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Should this be a salvage title?

mknmoves

mknmoves

Experienced Member
Joined
8 March 2010
Messages
397
Location
Charlotte, NC
Project NSX, VIN: JH4NA1181TT000118

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/REPA...iewItem&pt=US_Cars_Trucks&hash=item27b3bd2763

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!By1w2zQ!Wk~$(KGrHqMOKi8E)IIIdT8DBMT,jzB+3w~~_12.JPG





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Seller: 75liquidlou ( Feedback Score Of 456)
 
Last edited:
No. Looks like it will buff out.:eek:
 
If the owner didn't "sell it" to the insurance company (which looks like what is happening), then it won't be a salvage title. It doesn't become salvage until the car is "totaled" by insurance. Maybe the insurance company made him an offer and he thinks it was too low and decided to keep it instead of totaling it betting that he'll get more by auctioning it off. Which if that's case, if someone buys it, and repairs it, even the accident might not even show up on carfax if the repair shop doesn't report the repair. Just something to think about.
 
CarFax seems to like this one... lightly used before it was lightly rolled :biggrin: If I had a facility to do body work I might take a flyer for $10K or so, especially if the frame and engine are undamaged as the listing indicates.
 
RJPKRP said:
If the owner didn't "sell it" to the insurance company (which looks like what is happening), then it won't be a salvage title. It doesn't become salvage until the car is "totaled" by insurance.
Click to expand...

This is bad advice. As an ex adjustor and damage estimator for Progressive, I can assure you the owner can retain ownership and have the car issued a salvage title. The insurance company can total the car for cost of repair, to avoid the potential headache from a repair that is never 'perfect' in the owners eyes, or simply because they choose to. As it is your posession, the insurance company has to provide you with a salvage value, should you wish to purchase the vehicle back.

The salvage value is determined by a vendor, like co-part, and the insurance company then makes you a full offer if they take ownership of the vehicle, or a reduced offer (the salvage amount) if you wish to keep the car.

In either event, the insurance company will report the car to the DMV as being in an accident and totaled, and they will send a letter to the owner advising the title must be surrendered in x number of days (depends on local statutes) to be branded.

The fact he shows a picture of a clean title means nothing. It could be he never had it branded. Also, its not an instant process so there is down time between the vehicle being determined a total loss and the title branding process beginning.

If I were trying to pawn a soon to be salvaged car to an unsuspecting buyer, ebay is a good method. Alternitively, if I wrecked my NSX, and didn't have collision insurance, the only way to re-coup some of the value is to sell the car as is, which might be what this person is doing.

Looking at the pictures I would be wary though. The pillar/roof damage will scare alot of people who are potential buyers down the road. Additionally, I've seen a number of fenders that looked repairable, but when removed the underlying aprons needed to be replaced. And cars don't like to be rolled, there could also be suspension damage, engine/transmission damage, not to mention all the little cracks/fractures that could be present on the headlights, core support, etc, that would need to be replaced to do a proper repair and not a band-aid.

At almost 10k (with 5+ days left on the listing), with what could easily be 10-15k+ to repair if it is worse then it looks underneath, and no maintinence history listed, you could be into a wrecked NSX for 25-30k+ in the blink of an eye. At 5k I say its a parts car worse case scenario and you'll at least break even, but at 10k+ you could stand to lose some serious $$$.
 
RJPKRP said:
If the owner didn't "sell it" to the insurance company (which looks like what is happening), then it won't be a salvage title. It doesn't become salvage until the car is "totaled" by insurance. Maybe the insurance company made him an offer and he thinks it was too low and decided to keep it instead of totaling it betting that he'll get more by auctioning it off. Which if that's case, if someone buys it, and repairs it, even the accident might not even show up on carfax if the repair shop doesn't report the repair. Just something to think about.
Click to expand...

<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

In my experience, if an Insurance company totals the car (which this one IMO should be) they then negotiate/offer the owner the car back. He can either accept the offer or turn it back to the Insurance company. If he buys it back, the Insurance company is suppossed to issue a salvage title.

Unless this owner, didn't have full coverage or didn't report the accident??

In any case in MOST states on the back of the title, there will be a box to check, regarding whether the car was ever involved in an accident within a certain percentage of its value, ie: 25%, 50% etc. The seller should def be checking that box if it exists on his title.

Just my .02
 
Let's make no mistake.....I'm not saying anyone should purchase this car and attempt to repair it. Let alone try an keep a clean title at the same time.

I'm just explaining how this car MIGHT escape having a salvaged title, especially if the owner never reported it to insurance, or worse yet, had no insurance to begin with.

mknmoves said:
Unless this owner, didn't have full coverage or didn't report the accident??
Click to expand...


Hard Five,

Thanks for explaining the process. I was under the presumption that totaling worked much the same as other insurance claims/non claims. Where I have the option to decline my insurance payment for a service (say hail repair and painting) even though it exceeds my deductible. Perhaps I want to use a specific body shop who doesn't have an agreement with my insurance carrier, then I have the right to decline the insurance payment and self pay. Thought it worked the same with totaled cars too (dunno, I haven't totaled a car in almost 20 years....knock on wood (I just did)).

So that leaves this car either in the limbo state you described or the owner didn't notify/have insurance.

Once again, I am not recommending someone purchase this vehicle unless you have a specific use for the parts.

