How an M4 made me decide against an R8 (for now)...and brought me back to the NSX.

[WeakestLink]

Had a black 2018. Traded it in for a yellow 2020 (engine updates and prefer yellow). Got an allocation for a 2022 Type S and sold the 2020 before the Type S arrived. Loved the Type S but I didn't feel comfortable driving a $230-240k car. Not sure how to explain the psychology of being ok driving a $150k car but not a $200k+ car.

In any case, I ordered the very last R8 Performance at my local dealer, thinking it is my last chance to get the awesome sound of a screaming V10 engine. In an effort to preserve some tax credit on the sale of the Type S, and to give me something fun to drive while waiting 5 months for the R8, I bought a 2024 BMW M4 xDrive Competition. On paper, the M4 is amazingly quick (0-60 in 2.8 secs). But all that power didn't seem usable in every day driving. If you floored it, the M4 would move. But if you just wanted to accelerate quickly without going all out, the lag for the gears to shift and/or turbo to kick in was really annoying. I don't track or race so I'm more interested in the every day driving experience.

I've been driving EVs as my daily driver for 7+ years so I've grown accustomed to the instant torque. I think the electric motors in the NSX make it drive more like an EV in terms of power delivery. The entire time I had the M4, I kept thinking that the R8 would probably have a similar power delivery experience which would drive me nuts. When Audi told me that my R8 production was delayed again from Nov to Feb, I bought a 2021 NSX thinking that I can decide in Feb whether to just keep the NSX or trade it on the R8. I got a decent price on the NSX and don't think I will lose too much in 3 months. Of course, the day after I bought the NSX, my Audi rep texted me that the R8 got moved up and is now supposed to be delivered in late Nov/Dec.

I just received the NSX yesterday from the transport company. I have to address two small issues (broken clip for trim piece and side bolster wear) but I'm overall glad to be back in an NSX. I really wish I had just kept my yellow 2020 but nothing I can about that now. I'm leaning towards just keeping this NSX but I will make that final decision when the R8 arrives. Will the sound of the R8's V10 be enough to overcome the uneven power delivery of a gas powered engine?

 

[leov]

Having a sweet sound is nice but the priority will always be the actual drive. And based on the type of driving that you do (similar to me), it will be next to impossible to beat the NSX, especially at its' price range.

 

[drmanny3]

I suspect you can warranty the leather side bolster wear on your 2022 NSX for what it is worth. And yes the front electric motors give you instant torque that you can feel.

 

[Bricks and Bio]

Great story and sequence of ownership experiences, thanks for sharing
I have only been an electric car owner for a bit over a year, to me the Lucid is a very different experience, it just goes and without a sense of what the motors are having to do to make that happen
I have had my NSX for 7 years and the soundrack is mated to the performance
My question is, how much do you value the sound of the ICE?
For example, my LC500 convertible is not too fast but the soundtrack combined with the open top make for an intoxicating driving experience
If sound is your priority, I am guessing the R8 will be a car you really connect with

 

[WeakestLink]

I *think* I will value everyday driving experience over sound. But I've never had a great sounding car...the closest being a Carrera S with Sport Exhaust. I do know that the lag in the M4 was driving me nuts. My current daily is an RS Etron GT and I really like how you can step on the pedal at any speed and it immediately goes.

I need to jump over to the exhaust thread to get advice on how to make the NSX sound better. I know I can't get the throaty V10 sound but I'd be happy with a screaming Ferrari-like sound.

 

[docjohn]

So I don't quite get the "sell the type S" because it is too My "precious."..but sportscars are emotion driven. So since it sounds like buying them isn't the issue, and you like aural...
may I suggest flat plane crank, and either old 458 Italia, or new Z06 C8....which sounds ridiculous..

 

[Honcho]

Or a GT3. But I hope he keeps the NSX this time.

 

[docjohn]

Heck the GT4 RS( same engine) is also amazing sounding

 

[Bricks and Bio]

I will take an outsider looking in on the Type S
If you don't have a strong preference for the look of the Type S or connect to the "limited thing (noting the 22 sold in a multiple volume to the 21)" or the improvements and did not get it for sticker, then in a rational moment one might say why do I have say $75K more into this than I would for an earlier Gen 2 car (which will be easier to get parts for in the future).
I have yet to see a Gen 2 go up against a Gen 2 Type S to quantify the differences in performance (strange since the Type S has been on the street for a while).

