i'm not being PC out of fear or respect for/of anyone. He never stated the engine blows smoke, idles rough, accellerates poorly, or has any other problem related to driveability.. He said he's concerned (rightfully so) that pushing it hard could cause problems without that box installed. sure there's a possibility of problems, but who has a blown motor without some sort of issue named above? that's the only reason i say i don't think it's blown...he never mentioned a decrement in driveability..
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Long Term Serious Basch Boost Supercharger Problem
- Thread starter bharpensx
- Start date
peiserg said:
You have blinders on if you think he doesn't have problems, I would bet you a grand he has at lest some kind of damage to his pistons. Its only a mater of time until it becomes clear how bad it is, if he keeps driving it the way he is now he may never know.
My car was driving great even after it blew oil all over the 15 other NSXs that where following me.
Out of 150+ bbsc sold, 48+ have blown up. Not very good odds IMO.
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prova4re said:
48? Sounds a little high.
Do the leak down, it should be less than 15%, if the head gasket is gone it will be readily apparent. There is a know history of faulty coolant reservoir issues with this system, yours can be removed in 15 minutes and pressure checked at any aluminum welding shop who can also repair the unit if there is a pin hole or leaking weld. I would wait on the prognosis until this key information is in. The leakdown can be done as easy as a spark plug change without removing the charger or drive system, usually $300 bucks or so
The shop in Atlanta that has one of the top AEM tuning experts is Balanced Performance.
http://www.balancedperformance.com
http://www.balancedperformance.com
DONYMO said:
I second this recommendation. Ed is the best, and the entire shop is very professional.
OH MY GOD!!! Look for a second engine ASAP,
First he said the car runs fine, just has a coolant leak AT THE RESIVOR!!!
Second, since the car haven’t really been used for 3 years why the rush to find the new engine ASAP?
And how do you know that after spending 6K or more on a new used engine it doesn’t have issues?
My advice...if anyone cares...
#1 compression and leak down test (just to make sure it will handle #2)
#2 get an AEM, they are cheap...
#3 tune, (learn to trust people, this car is nor as insanely different from all the other cars on the market, a trained AEM tuner should have no problems with it.
#4 relax, learn to trust people you don’t "know" and stop reading about how bad everything you do to you car is...
First he said the car runs fine, just has a coolant leak AT THE RESIVOR!!!
Second, since the car haven’t really been used for 3 years why the rush to find the new engine ASAP?
And how do you know that after spending 6K or more on a new used engine it doesn’t have issues?
My advice...if anyone cares...
#1 compression and leak down test (just to make sure it will handle #2)
#2 get an AEM, they are cheap...
#3 tune, (learn to trust people, this car is nor as insanely different from all the other cars on the market, a trained AEM tuner should have no problems with it.
#4 relax, learn to trust people you don’t "know" and stop reading about how bad everything you do to you car is...
First, let me thank you for your input on my problem:
1. I don't know if the engine is okay any more, I am trying to figure that out.
2. No one has ever figured out that the coolant leak is at the reservoir, and if it is, I can't replace it, as it is now Basch proprietary.
.............
Why am I in "a rush" to find a solution? I have had a car that is sitting for 3 years. It is your suggestion that it sits for three more? (rhetorical question)
-------------
As for an AEM, that might be a great answer. Should I relax and trust people? This problem came about after a lot of other superchargers had been released. I waited until someone who "knew" NSXs developed something that was supposed to be very good and without problems.
Again, I wish to thank you for your advice and wish you the best in the future.
BHarpe.
Oh, one final thing..you might want to consider..and it may not be important to your future. Make sure that your grammar and spelling is correct so people can figure out what you are saying.
1. I don't know if the engine is okay any more, I am trying to figure that out.
2. No one has ever figured out that the coolant leak is at the reservoir, and if it is, I can't replace it, as it is now Basch proprietary.
.............
Why am I in "a rush" to find a solution? I have had a car that is sitting for 3 years. It is your suggestion that it sits for three more? (rhetorical question)
-------------
As for an AEM, that might be a great answer. Should I relax and trust people? This problem came about after a lot of other superchargers had been released. I waited until someone who "knew" NSXs developed something that was supposed to be very good and without problems.
Again, I wish to thank you for your advice and wish you the best in the future.
BHarpe.
Oh, one final thing..you might want to consider..and it may not be important to your future. Make sure that your grammar and spelling is correct so people can figure out what you are saying.
prova4re said:
That's why you don't buy a SC kit from a mechanic.