I saw someone asking here on prime about listing parts from a parts car, I wonder if it is that prime member, or if this is just a new parts NSX.
 
RJPKRP said:
I was under the presumption that totaling worked much the same as other insurance claims/non claims. Where I have the option to decline my insurance payment for a service (say hail repair and painting) even though it exceeds my deductible. Perhaps I want to use a specific body shop who doesn't have an agreement with my insurance carrier, then I have the right to decline the insurance payment and self pay.
Click to expand...

You are somewhat right. If you own your car outright (no lien) and if you turn in a claim that you end up deciding is not worth it, you can close the claim without a payment from the insurance company. The issue is, if the insurance company determines the car a total loss, the insurance company is contractually obligated to pay, so they will rarely allow you to walk away without receiving a payment as you could come back 1-2 years later and ask for payment. Problem is the payment would be based on market value at the time of the loss, which obviously gets much harder to show as time goes on.

Additionally, as in this case, its a bad buisness decision to allow a vehicle with obvious structural damage (the pillar) to close there claim without payment and branding of the title. If the vehicle was sold, and the damage was not disclosed to the buyer, its possible (though not likely) that the new owner could come back legally against the insurance company, as there would be a record of the claim through ISO (its a claims database), and the car would have been flagged as a total loss.

If you have a car that might be a total, best to have a reputable shop look it over and make a determination on there eval. With exotics, most insurance company's are quick to total if they can, as owners are typically very devoted to their cars, and in some eyes the fact a car has been repaired, regardless of quality, ruins the cars value. Its 'easier' to total the car and avoid that issue entirely.

In this case though I bet it is really too damaged to be fixed by your average owner (a body shop guy could probably make it happen though). I bet I could write a 20K+ plus estimate on this car without much effort (especially if I'm using new OEM parts and not used)
 
The color of the car is green so it is automatically a total loss.:biggrin:
Jk.

There is the possibility that the owner did not have collision coverage on the car at the time of loss.

The laws vary from state to state, sometimes greatly, in regard to salvage status and how it is attained.

I understand the law here in NY very well but since the car is a PA car and I assume registered/titled there I do not know the answer to the OP's question.
What I or others may suggest could be completely wrong if there knowledge is based on their experience operating in a different state.

Find Pennsylvania's DMV site and I bet you'll find the information about salvage status for that jurisdiction there.

If you are looking at this as a potential car to buy and rebuild I think that it is a poor value. You would be into the repaired car for at least the full value of the car if it was not damaged. Salvage NSX's in general are too expensive to be worth rebuilding. IMO.
 
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Well, It looks like someone DID repair it, and didn't even consider mentioning it to potential buyers. Ebay's Auto check gives it almost a 100 score!

Sorry to dig this one up, but I thought it was necessary to make my point. My point you ask? There are some real scumbags out there and people in the market (like myself) need to really be careful! I will admit, its still not a terrible price for a low mile '96 even if rolled and repaired. My guess is all the bidders found this thread before hand. Hope the new owner doesn't have too difficult a time getting that targa off and on ;)

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/e...50071&viewitem=&sspagename=ADME:B:WNA:US:1123
 
If that is the same car, and it looks like it
good job on the PI work! :cool:

:mad: That f!%#ing scum bag is going to take some poor mans hard earned cash :mad:
 
Wow, it really did buff out, didn't it? :rolleyes:
It only took 90 days to flip a flippin' flipped NSX.
I as well hope that the new owner did his due dilligence though it is pretty evident from the pics that there was body shop spray all over the engine compartment (targa bar) as well as the front compartment.
Best of luck to the new owner.
 
For $23,800 someone probably thinks they got the steal of a lifetime...
 
It's pretty scary that a car can have been rolled like that and still have a clean title. I know it happens all the time. I sure hope the person that's going to buy this thing at least Google's the vin since carfax and autocheck don't show the accident.
 
does anyone have pics of this car wrecked? lets add them to this thread

well here is the VIN so a search will find this

Vin = JH4NA1181TT000118

but when you google it only that car group shows up.

I thought if you google a VIN and its listed on prime it would show up in the google search its weird.
 
Last edited:
im glad i am not the only one keeping pic with VIN's LOL

we are the prime collective
 
macninja77 said:
i almost picked the car up just because it was green i never looked twice but easy fix
Click to expand...
I uploaded the image to NSX Prime so everyone can find it...

JH4NA1181TT000118.jpg


shawn110975 - if you have other images you should do the same... and add any pictures to the Salvage List to make it easier for others to find...
 
I emailed this seller during the Ebay auction about it being salvage/rolled etc...this was the sellers response...

I have no knowledge about it being previously rolled, the top fits fine and is aligned fine.
There doesn't appear to have any wind leaks and doesn't leak water (that I have seen) (when we washed it there were no leaks)
Thanks

- avtacarguy
 
They did add this to the ebay auction on 3-7-2012.
APPARENTLY THIS NSX HAS BEEN IN ONE ACCIDENT NOT REPORTED TO AUTOCHECK...

PLEASE CALL OR EMAIL FOR DETAILS AND WE WERE JUST MADE AWARE OF IT.
IT RUNS AND DRIVES EXCELLENT AND LOOKS VERY GOOD.
SORRY FOR ANY INCONVENIENCE
Click to expand...
 
Yikes! When I get to a point of buying one, I will certainly run the vin through prime. I'm likely a couple years off anyhow....too many irons in the fire now.
 

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