 

[docjohn]

The S vs a 19-21 my performance differences are insignificant. The S is all about the front facelift, the Rear diffussssaaaa.... Last of the breed and the numbered series.

 

[WeakestLink]

I've admitted that I cannot explain why the Type S felt like too much car to drive but the regular NSX does not.

I definitely preferred the looks of the Type S but, to me, the differences aren't worth $80-90k outside of the collectability potential. And if I'm relying collectability, then I'd always be worried of scratches, dents, etc. I don't rely on auto reviews but most of them have reported better performance stats (at least 0-60) on the 2019-2021 NSX vs the Type S. Probably just differences in testing environments.

I have great respect for Porsches and would probably drive one if it were my only car. But there are so many on the road. And the current prices are insane. I'm definitely not a Corvette guy. I might eventually get a Ferrari (bucket list) as I understand their reliability has improved greatly. But idk if I would drive it daily.

I like the looks of the NSX and the expected reliability. So I guess I would extend my priorities to looks, reliability, performance, resale value and then sound. When I list out all the factors, I guess sound isn't a top priority.

I previously had an R8 but it had a V8, not a V10. As I perform my mental judo, I'm convincing myself that the NSX will hold its value better than the R8 simply due to the relatively high production numbers from 2006-2023.

 

[drmanny3]

It is interesting to hear different points of view concerning the ownership of exotic cars. I can not tell you how many times I have heard from those who have owned many exotics say in the end they have come back to the NSX. Why, because it is a reliable performance car, that does not require a mechanic following you everywhere you go. There are some great exotics out there that you pay once for the ownership, followed by paying to keep it running. Like getting a fast boat. The best day was getting it, followed by the second best day selling it.

 

[Bricks and Bio]

It surprises me how some folks that get into high performance cars miss/glance over the maintenance costs.
A guy on Ferrarichat with a 458 said his major service at 7 years at a dealership (after the service included when you purchase new) ran out was $5100.

 

[alum04org]

It surprises me how some folks that get into high performance cars miss/glance over the maintenance costs.
A guy on Ferrarichat with a 458 said his major service at 7 years at a dealership (after the service included when you purchase new) ran out was $5100.

Oh yea, B & B.
As much as I continually examine Ferrari ownership (either 430 Scuderia or a 2013-2015 458 Italia - no Spider), I observe the maintenance receipts/costs on BaT listings. Outrageous parts and service expense(s).

 

[docjohn]

There is a bit of ass kissing baked into F car ownership..no thanks..

 

[Bricks and Bio]

I think a lot of it is where you live and how the local dealers behave and what kind of indy shop network is available.

Here in Chicagoland we have 2 well established dealerships, Lake Forest and Continental that folks speak well of and multiple reputable Indy shops.

There is also a one of a kind owner group (Porsche would be an even bigger one) and opportunity to participate in really cool events

Plus for me, it's the brand I was nuts about when I was a kid

I really like the 296GTS thought the pricing is super crazy and it is likely to be a nightmare to own

The most rational one of the recent cars is likely a Portofino as a lot of the problems from the California were sorted out in the later car or the F8 at a much higher price point

 

[docjohn]

Ha, The portfino M is on my short list...I would enjoy stuffing my teenage sons in the vestigial rears seats..But remember at the swanky club events they have special "short" table seating for the California and portofino owners...

 

[Jetpilot3]

Great that you've returned to NSX ownership. The V-10 R8 is incredible sounding and I think you'd probably love it as well.

I've had a number of first gen NSX's and recently the Corvette C8 Stingray. Great car for the money but quality issues and it being on every street bug me. I'm awaiting the E-Ray Hybrid C8 and seeing as I'm sitting in the #1 spot at my dealership will take it and give it a go. My 17 NSX current wears winter tires and I can't wait to try it out this winter. The NC1 NSX is just so damn good and sexy to look at...

Plus I love the NC1s rarity and performance. It feels special.

 

[iconoblast]

Having had a V10 in an Audi S6, and a Gallardo, I don’t miss the sound. One exception might be the throttle blip on downshift in the latter. I would, however look to a modern turbo S to get a backseat and be back under warranty, as well as a little better steering feel and acceleration… shame on Porsche by the way for being seven years behind Acura in hybridizing.
Right now I’ll stick with my 2017 as I am out of money and I think the type S cost audio and snout are unacceptable.

