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cant decide NA or supercharge

Joined
6 June 2004
Messages
261
Location
Montreal, Quebec . Canada
you see im thinking of getting more horses into my car and i see SOS offers a stage 3 NA upgrade for about 8000 and comptech a supercharger for about 10000. Now my question is wich gives me more horses and reliability for my money.
 
I'm certainly not an expert, but it is my understanding that the NA tune will certainly be more reliable than the SC. On the other hand, the guys at SOS can get 400++ rwHP (with complementing mods) out of the CTSC!

In conclusion:
NA = > reliability; < power
CTSC = < reliability; > power

BTW, I'll eventually be going with the NA tune but I'm biased since I live in SOS land!
 
redshift said:
I'm certainly not an expert, but it is my understanding that the NA tune will certainly be more reliable than the SC. On the other hand, the guys at SOS can get 400++ rwHP (with complementing mods) out of the CTSC!

In conclusion:
NA = > reliability; < power
CTSC = < reliability; > power

BTW, I'll eventually be going with the NA tune but I'm biased since I live in SOS land!

as far as reliability goes, boost is also reliable as long as its tune properly.

Go with a supercharger. you'll get more power out of it.
 
haha NA is not necessarily always more reliable (i think of my friends super tuned big block that cant go driving more than 45 min without overheating) :biggrin:
at least with boost, if your fuel is managed properly and you have covered
any holes in your fuel maps for those jerky stop to full throttle inputs, plus you can always dial the boost down.

i was thinking about the SOS stage 2 as well though, its kind of nice to have your wheel horsepower exceeding/matching your OEM crank horsepower :biggrin:

although it would be nice to see some others bite the bullet on the SOS stage 3, it sounds like a pretty good alternative to a SC.

the thing to remember i think is that there are alot of unmentioned associated costs with either route

it definitely would be a good idea to hunt someone down with a comptech SC, and catch a ride, to see how you like the accelleration difference,
even someone i know that has 600+ rwhp told me once that, he thought it would feel faster than it did :biggrin:
 
saint2709 said:
so what your saying is get the stage 2 NA upgrade and then add the supercharger Wow!
Your saying +400 horses and still reliable, come on

what im saying is boost the nsx and get it tuned. If the tuner is knowledgeable then it will be reliable.

I've been driving a boosted honda since 2001 and have no reliability issues at all. Its also my daily driver.
 
NA is expensive and not often rewarding..given there are proven reliable boost options for the nsx, it's a better choice as long as you use the appropriate tuning.

NA is hard, you have to be dedicated to do it. If you look over the Stage 3 tune..it's best to do on a high mileage engine that needs a complete rebuild..as theya re going to sleeve it anyway. You also are not including the fine print

This stage includes processing of the engine block and installation of the engine block sleeves. Tear down, reassembly, seals, & bearings are not included. Larger injectors are required, and depend on your specific requirements.
Please contact us for a quote on your specific needs.

recommended:
adjustable cam gears
ScienceofSpeed Billet Oil Pump Gear
AEM Engine Management System (sold with ScienceofSpeed tuned calibration)
"

that is easily another 2-4k depending on labour rates and possible other parts you might do.
 
NA is the absolutely safest way to make power, hands down. Granted you won't be able to put up the numbers that boosted guys will be able to but you can still have fun, just not as much. :)
However you will rest better at night knowing that 99% of the time when you are driving the car it will be running properly as it was intended to from the Honda gods.
Even if your car is boosted and properly tuned it CAN have problems. There are members on here that can attest to that. I won't go any further than that. If they feel the need to chime in on subject then they can. But for the most part, tuning a boosted car will yield exciting and fun results.
Like my buddy Armando says, if you wanna play you better be willing to pay!!!!
 
If you want day in day out reliability, ease of operation, good vendor support, and something with a good fun factor it is very tough to beat a properly tuned CTSC. Squeezing out 400rwhp in an economical manner may be another story. However, with proper modifications and around 12k you should be near 370-380rwhp with plenty of low end torque. Hell if you wanted to you could install a small shot for some fun. When our NSX was CTSC’d we ran around at 450-470rwhp for tens of thousands of miles and track fun without any problems. In our opinion, if you have previous experience with turbos and have an affinity towards them, this is also a great alternative.

The NA route is very misleading here, it is safer and more reliable to a point. However, once you start boring out and raising compression, you better be sure your engine builder has the experience and knowledge to do it right. Once built find the best tuner for your particular EMS you purchase. In our opinion, the bang for the buck just isn’t there for the big NA package.

