Methanol Injection Failsafe & AEM EMS

[nsxinkl]

I understand that some guys who run Methanol injection wire in boost control solenoid so that if they run out of methanol injection, the solenoid opens and dumps boost to wastegate pressure.

I need help on wiring and setting up failsafe for my methanol injection on AEM EMS. The failsafe function can be set as always on or always off. When failsafe is triggered, it will send signal via a wire. How do I connect this wire to the AEM EMS? Which pin on the AEM EMS do I use for this purpose? Should I set the failsafe as always on or always off?

Which function on the AEM EMS should I use to dump boost to wastegate pressure when failsafe function is triggered? (I already have boost control solenoid)

TIA

 

[angus]

You only need to connect the failsafe wire from the CMGS to cut power to the boost solenoid.

 

[nsxinkl]

You only need to connect the failsafe wire from the CMGS to cut power to the boost solenoid.

without power to the boost solenoid, would boost go out of control? How to limit it to say 6psi?

 

[nsxinkl]

Can someone please post or pm me the wiring diagram?

TIA

 

[DDozier]

Can someon please post or pm me the wiring diagram?

TIA

This may help you to understand what is happening.

http://www.splparts.com/doc/tech/EBC.htm

The waste gate on your turbo is controlled by a spring, left to its own devices a 6lb spring will allow the turbo to build 6lbs or so of boost, then the spring in the waste gate can no longer hold against the pressure and it releases the waste gate allowing exhaust to be diverted away from the turbo slowing it down. This is well and good if you only want to see 6lbs of boost. If you want to see more you either increase your spring presure and mechanically raise the boost or you can add a boost controller to do the same thing by modifing the boost signal going to the waste gate.

Here is an example:
If you setup your system to hit 6lbs using just the waste gate spring and that is your safe limit without meth, then you should tune the car to 6lbs of boost first, make sure it is safe before you add in the boost control. Tune again to the higher max boost level lets say 9lbs. You simply wire any fail safe from any of your systems not just meth to the boost solenoid, if the solenoid can not function then the only thing to control boost would be the spring pressure and you will see 6lbs of boost, your safe limit in this example. Without the boost solenoid there should be no way to reach 9lbs of boost.

You can use this failsafe to limit boost for many different reasons, lets say you do not want the valet to burn off all of your tires, you could wire a small switch hidden on the dash to disable the boost solenoid, and now he can only burn off your tires at a 6lb level instead of 9lb level. You can use your oil or coolant temp to trigger this as well, so as the temps rise the boost will fall back to a safer level.

I hope this and the related link helps.

Dave

 

[nsxinkl]

Thanks Dave, that was really informative for a mechanical imbecile like me. Really appreciate it. I will try to understand it and attempt to set up the failsafe function to dump boost to wastegate pressure correctly.

 

[lightguy]

You know whats cool ?
Angus/Wil helping to solve a problem with anothers kit.

Dave you too

 

[nsxinkl]

I still have not figured out how to wiring for the failsafe to operate properly. Can someone please post or PM me the wiring diagram?

TIA

 

[Cody@LoveFab]

Hey Shaw. We switched email again as Yahoo has really been acting up. Anyway, I'll try to send you a diagram sometime today from our Gmail account, [email protected]

 

[nsxinkl]

Cody, once again thanks for stepping up and offering your help. It is much appreciated.

 

[Maximumyield]

Can someone please post or pm me the wiring diagram?

TIA

I am useing a grounded ON/OFF switch under the astray lid to activate the methanol and trigger the NOS/Methanol map on the AEM EMS which uses a grounded input to do so.

When The switch is on it will trigger the grounded input to the AEM EMS and switch the map to a NOS/Methanol map, sending a grounded output from the AEM EMS to a second 5 pin relay which will trigger the +12v wire to the methanol control unit and methanol pump turning it on.
I am useing 2 relays to accomplish this, like the pic below.
Now when the failsafe wire from the methanol control unit triggers the relay due to a problem like running low on meth, blown fuse, or short circuit etc, it will automatically trigger my switch to the off position and therefore kill the methanol and automatically set my EMS back to no methanol map, even though the manual switch is still in the on position under the astray lid, it overides it to off from the relay triggered by the failsafe wire.In this system I am turning the methanol ON/OFF by a switch, not useing it fulltime.

I decided to go this route so I can drive the car with the option of having methanol (HI) boost when I decide, I am not useing methanol fulltime, switch off no methanol (LOW) boost since I have a water cooled intercooler also.

A Note, I had rev A, one of the first editions on the AEM EMS and the ground input/output triggers would not work no matter what I did, after talking to Edward @ AEM many times, I was informed my wiring was probably ok and it was the AEM EMS that needed to be upgraded to Rev C, current.
AEM was very good to me and updated it for Free NO charge, and my AEM EMS was almost 2 years old, and out of warranty (1 year).
I just had to pay shipping one way I believe. Thanks for the great customer service AEM thumbs up.Got the AEM EMS back and it worked like a charm. :smile:

I will attach the diagram I used and some relay info below.
Hopefully this can help (nsxinkl) or someone else.
I am sure you could come up with other ideas from a diagram like this too,
You can find the input and output wires in the AEM manual to use if you go with a switch.
http://forum.aempower.com/forum/index.php/topic,24103.0.html

 

[angus]

If you set up your methanol to flow enough volume , your methanol will be it's own failsafe, I set up cars so that if the methanol cuts off for any reason (ie. runs out of meth , pump fails , fuse blows , etc.) the AFR will go into 17-18:1 range - at this AFR the car will not even accelerate under boost, car will just bog as soon as you go into boost - not to mention you will see your AFR gauge go dead lean...

I am not a fan of anything complicated and this is by far the simplest way to set up the methanol - no extra wires or nitrous maps needed.

What you are doing is running enough cc's of methanol so that you can trim the fuel down under boost (you are supplementing the fuel with methanol) this means if/when your meth is not flowing , your AFR will go lean , the trick is to set it up so it will go leaner than 17:1 as I have found that at that AFR the car bogs down and will not even accelerate, thus preventing engine damage.

This is just my 2¢

 

[baynsac]

If you set up your methanol to flow enough volume , your methanol will be it's own failsafe, I set up cars so that if the methanol cuts off for any reason (ie. runs out of meth , pump fails , fuse blows , etc.) the AFR will go into 17-18:1 range - at this AFR the car will not even accelerate under boost, car will just bog as soon as you go into boost - not to mention you will see your AFR gauge go dead lean...

I am not a fan of anything complicated and this is by far the simplest way to set up the methanol - no extra wires or nitrous maps needed.

What you are doing is running enough cc's of methanol so that you can trim the fuel down under boost (you are supplementing the fuel with methanol) this means if/when your meth is not flowing , your AFR will go lean , the trick is to set it up so it will go leaner than 17:1 as I have found that at that AFR the car bogs down and will not even accelerate, thus preventing engine damage.

This is just my 2¢

Do you need to have AEM- EMS to do this of can it be done with FIC?

 

[Cozmo]

Do you need to have AEM- EMS to do this of can it be done with FIC?

The fic has a dual calibration mode so you could have a 'no meth' tune, then wire it up so that it changes to that calibration when it gets the signal from your meth controller.

 

[angus]

Do you need to have AEM- EMS to do this of can it be done with FIC?

This has nothing to do with the engine management - that is the beauty of it.

It is completely independant and very simple, which is why I like it.