboughr with cash in hands...bla..bla... that for me is not standing on their word... if i was the first to contact them, then they would deal with me no matter how many guys bang on their door with cash in hand or whatever...

I see Prime as classified newspaper... if you have a bad deal you don't go to the newspaper administration and demand them to ban that seller... so, my opinion is that Lud doesn't have to move a finger against any seller or buyer against whom someone complaints...

In United States i see legal issues handled quite fast, very efficient justice, yet i find very weird that being Dali local to most of you, they are still in business with, apparently, no legal matters over their heads... so, what gives?

Conclusion: Nothing is as Black and White as lot of you try to paint here on all this MJ/Dali innuendos.... the fact that he don't answer doesn't help is case, but don't make him automatically guilty either (not trying to be devils lawyer here).

Sorry for all this huge testament, but it is just some thoughts about businesses through Prime.

 

[Deltron Zero]

Hi,
let's just say that if i had a iTrader rating for every transaction here, my iTrader rating would be twice what it is now... what i find is that when everything is fine, either a buyer or a seller don't feel the need to post some positive feedback, but if is negative then either one will start freeking out...

On Amazon only 10-20% of customers would submit feedback on their own - and you can be sure anyone upset would be in that group. In my case this was the only time feedback became an issue. Once we actively solicited positive feedback it vastly improved our stats and also helped build consumer confidence.

I see Prime as classified newspaper... if you have a bad deal you don't go to the newspaper administration and demand them to ban that seller... so, my opinion is that Lud doesn't have to move a finger against any seller or buyer against whom someone complaints...

I agree with you here - he doesn't have to do anything. I think perhaps he wants to as a service to the community.

 

[RSO 34]

In United States i see legal issues handled quite fast, very efficient justice, yet i find very weird that being Dali local to most of you, they are still in business with, apparently, no legal matters over their heads... so, what gives?

Conclusion: Nothing is as Black and White as lot of you try to paint here on all this MJ/Dali innuendos....

These are not innuendos - these are facts. There have been way too many established instances in which Mark Johnson/Dali Racing has ripped off members of our community, refused to communicate with them privately, refused to acknowledge them publicly and all while continuing to utilize the free advertising this site provides.

I may not be Rand McNally but to say that "most of us are local" to Dali/Mark Johnson and you find it "very weird" that we are not utilizing American courts is completely overlooking the obvious. MJ/Dali operates out of San Diego, California which, although a sizeable city by most standards, has a population of just over 3 million over an area of 4200 square miles. Considering that the continental United States is in excess of 3.1 million square miles and had a population of 280,000,000 in 2000, very few members are actually "local" to Dali/MJ.

Any legal action would have to be brought in San Diego, generally in a small claims court, which results in an estimated 99% of persons he has ripped off having no legal recourse.

 

[SOURCE 1]

These are not innuendos - these are facts. There have been way too many established instances in which Mark Johnson/Dali Racing has ripped off members of our community, refused to communicate with them privately, refused to acknowledge them publicly and all while continuing to utilize the free advertising this site provides.

I may not be Rand McNally but to say that "most of us are local" to Dali/Mark Johnson and you find it "very weird" that we are not utilizing American courts is completely overlooking the obvious. MJ/Dali operates out of San Diego, California which, although a sizeable city by most standards, has a population of just over 3 million over an area of 4200 square miles. Considering that the continental United States is in excess of 3.1 million square miles and had a population of 280,000,000 in 2000, very few members are actually "local" to Dali/MJ.

Any legal action would have to be brought in San Diego, generally in a small claims court, which results in an estimated 99% of persons he has ripped off having no legal recourse.

Interesting... How many of these 12 main complaints we have here are form people on that side of the US? Anyone near MJ?