If you are still head strong on the NA route though we will soon be unloading several sets of 95mm high compression pistons and rods in the near future.
 
My personal thoughts would be if you are looking for a little more low end grunt and great around town driveability, go with the CTSC. Spend the 8K and call it a day.
 
Guess I should've been a little more clear in my reply. I was implying if you choose the NA route then I was assuming you would also keep everything as it came from the factory and not upgrade internals as FX pointed out.
They are correct in thier points also and have knowledge in those areas.
 
GruppeM SC

How does GruppeM SC fall into the mix w/ the FI options... It'd be nice to get some first-hand input from someone who has such on their NSX. I know an owner in Houston, but he doesn't frequent the boards much - if at all.

Can anyone shed some light on it in comparison to the CTSC (ie. costs, pros & cons, tuning, support, performance, etc).

Thanks.
 
Have a CTSC on my NSX that installed myself approximately 1 year ago. The car starts every time. hot weather or cold. Have taken some extended road trips including diving the car from Chicago to Watkins Glen last fall for EXPO. Ran the track event while there and my instructer commented that my car seemed to produce 100 more HP than his NSX judging by its excelleration out of turns and the higer speeds it achieved in the strats. Drove the car back from EXPO to Chicago stopping only for fuel and got almost 29 MPG. I could not be happier with the decission to go Comptech. Dependability has not been an issue.
 
Factor X Motorsports said:
The NA route is very misleading here, it is safer and more reliable to a point. However, once you start boring out and raising compression, you better be sure your engine builder has the experience and knowledge to do it right. Once built find the best tuner for your particular EMS you purchase. In our opinion, the bang for the buck just isn’t there for the big NA package.

If you are still head strong on the NA route though we will soon be unloading several sets of 95mm high compression pistons and rods in the near future.

I completely agree. I've built a few all-out 4 cyl H22a motors and they are ny no means anymore reliable once you start sleeving and basically rebuilding a motor. You're at the mercy of the builder. How about after 25,000kms and your sleeves shrink and you have to pull the motor and deck the block again (that hurt).

I think the 11:1 CR on the stage 3 is too reserved..I'd be going 12:1 straight up. I don't think the bang for buck is there either...whether it's cams or a stroker kit...the motor is not exactly pulling out mad numbers with the parts available.
 
Going NA with an NSX has been the unique way of making power. If you do, a very important aspect to keep in mind is that you will have to make sure your car is as light as possible. Sometimes just that can start to quickly add up in cost. I've seen a lot of Prime members running a Comptech or Basch SC only and they have been happy. Others with more mods have made much more power. It all depends on what you want and where you want to invest the money. It's good your are doing the research. Be informed, ask away!

Nik
 
saint2709 said:
you see im thinking of getting more horses into my car and i see SOS offers a stage 3 NA upgrade for about 8000 and comptech a supercharger for about 10000. Now my question is wich gives me more horses and reliability for my money.

imho, go boost, once you experience boost. You will never want na, at least not a small displacement na. Power is addictive thing.

Boosted nsx must be fun as hell to drive :smile:
 
Re: GruppeM SC

Osiris_x11 said:
How does GruppeM SC fall into the mix w/ the FI options... It'd be nice to get some first-hand input from someone who has such on their NSX. I know an owner in Houston, but he doesn't frequent the boards much - if at all.

Can anyone shed some light on it in comparison to the CTSC (ie. costs, pros & cons, tuning, support, performance, etc).

Thanks.


i saw a gruppem at SOS a couple days ago, it looks mean! But the tech did mention that on tuning, they found IAT's in excess of 250!! Holy crap!
That is without aftercooler, of course. once you tack on an aftercooler (to the tune of probably 2-3k installed) that should help out a lot..
 
NA is boring. FI is fun, believe me nothing like scaring the crap out of people with your diverter valve/ blow off valve/wastegate, etc.
 
NetViper said:
My personal thoughts would be if you are looking for a little more low end grunt and great around town driveability, go with the CTSC. Spend the 8K and call it a day.

How do you figure $8k?
 
icefire said:
Just call Clint at NOPI :wink:

what about the headers, exhaust, intake, installation and a new clutch? :tongue:
 
BRIDGEWATER ACURA said:
what about the headers, exhaust, intake, installation and a new clutch? :tongue:

You don't need all that stuff just for a CTSC... but it helps :)
 
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