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BaschBoost performance numbers???

J

JoeSchmoe

Experienced Member
Joined
9 May 2000
Messages
687
I dont know if this topic has been covered yet, but are there any credible numbers for the BB on a stock 3.0L car yet? 0-60? 1/4 mile?


Also, will the unit get CARB approval?
 
Originally posted by JoeSchmoe:
I dont know if this topic has been covered yet, but are there any credible numbers for the BB on a stock 3.0L car yet? 0-60? 1/4 mile?


Also, will the unit get CARB approval?

Joe, We have not done any drag testing, I don't know if anyone has with their beta cars. The dyno numbers appear elsewhere in this Forum, but short version is that the three 3.0L cars we have done are all between 360 and 385 at the wheels.

We are applying for CARB aproval, but that will take a few months at least. The process is very slow.

Cheers,
Mark Basch
Click to expand...
 
Hey Mark!

What PSI are you running your SC system at?

------------------
David Allen
'00 Silverstone NSX-T
 
I would like to know any tested performance numbers for a forced-induction NSX. Turbo, Twin Turbo or Super.. etc.

Also, does going with FI give you that "pushed back in the seat" feeling?



------------------
NetViper -= 100% Stock EBP 2000 Civic Si =- Still looking to get an NSX, but at least I can live life at 8,000 RPM!
 
No, it's more like "oh $hit! hang on!" at least that is what I hear from people I give rides to ;-)

-- Chris

------------------
SoS_logo.gif


http://www.NSXClassifieds.com - free NSX classifieds site!
 
Originally posted by ScienceofSpeed:
No, it's more like "oh $hit! hang on!" at least that is what I hear from people I give rides to ;-)

-- Chris
Click to expand...

Chris people say that when I drive too... are you sure it's the BB?
biggrin.gif
LOL!

You don't want to know what they say when I'm stopping but once I am I usually hear "where's the damn door handle.."
biggrin.gif
biggrin.gif
 
I actually wanted to start a discussion that talked about the differences between the BaschBoost kit and the Comptech kit. I saw that Mark said that a 3.0L was getting ~360-385RWHP with his kit - I'm curious as to how he is doing that since I have the CT 6PSI SC on my 3.2L (with headers, intake and exhaust) and I only dyno ~345RWHP (on the same dyno that Mark uses, if he still uses Technodyne in Phoenix) - and that RWHP number is after Mark tweaked my settings.

Mark, can you go into some detail as to why your kit produces quite a bit more RWHP than the CT kit? Are you using a 9PSI pully?

------------------
David Allen
'00 Silverstone NSX-T
 
I'm not sure on the comptech but isn't it a roots blower. I've read that roots are about 55% efficient. Marks is a Centrifugal blower, I've read these are about 75% efficient. This may be the big advantage. Now I'm not sure if my information is 100% accurate, I don't have my supercharger book in front of me.
 
Sticking in the BB, wouldnt that mean you gotta change many other components on your car just to be able to handle the extra power and torque? Things like a more powerful clutch and an oil pump? Or can you actually run the BB with everything else stock on the car?
 
Oil pump can stay as is. More HP does not affect the pump's ability to pump. If the engine is already apart, it makes good sense to replace the OEM pump with an aftermarket high volume oil pump.

As far as the clutch, it depends largely on how sloppy the driver's footwork is, or if the clutch is abused by using it as a hill brake. I have over 30k supercharged miles (including track events) on my clutch and it is only now beginning to show *very* minor signs of slipping. Even if it cratered today, I consider that more than adequate clutch life for a forced induction application.

[This message has been edited by AndyVecsey (edited 03 January 2002).]

[This message has been edited by AndyVecsey (edited 03 January 2002).]
 
Originally posted by nsxxtreme:
I'm not sure on the comptech but isn't it a roots blower. I've read that roots are about 55% efficient. Marks is a Centrifugal blower, I've read these are about 75% efficient. This may be the big advantage. Now I'm not sure if my information is 100% accurate, I don't have my supercharger book in front of me.
Click to expand...


The Comptech unit is a screw design NOT a roots type of blower. There is a difference between the two. The screwtype is made in Sweden and is more efficient than the roots or the centrifugal (however you spell it) design. "The Whipple twin screw compressor is 75% to 85% adiabatic and volumetric efficient while the roots is commonly 40% to 55%. Common centrifugal superchargers have a PEAK of 65% to 80% but do just that, peak. Over an entire rpm range, a screw compressor has an average efficiency far greater than the roots or centrifugal. Over an entire rpm range, a screw compressor has an average efficiency far greater than the roots or centrifugal." As for throttle response, it is pretty much instantaneous. Feels like you have more cubic inches in your motor. Remember, more efficiency means LESS heat generation at a given boost level.
wink.gif



------------------
Kenji Ligon
91 Red CTSC NSX

[This message has been edited by Attitude Adjuster (edited 03 January 2002).]
 