SDNSX said:
These are the reasons why I say look for a used engine..........
1) This is 2005 now and I no longer track the car and am afraid to take it much over 5000 RPM for fear of detonation. So the car which I loved to drive and was going to be one of those 100K+ NSXs easily hasn’t had 10,000 miles put on it in the last 3 years. It sits dormant in the winters, which are mild in NC. I finally got it out again this month and this time promised myself to take this to completion this spring and summer.
2) The car is still in its original supercharged state, me worrying about detonation, dealing with the water leak and afraid to have any more fun in the car.
3) Without putting a dollar amount on anything, a normally aspirated NSX that you can drive anywhere and have fun with any time is worth MUCH MORE than a supercharged NSX that you are afraid to do anything with.
This is why I said get it ASAP..........
4) IS THERE ANY WAY TO GET THIS CAR BACK TO STOCK??
As for my spelling or grammar, I don't have time or the patience to sit in front of this computer and worry about what you or anyone else thinks. I would rather be out in the real world making money, then sitting here talking about how much your going to lose if you keep going down the BBSC road.
Best of luck.
1) This is 2005 now and I no longer track the car and am afraid to take it much over 5000 RPM for fear of detonation. So the car which I loved to drive and was going to be one of those 100K+ NSXs easily hasn’t had 10,000 miles put on it in the last 3 years. It sits dormant in the winters, which are mild in NC. I finally got it out again this month and this time promised myself to take this to completion this spring and summer.
2) The car is still in its original supercharged state, me worrying about detonation, dealing with the water leak and afraid to have any more fun in the car.
3) Without putting a dollar amount on anything, a normally aspirated NSX that you can drive anywhere and have fun with any time is worth MUCH MORE than a supercharged NSX that you are afraid to do anything with.
This is why I said get it ASAP..........
4) IS THERE ANY WAY TO GET THIS CAR BACK TO STOCK??
As for my spelling or grammar, I don't have time or the patience to sit in front of this computer and worry about what you or anyone else thinks. I would rather be out in the real world making money, then sitting here talking about how much your going to lose if you keep going down the BBSC road.
Best of luck.
prova4re said:
I agree with prova4re.
It is the cheapest and best solution.
IMHO it sounds like you are terrified of this car which in todays world is a pretty low tech machine...As a master certified tech for 25+ years I would suggest what many have said...get a leakdown test ASAP..If the engine passes take the car to a qualified shop/ tech to install and tune the AEM and have the coolant surge tank removed and all seams RE-welded!
Hope it all works out but to me it sounds like you are afraid of the car at this time so....I WILL BUY IT!
Hope it all works out but to me it sounds like you are afraid of the car at this time so....I WILL BUY IT!
you seem like a pretty nice and attentive guy - why don't you buy him one?bharpensx said:
01blacks4 said:
01blacks4 :biggrin:
First of all, I wish to thank everyone of you for your input and information on this problem as well as solutions. I have just had the opportunity now to catch up with all of the public information. I have been responding to private posts and emails separately and making a few calls.
I am going to write something more detailed with my plans, perhaps asking for more input. But I wished right now to express my appreciation again for the NSX Owners helping each other.
When it comes to car clubs, it doesn't get any better than this.:smile:
Bill Harpe.
I am going to write something more detailed with my plans, perhaps asking for more input. But I wished right now to express my appreciation again for the NSX Owners helping each other.
When it comes to car clubs, it doesn't get any better than this.:smile:
Bill Harpe.
I have not proved any damage, nor have I approached Mark for possible reparations.
Bill,
I'm an oldie here too from the past and (unfortunately) don't wander over here too often anymore. Frankly, one reason I stopped by was because that it seems like there are SO many Ford GT owners that have or previously have had NSX's. It's really an amazing statistic I believe.... but I digress.
I had the Basch installed on my NSX approximately the same time as you did. Through the school of hard knocks (no pun intended) I discovered that no one in the NSX community knew anything much about the SS box - and unfortunately not Mark (at the time). Over the course of approx. 4 months, I got to know the SS box quite well - and also had the good fortune to get to know Mark (owner of Split Second) pretty darn good.
With a considerable investment in some good wideband equipment and a lot of hours of careful tuning, I created more than 60 variations of SS mapping tables for the NSX. Mind you, during every step of testing, I was running 100 octane (as a precaution) and the wideband was both datalogging and providing real-time feedback. In my humble opinion, I think I ended up with absolutely the best tuned Basch SC on the planet. Seriously, my car ran very, very well.... and still does today for the new owner. BUT, it was completely unrealistic for your average owner to have to go through what I did to get the kit running as it should.