There is such a thing as “too nice to drive” that for me at least comes around north of $200,000. Once I spill Coffee in it or get a door ding, the pressure is off and I can drive it, unless insurance and maintenance are crazy. My 2017 Nsx came scratched but mechanically sound and unfortunately I have added to cosmetic issues. I think it sounds damn good though.

I’m a bit strange in that I would rather hear turbos than wailing flat six. Can I get both? =The sagacious world-class athlete with an DD cup

 

[Ion]

There is definitely an emotional component to purchases like these. You have to just try different things within your allocated budget and go with your gut.

I test drove a 17 R8 V10 (non-plus) just minutes before the NSX I ultimately bought. It had a titanium exhaust and the sound was completely amazing but the ride was surprisingly bouncy and it had a lot more bark than bite when it came to acceleration. Maybe I would have felt different had it been a V10 plus with a tune and adjustable suspension.

What sold me on the NSX was how comfortable it was on the same roads and how the character completely changes with the different drive modes. It makes for a very comfortable cruiser but it also has a lot more low end punch thanks to hybrid assist. I had no doubt after the test drive that the NSX was the car I wanted to take home as it’s a beautiful car and very easy to live with. If you like that instant torque feel, I highly recommend a sprint booster if you don’t have one already. This remaps the throttle response and really makes the NSX feel like an EV off the line. I also put a Ktune flash on mind and top end power is greatly improved as well.

My only gripes about the NSX are the exhaust sound (or lack thereof), crazy amount of wheel gap, an interior rattle from the dash and the fact that the various settings can’t be decouple from the drive modes like on GTR / R8. I would prefer throttle, steering and exhaust from “sport +” with suspension from “sport” and intake sound from “quiet” and I wish sport + would auto shift in to 8th / 9th on the highway but we’re stuck with preset modes so I end up switching around a lot. I’ve heard a few clips of NSX with upgraded downpipes and exhaust and that greatly improves sound and adds some turbo whistle. There is a TSB on how to fix the dash rattle and a lowering kit greatly improves the stance so all of my gripes can be addressed other than the preset modes but it’s a minor quibble really for an otherwise great car.

As for the Type-S, I get it. I love the exterior styling changes but not sure it’s worth the premium. Fourwheel trader did price analysis on NSX recently and came to same conclusion. Between the huge ADM plus fear of driving due to depreciation or damage, I’d rather have something I could just drive and enjoy without worrying so much about it.

A buddy of mine just picked up an R8 with a titanium exhaust and tune and I followed behind him the other day. It really does sound amazing. I may get tempted to pick up an R8 / Lamborghini at some point just to enjoy that glorious soundtrack but NSX is certainly a worthy alternative and ultimately I think a more comfortable car to drive, at least for me. There Is no wrong answer between these two. All comes down to personal preference. Trying to decide between these two cars is a good problem to have.

 

[Honcho]

Ha, The portfino M is on my short list...I would enjoy stuffing my teenage sons in the vestigial rears seats..But remember at the swanky club events they have special "short" table seating for the California and portofino owners...

I thought about a Portofino or California for Mrs. Honcho, but she doesn't want the F-car attention.

 

[TigerNSX]

I had owned both Gen2 NSX and Gen2 R8 Performance at the same time, but recently sold the R8 back in October.

Here are my thoughts:

• I thought the R8 sounded intoxicating, especially between 5K-8K rpm. BUT it did get tiring at times because it was difficult to drive constantly at 5K-8K on the public road. When I would cruise around, the sound was just OK.
• I liked its sharp and quick steering. It's a big and heavy car, but it felt incredibly nimble. BUT I just did not like how the steering wheel felt in my hands. The pedals on the steering wheel were plastic and felt cheap, and the design of the steering wheel felt similar to other Audi including Audi SUVs.
• I felt that they tried to cram too much into the dashboard. It was cool at first. BUT over time, I found myself not loving it. And when I saw that other Audis also had similar dashboards, the R8 felt less special.
• The quality of interior materials (leather everywhere + Alcantara headliner) was high. BUT the leather on the passenger airbag area started delaminating and bubbling. I understand that certain NSXs also suffered from this. However, I was quite annoyed by it, and Audi would not cover it under warranty.
• There were more rattles in the R8 than the NSX. My car had rattles around the door, behind the passenger seat, and the passenger side blade. And the Audi dealer nearby me just could not fix them.
• The R8 felt like it had more room inside than the NSX. I mean I could adjust the seats in so many different ways, and my passenger could also be very comfortable. It also felt more luxurious than the NSX. My children and wife unanimously preferred riding in the R8 to the NSX where they felt more claustrophobic.
• I had many of my friends and family members drive the NSX and the R8 back to back. Most of them preferred the R8 to the NSX. I think it's easier to fall in love with. It sounds more exotic than the NSX, it has a luxurious interior, and it's easy to drive dizzyingly fast even as a novice driver. BUT even though I really liked the R8, I was not in love with it. Whenever I went to my garage, I often found myself wanting to drive the NSX more than the R8. And I felt that the driving experience of the NSX was more special.