OK, but how come my 3.2L CTSC NSX only produces ~350RWHP and Mark is getting upwards to ~385RWHP on 3.0L cars?

------------------
David Allen
'00 Silverstone NSX-T
 
attitude adjuster,
Where did you get your info from.
The book I have says that the twin screw is about 70% efficient. The centrifugal is about 75% efficient. How did you find out the Comptech is a twin scew.

I would love to look at the info you have access to. I am not doubting you, I am just interested in the info.

Answered one of my questions, looked on Comtech's site. Yes you are right theirs is a twin-scew.

[This message has been edited by nsxxtreme (edited 04 January 2002).]
 
You guys are both right about the efficiency of the two basic different types of SC designs. However, here is the piece of the puzzle that is missing from this discussion which I think will resolve the paradox of why one SC system makes more power than the other. The CT SC is indeed a twin-screw type blower, which is in general more efficient than a centrifugal SC.

The rub, however is this: the particular Lysholm twin-screw unit that CT uses just happens to reach it’s max efficiency at around 8.5 to 9 PSI with the NSX motor. What starts to happen at this boost level, with this particular blower is that the heat buildup is so great as to really start to take away from your peak dyno numbers. What the CT SC was designed to do from the get-go was to produce low-end grunt, not just peak dyno numbers.

The BaschBoost, on the other hand, uses a Paxton Novi 1000 centrifugal unit which is good for around 12 PSI or so with the NSX motor before it really loses efficiency. It therefore runs much cooler in this application. The air also has a very short path from the compressor side right into the throttle body. That’s why you see better peak dyno numbers at lower boost with the BaschBoost. Believe it! I took a ride in Chris' car and still can't believe he was running only 5 PSI!
smile.gif



Originally posted by David Allen:
OK, but how come my 3.2L CTSC NSX only produces ~350RWHP and Mark is getting upwards to ~385RWHP on 3.0L cars?
Click to expand...



[This message has been edited by NSXTC (edited 04 January 2002).]
 
I hope you meant twin-screw and this was just a type-o. At least on Comptech's site they claim a twin-scew. Twin-scew is much different then roots performance wise.
 
Ha! thanks for catching that! It is indeed a twin-screw made by Lysholm, sold in the US by Whipple:

<img src=http://www.superchargersonline.com/images/tech/whipple/sc_cutaway2.jpg>
 
From what I understand, there were some performance compromises made on the Comptech design to make sure that the supercharger fit underneath the engine cover. I remember it having something to do with the intake tract.
 
How about some top speed numbers? How long do rear tires last?
 
Originally posted by nsxxtreme:
attitude adjuster,
Where did you get your info from.
The book I have says that the twin screw is about 70% efficient. The centrifugal is about 75% efficient. How did you find out the Comptech is a twin scew.

I would love to look at the info you have access to. I am not doubting you, I am just interested in the info.

Answered one of my questions, looked on Comtech's site. Yes you are right theirs is a twin-scew.

Click to expand...


Look at
http://www.hotrodsusa.com/buynow/manufactures/whipple/faq.html#8

the website explains it. I don't know how accurate their numbers are, but it is pretty much online with my knowledge of superchargers. Also realize that the beauty of the Basch "beat you at the track"
wink.gif
Boost System is that it keeps the variable runner intake system in place. This make for ease of install/uninstall and performance. The shorter intake runners is best for high RPM numbers while the longer runners helps with low end torque. Now, I don't know how the Bacsh Booster will ACTUALLY do since I don't have one, BUT I say this.... I LIKE THE CONCEPT AND THE SYSTEM THUS FAR!!! In theory, this is on the money...

Cheers,

------------------
Kenji Ligon
91 Red CTSC NSX

[This message has been edited by Attitude Adjuster (edited 04 January 2002).]
 
Originally posted by JChoice:
From what I understand, there were some performance compromises made on the Comptech design to make sure that the supercharger fit underneath the engine cover. I remember it having something to do with the intake tract.
Click to expand...

CT uses a cut-down version of the intake manifold. This is the primary reason power drops off towards the very top of the RPM range with the CT unit. The Basch unit keeps the stock manifold.
 
Another thing too is that I know Mark Basch's kit will be the best kit to get from just alone his personal work ethics and his determination to produce a high quality kit. IMHO, customer service and the service after the money's been dropped on the product is a number-one requirement for me. The performance of the kit is a given to me for if I am seriously considering it then it fits my criteria of what I want.

------------------
Kenji Ligon
91 Red CTSC NSX
 

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