Also, since so much time has passed, I'm no longer reluctant to say things I wouldn't have said in the past. So, regarding the , replacement version of the SS Box, Mark Basch and Mark from SS were never in agreement that there really was a problem with box number 1. In other words, there might not be any harm at all to stay with the SS box you have in the car. (Again, I think most of the pengine problems were due to poor mapping tables.)
Another admission is that I'm not sure that Mark Basch EVER came out with a real good map. Honest to God, in all of my experience, I only heard my car ping one time, and that was the day that Mark had dropped the car off at my home and I took it for the first drive with the SC. In all of my testing and experimentation - we NEVER allowed the car to get itself into a lean ping condition. Anyway, at one point I know that Mark was distributing a mapping table that I developed (he denies it... and perhaps we iterated to the same table), but I made progressively better tables.
Let's get back to you post and quest for input:
1. Your coolant leak is coming from the polished aluminum overflow reservoir. I'm certain of it. These overflows were sourced from Dali back when Mark B and Mark J were still friends. The whole first batch of them leaked. Mine leaked. Mark B replaced mine and acknowledged that he had replaced several others. This is your coolant problem.
2. I wouldn't worry about installing the new SS box. However, I would update to a better map. If you can't get one from Mark or the gent's here, I'd be happy to go root around and see if I can find mine. I caution you, however, unlike Mark I do not claim that one size fits all. If you want my table, know that it works perfectly in my car. I would THINK that it would work well in your car BUT I DONT KNOW. Get back to me if you want.
3. There's an outside chance that I still have Mark's instructions on installing the new box. As I recall there's at least one non-straightforward wiring trick. By the way, on all of our early cars, Mark spliced directly into the ECU wiring harness. Along with the new box, I strong-armed Mark into giving me the short female/male ECU loom to make the SS box truly plug and play. When I installed the new SS, I restored all of the factory connections (solder, shrinkwrap, etc.) and installed the short pigtail for the SS.
Finally, let me know how I can help.
And back to my original soapbox, I hope to see more of you over on the Ford GT forums..... dare I call it the next generation NSX?
Peace.
I'm an oldie here too from the past and (unfortunately) don't wander over here too often anymore. Frankly, one reason I stopped by was because that it seems like there are SO many Ford GT owners that have or previously have had NSX's. It's really an amazing statistic I believe.... but I digress.
I had the Basch installed on my NSX approximately the same time as you did. Through the school of hard knocks (no pun intended) I discovered that no one in the NSX community knew anything much about the SS box - and unfortunately not Mark (at the time). Over the course of approx. 4 months, I got to know the SS box quite well - and also had the good fortune to get to know Mark (owner of Split Second) pretty darn good.
With a considerable investment in some good wideband equipment and a lot of hours of careful tuning, I created more than 60 variations of SS mapping tables for the NSX. Mind you, during every step of testing, I was running 100 octane (as a precaution) and the wideband was both datalogging and providing real-time feedback. In my humble opinion, I think I ended up with absolutely the best tuned Basch SC on the planet. Seriously, my car ran very, very well.... and still does today for the new owner. BUT, it was completely unrealistic for your average owner to have to go through what I did to get the kit running as it should.
Also, since so much time has passed, I'm no longer reluctant to say things I wouldn't have said in the past. So, regarding the , replacement version of the SS Box, Mark Basch and Mark from SS were never in agreement that there really was a problem with box number 1. In other words, there might not be any harm at all to stay with the SS box you have in the car. (Again, I think most of the pengine problems were due to poor mapping tables.)
Another admission is that I'm not sure that Mark Basch EVER came out with a real good map. Honest to God, in all of my experience, I only heard my car ping one time, and that was the day that Mark had dropped the car off at my home and I took it for the first drive with the SC. In all of my testing and experimentation - we NEVER allowed the car to get itself into a lean ping condition. Anyway, at one point I know that Mark was distributing a mapping table that I developed (he denies it... and perhaps we iterated to the same table), but I made progressively better tables.
Let's get back to you post and quest for input:
1. Your coolant leak is coming from the polished aluminum overflow reservoir. I'm certain of it. These overflows were sourced from Dali back when Mark B and Mark J were still friends. The whole first batch of them leaked. Mine leaked. Mark B replaced mine and acknowledged that he had replaced several others. This is your coolant problem.