 

[WeakestLink]

I had owned both Gen2 NSX and Gen2 R8 Performance at the same time, but recently sold the R8 back in October.

Here are my thoughts:

• I thought the R8 sounded intoxicating, especially between 5K-8K rpm. BUT it did get tiring at times because it was difficult to drive constantly at 5K-8K on the public road. When I would cruise around, the sound was just OK.
• I liked its sharp and quick steering. It's a big and heavy car, but it felt incredibly nimble. BUT I just did not like how the steering wheel felt in my hands. The pedals on the steering wheel were plastic and felt cheap, and the design of the steering wheel felt similar to other Audi including Audi SUVs.
• I felt that they tried to cram too much into the dashboard. It was cool at first. BUT over time, I found myself not loving it. And when I saw that other Audis also had similar dashboards, the R8 felt less special.
• The quality of interior materials (leather everywhere + Alcantara headliner) was high. BUT the leather on the passenger airbag area started delaminating and bubbling. I understand that certain NSXs also suffered from this. However, I was quite annoyed by it, and Audi would not cover it under warranty.
• There were more rattles in the R8 than the NSX. My car had rattles around the door, behind the passenger seat, and the passenger side blade. And the Audi dealer nearby me just could not fix them.
• The R8 felt like it had more room inside than the NSX. I mean I could adjust the seats in so many different ways, and my passenger could also be very comfortable. It also felt more luxurious than the NSX. My children and wife unanimously preferred riding in the R8 to the NSX where they felt more claustrophobic.
• I had many of my friends and family members drive the NSX and the R8 back to back. Most of them preferred the R8 to the NSX. I think it's easier to fall in love with. It sounds more exotic than the NSX, it has a luxurious interior, and it's easy to drive dizzyingly fast even as a novice driver. BUT even though I really liked the R8, I was not in love with it. Whenever I went to my garage, I often found myself wanting to drive the NSX more than the R8. And I felt that the driving experience of the NSX was more special.

Thanks for the detailed review. My R8 is supposed to arrive on Monday but I will be out of town for the holidays and have another 2 weeks to decide. I had pretty much decided on keeping the NSX and then started having second thoughts after passing an R8 this afternoon that sounded great. I think I'm still going to stick with the NSX for the reasons stated above.

 

[TigerNSX]

In the end, it's a wonderful problem to have! Both are amazing cars. Congratulations!

 

[EuroBoutique]

Enjoyed your story!

We also have an F80 m3 and these cars are polar opposites but both great in their own way.... we are also a R8 specialty shop and run the Facebook owners group for R8 owners so we know the car well.

The R8 and NSX are similar cars with different DNA - both are unique cars that stand out as the average person has not seen either car from a general population standpoint. V8/V10 NA vs. V6 but the beauty is in the 1st gen design both cars offer manual transmissions!

Sadly in the 2nd gen both do not offer 6-speed manuals but side by side both cars do things well in different ways. In stock form the R8 has the better interior, exhaust note and German engineering (which is a plus/minus) depending on how you look at it.

2nd gen NSX could be better interior (using our CF parts catalog) and the exhaust can be upgraded too, see our latest video here:

Of course we are a bit biased but we think the Type-S can hold it's own against cars that punch way above the sticker price, recently we drove the new Ferrari SF90 at a $600k MSRP and we left thinking this car is really not 3x better than the Type-S with similar powertrains. Granted it's got 1000hp vs 600hp for the Type-S, the two cars on the street are quite comparable.

Look for our post on the SF90 comparison shortly!