2. I wouldn't worry about installing the new SS box. However, I would update to a better map. If you can't get one from Mark or the gent's here, I'd be happy to go root around and see if I can find mine. I caution you, however, unlike Mark I do not claim that one size fits all. If you want my table, know that it works perfectly in my car. I would THINK that it would work well in your car BUT I DONT KNOW. Get back to me if you want.
3. There's an outside chance that I still have Mark's instructions on installing the new box. As I recall there's at least one non-straightforward wiring trick. By the way, on all of our early cars, Mark spliced directly into the ECU wiring harness. Along with the new box, I strong-armed Mark into giving me the short female/male ECU loom to make the SS box truly plug and play. When I installed the new SS, I restored all of the factory connections (solder, shrinkwrap, etc.) and installed the short pigtail for the SS.
Finally, let me know how I can help.
And back to my original soapbox, I hope to see more of you over on the Ford GT forums..... dare I call it the next generation NSX?
Peace.
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kpond said:
I thought the gallardo was the next gen NSX. :biggrin:
I had a similar coolant problem after going SC. The smell of the coolant with never a trace of the coolant itself. I felt it was caused by boil-over not controlled by the pressure cap. I added Redline's "water wetter?" and higher rated pressure cap. That seemed to solve the problem.
I did not like the added stress of higher pressure in the coolant system so I eventually changed to Evans alternative coolant that has 375 degree boiling point and better heat transfer characteristics than Ethelyn/glycol and water. I now run at atmospheric pressure and no smell or overheating problems. I would be very suspect of the coolant tank, I have heard of more than a few after market tanks leaking at the seams.
I real don't know if you have an engine problem; only testing will tell for sure. The previously recommended compression test; which is fast and simple, would be my first step. If no problem is evident then go to leak-down test to confirm the preliminary results from the compression test. If both test are positive I would proceed with the purchase of and AEM and locating a reliable tuner.
This is how I would proceed if I owned the car. There are number BBSC systems that are reliable and producing nice gains according to threads; I hope you are soon one of that number.
Please keep us informed of you progress and the decisions regarding the car. Before making the decision to replace the engine I would explore all possibilities. You never know for sure what you are purchasing when buying a used engine. I bought a spare engine and upon tear down found some serious internal problems. If your engine does have a problem I would be glad to talk about what the resolution was for dealing with my problem.
Bob
I did not like the added stress of higher pressure in the coolant system so I eventually changed to Evans alternative coolant that has 375 degree boiling point and better heat transfer characteristics than Ethelyn/glycol and water. I now run at atmospheric pressure and no smell or overheating problems. I would be very suspect of the coolant tank, I have heard of more than a few after market tanks leaking at the seams.
I real don't know if you have an engine problem; only testing will tell for sure. The previously recommended compression test; which is fast and simple, would be my first step. If no problem is evident then go to leak-down test to confirm the preliminary results from the compression test. If both test are positive I would proceed with the purchase of and AEM and locating a reliable tuner.
This is how I would proceed if I owned the car. There are number BBSC systems that are reliable and producing nice gains according to threads; I hope you are soon one of that number.
Please keep us informed of you progress and the decisions regarding the car. Before making the decision to replace the engine I would explore all possibilities. You never know for sure what you are purchasing when buying a used engine. I bought a spare engine and upon tear down found some serious internal problems. If your engine does have a problem I would be glad to talk about what the resolution was for dealing with my problem.
Bob
Bob Kenney said:
Tell me more about your experience with the Evans coolant. How easy was it to switch over as I know there cannot be any water in your system? What are your thoughts on the capability of the aluminum block to handle those higher temps? I have thought about this setup for a year, but wondered how a non-drag setup would handle this coolant.
ncdogdoc said:
Gary;
The switch over to Evens is a little arduous.
1. I drained all my normal coolant.
2. I changed to a lower temperate thermostat.
3. I refilled the system with Sierra antifreeze to flush all the original antifreeze. Sierra and the Evens are compatible were Evens and Ethylene/glycol are not. I ran the car at idle until it came up to temp and I was sure the coolant was circulating. I did the standard bleeding of the system to be sure I had full circulation. I then drained the system again and let it sit overnight with all drains open.
4. Filled the coolant system as normal and bleed it again and it was good to go.
Every thing is running cooler than before; I feel it helps deal with the extra heat generated by boost helping keep the whole engine safer. I will be doing track events this summer and give it a much harder test but to date the street drives, engine and drive train testing have not taxed the coolant system at all.
Bob
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